Why did my $400 clownfish die?

[yagesz]

I had a pair of frostbite clownfish they both died in the last week.

They were in a 40B with 2 blood shrimp, pink spotted goby and one bangai.


My parameters are fine. What could it be.

[Shia]

Wow, that is a lot for clownfish. Sorry for the loss. Any weird behavior before they died?

[MacWilliams]

Can you post what your parameters were?

[SDguy]

Did you QT?

[yagesz]

Clownfish were happy in the tank for 4 months. They were the first fish in. Night before they died the one was swimming in circles on the corner. But he has done that many times. No fish have been adddd for 2 months.

[mcfa2403]

That stinks, but that is also very little info. Any pictures of the fish? Any external signs of disease (white specks, black specks, white blotches, flukes, awkward swimming, bite/attack marks, were the two clowns fighting, were they trying to host anything that might have had too much sting, any popping sounds at night that might mean hitchhiker)? What do the other fish look like? How long were they in the tank? Were any of your other fish recently added? Did they hang out near equipment/have you had any equipment act up? There are so many things it could be any information could be important

[yagesz]

Far as I could tell from looking under a mag glass neither had any of those signs.

They died over a week apart. Nothing to host. Just a lot of zoas.

[MacWilliams]

Not sure how likely this is but did you do any maintance and upset the zoas? They might have released their toxins into the water and stressed / killed them. As it was said before without much information im just reaching here. Lol

[yagesz]

Yeah. Idk either. The zoas are all in a garden spot and the clowns were never near.

I'm stretching for reasons to. I could not see anything in the normal that would cause it.

[yagesz]

The only thing I can think up is the blood shrimp.

The clowns used a hiding spot that the shrimps too over. And it's where I found the one this morning dead. Idk

[jdhuyvetter]

I have found that fish death seems to be directly connected to price. The higher the price, the faster they disappear or die or jump out. Not sure why, it may just be me.

[ALH]

I have found that fish death seems to be directly connected to price. The higher the price, the faster they disappear or die or jump out. Not sure why, it may just be me.

Lol, that's been my (largely disregarded) opinion. Expensive fish = more likelihood to jump. Sorry about your fish, Yagesz, that really sucks.

[davocean]

The only thing I can think up is the blood shrimp.

The clowns used a hiding spot that the shrimps too over. And it's where I found the one this morning dead. Idk

I seriously doubt the shrimps had anything to do w/ it.
It's hard to say for sure what happened w/out knowing your tank better, just too many possibilities.

[saltyair]

do you have a grounding probe? stray voltage?

[yagesz]

do you have a grounding probe? stray voltage?


No I dont. My house is so old the wiring is not grounded..... Totally forgot about this.

Solution?

[Sobos Reef]

First off, sorry about your fish, that stinks but How about posting up some real numbers? Without telling us your parameters, you're shooting in the dark. I'm interested in your ammo, nitrites and nitrates.

Always start with the basics. The possibilities are endless without basics.

[yagesz]

I am not home and won't be for a few days. So i don't have access to my numbers. they are all written down in a notebook. But the numbers weren't different then normal.

[Sobos Reef]

I am not home and won't be for a few days. So i don't have access to my numbers. they are all written down in a notebook. But the numbers weren't different then normal.

Fair enough but your "normal" may be a different normal to others . Know what I mean?

[yagesz]

Yeah I know what you mean. But AMmo, Nit, Phos were all low. Close to zero

[tkeracer619]

On a tank that old there should be zero ammonia.

Could be long term exposure to ammonia or it spiked. It will kill the fish and the gills may or may not have been red. It can be hard on those fish to see red gills.

[mcfa2403]

The only thing I can think up is the blood shrimp.

The clowns used a hiding spot that the shrimps too over. And it's where I found the one this morning dead. Idk

Seems unlikely, more likely the shrimp pulled the clown over after death. Any chance of fighting? How old/what size were they, could they have been trying to establish dominance? Perhaps the pink spot? For some reason I feel like aggression was involved based on the fact that clowns tend to be hardy and that your other fish are alive.

