Trouble keeping SPS

[x2boarder]

Hey guys, I am having problems keeping SPS alive. Right now I have a Stylo that is losing the battle as well as a birdsnest (I think it's dead) and some month that isn't too happy.

I have a 150G tank with live rock. I use a RW-15 propeller pump on random mode for circulation. I am also skimming and have a cheato sump with a phosban reactor.

My levels are all normal

Temp 76.5

Ammonia,nitrite,nitrate 0/0/0

Dkh 9

Calcium 440/460


Any help would be awesome. I keep polyps, anemone, LPS, andhttp://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15/01/25/cf472cf710c192a795a073b4fc4951fb.jpghttp://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15/01/25/50afe47333702551dd0564b9798761e9.jpghttp://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15/01/25/74fe77473e364062eb5a50af1b5220c2.jpg mushrooms with no problems.

[toothman]

I have better success with: tank temp 78-79, nitrates 1-2, kh 7-8, 9 is too high, what type of light do you have? You could add some sodium nitrate to raise it. What are your phosphates and what do you use to test it. There are some great tanks with higher phosphate but I think it is easier to keep coral healthy with phosphate less than .03 ppm. And welcome to reef central.

[milto29]

When I had problems with my monti. It was that I had too much GFO in my reactor. I found out the hard way. That it has to be right on.

[Mark9]

What are running for lights?

[x2boarder]

Phosphates are 0.00 according to my test kit (API) I do run GFO but not sure I need to anymore. I had a major bloom about 9 months ago after a crash. Since then everything has been stable so I just kept running it.

I am running AI LEDs 2x over my tank. 70w/85B/85RB are my current settings. I don't have a par meter, but they are way brighter. Than my old MH (had LEDs for 2 years now, just tried SPS about 3 months ago)

How would I lower my kh?

Also, temp is something I am experimenting with. I live in the frozen tundra so it's hard to get my tank that warm without heaters running 24/7. I have a basement sump too

[Mark9]

I wouldn't consider 9 high, I run around 8.4.

[Travis.K]

having same problem here with montis and deepwater acros. im convinced its the LED's as i have just converted to Hydra52s a few weeks ago and thats when my troubles started. Im positive i started them out on the tank too high intensity, too low to the tank, and too long during the day. i have them at 70% acclimation mode right now and i will see if things improve. Most people that have LEDs on SPS tanks that ive read have the same problem at first with being too intense too quickly

[x2boarder]

I pulled the frags from a LFS that had them under T5s, they said my LEDs were not strong enough...so I placed them middle and moved to high over the weeks. I am thinking I bleached them?

Live aquaria says 8-12 is the range, but you can't trust everything you read online....

Can someone help me slowly lower and I'll keep track?

Here is a shot of the monti I took today.

http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15/01/25/b6f5e196614bb2595bf554bea5190534.jpghttp://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15/01/25/58f6b208a5f0c0250ef0f337379753f7.jpg

[smtank]

The local fish store told your AI's were not strong enough? as in intensity?

I have Hydra, I am running them at 30% acclimation because anything else was too strong. My tank is a shallow tank though.

I would consider stopping your GFO since the algae issue has past, since your tank has no detectable phosphate and or low nitrate I would also let the alk drift down.

[x2boarder]

How do I let it go down? I don't dose for it...it's just what it is naturally

[smtank]

Back off your water changes if you're doing them routinely and see if it drifts down. Once coralline algae sets in really well the value will drift down quicker, same for when you add larger colonies or your existing colonies begin to grow at a quicker rate.

If you can not get the value to come down using those methods then try and let the phos and nitrate drift up just a little. It's all about balance, I have to run a lower alk the lower my N/P values are, that just my experience.

[x2boarder]

Coralline is growing everywhere. I can't keep it off the glass!

[toothman]

try adding some fauna marin, organics.
I would also purchase a hanna 736 phos. meter
Nitrates of zero is a problem in my tank, try purchasing salifert nitrate.

Api test kits are great for ca and kh

I would also say 9 kh is ok for some systems depends what your phosphate is, if you run a low phosphate tank 7-8 is much better, nsw is 7.2

[x2boarder]

Now that I think about it too, I am adding almost 1 - 1.5 gallons per day of fresh top off.

[reefology1]

fresh top off? any kalk in it? what do you dose? what salt are you using? need more info and maybe a full tank pic.

btw, alk is fine. i would guess low nutrients but need reliable test kits. i would also take gfo off line slowly over course of couple weeks at least.

[Pife]

How new is your tank? Have you ever kept coral before?

[x2boarder]

The fresh water is RO/DI and I just checked my TDS and it's between 2 & 3. I don't add anything to my water, aquarium or top off water. I rely on water changes to get the grace elements and honestly never had a problem with my other corals before.

I am using Instant Ocean salt mix.

This tank is only a little over 2 years now but the rock came from a tank that I had for about 6 years overall. I have kept easy corals and anemones for about 5 years, but always had trouble with SPS. Mainly lighting in my old tank.

Here are some pics of the full tank and a few happy corals for good measure.


http://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15/01/28/cbfb5da5dee1e39866e463f08a4059ae.jpghttp://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15/01/28/fc542662c7aae96868dabbc5413a5482.jpghttp://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15/01/28/abf6d2cfa95fd836e188b65e7e88e80e.jpghttp://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15/01/28/e8cfe2ef65adb9c3fd4bdc935dacb192.jpghttp://tapatalk.imageshack.com/v2/15/01/28/2b55d89aadf401856fb93bcaf1e70b5f.jpg

[Mandrake]

How old are your RODI filters? TDS should be 0

[x2boarder]

About 3 months. I think I need to clean my container tho, I am pretty sure the output is still 0.

