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View Full Version : How effective is your quarantine?


TylerS
04/08/2015, 07:52 PM
I'm interested in finding out how effective your fish quarantine practices are. Specifically how many people regularly consistently quarantine fish for more than 3 weeks but have still had a parasite or disease outbreak at some point (multiple fish sick or dead at approximately the same time due to the same parasite or disease).

I realize some of this is open to interpretation, but if there are enough responses it would still give a good idea of what's going on in peoples tanks I think. I picked 3 weeks due to this article http://www.advancedaquarist.com/blog/quarantining-marine-fish-made-simple suggesting that as a minimum.

I'd be interested in the details if you do quarantine and still had an issue (why do you think you had the outbreak?)

snorvich
04/08/2015, 07:59 PM
My quarantine protocol is in my blog but does not fall into one of your options.

TylerS
04/08/2015, 09:15 PM
My quarantine protocol is in my blog but does not fall into one of your options.

I read some of your blog. In your case you could pick either, I'm mostly interested in if you use thorough quarantine practices and if it's been effective. The prophylactic vs non-prophylactic is more for just some extra info.

Have you ever had a breakout in your display tank?

CHSUB
04/08/2015, 09:26 PM
i used copper for many years and killed many fish. i now use Tank Transfer and one extra week of observation in a well lit QT tank and i'm 100% successful getting fish to the DT alive and parasite free. however, it's a much small sample size then when i used copper and meds.

alton
04/09/2015, 05:28 AM
Acclimation to my water, 1 hour Prazi Pro Bath, up to 20 min. fresh water bath, and into a 100 Rubbermaid tub half full with water from my 300 using a power head, heater, and foam filter. I like having the black sides of the tub with no reflection to excite the fish

snorvich
04/09/2015, 05:48 AM
I read some of your blog. In your case you could pick either, I'm mostly interested in if you use thorough quarantine practices and if it's been effective. The prophylactic vs non-prophylactic is more for just some extra info.

Have you ever had a breakout in your display tank?

I always use tank transfer and Prazipro which eliminates ich and flukes. In this day and time when fish sources run a low level of copper in their system which mask the more virulent parasites such as velvet, brook, uronema, that I must see healthy fish and as such always isolate for four weeks beyond tank transfer. All parasites will always evidence in that period of time; plus it gives new fish time to develop an eating regime with no competition. As your embedded base of valuable fish increases, you will not want to risk any issues. I have been doing this a fairly long time and in the early days I encountered most issues. I want to avoid re-encountering them. :D

iced98lx
04/09/2015, 08:00 AM
I always use tank transfer and Prazipro which eliminates ich and flukes. In this day and time when fish sources run a low level of copper in their system which mask the more virulent parasites such as velvet, brook, uronema, that I must see healthy fish and as such always isolate for four weeks beyond tank transfer. All parasites will always evidence in that period of time; plus it gives new fish time to develop an eating regime with no competition. As your embedded base of valuable fish increases, you will not want to risk any issues. I have been doing this a fairly long time and in the early days I encountered most issues. I want to avoid re-encountering them. :D

The suppression of major problems via copper in wholesale and fish store systems worries me, I'm glad I'm not the only one!

GroktheCube
04/09/2015, 08:19 AM
TTM + Prazi+deworming for fish. After TTM, fish settle into a cycled QT for two days, then first round Prazi. Second a week later. Food with fenbendazole+focus for two three day periods thereafter, with three days between the treatments. Adds up to about a month, which SHOULD be enough time for brook or velvet to show up. I have chloroquine and copper on hand for those. Chloroquine would be choice #1 unless it's a wrasse. I only had velvet show up once. Used FWD to confirm it was velvet and not severe flukes, then started copper. Lost a firefish, but the wrasses pulled through.

I've never had a parasite come in on fish, but I did manage to introduce ich via non-QTed snails before I set up an invert QT.

reefgeezer
04/09/2015, 08:43 AM
None of you options adequately describe my QT process.

1. Tank Transfer then into a bare bottom QT Tank
2. Treat Prazipro for 2 weeks
3. Feed/observe for a minimum of 4 more weeks.

