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fishhuman
09/19/2014, 10:54 PM
I know live aquaria is pretty much the best place to buy your fish but was wondering are all their fish sustainably caught( no cyanide)

gbru316
09/19/2014, 11:11 PM
No.

fishhuman
09/19/2014, 11:38 PM
Then is it still a good place to buy fish?

Hzuiel
09/21/2014, 08:27 PM
They have a sections specifically for captive raised coral and fish, shop only out of those sections if you want to support sustainable reefing.

gbru316
09/21/2014, 08:38 PM
Then is it still a good place to buy fish?
Depends on how moral you're feeling and how fat your wallet is.

James77
09/21/2014, 11:15 PM
No.

You know this how?

rwb500
09/22/2014, 12:07 AM
OP, why do you suggest that "sustainable caught" is the same as "no cyanide?" The two are very separate.

stifrk
09/22/2014, 12:17 AM
Give the op a break, they are trying to support safe capture companies. Just answer the question if you know it.

gb530
09/22/2014, 02:47 AM
OP, why do you suggest that "sustainable caught" is the same as "no cyanide?" The two are very separate.

Who wouldn't suggest that? They are directly related, don't quite understand your logic here, lol

gbru316
09/22/2014, 06:15 AM
You know this how?
Assumption based on the most common industry practices. Liveaquaria doesn't capture their own fish, they get them from a distributor.

Zoodiver
09/22/2014, 08:45 AM
Sustainable means not clearing out all of the fish so that the wild population can maintain healthy numbers even with what is being collected by humans no matter what you are using: cyanide,MS222, Quinaldine, nets, hook and line, etc...

Not using cyanide doesn't qualify it as 'sustainable' collection.

Finding an honest collector, then an honest shipper, then an honest distributor/wholesaler, then and honest retailer is almost impossible. One doesn't know what the other is doing. They can say anything they want to sell fish, but very rarely does a seller know the source of the fish, or what they have been through prior to ending up in the retail tank.

hart24601
09/22/2014, 09:27 AM
They do sell captive raised fish, especially divers den. Just keep an eye out.

gb530
09/22/2014, 12:59 PM
It's really not about being in the divers den section, or even on Liveaquaria for that matter. What you should do as a hobbyist is inform yourself on which species of fish/coral you are buying. For example, if you buy a snowflake clownfish or red planet acro, you know they are tank raised specimens. On the other hand, if you buy a blue hippo tang, you should know that this type of fish is almost always caught in the wild from places like Indonesia or the Maldives. Then, looking at which country they come from is important as different countries have different catching practices.

All stores carry sustainable and unsustainable fish/corals, whether online or at your LFS. :beer:

gone fishin
09/22/2014, 01:08 PM
The only way to know for sure how a specimen was collected is to collect it yourself.

I would make the assumption that Live Aquaria would not knowingly participate in the selling of specimens collected under questionable ethical practices. If they did and word got out it would most likely be a severe blow to their bottom line. just my 2 cents.

Zoodiver
09/22/2014, 05:58 PM
Sadly, very few fish coming out of the Pacific are caught by means that most of us would agree with.

gbru316
09/22/2014, 06:05 PM
I would make the assumption that Live Aquaria would not knowingly participate in the selling of specimens collected under questionable ethical practices. If they did and word got out it would most likely be a severe blow to their bottom line. just my 2 cents.

With the volume they sell, I'm not sure it's wise to make that assumption. The vast majority of fish are collected in the most cost effective manner possible. The price reflects this.

A sustainably collected, wild caught maroon clown costs around $100 here in the states. Many fish cost quite a bit more.

There seems to be a great disconnect between what people say they want, and what they actually purchase. When most people are willing to pay the prices of sustainable collection, only then will it become the rule. Until then, sustainable collection is the exception.

fishhuman
09/22/2014, 06:47 PM
I know the difference between sustainability and cyanide fishing now. I love captive bred but I already have clownfish and cardinals and don't want to get into dottybacks as they are aggresive. I spoke to a guy on the phone from liveaquaria and he basically told me the same thing some of you are, that they wouldn't knowingly but since it is the fishermen that catch them sometimes one may slip buy. Right now all the fish on my cart are from places like Hawaii and Australia where I know I can get minimal impact on the enviroment fish. However I have seen many fish I like from Indonesia which isn't good and wanted to know if I shouldn't get from their or should.

syrinx
09/22/2014, 09:36 PM
The fish are the proof of the collection methods. If you have a supplier that consitantly has fish that dont do well- you change the supplier. If the fish live- they likely have been collected and handled in a safe manner. As far as numbers collected and exported- that is up to individual gov. agencies to decide.

animalkingdom
09/23/2014, 07:52 AM
The fish are the proof of the collection methods. If you have a supplier that consitantly has fish that dont do well- you change the supplier. If the fish live- they likely have been collected and handled in a safe manner. As far as numbers collected and exported- that is up to individual gov. agencies to decide.

+1 If the fish don't do well change suppliers. Although I think we put too much faith in government agencies...

GreshamH
09/23/2014, 03:50 PM
Sustainable means not clearing out all of the fish so that the wild population can maintain healthy numbers even with what is being collected by humans no matter what you are using: cyanide,MS222, Quinaldine, nets, hook and line, etc...

Not using cyanide doesn't qualify it as 'sustainable' collection.

Finding an honest collector, then an honest shipper, then an honest distributor/wholesaler, then and honest retailer is almost impossible. One doesn't know what the other is doing. They can say anything they want to sell fish, but very rarely does a seller know the source of the fish, or what they have been through prior to ending up in the retail tank.

LA uses a few wholesalers but mainly one... one highly known for controlling their "short chain collections (that should be a massive hint to you). While you can;t always be positive, this is one I would bank on.

Agreed on the sustainable part of your post :)

GreshamH
09/23/2014, 03:53 PM
Sadly, very few fish coming out of the Pacific are caught by means that most of us would agree with.

That is utterly disagree with. There are numerous locals in the Pacific with very legit collection practices. SI, MI, Palau, Fiji, AU, Guam, Tonga, Hawaii, SoC, and many more.

CODE3EMT
09/23/2014, 04:30 PM
gb530 is correct. Most captive raised fish are going to be clowns, cardinals, etc.
Your limited to those selection of fish. Real fish like Angels, Tangs, Butterfly's, Wrasse, etc. are not captive bred.
IMO..... just buy the fish you find desirable and will be compatible in your aquarium and enjoy the hobby. Thinking of where they came from, how many are left, or how they were caught is all academic IMO.

Jrhunter0000
09/23/2014, 05:28 PM
I love la but i never had any issues with saltwaterfish.com some have i always had good luck.