Tell me how this can be?

[SassyAngel111]

Ok I am battling a bad out break of GHA. After testing my TDS from my RO/DI the reading is 004ppm. So I sat up a 20gl tote last night have the salinity at 1.026. I tested for CA (380ppm salifert test), Mg (1050ppm salifert test) and this is after I have added 9 tsp. of Seachem Reef advantage Magnesium and still only reading 1050 ppm), PO4 (.25 API test) and the salt that I am using is IO.

As for the GHA I will be taking the rock out and spraying them with peroxide and using a toothbrush to scrub off the HA.

At ends wit with the test readings

[Dkuhlmann]

Turbo snails are your friend if you have GHA.

[SassyAngel111]

how many should I add? But how do I keep this down when I do partial wc of 20 to 35gls every wk. and the tank is a 72gl.

Unless my skimmer isn't big enough but it is the only one that I can use for the refugium, the fuge is the Eshopps R100 and the skimmer is the Eshopps s120.

What more can I do to keep the HA from coming back?

[Lmax8rn]

When my mag gets down to that level, I have to add about 100 ml of mag to my 110 gallon tank to get it up to 1230-1300. No harm has come using this big of a dose. I would also consider changing your resin and membrane. Try cutting back the lughts for a few days, and yes, get a bunch of snails. 1 snail or crab per gallon is the recommendation from my LFS, and they are very knowledgeable.

[Lmax8rn]

Also, try more frequent water changes to decrease nitrate levels. I do 20 gallons a week in my 110.

[SassyAngel111]

Lmax8rn, so before I do my water change today how high should I raise the Mag to, to get it to the 1230 - 1300 reading? I have a 18gl tote set up for the change, as for the resin I can't do anything until next week when the LFS gets some more in. As for the membrane the unit is only 3 months old (spectraPure refub 90gpd), I hope the membrane is not bad already?

[SassyAngel111]

My nitrates reading is .5ppm using a red sea test

[Dkuhlmann]

I'd put at least 6 of the turbo snails. If you put too many they will starve once the algae is gone. I've got two in my 30 gal and it seems to be plenty and they are hard workers and clean everything.

[SassyAngel111]

Ok I go get some turbos. but even with a new DI resien what can I do if my nitrates are still reads a 5ppm.

Could a lot of the issues be with the IO salt since it took 13 tsp of the seachem Reef advantage magnesium to a 18gl tote just to get a 1350 reading?

[Reefstarter2]

Mag takes a lot to bring up , I have to add a gallon of the stuff to my 500 gallon system to raise it 100 points . no problems with doing so even though I did it over 2 days . it is recommended not to raise your mag more than 100 PPM a day . as for the other stuff get online and use a reef calculator . GHA ehh no biggie turbos mow it down . 5 ppm is fine for nitrates , I bet you got phosphates though , I use a martini instruments phosphate low range photometer and is accurate as hell . anything else is just kinda close

[Chevrefils]

Mollies are GHA eating machines.

[Reel North]

The phosphates are probably in your rock. Where did you get it from? Did you cook it to Lower phosphate? Run gfo?

I got some rock from a few guys shutting down tanks. I've been cooking it for about 6 weeks. pO4 was .56. Now it's .17. .25 will make your life hell

[SassyAngel111]

The phosphates are probably in your rock. Where did you get it from? Did you cook it to Lower phosphate? Run gfo?

I got some rock from a few guys shutting down tanks. I've been cooking it for about 6 weeks. pO4 was .56. Now it's .17. .25 will make your life hell

I bought the rock from a lfs, it is like what BRS sales, the dry reef saver rock.

[Dkuhlmann]

I doubt your problem is your salt, more than likely leaching from the rocks. All you can do at this point is fight through it and have some fat happy cuc's Emerald crabs will eat a good bit as well. I'd do maybe two in your tank at most. You don't want anything you add now to starve later.

[SassyAngel111]

I wont go with crabs. I'll just stick with more water changes and scrub the rocks to remove as much of the HA as I can then just make sure that the Mag is up were it should be. Might even try changing salt to the IO reef crystal.

[ThRoewer]

Turbo snails are your friend if you have GHA.

+1 on the turbo snails, though I would try to get the smallest possible (they grow anyway) as the big ones sometimes are like elephants in a fine china store.

The other snail species you want to try to get are some Stomatella snails as they can go into places the turbos can't reach due to their size. Another advantage is that they will multiply in you tank. Unfortunately you can't buy them but your LFS should hopefully have some in their system and be able to give you a few.

[Reel North]

Talk to you Lfs about buying a sea hare. They will slaughter algae. Once the HA is gone you can sell it or pass it on. Run some GFO and start low vodka doses. It will bind the PO4.

Your rock is definitely the issue. That rock is loaded with phosphate. Scrubbing the rocks won't help. It will be back quickly. Kalkwasser will also help to bind up the phosphate, as will lanthanum chloride.

