Total ammonia calculator

[cliera]

Hello, i wish to know how i can calculate the total amonia nitrogen (NH3+NH4) from NH4-N (or NH3-N), that's because i have a ISE sensor for NH4-N but i need to calculate TAN using this sensor.

Thank you so much.

[rwb500]

is this for an aquarium? there is no purpose to this for aquarium purposes. both should/will be zero.

[cliera]

is this for an aquarium? there is no purpose to this for aquarium purposes. both should/will be zero.

That's is because i have a scholar proyect, to grow lobster and geoduck. The biologist use colorimetric test (0 mg/l to 8 mg/L), and he need to sense this same valor automatic with some electronic equipment, using a ISE sensor NH4-N.

The pH from the farm is 7.00 to 9.00, and temperatura 15 to 30 celcius degrees

[Dan_P]

Hello, i wish to know how i can calculate the total amonia nitrogen (NH3+NH4) from NH4-N (or NH3-N), that's because i have a ISE sensor for NH4-N but i need to calculate TAN using this sensor.

Thank you so much.

The amount of free ammonia depends on the pH and temperature. Since you know NH4 amount and the equlibrium constant, can't you estimate the amount of NH3 that must be present? Are you asking for a formula or table?

[cliera]

Yes, I ask for a formula :), I know the Emerson equation (obtain the fraction of NH3 from a know TAN measure) that need pH and temperature, but I need to convert NH4-N from the measure of an ISE sensor, to NH4/NH3, in orden to have the same measure using colorimetric test (0 mg/L to 8 mg/L).

This calculator does that thing, but I what to program a microcontroller to do that automatic. http://www.hamzasreef.com/Contents/Calculators/TotalAmmonia.php

[Dan_P]

Have you tried contacting the author of the ammonia calculator to see if he will just guve you the equations?

If he refuses, let me know.

Dan

[Dan_P]

Hello, i wish to know how i can calculate the total amonia nitrogen (NH3+NH4) from NH4-N (or NH3-N), that's because i have a ISE sensor for NH4-N but i need to calculate TAN using this sensor.

Thank you so much.

It took me about fifteen minutes to find the formula on the Internet using Google, which I am happy to share, for the price of answering the following question: Why didn't you use Google?

I admit though that contacting a salt water aquarium forum was clever except that forums aren't a peer reviewed sources of information. Kinda risky for your project.

Dan

[bertoni]

This might help:

http://www.google.co.jp/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=9&ved=0CFEQFjAI&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ecy.wa.gov%2Fprograms%2Fwq%2Fpermits%2FPermitCalcJanuary2014.xlsm&ei=rmUNVfr5DYTKmwWS4YDgDg&usg=AFQjCNHW-r2Iz2dB6i2byfCP8McXbkOVcg&bvm=bv.88528373,d.dGY&cad=rja

[Dan_P]

This might help:

http://www.google.co.jp/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=9&ved=0CFEQFjAI&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ecy.wa.gov%2Fprograms%2Fwq%2Fpermits%2FPermitCalcJanuary2014.xlsm&ei=rmUNVfr5DYTKmwWS4YDgDg&usg=AFQjCNHW-r2Iz2dB6i2byfCP8McXbkOVcg&bvm=bv.88528373,d.dGY&cad=rja

This looks like a great collection of spreadsheets!

[cliera]

It took me about fifteen minutes to find the formula on the Internet using Google, which I am happy to share, for the price of answering the following question: Why didn't you use Google?

I admit though that contacting a salt water aquarium forum was clever except that forums aren't a peer reviewed sources of information. Kinda risky for your project.

Dan

That's because I don't know so much about aquarium chemistry (Im an electronic engineer), I only know how to obtain the fraction of NH3 by know TAN measure, using Emerson equation (but I need to do inversely). I asked the biologist in charge of the aquarium where I work , but always uses the colorimetric method (indicating 0 mg / L to 8 mg / L of TAN ), annex the picture.

So, they want to use a ISE sensor NH4-N, to obtain the same value of TAN in the picture, so I am programming a microcontroller for an automatic measure, that's why I am looking some help :)

Thank you so much.

http://www.americanaquariumproducts.com/images/graphics/ammoniacolor2.jpg

[cliera]

This looks like a great collection of spreadsheets!

