Apex Users opinion of Quality or the lack of.

[tdb320reef]

First I want to thank Neptune for creating an amazing product. Considering that many of my other posts in their site have been deleted the purpose of this post is to communicate the frustrations of many users including myself and share your opinion of the Apex Quality. For the record, over the last few years I have been the go to guy setting up Neptune Apex controllers for hobbyist and local Pet Shops in the Metro Detroit Area so have been around long enough to watch the system evolve.

With the onset of the 4.3X Firmware Neptune has attempted to add robust functionality including programming and functional enhancements such as fusion. Since the upgrade to this class of firmware the Apex controller has become unstable with web server time-outs, availability of the components, and self-initialization formatting resulting in 1000s of dollars of damage and loss of life in my case. Just the other day I purchased two brand new lab grade probes and they are .12 off from each other and the troubleshooting method is to stick a paperclip in the BNC connectors.

I have used network tools to measure http 200 get and monitor the webserver mapping out the service time-outs. I have opened several cases with tech-support and get information like the issues are “a-typical” and need to be replaced with new hardware or that the system needs to be split up or that the bootloader is the wrong version which by the way I validated it was updated. Other conversations end with less than optimal troubleshooting methods and I am left with less than enough information to solve the issue.

Shame on my for designing my 320 gallon SPS tank dependent on the Apex controller but I am interested to see if similar issues are happening to the customer base.
Now considering that there seems to be a new firmware release every few weeks, I assume many of these issues are being discovered and addressed. However, there does not seem to be a high level of quality and availability from the final product.

I am not sure how Neptune is addressing the QA of the FW but I feel as I am part of that Bata group as a customer and I would rather have a final working product that has been previously tested and signed off that it is of the highest quality.

With all of that said do you feel that Neptune should improve efforts to improve the quality and availability of the product vs adding functionality like fusion? If the option was available would you purchase a version of the Firmware that is stable and available similar to version 4.2 but will run all of your hardware such as your feeder?

Best Regards,
Thomas Baker

[ska d]

Compared to other controllers out there the apex is still the one I'd choose. But I'd bet in the next couple if years there will be some competition for them. Vertex is supposed to be coming out with one, and I really like other vertex products. But I think Neptune got themselves stuck behind a rock and hard place. Maybe fusion was in the works already but when the email issues started popping up they had to jump the gun. I think that was apparent when Neptune was advertising for a new programmer, something obviously happened internally, and it may or may not have anything to do with the problems they are having now. Me personally, I have noticed a few glitches since the updates. If I use the sliders (that aren't even in fusion yet) my lights will randomly pulse, almost like I've got a lightning program going. I had the system re boot on me for no reason once. Luckily I don't have a huge system but I sure wouldn't want to lose it due to a malfunction, especially considering I lived without a controller for years and never had a single crash. I stated on the Neptune forum about how I was worried that Neptune may be just chasing bugs now. You see it all the time with software devs, they patch things so many times it ends up creating bugs within bugs. And by the time it gets fixed, if ever, everyone has moved on to another product. Let's hope Neptune isn't going to let things get ahead of them to much. Which is why they are being so careful with the beta, I assume.

[tdb320reef]

Compared to other controllers out there the apex is still the one I'd choose. But I'd bet in the next couple if years there will be some competition for them. Vertex is supposed to be coming out with one, and I really like other vertex products. But I think Neptune got themselves stuck behind a rock and hard place. Maybe fusion was in the works already but when the email issues started popping up they had to jump the gun. I think that was apparent when Neptune was advertising for a new programmer, something obviously happened internally, and it may or may not have anything to do with the problems they are having now. Me personally, I have noticed a few glitches since the updates. If I use the sliders (that aren't even in fusion yet) my lights will randomly pulse, almost like I've got a lightning program going. I had the system re boot on me for no reason once. Luckily I don't have a huge system but I sure wouldn't want to lose it due to a malfunction, especially considering I lived without a controller for years and never had a single crash. I stated on the Neptune forum about how I was worried that Neptune may be just chasing bugs now. You see it all the time with software devs, they patch things so many times it ends up creating bugs within bugs. And by the time it gets fixed, if ever, everyone has moved on to another product. Let's hope Neptune isn't going to let things get ahead of them to much. Which is why they are being so careful with the beta, I assume.


