Tank focused on flasher/fiary wrasses

[GoldeneyeRet]

I have been thinking of setting up my 120 again. It has been down for about 5-6 years.

I had thought I wanted to build it around anthias, but the more I read the more I think I want 4-5 Fairy/Flasher wrasses. I would like to keep a high load of small, peaceful fish, the wrasses being the focal point. I would chose my final equipment set-up and the rest of my livestock around these wrasses.

The question is which fairy/flasher wrasses should I consider? I want them to be the smaller and more peaceful of the group. I would also like them to be differing in color (from one another)as much as possible. I am going to limit the cost to the more moderate or cheaper species as well. maybe up to around $80 each, but the cheaper ones are preferred. l would also consider spending more if there was a real benefit to a more expensive species but from what I can see the moderate priced ones have plenty to offer. There are no stores here that have any, so I have to rely on pictures and I know that really doesn't do them justice.

From what I have read, here are some initial thoughts: Lubbocks and orange backed fairies, maybe the flame? flashers seem easier to chose as they are smaller but a lot of them look somewhat alike from the pictures. Linespot and blue look interesting. The mckoskers, carpenters and several others all seem to look similar and it seems as many might work in this plan.

I appreciate any feed back regarding selecting and keeping these wrasses. Which ones will fit my plan the best? All opinions are very welcome and thanks for the help in planning my fish list.

Thanks

[hogfanreefer]

With these criteria my choices would be C. lubbocki, C. aurantidorsalis/luykyuensis and C. rubrimarginalis. For flashers P. flavianalis and P. lineopunctatus.

That would give you 3 distinctly different colored fairies and 2 very different colored flashers. The last two fairies get a little larger but with the small lubbocki and the small flashers you have plenty of room in your size tank.

JMO.

[GoldeneyeRet]

Thanks for the advice hoganreefer, That's exactly the kind of advice I was looking for. After looking at each of these more closely, I think it looks like a perfect grouping for me.

Anyone else have any other ideas?

Thank a lot!

[hogfanreefer]

If you want to get a little frisky with the money, substitute a C. lineatus for the rubrimarginatus and a P. octaenia for the flavianalis

[GoldeneyeRet]

Hmm..... the C. lineatus looks similar to the rubrimarginatus but maybe quite a bit more attractive. It is twice the price, is it twice as nice? (actually 4x the price, but that wouldn't rhyme) A definite possibility.

I looked up Pseudocheilinus octotaenia at first and for a second I thought you were cray! Then I realized my mistake. Is the Paracheilinus ocotaenia more aggressive? I am reading it might be and although it should be compatible with the other wrasses, how is it with other small fish? It does look very attractive.

Thanks for the suggestions, I am open to any other s as well.

[evolved]

I have been thinking of setting up my 120 again. It has been down for about 5-6 years.

I had thought I wanted to build it around anthias, but the more I read the more I think I want 4-5 Fairy/Flasher wrasses. I would like to keep a high load of small, peaceful fish, the wrasses being the focal point. I would chose my final equipment set-up and the rest of my livestock around these wrasses.

The question is which fairy/flasher wrasses should I consider? I want them to be the smaller and more peaceful of the group. I would also like them to be differing in color (from one another)as much as possible. I am going to limit the cost to the more moderate or cheaper species as well. maybe up to around $80 each, but the cheaper ones are preferred. l would also consider spending more if there was a real benefit to a more expensive species but from what I can see the moderate priced ones have plenty to offer. There are no stores here that have any, so I have to rely on pictures and I know that really doesn't do them justice.

From what I have read, here are some initial thoughts: Lubbocks and orange backed fairies, maybe the flame? flashers seem easier to chose as they are smaller but a lot of them look somewhat alike from the pictures. Linespot and blue look interesting. The mckoskers, carpenters and several others all seem to look similar and it seems as many might work in this plan.

I appreciate any feed back regarding selecting and keeping these wrasses. Which ones will fit my plan the best? All opinions are very welcome and thanks for the help in planning my fish list.

Thanks
You could have more than 4-5, if you choose carefully.