[SassyAngel111]

Talk to you Lfs about buying a sea hare. They will slaughter algae. Once the HA is gone you can sell it or pass it on. Run some GFO and start low vodka doses. It will bind the PO4.

Your rock is definitely the issue. That rock is loaded with phosphate. Scrubbing the rocks won't help. It will be back quickly. Kalkwasser will also help to bind up the phosphate, as will lanthanum chloride.


As for the sea hare, since reading up on them I think I will skip them. As for the GFO I will be picking some up tomorrow since my local LFS had closed early today.

[SassyAngel111]

I doubt your problem is your salt, more than likely leaching from the rocks. All you can do at this point is fight through it and have some fat happy cuc's Emerald crabs will eat a good bit as well. I'd do maybe two in your tank at most. You don't want anything you add now to starve later.

Dkuhlmann, is there anything I can do with the rock now since it has been in the tank now for about 3 months or should I just let it run its course? Again this is like what BRS sales.

I will just start doing about 10gls w/c every 2 or 3 days and will use the kent marine phosphate sponge, but the main thing to my question is there anything I can do with the rock now?

[ryeguyy84]

Aggressive use of GFO, water changes and a CUC will take care of it in time. the rocks will leach out phosphate and the algae will use that to grow. Pluck as much as you can to export the nutrients. it's the same as a refugium but unfortunately less attractive.

[Jade5051]

Gfo!

[disc1]

You say the TDS out of your RODI system is at 4ppm. 4ppm of what exactly? If the bulk of that is phosphate then that is your problem right there. Get some new DI resin and cleaner water may make a big difference.

However in my experience, all of the reef saver rock I've ever dealt with grew hair algae like it was going out of style.

[Dkuhlmann]

I agree with the others that you will have to try and get that tds down, run gfo and do water changes and ride it out. I'm also dealing with some algae and will have to get better on my maintenance as I've been out of town a few weeks. Many of my CUC are dead to the killer hermits and I just added a sand sifting starfish. I don't want to overdo the snails as I told you already if you do they will have nothing to eat once this dies down. So it's a tradeoff. I'd do weekly wc's about 10% or more and keep that gfo going. You can also use sugar to bind the nitrates and they will go out of the skimmer. I brought mine down considerably that way. I didn't want to use vodka or vinegar so I used granulated sugar only a 1/2 teaspoon per 40 odd gallons. I'd think the sugar would help drop the phosphates as well.

I do overfeed my tank as I'm about to put the last 3 or 4 fish in it at one time to help save on the shipping of the fish that I want. I live in NW Iowa and it's impossible to get fish here without driving 3 hours one way or dealing with Petco. I don't think my algae problem is as bad as yours but it's still a pita.

[wagohn]

Ive never been a fan of 'chemical fixes' until I was recommended this stuff:

http://www.redseafish.com/reef-care-program/algae-management-program/no3po4-x/

Its nothing short of amazing. My 30 gallon was going thru cycles of red and then green cyano. I literally tried everything from snails, to scrubbing rock, to changing out MH for LEDs, to 'lights out period', and finally chemi-clean. Within 2 days of any process, the cyano would return.

In 3 weeks since using this stuff, Ive gone from sheets of cyano covering everything to absolutely zero problem algae (see before and after pics). My rock is now 100% algae free and I rarely have to clean the glass.

Highly recommended.

[SassyAngel111]

ok not sure if this makes sense, went and bought a Salifert phosphate test and the reading is 0, I then did the higher sensitivity test and still got a 0 reading. So now I'm real puzzled if no phophate and my nitrates is 0 where would the HA be coming from?

I just did about an 15gl w/c yesterday.

[eddiereefs]

The algae is more than likly consuming the po4 so u cant get a reading on it. U have to test for phosphorus if u want a more accurate reading. Get turbos, 5 is fine for your tank, run gfo, and do good reef keeping husbandry and u will be fine.

[SassyAngel111]

Ive never been a fan of 'chemical fixes' until I was recommended this stuff:

http://www.redseafish.com/reef-care-program/algae-management-program/no3po4-x/

Its nothing short of amazing. My 30 gallon was going thru cycles of red and then green cyano. I literally tried everything from snails, to scrubbing rock, to changing out MH for LEDs, to 'lights out period', and finally chemi-clean. Within 2 days of any process, the cyano would return.

In 3 weeks since using this stuff, Ive gone from sheets of cyano covering everything to absolutely zero problem algae (see before and after pics). My rock is now 100% algae free and I rarely have to clean the glass.

Highly recommended.

wagohn, since I am getting a zero reading after buying a salfert po4 test kit but still have HA how much of this should I use in a 75gl tank or if anyone else could answer this.

[wagohn]

wagohn, since I am getting a zero reading after buying a salfert po4 test kit but still have HA how much of this should I use in a 75gl tank or if anyone else could answer this.

If I were you Id just follow the recommended dosage on the bottle (or a little less). For my 30 gallon, I currently does the recommended 3 mls per day. As my issues have now cleared up, I will switch to the 'maintenance' dose of 1 ml per day. So I guess I need to buy a BRS dosing pump to automate the process.