That is exactly my point. They are using the population as functionality testers. They release FW so fast that like you said no testing is being done and the changes are creating the bugs. Well for me, My problem started with adding an EB8 and missing outlets. The problem was fixed but TS goes, Oh by the way test this new firmware 4.31_2B something that would fix previous performance issues. Next thing I know I have 30 gallons of water in my basements that night.


I personally think they are bloating the device and it is not scaling well with the new anti enhancements. I think it would be wise to scale back on the development and implement a QA team and for the project management team to adopt SDLC methods.

Boom Problem solved. I don't mind offering them free advice but wish thay can release a skinned down version of the firmware that is tested solid and works with all hardware components without the unnecessary "Cloud" fusion anti enhancements.

[kurt_n]

... They are using the population as functionality testers. ...

Welcome to the real world.

What software have you purchased in the last 5 years that hasn't had a business model like this? In the 'good ol days', software updates were not expected. You bought the software, and it worked. Then slowly, expectations were lowered and now you have software that truly doesn't deliver what is promised until about 5 or 6 updates into the life cycle.

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you regarding stable firmware. Shoot... I'm running 4.20 and will probably continue to do so for quite a while. I don't need Fusion or the new features, and my system is stable. I'm not the type that has to have the latest and greatest. 'If it ain't broke, don't fix it.'

But I also think you have to keep in mind that many of those firmware updates were BETA, and were released as such. And if they weren't releasing frequent firmware updates to try and correct glitches, people would be jumping up and down screaming that Neptune wasn't trying to fix the glitches!

[tdb320reef]

Welcome to the real world.

What software have you purchased in the last 5 years that hasn't had a business model like this? In the 'good ol days', software updates were not expected. You bought the software, and it worked. Then slowly, expectations were lowered and now you have software that truly doesn't deliver what is promised until about 5 or 6 updates into the life cycle.

I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you regarding stable firmware. Shoot... I'm running 4.20 and will probably continue to do so for quite a while. I don't need Fusion or the new features, and my system is stable. I'm not the type that has to have the latest and greatest. 'If it ain't broke, don't fix it.'

But I also think you have to keep in mind that many of those firmware updates were BETA, and were released as such. And if they weren't releasing frequent firmware updates to try and correct glitches, people would be jumping up and down screaming that Neptune wasn't trying to fix the glitches!

It was the real world when they wrote version 4.2 but if you are running newer devices like the feeder you are forced into the newer versions.

I appreciate your feedback and won’t focus on the negative tonality. I will say that when you get to a desperation point of outlets not showing up, controller powering cycling which subsequently results on what Neptune calls corrupt page writes and subsequent failure and disaster you get to a point where you will try anything.

The point here is not to get situational or decompose perspective of real world observation point but to rather focus on quality. If I am reading correctly you agree 4.20 was a quality release, for me and what I am reading 4.3X is not quality. What has changed since? Bloat and unnecessary tooling which Imo compromises stability.

So the true questions for discussion is can Neptune improve quality by perhaps adopting SDLC methods or implement a formal QA team with formal testing practices? Can they go back to 4.2 and figure out how it went so well and then do a gap analysis to figure out how 4.3 went so wrong? Will they or can they release firmware skinned down with high quality without turning my 320 gallon SPS tank into a ticking time bomb?

[kurt_n]

Just because you don't agree with my post, it doesn't mean it has a "negative tone." :)

[Edit: Just looked at all your recent posts on a lot of threads here. And you think *I'm* the one being negative??! Sheesh. Done with this thread!]