Availability and price will be your limiting factors.

Cyaneus and lineopunctatus are also very similar to the casual observer; the shape of the tail is the main difference.

You might find this useful: http://www.3reef.com/forums/tropical-fish/all-about-reef-safe-wrasses-122261.html

With these criteria my choices would be C. lubbocki, C. aurantidorsalis/luykyuensis and C. rubrimarginalis. For flashers P. flavianalis and P. lineopunctatus.

That would give you 3 distinctly different colored fairies and 2 very different colored flashers. The last two fairies get a little larger but with the small lubbocki and the small flashers you have plenty of room in your size tank.

JMO.
That would be a suitable plan.

[GoldeneyeRet]

Thanks for that link to your article, but more thanks for writing it. I found it early on in my search for these fish and have it close at hand every time I go looking for wrasses.

As far as having more, I am seeing how these can be addictive, I already want about 20 of them!

Thanks for all the help.

[velvetelvis]

Nothing useful to add, but be sure to post pics when the tank is stocked! It sounds like it's going to be beautiful. :D

[GoldeneyeRet]

velvetelvis haha awesome name! I will post some pics, but it will be a looong time before any fish arrive. I havent even started set up yet!

[d-man]

IMO lineatus is one of the prettiest hands down. A beautiful male golden rhomboid as well, but price is up there.
My favs in my tank are my male red velvet(tank king), rhomboid, attenuatus, cf lancelatous and my blue spot tamarin.
I have mant more, but these are my tank wrasse favs.
Next on the list will be a lineatus.

[capt85]

I just picked up a C. rubrimarginalis that was mislabeled at the LFS and I am VERY happy it was mislabeled. Once in QT this is a beautiful fish and was very luck to get it at the price I did. I would recommend sticking with the C. rubrimarginalis instead of the C. lineatus because of the price.

I also loved having Halichoeres chrysus (yellow "Coris" wrasse). I had a pair and the males coloration on his face was beautiful!! And he ate flat worms :)

[GoldeneyeRet]

Thanks for the useful advice everyone. I do appreciate it!

I am still listening if there are any further ideas! I do think the options listed so far are convincing enough for me to move forward. Im going to haul the tank inside tonight and see what redesigns and changes I need to make! I don't have to make any final decisions on fish for months, but having some specific options helps a lot.

The project begins!

Thanks again to everyone for the help.

[GoldeneyeRet]

With these criteria my choices would be C. lubbocki, C. aurantidorsalis/luykyuensis and C. rubrimarginalis. For flashers P. flavianalis and P. lineopunctatus.

So it looks like this combination is roughly what I will go with, Thanks for the advice! Any other suggestions as far as the wrasses are still welcome!

I was just out drilling holes in my tank and wanted a break so I am searching for more stocking suggestions. This time on suitable tank mates for these wrasses.

What gets along well with these? Again, tank is a standard 4' 120. A few of my favorites might have some problems:

Yellow assessor , A flavissimus,( I had one for years and loved it) Is this in too much of the same niche that it will lead to problems?

Orchid Dottyback, P.fridmani: Never had one but I think they are stunning. Too aggressive for the wrasses? If this doesn't work, would a black capped basslet be a possible substitute? I had a royal Gramma once and he was aggressive but only in his small territory.

Nemateleotris, firefish Again, never kept one but I like them. Are they too shy for this stocking list?

These are the ones that I really like that I am most unsure about. I am open to any advice or suggestions!

Thanks again wrasse lovers, you have me so fired up!

[eatbreakfast]

Yellow assessor , A flavissimus,( I had one for years and loved it) Is this in too much of the same niche that it will lead to problems?

Orchid Dottyback, P.fridmani: Never had one but I think they are stunning. Too aggressive for the wrasses? If this doesn't work, would a black capped basslet be a possible substitute? I had a royal Gramma once and he was aggressive but only in his small territory.

Nemateleotris, firefish Again, never kept one but I like them. Are they too shy for this stocking list?

These are the ones that I really like that I am most unsure about. I am open to any advice or suggestions!

