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ahmed_iAM
04/16/2014, 03:30 AM
While in Dubia I went to the local aquarium stores. In one of then I found this. I estimate its upwards of 60 plate corals. I visited the store twice after. They sold out of them and restocked ~60 again. The picture doesn't display this but they had are acro and styrophora colonies besides them, some colored with some sort of dye that leaked off when in water. It was definitely not artificially made based on the feel and density of each plate. It's such a shame they can be sold this way. :angryfire:

Reeferz412
04/16/2014, 11:26 AM
Indeed very saddening. Do they have any sort of collecting laws in Dubai?

ahmed_iAM
04/16/2014, 11:38 AM
I don't think these corals are native to the area. They mostly dwell in the Indo-Pacific not the Gulf or Red Sea so these would probably be import laws.

GreshamH
04/16/2014, 11:57 AM
The Curio trade is massive... you think the aquarium trade is big, the curio is way bigger and does a lot more damage. They get to pull in tonnage, and we are regulated to per piece.

reefwiser
04/16/2014, 11:58 AM
Back in the day there would be road side stands in Florida that sold bleached coral all day long
Hundreds of all types of coral would be stacked on tables. Key West had a big coral shop
back in the 80's when I visited then.

http://datamanagement.reefcheck.org/photos/Corals%20and%20shells.jpg

http://biophysics.sbg.ac.at/sey/scan/curio.jpg

ahmed_iAM
04/16/2014, 12:01 PM
Wouldn't beached corals show a bit more damage? I'll see if I have a photo of the dry acro colonies. There was very little damage to the body of the coral.

KafudaFish
04/16/2014, 02:33 PM
Back in the day there would be road side stands in Florida that sold bleached coral all day long
Hundreds of all types of coral would be stacked on tables. Key West had a big coral shop
back in the 80's when I visited then.

http://datamanagement.reefcheck.org/photos/Corals%20and%20shells.jpg

http://biophysics.sbg.ac.at/sey/scan/curio.jpg

I have 2 corals that barely fit in a 5 gallon salt bucket from the 70s so who knows how much went that way.

billsreef
04/16/2014, 07:01 PM
There are still places like that selling shells, dead corals, dried starfish, dried seahorses and dried puffers in FL.

James77
04/16/2014, 07:48 PM
There are still places like that selling shells, dead corals, dried starfish, dried seahorses and dried puffers in FL.

Makes me sick to my stomach. I had a friends mother give me a whole bunch form her trip to FL about 15 years ago....I could barely feign a smile to be nice. How cruel.

ShallowPlanet
04/17/2014, 03:13 PM
So do they just capture these alive and then kill them? And some of the environmentalists want to attack the hobbyists that are growing coral...

ahmed_iAM
04/17/2014, 04:48 PM
So do they just capture these alive and then kill them? And some of the environmentalists want to attack the hobbyists that are growing coral...

Perhaps we don't full know the situation. Perhaps these are from bleached reefs but I these maybe wild collected ones. If they make $0.25 to a person in Sri Lanka or another south east Asia country it would be an easy decision between feeding your family or the environment. These issues are a bit harder to tackle than what it looks like on the surface.

billsreef
04/17/2014, 08:49 PM
So do they just capture these alive and then kill them? And some of the environmentalists want to attack the hobbyists that are growing coral...

They are collected alive. It's the only way to get such perfect specimens :(

Fishfirst
04/18/2014, 06:58 AM
Perhaps we don't full know the situation. Perhaps these are from bleached reefs but I these maybe wild collected ones. If they make $0.25 to a person in Sri Lanka or another south east Asia country it would be an easy decision between feeding your family or the environment. These issues are a bit harder to tackle than what it looks like on the surface.

No, it really isn't. Its just like shark finning, grinding up seahorses fight impotence and eating tiger testicles to increase your size... all ignorance, all exploitive

ahmed_iAM
04/18/2014, 02:09 PM
No, it really isn't. Its just like shark finning, grinding up seahorses fight impotence and eating tiger testicles to increase your size... all ignorance, all exploitive

They aren't do it for fun. Its a matter of getting food on the table. It will continue as long as there's demand and a lack of "good" jobs in the regions the corals come from.

mayjong
04/18/2014, 03:09 PM
agreed.
you are not going to stop the collectors from feeding their kids, they simply dont care and need the money. i would wager that most (if not all) on this forum would do the same thing if their kids were hungry and they were in the same situation. the real soution is to stop buying the stuff and the collectors will stop collecting.
end the demand, and the supply will stop

syrinx
04/18/2014, 11:43 PM
I have a conch shell my great grandmother got in fla in 1910. The thing about the collectables- esp dried coral, is that it is a everlasting decoration. Live coral on the other hand is usually kept for a much briefer period of time before being replaced. I dont know the regulations on collection etc for the different countries, so I cannot comment whether the limits are not restrictive enough..

Keoki18
04/28/2014, 02:23 PM
Both ahmed and mayjong bring points of reality. However, Fishfirst is correct in his understanding of the situation. This very real problem is extortion of the reef, and for that matter, out planet. Yet, I understand where both of you are comming from. The problem stems from the lack of education. These people are feeding themselves now, but will eventually run out of a resource that they so relied upon. A more practical way of answering both sides of the argument is to teach these people sustainable marine-culture such as the group on Apo Island I work with. Here, we have taught the locals how to grow and conserve coral reefs, taking a bit from this growth over time to sell in the aquarium hobby. This way they protect the reef, they feed their family, and they have a continual source of income.

oceanarium
05/19/2014, 07:21 PM
I have a conch shell my great grandmother got in fla in 1910. The thing about the collectables- esp dried coral, is that it is a everlasting decoration. Live coral on the other hand is usually kept for a much briefer period of time before being replaced. I dont know the regulations on collection etc for the different countries, so I cannot comment whether the limits are not restrictive enough..

Indeed the curio may well last and be loved for many years, the live coral well more often than not its one of many that did not survive the collection and transport process and rarely lives for more than a hand full of years. Either way they are both as good as dead to the sea they came from.

I have a sea shell collection, some I found some are handed down from parents and grandparents. More importantly i still have and cherish them all, unlike my aquarium coral collection.

ahmed_iAM
05/20/2014, 05:04 AM
Here is another one from my trip I found while browsing through the photos. Was about 1.5ft wide. Was laying on the ground. again278408