I've read your posts on the other forum about your problems, and I feel for you. I really do. It sucks when stuff fails. And 'sucks' is definitely an understatment.

I think you're reading more into my post than what I meant. I'm not implying that something broke in Neptune's internal QA process at 4.20... I'm just saying that's the last firmware update before the 4.30 jump and that when they originally issued 4.30 it was BETA. The only reason I even went to 4.20 was because I was chasing an issue with my base unit (ended up being a circuit in it going bad) and that was my first troubleshooting step. If it hadn't been for that, I'd probably be at 4.12!

Even if I wanted some of the new features (sliders on the 0-10V are going to be handy as I upgrade to LEDs), I in no way would upgrade firmware now. Why? Because I've kept up to date with what is going on and in my opinion there are still too many issues lurking for my taste. Then again, I'm just looking at negative posts on the internet which don't reflect all of the installed user base. People rarely post good things... but they'll sure let you know about the bad. When things finally settle down, I'll probably update - but I'm in no hurry.

[tdb320reef]

Just because you don't agree with my post, it doesn't mean it has a "negative tone." :)

[Edit: Just looked at all your recent posts on a lot of threads here. And you think *I'm* the one being negative??! Sheesh. Done with this thread!]

I've read your posts on the other forum about your problems, and I feel for you. I really do. It sucks when stuff fails. And 'sucks' is definitely an understatment.

I think you're reading more into my post than what I meant. I'm not implying that something broke in Neptune's internal QA process at 4.20... I'm just saying that's the last firmware update before the 4.30 jump and that when they originally issued 4.30 it was BETA. The only reason I even went to 4.20 was because I was chasing an issue with my base unit (ended up being a circuit in it going bad) and that was my first troubleshooting step. If it hadn't been for that, I'd probably be at 4.12!

Even if I wanted some of the new features (sliders on the 0-10V are going to be handy as I upgrade to LEDs), I in no way would upgrade firmware now. Why? Because I've kept up to date with what is going on and in my opinion there are still too many issues lurking for my taste. Then again, I'm just looking at negative posts on the internet which don't reflect all of the installed user base. People rarely post good things... but they'll sure let you know about the bad. When things finally settle down, I'll probably update - but I'm in no hurry.

For me it was your introductory sentence about welcoming to the real world as if I was part of some kind of fantasy. Now looking at your stats I would image you are aware that thinks came come across the wrong way and I apologize if that was not your intent.

Other posts have added several suggestions and value. I have been in IT for 20 years and have seen systems come together and projects fail. Yes I had a negative experience with the product and it is my opportunity to voice it but that does not make me a negative person.

Taking the conversation on why you stay delayed in the firmware please suggest your opinion on how you think that they can improve the quality of the product? You never know if a decision maker is reading this information.

I have said many positive things about the product and personally have installed over 50 being the go to guy in Metro Detroit. Unfortunately, the perspective has changes as of recent not because I am negative but because of the implications and other issues that are popping up all over the place with the new firmware.

Thanks.

[unze]

All I can say is that my Apex has not been a issue, works in fusion and don't have time out issues.

[tdb320reef]

:beer:All I can say is that my Apex has not been a issue, works in fusion and don't have time out issues.

Can you please provide an overview of your system?

[GatorAlum05]

Reef savvy 150g with apex fusion. Mp40s. Radion gen3 pro.

No problems what so ever. Love fusion.

There's bound to be errors. That's the luck of the draw. Sorry about your problems but most people don't have them.

[tdb320reef]

Reef savvy 150g with apex fusion. Mp40s. Radion gen3 pro.

No problems what so ever. Love fusion.

There's bound to be errors. That's the luck of the draw. Sorry about your problems but most people don't have them.

