Fair price for a used 180

[andrewkw]

I've been looking for a used tank the past couple of months, seems like used prices have gone up a lot or people are just starting with high prices expecting to be lowballed. I hate it when people lowball me, so I'd like to avoid it but at the same time get a good deal.

The tank I'm looking at is a miracles 180 with starphire front, euro braced but with internal overflows. If I was going to do a custom tank it's not going to have 2 huge overflow boxes in the tank.

[anbosu]

What are you looking to spend?

Do you want to get the Miracles used or built new?

[andrewkw]

Sorry I should have been clear it's a used Miracles 180 with starphire front eurobraced with 2 internal overflows, been for sale for a while.

I'm not sure what the cost new is but I'm guessing 2k? I know a regular AGA 180 is 849, but a new marineland 300DD is about $1550, so once I get to that price point the 300DD becomes more of an option. The point I was trying to make is I don't want to pay much of a premium because it's custom since it's not my idea of custom (i would have done external overflows).

Ideally I am looking at spending less now, run this tank for perhaps 5 years then maybe by then have enough money to upgrade to a custom tank in the 300 range which I'm sure will cost 3,4,5k

[SeedlessOne]

That tank is for sure over 2k. I looked at a 150g from them and it was over 3k.

[andrewkw]

I own 2 miracles tanks, they are not custom 112g and 120g. While they certainly are nice, and have held up fine over the years, I don't see them as substantially better then my perfecto 90 which actually is custom but just size (36x24x24) starphire front and eurobraced.

If you're going to go custom as in a weird size, or stuff like external overflows or the 1 piece eurobracing which seems to be all the rage now that's fine paying extra, but other then the eurobrace (regular) and starphire front this is a stock sized tank.

[ca1ore]

My sense is that sellers overestimate the value of their used tanks. I sold my custom-built 180 four years ago for $100 - but it was 17 years old at the time. If somebody is selling a tank you think is overpriced, then be clear that you think that and make what you think is a fair offer. If they get all in a huff over a 'lowball' offer, that's their problem.

Personally I wouldn't ever pay more than 50% of original cost - and that only for a tank I was reasonable sure was of recent vintage. For anything much older than 3 years, I'd probably not pay more than 25%. You have no way of knowing how old a tank really is, particularly if the seller is not the original owner, and big tanks can be easily abused. As reference, a brand new Marineland 180, during one of their sales, goes for around $800.

[davocean]

I think you have to consider who built it, quality really varies.
So as a different example I'm looking for a cube right now, and I see all these cheaped out built tanks that seem to have fail written all over.
If I find a quality build, while I may expect some deal for being used, I don't mind at all paying 3/4 or so of original price if it still looks new.
Some brands mentioned have had failure issues, might want to look those up and then put a price on your livestock that you plan to put in them, and then add flood damage to that price!

[thegrun]

$500 would seem about right. The seller could probably get more if they are willing to sit on the tank for a long time, but since there is a very small market for a tank that big, $500 seems like a good price.

[davocean]

$500 would seem about right. The seller could probably get more if they are willing to sit on the tank for a long time, but since there is a very small market for a tank that big, $500 seems like a good price.

For a 180g starfire??
That would be a smokin' deal

[thegrun]

I see them around that price fairly regularly. I agree it is a good deal, but it seems close to what the market dictates. You see them listed higher and they just don't sell, eventually the owner drops his price to get rid of the tank. I nearly purchased a 150 Starfire last week for $400, but the overflow was on the wrong side of the tank for where I wanted to use it.

[andrewkw]

Honestly the eurobracing appeals to me more then the starphire. I have a 90g starphire I don't find it that big of a difference but then again its a low light tank not a high light reef. Shadows across the tank from center bracing or the dual bracing that is common on 180s are less appealing to me due to shadowing. I plan on lighting with Kessils.

The seller is asking $1800 for full setup. DELIVERED

"-180 gal Starfire  tank with 2 back built in overflows and euro brace - with 4 return nozzles custom built by Miracles
-Heavy Duty - High End Black Wood Cabinet with hidden Metal Frame and open back
-Danner MAG Drive Return Pump
-SWC 300 gal Skimmer with italian ASKOLL pump and pinwheel
-30 gal custom made Sump 
-20 gal 
- all plumbing
- 3x 250W MH  2x 165W T12 Black Metal Light Canopy - one of the ballasts doesn't work - I used LED lights instead.
- Delivery is tricky as the tank is very heavy and in my basement so I included all this cost - it's less headache for you. Company that brought it in - will deliver it"

I am interested in nothing but the tank and the stand since he's obviously not going to want to separate the stand. I'm guessing it is very tricky to get out of his basement thus he's including delivery. I wouldn't have to bug my one friend with a pickup so delivery certainly appeals to me, however if he's really using a company I will ask for delivery to my driveway and move it into my house myself to save on costs.

This setup has been for sale for many months, I believe he was originally asking 2k maybe more, now 1800

I am thinking something along the lines of 850-900 for tank stand, driveway delivery. If he wants to bring it up his stairs and I can pickup from his place more like 750-800. I'm sure he can sell some of that stuff for some money but a 30g sump does not appeal to me for a 180, I already have a skimmer, MH lighting doesn't interest me ect. I guess it doesn't hurt to ask, but I wanted to get some realistic input on the value of tank. I have been watching used tank prices for quite some time and a regular 180 seems to go anywhere from 200-800 (keep dreaming when they retail for 849). Don't want to overpay or I'd just buy a new tank myself and don't want to be insulting.

[andrewkw]

For comparison there is a marineland 180 not drilled (but not tempered) for 450 OBO on another local used forum. Just the tank.

I want to get a 180g to transfer my 112g in another location in my house. Probably move in a year or less then probably setup the 180 not where I want the final spot to be but near it and then several years down the road go for a 300g tank. Lots of steps but its a long term plan. No point trying to get an 8 foot tank now and have to bring it up and down again.

[davocean]

I think Marineland is a very poor comparison, at least at this time w/ all that I have seen in failure comments.
OP, sometimes it takes a bit to really spot the difference in starfire, I see it right away, but most noticeable for me is in my photographs.
I don't think your deal is out of line at all for a delivered tank of that quality.

[Linkblaze]

Yeah, I'd just make your offer and see what he says. Forget about worrying about "lowball." Anybody who gets upset about getting lowballed shouldn't be selling used stuff. It's all part of the fun.

[JPMagyar]

I agree with the $500 mark. The 2012 prices on Miracle's website list a standard 72x24x24 180 gallon tank at $850 and the stand for $598. Starphire shouldn't add more than $300 so $1750 new. I wouldn't pay more than 30 cents on the dollar for any used tank no matter who made it, and so I think $600 would be VERY generous assuming you are talking about just the tank and stand, but then I would expect at least $400 for delivery since it's really pick up AND delivery making a total of around $1000 for the tank and stand delivered.

Anyways, just another dudes opinion which we all know isn't worth the electrons used to write it :D

[PatW]

The larger tanks, like the 180, are relatively scarce. Starphire aquariums are even more scarce. Sure 33 percent on the dollar is what people have to settle for. But you are looking for a very specific item. I think you might have to pay a bit of a premium to get what you want.