I have quinine and copper based medications I can use at treatment levels should I see a need to use them. I don't use them at prophylactic levels as I believe all that does is cover up a problem.

I have lost a few fish in QT. As a matter of fact, I just lost a small Wrasse at about the 4 week mark :(. Sucks, but better that he died in QT rather than in the display tank.

scooter31707
04/09/2015, 08:45 AM
I honestly think it's a precautionary method which I think is very effective. My buddy quarantine his fish for 8 weeks. His currently stock has been in the tank for 4 months, no issues. One day he put a coral in his DT from his QT (putting his hand in the tank to get a piece of rock to glue the coral on). Well one of the fish was scared I guess and went hiding and did not show their face until the next day. Boom, it was covered in ich just like that. So who knows if that did it or what but 4 months with no issues and in 12 hours you have it.

snorvich
04/09/2015, 09:13 AM
The suppression of major problems via copper in wholesale and fish store systems worries me, I'm glad I'm not the only one!

I have seen far too many examples to not be greatly concerned.

gone fishin
04/09/2015, 09:22 AM
Since I moved here 5 years ago my tank has not had any parasites or diseases.

New fish go into TT then into main QT for 4-5 weeks, work schedule, for a total of 6-7 weeks of QT. Also, during that time they get 2 rounds of prazi. Since you did not mention it I also have a 29 gallon invert only tank that runs all the time. I place corals and any inverts headed to the DT in here for 72 days.

reefgeezer
04/09/2015, 09:29 AM
Since I moved here 5 years ago my tank has not had any parasites or diseases.

New fish go into TT then into main QT for 4-5 weeks, work schedule, for a total of 6-7 weeks of QT. Also, during that time they get 2 rounds of prazi. Since you did not mention it I also have a 29 gallon invert only tank that runs all the time. I place corals and any inverts headed to the DT in here for 72 days.

I think I'll steal that idea. I haven't QT'd inverts but it seems pretty easy and surely can't hurt. Thanks for the idea.

gone fishin
04/09/2015, 09:35 AM
I really like watching the sexy shrimp, porcelain crabs in there. Lately I have been dabbling with some macroalgaes in there.

billdogg
04/09/2015, 10:19 AM
I have been using a QT for several years with great success. I only medicate if I see a need to, just like I would if it were a human. I had never considered QT'ing my inverts/corals, but after a recent pair of losses (a new clam took out a much larger clam I had had for well over a year) I intend to set up a tank just for them and have it running 24/7/365.

design1stcode2n
04/09/2015, 10:43 AM
The more I'm reading about marine Ick and quarantine the more I'm thinking I shouldn't have tried saltwater.

gone fishin
04/09/2015, 11:40 AM
IMO a good QT protocol is what separates long term successful aquarists from those that do not stay around.

A QT protocol does not have to be difficult or expensive. It just requires dedication and commitment.

Silly clownfish
04/09/2015, 12:00 PM
I think your survey would be more accurate if you included snorvich's method as an option. It seems to be widely adopted on this forum. Pretty much what reef geezer and gone fishing describe and doesn't fit in any of your categories. I think you would find it is 99% effective.

CHSUB
04/09/2015, 12:04 PM
The more I'm reading about marine Ick and quarantine the more I'm thinking I shouldn't have tried saltwater.

most in the hobby never qt and some are successful. some of the folks here are on the extreme end of QTing. i've been in the hobby since the early 80' and Reef Central is the only place i've heard of people QTing snails for 72 days. nothing wrong with it, but if you've seen shows like "Extreme Hoarders" you will get the drift...:fun5:

BlackTip
04/09/2015, 12:06 PM
A side, but related question.

Who can say with certainty that his tank is Ich free due to the QT regiment he follow?

And, if not many can say yes, then why everything has to be QT for 72 days, if getting Ich in the tank is inevitable.

hogfanreefer
04/09/2015, 12:06 PM
I guess I misunderstood, I thought using Prazipro was using prophylactic medication so I voted that way.

My QT protocol is patterned after snorvich. TT (usually on arrival unless it's a delicate fish) then 5-6 weeks in a cycled bare bottom QT that only receives fish after they have been through TT.

Since I've been doing it this way I've had zero parasites.

gone fishin
04/09/2015, 12:14 PM
A side, but related question.