Thank you so much, Im working to understand how the equations works :), I sorry to many questions here, I was a little confused, because some companies use NH4 as TAN, others use NH3, or NH4/NH3, with different criterion of units, so i don't know how i can use that type of ISE sensors, in orden to measure the same as the colorimetric Kits.

[cliera]

Have you tried contacting the author of the ammonia calculator to see if he will just guve you the equations?

If he refuses, let me know.

Dan

Yes i send a email, but no response in many weeks :(, but i see he was in this forum, so i asking a little help :)

[Dan_P]

Thank you so much, Im working to understand how the equations works :), I sorry to many questions here, I was a little confused, because some companies use NH4 as TAN, others use NH3, or NH4/NH3, with different criterion of units, so i don't know how i can use that type of ISE sensors, in orden to measure the same as the colorimetric Kits.

Take a look at the spreadsheets "bertoni" posted. I will post the equation and explain it to you as well as explain the colorimetric tests. Give me a day or two.

Dan

[Dan_P]

How does one calculate the concentration of ammonia (NH3) in seawater from the measurement of ammonium concentration?

Equation Source

Here is where I found the equation. The first reference also refers to the original source of the equation. A good thing to look into to find out about limitations and assumptions.

http://water.epa.gov/scitech/swguidance/standards/upload/2001_10_12_criteria_ambientwqc_ammoniasalt1989.pdf

http://www.waterboards.ca.gov/waterrights/water_issues/programs/bay_delta/docs/cmnt081712/srcsd/engleatt2.pdf


With the estimate of the fraction of free ammonia from the equation below fNH3, and measured ammonium concentration [NH4], total ammonia concentration as one obtains from colorimetric ammonia tests is calculated by

total [NH3] = [NH4] / (1- fNH3)


http://i1028.photobucket.com/albums/y349/Drfungus137/image.jpg1_zpsnhbwllgm.jpg

[shermanator]

If you want to ballpark it (maybe not acceptable for this application), you can use the pKa of ammonia (~9.3) and the pH. For every pH unit lower than the pKa, you will have 10x more NH4+ than NH3. So at pH 8.3, you would have approximately 10:1 NH4+:NH3.

Of course, it's an equilibrium, so if you have an assay that is using NH3 up, you will alter the equilibrium and make more NH3 that is available to react (LeChatelier's principle).

[cliera]

How does one calculate the concentration of ammonia (NH3) in seawater from the measurement of ammonium concentration?

Equation Source

Here is where I found the equation. The first reference also refers to the original source of the equation. A good thing to look into to find out about limitations and assumptions.

http://water.epa.gov/scitech/swguidance/standards/upload/2001_10_12_criteria_ambientwqc_ammoniasalt1989.pdf

http://www.waterboards.ca.gov/waterrights/water_issues/programs/bay_delta/docs/cmnt081712/srcsd/engleatt2.pdf


With the estimate of the fraction of free ammonia from the equation below fNH3, and measured ammonium concentration [NH4], total ammonia concentration as one obtains from colorimetric ammonia tests is calculated by

total [NH3] = [NH4] / (1- fNH3)


http://i1028.photobucket.com/albums/y349/Drfungus137/image.jpg1_zpsnhbwllgm.jpg

In summary, if i use a ISE sensor of NH4, (by example, I measure 5 mg/L pf NH4), and obtain the fraction of NH3 (using the equation right here), I can calculate the total amonia (as the same values as colorimetric test)?

I look the pdf, i assume the document list the maximun values of total ammonia in seawater, to prevent mortality of marine species.

[cliera]

Take a look at the spreadsheets "bertoni" posted. I will post the equation and explain it to you as well as explain the colorimetric tests. Give me a day or two.

Dan

yes, i was looking the spreadsheets and equations, i assume the document calculates the value of total ammonia, according to the criteria to prevent mortality of marine species.

[Dan_P]

yes, i was looking the spreadsheets and equations, i assume the document calculates the value of total ammonia, according to the criteria to prevent mortality of marine species.

I did not check what the spreadsheet calculated, so I cannot confirm your assumption.