New Mandarin in Hiding. Normal Behavior?

[cody6766]

I added a Mandarin to my 120g the other day and I've barely seen it. It headed to a clear spot behind the rocks when I added it and hasn't really moved since. I see him in different places in the clear area, but he doesn't venture out. I added him Friday. None of the other fish are aggressive, or even showing interest in him. He was active in the tank at the LFS, but he was the only fish in there.

Are they typically shy upon introduction or could something else be going on?

[wrott]

Yes, it's probably hunting all of the pods that thought they were safe hiding behind LR.
Mine hides when I enter the room, but I catch a glimpse of her every other day or so--they are tough little beasts.
It should do fine in a 120g if you don't already have pod eaters.

[snorvich]

If he does not move in his rock hide out, possibilities are that he is being intimidated, he is still too new to come out, or he was captured with cyanide. If you can see him, check to see if he is pecking at the rock, and if so, how frequently.

[snorvich]

What fish are in this tank?

[cody6766]

Other fish are:
Small Kole tang
Medium Foxface
Black Occ Clown pair
YWG
Yellow Tailed Damsel
Purple Stripe Dottyback

The dottyback is the one I would be concerned with if I saw my list, but it's really docile. It only pushed around the yellowtail when I added it, and then lost all interest in it. It's in and out of the rocks doing fish things, not bothering anything else in the tank. I haven't seen it poking around the hole the mandarin is hiding in at all. The clowns don't have claimed territory either. They just cruise the tank and keep to themselves.

I've seen him peck pods on a few occasions, but it's really hard to get a good look in his cave. He may be doing it more than I've seen.

[snorvich]

Give it more time. If it is simply "new fish syndrome" he will be out and about.

[cody6766]

Well, he came out tonight, shortly after my last post, but he came out sideways. He was very clearly sick, so I moved him to the fuge because of the abundance of pods if he somehow makes it, and because it will be easier to remove him when he dies. He's on his side and probably not going to make it through the night. I drip acclimated for a few hours, so I'm guessing he was ill from collection. It's a shame...he's a really pretty fish. I may try to track down an ORA mandy for the next one.

[snorvich]

Well, he came out tonight, shortly after my last post, but he came out sideways. He was very clearly sick, so I moved him to the fuge because of the abundance of pods if he somehow makes it, and because it will be easier to remove him when he dies. He's on his side and probably not going to make it through the night. I drip acclimated for a few hours, so I'm guessing he was ill from collection. It's a shame...he's a really pretty fish. I may try to track down an ORA mandy for the next one.

Very mixed results with ORA mandarins. I do not recommend. Find a healthy wild caught for best results. I am pretty sure this one was a cyanide issue.

[snorvich]

In general, when shopping for a mandarin, look for mandarins that are in kept in tanks with a large ball of chaeto. Healthy mandarins will "peck" at a copepod at least 5-6 times per minute on average. The test food I use for supplied food is Nutramar Ova but supplied food is not going to be sufficient to maintain this fish long term.

[cody6766]

Noted on the ORA mandarins. The reviews I read were similar. At the LFS (a reputable one), the fish was moving about and seemed healthy. I didn't watch for signs of feeding because I was in a bit of a rush, but I'm guessing the stress of the move pushed what was an already ill fish over the edge. It's a shame too, because he was a large, beautiful fish. His color was better than a lot I've seen. Oh well, better to lose a $25 fish than a $250 one...but losing fish still sucks. Thanks for the advice. I'll be mandy shopping in a few days.

[MondoBongo]

is he definitely gone then? i'm sorry for your loss.

[cody6766]

Yes, i flushed him last night. He was floating before lights out. Hopefully I'll find a nice replacement today. If not, i can probably bring one home in about 2 weeks, given time for the lfs to order and in-store qt.

[wrott]

"drip acclimated for a few hours"
You really should have new fish in the tank no more than ~30min from opening the bag. They will suffocate and are stressed even more by prolonging acclimation.

[cody6766]

It was probably more like with an hour to an hour and a half. I'm not sure why I said a few hours...maybe the wine? haha. He was moved to a wide container, not the bag, for acclimation. I use a translucent pitcher for smaller fish. There is plenty of surface area for gas exchange. I've been doing this for fish and corals for a few years with no issues except this fish. I normally spend half and hour to an hour, depending on water volume in the pitcher and drip rate.
I'll read up on shorter periods,though. Just because I've been doing something one way doesn't mean it's not excessive or the best way.

[snorvich]

Yes, i flushed him last night. He was floating before lights out. Hopefully I'll find a nice replacement today. If not, i can probably bring one home in about 2 weeks, given time for the lfs to order and in-store qt.

I recommend that you quarantine. In store quarantine is simply asking for problems.

[cody6766]

I know I should QT, but I don't have the space to set up a tank. I'd probably go through the effort if I was adding a few tangs or if I had quite a few more fish to add, but I think the risk is worth the trade for space and effort saved. If I had a tank full of sensitive fish or planned to add them I'd definitely do it. I also know that the excuse everyone uses right before adding the fish that kills the tank. The store's in-store QT is more of a health check than anything. She holds the fish in disconnected tanks for a week to make sure they're healthy and eating. She won't sell them if they look questionable or not eating. It isn't a bare bottom QT with meds and all.

I added a new mandarin the other day and he seems to be doing very well. He's rarely seen, but when he is he's pod hunting. He was moving about the tank an hour or 2 after I added him, so I think the previous one was sick from collection or shipping.

I think I'm going to add a few crushed coral piles near the back of the tank to encourage pod growth. I have a fuge, but the skimmer and return pump share a chamber, so I'm sure I lose a few that way. I remember snorkeling and seeing rubble piles just teeming with life. Hopefully a few small piles of crushed coral will emulate that in my tank without trapping too much detritus. I have really fine sand that's packed pretty tight, so they aren't able to hide and reproduce there.

[HPark]

It was probably more like with an hour to an hour and a half. I'm not sure why I said a few hours...maybe the wine? haha. He was moved to a wide container, not the bag, for acclimation. I use a translucent pitcher for smaller fish. There is plenty of surface area for gas exchange. I've been doing this for fish and corals for a few years with no issues except this fish. I normally spend half and hour to an hour, depending on water volume in the pitcher and drip rate.
I'll read up on shorter periods,though. Just because I've been doing something one way doesn't mean it's not excessive or the best way.

As someone that has gotten in and out of the hobby several times over the past 10-15 years or so, I think the advice on this question has changed somewhat. It's still important to avoid a dramatic change in salinity (especially lower to higher from what I've been told) but this can be accomplished by matching the qt water beforehand to the tank the fish is coming from.

For what it's worth - since I started speeding up the acclimation process (matching qt water to bag beforehand) I haven't lost a new arrival that would have been due to the acclimation. Not saying I lost a ton before with drip but they certainly seem to adjust more quickly with a shorter acclimation.