Who can say with certainty that his tank is Ich free due to the QT regiment he follow?

And, if not many can say yes, then why everything has to be QT for 72 days, if getting Ich in the tank is inevitable.

I reset my tank up about 5 years ago when I moved here. I do not have ich or any other fish ailment, disease, parasite in my tank.

WayneL333
04/09/2015, 12:25 PM
I always use tank transfer and Prazipro which eliminates ich and flukes. In this day and time when fish sources run a low level of copper in their system which mask the more virulent parasites such as velvet, brook, uronema, that I must see healthy fish and as such always isolate for four weeks beyond tank transfer. All parasites will always evidence in that period of time; plus it gives new fish time to develop an eating regime with no competition. As your embedded base of valuable fish increases, you will not want to risk any issues. I have been doing this a fairly long time and in the early days I encountered most issues. I want to avoid re-encountering them. :D

+1. I follow this same methodology. The only deviation I sometimes use is a 45 min 1ml/ gallon Formalin bath between transfers if I know a fish is prone to a parasite like tangs are to ich.

pledosophy
04/09/2015, 12:25 PM
12 weeks QT for everything that will not survive a revive dip. I keep a 90g setup all the time incase I make an impulse buy

Sk8r
04/09/2015, 01:35 PM
Honestly, I haven't seen ich in the last 10 years. Period. I've seen lymphocystis, once.

Source matters, species matters. Precautions definitely matter.

TylerS
04/09/2015, 05:04 PM
Unfortunately I can't edit the original poll for tank transfer method, but I'm most interested in finding out details of people who are doing extensive quarantine and still had something slip by. What was it and how did it happen? This way I can make sure I don't repeat those mistakes! Then further I was wondering if trends would show up between prophylactic vs non-prophylactic quarantines.

If it really matters I would also consider Prazipro and tank transfer as a "prophylactic" since your doing something to treat a disease or parasite even though you don't see any symptoms. To bad I put the word medication in there or else I think it would be pretty clear.

Thanks for all the responses and comments so far. I've already learned about options that I wasn't aware of!

snorvich
04/09/2015, 05:13 PM
+1. I follow this same methodology. The only deviation I sometimes use is a 45 min 1ml/ gallon Formalin bath between transfers if I know a fish is prone to a parasite like tangs are to ich.

Which is a good idea.

woodnaquanut
04/09/2015, 05:35 PM
Honestly, I haven't seen ich in the last 10 years. Period.


If you need a reminder you could come by my LFS. :thumbdown

Twenty+ tanks sharing the same water. New fish every week. It's like living in an ER waiting room!

WayneL333
04/09/2015, 05:55 PM
Which is a good idea.

I don't want to take credit for this though. This insightful protocol was bestowed upon me by Karen. This is what she told me they did at the Waikiki aquarium with great success.

serbusfish
04/09/2015, 07:40 PM
Here's some controversy for ya'll. I was planning to set up a 10 gallon quarantine tank, but I talked to a guy at my LFS about it. He told me as long as I buy healthy looking fish from their store that are shown to be eating I wont need a quarantine tank. Unlike a lot of shops they dont run any copper in the systems, and salinity is kept at 1.026 like most hobbyist reef tanks. He told me if I were to quarantine a fish and expose it to copper, once it is transferred to the main tank where there is no copper present its immune system will be compromised and the chance of it getting ill will be significantly increased. Also, he made the point that white spot/ich is present all the time in our tanks, it is fish stress that allows the parasite to attack its host, a healthy stress free fish wont get it.

The bottom line from the conversation was stress leads to problems, so what do you think is more stressful for a fish, an hour or so journey home in a bag resulting in it being put it into a small, uncycled empty tank, or getting it home, doing proper acclimation and transferring it straight into a large properly decorated home?

He said neither him or Snowy (another guy that works there, VERY knowledge dude) run quarantine tanks, and they have never had problems with fish disease. He admitted of course that if you buy fish from places that use copper or if you ship fish long distances it would be a different story, but otherwise quarantine tanks can cause more problems than they solve.