Most people don't run 5 EB8's, 2 PM1's,1 PM2, 1 WXM, 3 PH probes, 3 temp probes, VDM outlets, three breakout boxes and controlling tunze, exotech pumps, LEDS and many other devices. I am not saying that a standard unit will not have issues but the reason why I ask is I am curious if users with larger systems are having said quality issues. You may view the systems components here:

http://www.reeftronics.net/tdb/apex-status

[GatorAlum05]

Most people don't run 5 EB8's, 2 PM1's,1 PM2, 1 WXM, 3 PH probes, 3 temp probes, VDM outlets, three breakout boxes and controlling tunze, exotech pumps, LEDS and many other devices. I am not saying that a standard unit will not have issues but the reason why I ask is I am curious if users with larger systems are having said quality issues. You may view the systems components here:

http://www.reeftronics.net/tdb/apex-status

I run wxm, pm2, pm3, 2 eb8, condx probe, 2 ph probes, 2 temp probes, 1 break out box, calcium, alk, magnesium dosing, uv lighting, uv pump, vodka dosing, 3 sump fans, 4 thermometer, etc, etc

there's plenty of redundancy. you just happened to get a bad batch. go get it fix via neptune.

[tdb320reef]

I have had the controller since late 2010. Are you suggesting I got a bad batch of firmware because it was solid until I moved to the 4.3X. Neptune needs to fix the code for it to work correct and has been unable to come up with a solution. I will admit I have had a negative experience but the discussion is about quality and not my tone. When or if your system grows from an outlet perspective, Id be interested if you have the same view points.

[GatorAlum05]

that's cool, I've had neptune since the aquacontroller days. let me know when you contact neptune and get your problems fixed or an entire system replaced. i'm glad when I downloaded the beta, I already knew there would be glitches since it was stated as a beta release. i'm glad to be part of a revolution as a test subject.

[pencil3]

A screen shot of my modules on my one system is attached. I am currently on 4.31_1E14 and haven't run into any new issues.

Most people don't run 5 EB8's, 2 PM1's,1 PM2, 1 WXM, 3 PH probes, 3 temp probes, VDM outlets, three breakout boxes and controlling tunze, exotech pumps, LEDS and many other devices. I am not saying that a standard unit will not have issues but the reason why I ask is I am curious if users with larger systems are having said quality issues. You may view the systems components here:

http://www.reeftronics.net/tdb/apex-status

[sanababit]

I am still at 4.1xx something, i did not update, i am waiting for everyone else to test, then i will consider it, if it aint broke why fix it... I have 2 eb8, 1 pm1, 1 wxm, 2 ph probes, 1 orp probe, radions, vortechs, calcium reactor, pumps, skimmer, etc, all controlled with the apex for about a year now, i have outside and inside control, my email dont work, but hey i cant have it all, lol

Sana

[slief]

All I can say is that my Apex has not been a issue, works in fusion and don't have time out issues.

Me too! I've had my Apex since they were first released. Prior to that I had the original first gen Aquacontroller. Yes, the very first Neptune Systems AquaController released. We are going back about 20 years..

Back to my Apex. Like I said, I've had it running since they were first released. I've recently upgraded to the latest firmware and have fusion running although I don't use much it as I've got DynDns setup and everything works fine regardless of where I am. I also use the Apex app on my iPhone.

I've got 7 EB8's and over 40 active outlets. I've also got countless virtual outlets doing all kinds of stuff. I have my Tunze's controlled by my Apex, my ATO is managed by my Apex via a breakout box. I've got two 5 LED lunar Sims, PM1, a PM2. I monitor PH, ORP and Salinity. I monitor for water on the floor, sump levels etc. One of my skimmer pumps shut off if the water level gets too high. alarms and email/texts get sent out if water levels get to high or low, salinity gets to high or low, water on the floor, PH ORP etc will all trigger alarms. I control all of my pumps, including my Hammerhead return pump, dart re-circulation pump and 3 large Tunze pumps. My Tunzes are programmed with several profiles that change throughout the day to create various wave cycles, periods of calm as well as cycles that stir up detritus so it can be suspended and pushed into the overflow. I control some of my lights, skimmer, skimmer SCH, mix pump, failsafe to my chiller which I don't really need anymore, cooling fans, top off via float switches and a dosing pump, fail safe to my Genesis Renew auto water changer, etc. I also have the Apex auto feeder which I only use when I travel.