Thanks again wrasse lovers, you have me so fired up!

The Assesor and Firefish should be fine with fairy and flasher wrasses, I have kept them in the past with wrasses with no problem, and I always have firefish with them and they do just fine. I would recomend adding the assesor and firefish before the wrasses though.

The orchid dottyback is one of the more peaceful dottybacks and usually behave themselves with wrasses, just add the wrasses before the dottyback.
If you decide to go for the gramma instead, I have also had success keeping them with wrasses without issue so you should be fine there as well.

[hogfanreefer]

I have both a fire fish (N. magnifica) and a Royal Gramma with my wrasse without problem. The fire fish is shy and should be first in as noted above. The gramma will occasionally do his open mouth display but only right in front of his hidey hole.

[GoldeneyeRet]

Awesome feedback, thanks.
One of my other favorites is a Randall goby. I had one paired with a shrimp for a long time, will not be getting a shrimp this time.

Here are some others I see that could be part of this community, let me know if you see any problems or have any suggestions.

Rainford goby, Had one, enjoyed it
Clown goby, perhaps the green or black-- Never had one
Barnacle or tailspot blenny, never kept a blenny other than a PIA LMB
Mandarin? never had one, don't really love them but my wife likes them.

Any problems that you see? Any other suggestions to add some variety?

Thanks again for all the help.

Back to drilling I go, sure does take a while!

[hogfanreefer]

Wow, I also have a Randall's goby as well as a Yasha's (both with pistol shrimp) and they do fine with my 9 wrasse (including 3 Halichoeres).

If you want a mandarin, stay away from Halichoeres. My 3 make sure copepods don't last long in my tank. Fuge is crawling with them but hardly ever see anything but really scared amphipods in my DT.

[GoldeneyeRet]

Hmm.... I had not considered the Halichoeres. It is getting harder to choose...

[hogfanreefer]

This is my Vrolik's wrasse. He's a little bigger than this pic now.

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f164/huntindoc/aquarium/Vrolikswrasse2_zps2bf5331c.jpg

[GoldeneyeRet]

That's is a beautiful fish! What are the other 2 Halichoeres you have? And how big is that Vroliks?

[hogfanreefer]

Other two are H. chrysus and H. claudia. The Vrolik's is about 4 1/2"

[GoldeneyeRet]

You wrasse lovers have been so helpful, I have to ask some more.

I am at the point in my build that I want to decide between a Mandy and a Halicheores or two. My wife likes the Mandy, but the wrasses might be very nice to add.

Mandy probably should have a Fuge, but the H. wrasses would not, correct? They are voracious pod eaters but do not require them, right?

Halicheores would need deeper sand. I have been reading anywhere from 1 to 3 inches. How much do I really need to keep them snug in bed?

Finally, how invert safe are they? I have read that H. biocellatus, H. chyrus, and H. iridis are fairly easy on the CUC. Do yall agree with that?

Those three look like they are the leading candidates for me, any other suggestions? Smallish, as peaceful as possible and more invert friendly are the criteria for me.

Hunter, your article continues to be of enormous help, THANK YOU!

[eatbreakfast]

As a wrasse lover, I would steer you toward wrasses over a mandarin any day.

IME Halichoeres wrasses are easier to keep than a mandarin, and although they do pick at pods all day a refugium is not necassary for success, just a few feedings a day.

They definitely need sand to sleep in at night, but they only need enough to cover their bodies. 2" is usually more than sufficient.

The 3 species you listed above are all on the peaceful and relatively CUC safe end of the spectrum. I have personally never had a problem with any of these going after my inverts, but as they get larger it is still possible, though unlikely.

[griseum]

How about some of the pseudojuloides spp? The pencil wrasses...
I believe, IME, that they are much less abundant at most LFS, but there are several species that are quite beautiful!
I'm wrasse lover in training, my collection consists of C. rhomboidalis and C. earlei, in a Marshall Island Display. And a largy Mystery wrasse as well, in another system.

D-man- you have a very nice collection it sounds. Do you have a thread with pics you could PM a link too?