[reefology1]

No Tds is never zero in ro water, that's ro/di...2 or 3 is excellent!

Large hammer (which is really nice btw) and zoas, how long have they been in there?

They like high nutrients more so than SPS so if they're thriving it's likely not that. Though I like to see some detectable levels of both N03 and P04 on a decent test kit.

Most SPS need lots of current so I would check out some YouTube videos of SPS tanks to get an idea. Current is a somewhat tricky thing to get right. You want a lot of indirect current to bring food and nutrients to while pushing waste away from your corals. I have 20x internal flow and still blast my corals once a week with a baster to make sure nothing has settled on then.

As for lighting, I believe new additions should be left in indirect light for at least a week while they become accustomed to water conditions (which btw is the most critical and complex part of keeping SPS), then if they look ok, should be moved up and watched for changes in polyp extension and color. If you notice a change then, you know it's likely the lighting.

Many reefers use IO salt (myself included) and it's a good salt, but like most can change from batch to batch. As a general rule, I test the big 3 (cal, mag, alk) every new bucket and usually have to add calcium and magnesium to get my ratios right. IO usual is high in alk so I wouldn't worry too much as long as you bump up the other 2 to keep things balanced.

Hope that helps.

edit: sorry my bad, you did sat ro/di...3 is still excellent and not the problem, also stated N03 and P04 were undetectable :)

[jminick2]

Some corals just don't do well switching from t5 to led the have to be properly acclimated even then sometimes they die.

[reefology1]

Some corals just don't do well switching from t5 to led the have to be properly acclimated even then sometimes they die.

i think he switched from MH and he had LED's when he got the SPS, but point well taken, acclimation is vital.

[x2boarder]

Large hammer (which is really nice btw) and zoas, how long have they been in there?


I have had that for 4 years? It came over from my other tank. It started as one head and now I have 3 colonies of 5+ heads, it grows like a weed!


Most SPS need lots of current so I would check out some YouTube videos of SPS tanks to get an idea. Current is a somewhat tricky thing to get right. You want a lot of indirect current to bring food and nutrients to while pushing waste away from your corals. I have 20x internal flow and still blast my corals once a week with a baster to make sure nothing has settled on then.


I am running a single RW-15 right now, it is on "else" mode, which is a random current and is causing issues with my argonite sand, I am going to be converting to a heavier sand to stop it from blowing around the tank so much.

i think he switched from MH and he had LED's when he got the SPS, but point well taken, acclimation is vital.

Yes, I switched from MH to LED's (the zoas and hammer were under those lights). But the frags that I just lost (birds and green monti) were from a pet store with T5s. The red monti is still hanging on, but I am worried about it.

Should I be testing for anything else? I don't have a magnesium test, but I'm not sure I need to be testing for that if everything else is inline.

[reefology1]

Should I be testing for anything else? I don't have a magnesium test, but I'm not sure I need to be testing for that if everything else is inline.

you'll need to test mag if you plan to stick with sps but i highly doubt its an issue now/here.

did you dip your frags when you got them and have you checked for pests?

oh, also wanted to ask if your cheto is growing?

[x2boarder]

I do plan to keep them, some of my personal favorites are SPS but I just never succeed. I am determined to change that!!!

I did not dip them, but I do have a dip that I could have (should have) probably used. I have looked for red bugs, etc and never saw them. I do have a plethora of micro brittle stars and them seem to like the underside of the SPS but no indication they are harming it?

Cheato is not really growing. It has stayed very green but not changed in size or density in quite some time. I run light 24/7

[reefology1]

Ok so most likely scenerio is it was the acclimation but there's not much you can do at this point regarding turning things around. I would almost always move them to less light because that causes less stress to the animal and gives you the greatest opportunity to make adjustments. However in your case I'm still not sure if we're dealing with too much or not enough.

You should try feeding them and adding amino acids to aid recovery.

Good luck.

[x2boarder]

Well, I ended up killing my Stylo from too much light. I had been fine with it for almost 4 months and when my LFS said I didn't have enough light I turned things up to 95% over the course of 2 weeks and now the Stylo is dead too. After finding a forum about my lights and most people with my size tank run them about 65%...

I just want to save my monti now. Can you recommend a brand for me to get? I don't have a store within 2 hours of my house so I will need to order it online.

[reefology1]

i feed diy and cyclopeeze but you can try coral frenzy or reef roids once or twice a week. Acropower for amino acids.

hope this helps.

[milto29]

Well, I ended up killing my Stylo from too much light. I had been fine with it for almost 4 months and when my LFS said I didn't have enough light I turned things up to 95% over the course of 2 weeks and now the Stylo is dead too. After finding a forum about my lights and most people with my size tank run them about 65%...

I just want to save my monti now. Can you recommend a brand for me to get? I don't have a store within 2 hours of my house so I will need to order it online.


Stop using GFO and switch your lights to 10k for a couple of weeks, also get some Polyp Booster and some Reef Chili and let it ride. It's going to take a couple of days for you to see changes. Your killing them with too much GFO. Trust me I went threw it.

[x2boarder]

I shut off the GFO last weekend, I have noticed an up tick in glass algae but nothing major. I reduced the lights down some and have been feeding reefchili since last night (just came in the mail)

I also got a magnesium test kit and I am in the 1400 range.

[x2boarder]

On other thing, when you said dial lights back to 10k, do you think my spectrum could be causing issues?