My system is large and obviously very complex with hundreds of lines of code and I have the utmost in confidence in it. I do however keep a spare pre-programmed Apex brain just in case. That said, I would not run a large system without an Apex. In the 3 or so years of having the controller, I've only experienced one minor issue and it was resolved quickly by Neptune Support. Unlike you, I have not experienced any issues with the current released firmware. I am not one for running beta firmware and only stick to released code. In fact, the only time I ever even bother to upgrade my firmware is if there is a very compelling reason to do so such as a new feature that I really want or a new product that I purchase that requires it. I'm of the mindset that if it works, don't mess with it.

That said, I would not expect 2 new probes to read the same. I always calibrate probes individually just to be sure regardless of if they are new or have been in my system for a year.

[tdb320reef]

Are any of the people set up on Reeftronics? Id love to review your systems and compare to mine to see if maybe something jumps out that may be contribution to the less than optimal operation.

Could being set up on ReefTronics contribute to the issues?

Thanks.

[giz2]

Like others I am running a fairly full system on my tank. All of the regular as was as WXM for Radions, VDM for Tunze pumps, Breakout box for ATO, Autofeeder etc. I am running Fusion and latest firmware. All is stable. I travel a fair amount so I like remote access. I am still keeping my DynDNS service in case I can't connect via Fusion. To be honest I am very impressed with Neptune. I had a Digital Aquatics controller before. I find Neptune are very progressive. Are they perfect, nope but I feel they try to resolve.

[RussM]

Could being set up on ReefTronics contribute to the issues?The Reeftronics polling engine uses code written in PHP; the part of that code which retrieves XML data from members' controllers is comprised of widely-utilized embedded PHP functions to perform standard http requests. With over 400 Apexes currently being polled every 10 minutes around the clock, I have absolutely no indication that pulling status.xml from members' Apexes has caused problems. I actually have a special "hammer the Apex" mode that I use periodically in testing against my own Apexes - it pulls XML data over and over again with only a few hundred millisecond gap in between requests - no issues when I do that.

There is one scenario, however, where Reeftronics *may* be a factor - the Apex's embedded web server can only handle a limited number of concurrent requests. So if you have several devices (desktop browser, smartphone app, app on tablet, Reeftronics, etc.) all hitting the Apex at the same moment, the Apex's web service can get overwhelmed.

Looking at your profile on Reeftronics, I see that you use the default/standard http port (80) on the public side of your router for external access to the Apex. I strongly recommend against that - as a network engineer, I have become a staunch advocate of using a non-standard/custom port for permitting access to *any* consumer-grade device from the Internet - including aquarium controllers (Neptune, DA, RA, etc), network cameras, NAS systems, home security systems, etc. Even my network-connected sprinkler system controller (yes, there's an app for that!) gets the custom port treatment. There is far too much malicious activity out there on the Internet, and a notable amount of that is scanning for web servers which are vulnerable to various exploits. There are other types of bad and/or undesirable traffic too. The Apex (and all other devices which are accessed through forwarded ports), receives and has to process all of that unwanted traffic. This can be a major factor in that "too many concurrent requests" scenario I mentioned. There's no need to have it that way. Using a custom port number in the port forwarding significantly reduces the likelihood that the Apex will be subjected to all that crap.

I highly recommend that you modify your port forwarding to use some public port other than 80. My standard recommendation in this regard is to pick a number between 1027 and 65534, and use that as the public TCP port in your port forwarding. When selecting a port, do avoid picking one which is a string of repeated digits or of sequential digits, such as 6666, 1234, 8888, 4321, etc.