OP you will definitely not regret fairy/flasher wrasses as IMO Cirrhilabrus genus alone encompasses some of the most colorful and beautiful reef fish around.

Good luck!

[GoldeneyeRet]

Thanks for the advice so far. I will look into pencil wrasses a little more.

I forgot to ask if there is a specific grain size sand required or preferred by the burrowing wrasses?

[eatbreakfast]

Pseudojuloides are a little more difficult than flasher, fairy and Halichoeres wrasses, as they do not ship well at all, the difficulty level being more along the lines of Macropharyngodon or Anampses wrasses. Once established they are hardy enough, but when kept with other wrasses males have a tendancy to revert back to female.

[evolved]

Hunter, your article continues to be of enormous help, THANK YOU!
Thank you

As a wrasse lover, I would steer you toward wrasses over a mandarin any day.

IME Halichoeres wrasses are easier to keep than a mandarin, and although they do pick at pods all day a refugium is not necassary for success, just a few feedings a day.

They definitely need sand to sleep in at night, but they only need enough to cover their bodies. 2" is usually more than sufficient.

The 3 species you listed above are all on the peaceful and relatively CUC safe end of the spectrum. I have personally never had a problem with any of these going after my inverts, but as they get larger it is still possible, though unlikely.
I don't have much more to say then what was just said here, except I feel 1" of sand is all you need - you'll end up with spots which are deeper than an inch from the flow within the tank. And they're good at finding the deeper spots too.

How about some of the pseudojuloides spp? The pencil wrasses...
I believe, IME, that they are much less abundant at most LFS, but there are several species that are quite beautiful!
I'm wrasse lover in training, my collection consists of C. rhomboidalis and C. earlei, in a Marshall Island Display. And a largy Mystery wrasse as well, in another system.
eatbreakfast is more experienced than I with the pencils, but they're typically on the delicate side. I would only recommend them to those with experience keeping wrasses.
You scared me with the mystery bit there for a second; glad to read it's in another system! :)

I forgot to ask if there is a specific grain size sand required or preferred by the burrowing wrasses?
It doesn't need to be sugar sand; just fine enough so they're not prone to cutting themselves when they bury. 3-4mm is fine.

[eatbreakfast]

eatbreakfast is more experienced than I with the pencils, but they're typically on the delicate side. I would only recommend them to those with experience keeping wrasses.


Thanks! I generally agree, but more based on their sensitivity from shipping. If you were able to find on at LFS that has been swimming around and eating for 1 week+ than you are much more likely to be successful(but isn't that true of most fish). What I find to be the biggest drawback with them is that if they are housed with other dominant wrasses i.e. md to lg fairy wrasses and Halichoeres wrasses, the males tend to revert back to female coloration. If they are allowed to be the dominant or only wrasse in a tank, than the males keep their vibrant colors.

[GoldeneyeRet]

Thanks for all the suggestions. I like those pencil wrasses, maybe I will give one a shot if I can find one at a LFS.

Thanks again wrasse lovers!

[GoldeneyeRet]

How about substituting a P.rubricaudalis for the P. flavianalis?

Is the temperament similar? I am struggling with this selection as the yellow fins, Mckosckers and carpenters all look similar, but Im not sure if they really do it for me.

Also, Whats the P. angulatus like? Is that a suitable alternative to the yellowfin? I can post a complete stocking plan if it would be helpful.

Thanks for the continued help.

[evolved]

^ IME, all the ones you mention there are about even on temperament.

[aquaph8]

I agree, but can't pick cause I love them all. Rubricaudalis is very similar to mccoskeri and flavianalis and to non-fish folk they will all appear to be little red fish but to someone as crazy as me they're all very special in their own way. With enough hiding places they all get along great.

[GoldeneyeRet]

Well, I went with the yellowfin , P, flavianalis, as originally suggested. It arrived today and looks fantastic. So far I am very happy with my choice. He is already eating well and acting very normal in QT.

Thank you all for the suggestions, it sure is wonderful to have such experienced and helpful folks to draw upon.