[Sobos Reef]

On a tank that old there should be zero ammonia.

Could be long term exposure to ammonia or it spiked. It will kill the fish and the gills may or may not have been red. It can be hard on those fish to see red gills.

+1 highly agree. On an established tank there should be 0 ammonia ALWAYS(unless you overfeed or having a decaying fish somewhere). You also said a little bit of "nit" which if that's Nitrites then you have a problem, if it was Nitrates then that's fine.

[Psionicdragon]

genetic mutation?

[saltyair]

Get a grounding probe - cost $20

No I dont. My house is so old the wiring is not grounded..... Totally forgot about this.

Solution?

[shifty51008]

Get a grounding probe - cost $20

you still need an outlet that is grounded for that to work.

[Themonsterisme]

do you have a grounding probe? stray voltage?


+1 was first thing I thought of ⬆️

[Themonsterisme]

Would a iron rod installed a few feet in the ground work as a grounding spot for a wire through a window to the tank ?

[Silvergryphon]

I would think it would work just fine. I'm not 100% sure but I believe that is basically what the grounding is for most homes anyways.

[OrionN]

Having ungrounded power for reeftank (not to code) is asking for trouble. With that much electricity power, salt waster, salt creap, heat and moisture isreally bad.
I would highly recommend that you bring your electricity up to code. There are certaily more than on house burned down by reeftank.

[gmack]

Would a iron rod installed a few feet in the ground work as a grounding spot for a wire through a window to the tank ?


If possible, tie 16awg copper to a ground strap - and strap that sucker to a cold water pipe- must be copper and preferably closest to the water pipe entering your home.

[yagesz]

I rent. And am on the second floor. I can't do anything about being up to code.

[Reefvet]

My LFS sells a few designer clowns. They're reasonably hardy. However recently that got an ORA Snowflake in and it died with inflamed red gills in 3 days.

The fish was in a system that has a dozens of healthy fish, no ammonia I'm sure. Other designer clowns in the same system and from the same shipment are doing just fine.

Genetic weakness ?

An effective ground would have to be a 6-7 foot copper rod driven all the way into the earth. A steal rod wouldn't do diddly. I've driven a new ground into the earth, it's no fun.

The shrimp would have died long before the fish if there was a stray voltage issue in your tank. Being an exoskeleton creature it's much more susceptible.

[Reefvet]

If possible, tie 16awg copper to a ground strap - and strap that sucker to a cold water pipe- must be copper and preferably closest to the water pipe entering your home.

That may dissipate any stray voltage but won't be a true earth ground. Doing so has the potential to do just the oposite and add to the problem by creating a larger conductive path and/or picking up any other stray voltage sources that are touching the water pipes. Bad idea.

[snorvich]

Genetic weakness ?



You bring up an interesting point. Since these clownfish are selected to produce a specific phenotype (that is not naturally occurring), the end result after inbred selection may be a weakened genotype. No way to test that hypothesis, however.

[shifty51008]

You bring up an interesting point. Since these clownfish are selected to produce a specific phenotype (that is not naturally occurring), the end result after inbred selection may be a weakened genotype. No way to test that hypothesis, however.

I be on my own here but IMO that's starting to become a problem with some bigger breeders these days, they are more about the money than culling the bad clowns. I have seen a lot of tank bred clowns lately from different major breeders that should never have left the facility. I'm not sure if it is because the staff hasn't been properly trained on which clowns to cull or not but there should be better QC, there is no reason for so many deformed clowns to be released.

[snorvich]

I be on my own here but IMO that's starting to become a problem with some bigger breeders these days, they are more about the money than culling the bad clowns. I have seen a lot of tank bred clowns lately from different major breeders that should never have left the facility. I'm not sure if it is because the staff hasn't been properly trained on which clowns to cull or not but there should be better QC, there is no reason for so many deformed clowns to be released.

Well, my other fish hobby is collecting koi. One of the most important issues that koi breeders face is appropriate culling. For koi, there is more than one culling since they do not reach color maturity early on. I doubt that most saltwater breeders cull their offspring.