If your router supports the use of different public/remote and private/local port numbers, you can leave the Apex on port 80, and just use a non-standard public port in the router's port forwarding/virtual server. Some routers don't permit this; if that's the case, then you will need to change the Apex's http port to the selected custom port.

[tdb320reef]

The Reeftronics polling engine uses code written in PHP; the part of that code which retrieves XML data from members' controllers is comprised of widely-utilized embedded PHP functions to perform standard http requests. With over 400 Apexes currently being polled every 10 minutes around the clock, I have absolutely no indication that pulling status.xml from members' Apexes has caused problems. I actually have a special "hammer the Apex" mode that I use periodically in testing against my own Apexes - it pulls XML data over and over again with only a few hundred millisecond gap in between requests - no issues when I do that.

There is one scenario, however, where Reeftronics *may* be a factor - the Apex's embedded web server can only handle a limited number of concurrent requests. So if you have several devices (desktop browser, smartphone app, app on tablet, Reeftronics, etc.) all hitting the Apex at the same moment, the Apex's web service can get overwhelmed.

Looking at your profile on Reeftronics, I see that you use the default/standard http port (80) on the public side of your router for external access to the Apex. I strongly recommend against that - as a network engineer, I have become a staunch advocate of using a non-standard/custom port for permitting access to *any* consumer-grade device from the Internet - including aquarium controllers (Neptune, DA, RA, etc), network cameras, NAS systems, home security systems, etc. Even my network-connected sprinkler system controller (yes, there's an app for that!) gets the custom port treatment. There is far too much malicious activity out there on the Internet, and a notable amount of that is scanning for web servers which are vulnerable to various exploits. There are other types of bad and/or undesirable traffic too. The Apex (and all other devices which are accessed through forwarded ports), receives and has to process all of that unwanted traffic. This can be a major factor in that "too many concurrent requests" scenario I mentioned. There's no need to have it that way. Using a custom port number in the port forwarding significantly reduces the likelihood that the Apex will be subjected to all that crap.

I highly recommend that you modify your port forwarding to use some public port other than 80. My standard recommendation in this regard is to pick a number between 1027 and 65534, and use that as the public TCP port in your port forwarding. When selecting a port, do avoid picking one which is a string of repeated digits or of sequential digits, such as 6666, 1234, 8888, 4321, etc.

If your router supports the use of different public/remote and private/local port numbers, you can leave the Apex on port 80, and just use a non-standard public port in the router's port forwarding/virtual server. Some routers don't permit this; if that's the case, then you will need to change the Apex's http port to the selected custom port.

Yeah, I remember the conversation when you talked and were laughing that you were using lagacy technology on the site but yet it worked so well.

Why swap 80 for me it would be less secure, Incoming traffic on 80 and 443 is coming into a reverse proxy(TMG). It is actually very secure. Running a back end cisco switch I created a VLAN specifically for the apex. Now using the mentioned theory, I isolated the apex and the web monitoring VM on the same vlan without a gateway(thus no packets routed to that network) and the only syn>ack is the monitoring server and the apex. I ran the Get 200 for 24 hour period with 0 devices connected and the Apex averaged an outage every 5 minutes.

Good advice but I already have the security covered having a Masters in IA and CISSP. I personally believe that device is not available because like Tech support stated it is running at over 80% of resources and perhaps the hardware in my base unit (early 2010) cannot support the newer 4.3x firmware. Perhaps they need to go back through their Serial Numbers and state that any serial number below a certain release is not compatible with 4.3x. If that was true Id be inclined to purchase the upgraded base unit with upgrade chip sets, procs, ram and rom.