Im sure few here will agree with this advice, but I thought I would just throw it out there. I trust the guys at my LFS, they arent your average run of the mill store, they wont sell you stuff if your tank or whatever isnt suitable, when I set my tank up Snowy told me dont rush it, I said i'll try, and he bluntly said you will or I wont sell stuff to you!

snorvich
04/09/2015, 08:06 PM
Here's some controversy for ya'll. I was planning to set up a 10 gallon quarantine tank, but I talked to a guy at my LFS about it. He told me as long as I buy healthy looking fish from their store that are shown to be eating I wont need a quarantine tank. Unlike a lot of shops they dont run any copper in the systems, and salinity is kept at 1.026 like most hobbyist reef tanks. He told me if I were to quarantine a fish and expose it to copper, once it is transferred to the main tank where there is no copper present its immune system will be compromised and the chance of it getting ill will be significantly increased. Also, he made the point that white spot/ich is present all the time in our tanks, it is fish stress that allows the parasite to attack its host, a healthy stress free fish wont get it.



Which is why many of us do not trust LFS recommendations.

mitchrapp
04/09/2015, 08:16 PM
Yeah, I was surprised when I went to one LFS, who is a gold sponsor of my local reef club, highly respected, highly spoken of, blah blah blah. Proudly told me that they don't QT any of their fish, they just dip them in a specially formulated solution developed by some PhD microbiologist just for them. Tried to talk me out of QT'ing my fish, saying it only added stress. Didn't listen to him and Qt'd anyways and good thing I did. Bam, next day, dead fish in QT, from what I suspect was brook or velvet. I suspect they were running a low level of copper in their system.

CHSUB
04/10/2015, 06:20 AM
Here's some controversy for ya'll. I was planning to set up a 10 gallon quarantine tank, but I talked to a guy at my LFS about it. He told me as long as I buy healthy looking fish from their store that are shown to be eating I wont need a quarantine tank. Unlike a lot of shops they dont run any copper in the systems, and salinity is kept at 1.026 like most hobbyist reef tanks. He told me if I were to quarantine a fish and expose it to copper, once it is transferred to the main tank where there is no copper present its immune system will be compromised and the chance of it getting ill will be significantly increased. Also, he made the point that white spot/ich is present all the time in our tanks, it is fish stress that allows the parasite to attack its host, a healthy stress free fish wont get it.

The bottom line from the conversation was stress leads to problems, so what do you think is more stressful for a fish, an hour or so journey home in a bag resulting in it being put it into a small, uncycled empty tank, or getting it home, doing proper acclimation and transferring it straight into a large properly decorated home?

He said neither him or Snowy (another guy that works there, VERY knowledge dude) run quarantine tanks, and they have never had problems with fish disease. He admitted of course that if you buy fish from places that use copper or if you ship fish long distances it would be a different story, but otherwise quarantine tanks can cause more problems than they solve.

Im sure few here will agree with this advice, but I thought I would just throw it out there. I trust the guys at my LFS, they arent your average run of the mill store, they wont sell you stuff if your tank or whatever isnt suitable, when I set my tank up Snowy told me dont rush it, I said i'll try, and he bluntly said you will or I wont sell stuff to you!

sounds like your LFS gets a gold star!!!! however, he's full of crap!!! i worked at a LFS that was very honest, but we had to pay rent, electric, etc. they need to sell you stuff to stay in business. where does your LFS buy their fish or does he catch his own in Fji? maybe their suppliers tanks have "ick" or worse.

design1stcode2n
04/14/2015, 08:20 AM
My LFS uses Prazipro, hypo-salinity and copper and was very blunt in that with the aquarium trade as it is today fish that used to be bullet proof 10-15 years ago are not anymore.

"I was told don't rush it, QT is a good idea and why would you want you jump right into maintenance? Stocking and building the tank is the fun part."

64Ivy
04/14/2015, 12:23 PM
I have been using a QT for several years with great success. I only medicate if I see a need to, just like I would if it were a human

Me too. I just keep them under observation for six weeks, during which time I'll establish a feeding regimen and give them the opportunity to regain their strength and stamina. If, however, I see any signs of problems during this time, I'll restart the clock at zero, do a couple doses of Prazi, then begin the observation period all over again.