[Gann810]

I agree with tdb320reef. There has been issues ... RussM has gone above and beyond to help me also..my system unexpectedly turned off and would not restart without turning breaker off and restarting. It has been fine sense then... but I would be lying if I said I was fearful of leaving my system after that... For me....My system worked flawlessly before fusion and I really had no reason to update so I have to take some responsibility for any problems being I realized it was in bata.. I can't hold apex responsible alone. All the manufactures seem to want to force you to use their equipment.. Instead of making it easily compatible with one central controller

[tdb320reef]

I agree with tdb320reef. There has been issues ... RussM has gone above and beyond to help me also..my system unexpectedly turned off and would not restart without turning breaker off and restarting. It has been fine sense then... but I would be lying if I said I was fearful of leaving my system after that... For me....My system worked flawlessly before fusion and I really had no reason to update so I have to take some responsibility for any problems being I realized it was in bata.. I can't hold apex responsible alone. All the manufactures seem to want to force you to use their equipment.. Instead of making it easily compatible with one central controller

Honestly, Id roll back to 4.2 but considering I have been traveling a lot the feeder comes in handy and is not supported under 4.2. If I do have one more disaster though, Ill ditch the feeder and roll back to 4.2. Currently I am moving critical components to a different system. Looking real hard at reef angel.

I wish Neptune would possibly roll back to 4.2 and provide support for the feeder.

[revnull]

If you believe you have identified a load issue, reduce what you can and prove it. Nothing says "bugs" like reproducible test cases. Start by disabling fusion and ask Russ to stop/pause reeftronics polling. Consolidate EB8s and remove "extra" modules where possible. Once you reach a point of stability, slowly add modules and features back until things reach a tipping point. Then do it again to prove the first time wasn't a fluke. :)
Sure it's a pain and Neptune isn't paying you to test/QA on your wildly expensive tank, but if you have the skill set and would like to provide the manufacturer useful data that would ultimately benefit all Apex users, please do. I'll throw my hat in the ring and help test where I can. Has anyone coined the term "Crowd sourced QA" yet? :)

[tdb320reef]

If you believe you have identified a load issue, reduce what you can and prove it. Nothing says "bugs" like reproducible test cases. Start by disabling fusion and ask Russ to stop/pause reeftronics polling. Consolidate EB8s and remove "extra" modules where possible. Once you reach a point of stability, slowly add modules and features back until things reach a tipping point. Then do it again to prove the first time wasn't a fluke. :)
Sure it's a pain and Neptune isn't paying you to test/QA on your wildly expensive tank, but if you have the skill set and would like to provide the manufacturer useful data that would ultimately benefit all Apex users, please do. I'll throw my hat in the ring and help test where I can. Has anyone coined the term "Crowd sourced QA" yet? :)

A while back I:

Disabled Fusion = Done
Deleted 90% of Vports = Done
Change data logging to 30 Minutes = Done

the aforementioned has solved the reboot issues however I still have web server timeouts. and have to refresh the dashboard 4-5 times for it to be available When changing code and submit page times out have to do it again 1 out of 3 times. Forget trying to get a graph.

[unze]

Maybe try another router. some work better than others, i found my netgear router works well compare to my cisco router.

[tdb320reef]

Maybe try another router. some work better than others, i found my netgear router works well compare to my cisco router.


The apex mgmt interface is connected to a Cisco 3750 layer3 switch. It is set up on a vlan to minimize broadcast traffic. The router sits on the switch and confirmed no errors. It seems complicates but it is a business class switch with no issues or errors in its configuration.

[Reefvet]

Mine works fine. Always has. :bounce1:

[Zoner]

Mine works fine. Always has. :bounce1:

Always been quality stuff for me. I have 3ebs, wxm, awm, 2 feeders, 2 ph probes, 1 ORP, 1 conductivity, 2 temps, 3 float switches.

Running Fusion beta now. All of the problems I've had in the past were operator error.

Sorry yours isn't working out, but I think the majority of people are thoroughly satisfied, so I would think that speaks to the quality.

[arinrb]

all i can say is that my apex has not been a issue, works in fusion and don't have time out issues.

+1