Really, i tried everything before try this method. I too had zero phosphate readings, likely because the huge amount of cyano was feeding off it. I still have a slightly elevated nitrate issue but its dropping rapidly. :)

[Dkuhlmann]

It's a false negative test since the gha is consuming the phosphates/nitrates. This is normal. Visualization is your test.

[SassyAngel111]

wagohn and Dkuhlmann thank you both I will start dosing with the RedSea NO3/PO4 X. by the way even the lfs that I bought it from highly recommonded this compaired to the GFO, since that can leach out the PO4 again if left to long in the reactor or in my case in the sock.

[66nag]

Feeling your pain.
Went thru the exact same thing.
No one told the newbie, that you shouldn't wet your tank and "dry test run" your tank with (dry) rock insitu, using tap water....:sad2:
So, 6 months later I was battling GHA on an epic scale..so much so that I had to dilute my tank water to get a phos reading with the Red Sea test kit..yes, it was THAT high....:rolleye1:
So, many, many water changes and Rowaphos later, despite phos readings of 0, there was STILL GHA on my rocks...
I had heaps of turbo snails, and despite physically removing the GHA EVERY week when doing H20 changes, it still reared its ugly, UGLY head...
The only thing that got rid of it was by taking the rocks out and pressure cleaning them...If I recall, I even think I tried taking the rocks out and peroxideing them, but for some reason it didn't seem to work all that well...(it may of helped though...)
I didn't raise Mg or use any chemicals, I tried the lightsoff etc. I can't explain why GHA persists despite all the above.... just perseverance and a pressure cleaner (maybe once you get rid of the roots?).
The GHA hasn't re-appeared (fingers crossed).
I'll try and find pics of before and after (will try not to scare you..:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::uhoh2:)
Not sure if that will work for you, but it may help if you are willing as a last resort!! :hmm6:
Good luck and don't let it get the better of you!!:thumbsup:

[Buzz1329]

Ok I am battling a bad out break of GHA. After testing my TDS from my RO/DI the reading is 004ppm. So I sat up a 20gl tote last night have the salinity at 1.026. I tested for CA (380ppm salifert test), Mg (1050ppm salifert test) and this is after I have added 9 tsp. of Seachem Reef advantage Magnesium and still only reading 1050 ppm), PO4 (.25 API test) and the salt that I am using is IO.

As for the GHA I will be taking the rock out and spraying them with peroxide and using a toothbrush to scrub off the HA.

At ends wit with the test readings

Not sure what 004 ppm TDS means. I use BRS TDS meter on my RO/DI and make sure it never gets beyond 0.

.25 on API phosphate kit seems VERY high.

1050 ppm magnesium is below the 1250-1350 ppm NSW level.

I'd focus on:

Getting TDS of RO/DI water to 0 -- you may need to change DI or some other part of filter.

Reducing PO4 levels -- if you don't have GFO reactor, get one (TLF reactor is cheap and works well); if you have one, increase amount of GFO or replace media more often.

Good luck or happy reefing or whatever,

Mike

[SassyAngel111]

66nag and Buzz1329 thank you both for your insight on this issue...

Buzz1329 I went and bought a Salifert PO4 test and this is reading 0 ( which I know that having any type of algea my reading will be off), just havn't tested my change water yet, nor have I tried like 66nag said diluting the tank water to see where the PO4 reading is.

[66nag]

Hope your not eating and the kids are in bed..:(

http://i1204.photobucket.com/albums/bb408/66nag1/20120722_181659.jpg (http://s1204.photobucket.com/user/66nag1/media/20120722_181659.jpg.html)
Pics of the GHA, (taken about 3 yrs ago) and I think it was actually worse than that and one stage (yes, seriously...)
Using Rowaphos, and once the phosphate (the worse phos reading was a WHOPPING 2.7 ppm on the "diluted" Red Sea kit before I bought a Hanna) stopped leaching out if the rock, (ie, my phos readings were 0), I took the rock out and blasted it with the pressure cleaner, as trying to scrub it every week with a toothbrush with the rocks insitu seemed to be futile.:headwally:
(The CUC wouldn't eat the long stuff, but seemed to prefer the shorter scrubbed stuff, so perhaps in time they may eat it if it were short enough??)
The last pic in the "thumbnails" is the same algae infested rock as above, still being used in my tank (pic taken last week - 'scaping has altered somewhat though!!, ).
Again, good luck from Down Under, and don't let it beat you...:rollface: :beer:

[SassyAngel111]

66nag a lot of my rock looks like that as well, and I have quite a bit on the sand as well. I did pull out half of the rock last weekend and had scrubbed them with a toothbrush and then got 5 turbos and 5 blue hermit crabs and an emerald crab which he is in the refugium at this time but will get putting him in the dt shortly since he has cleaned the rock in the fuge up and nothing more for him to eat there, and then coupled that with Sailfert's NO3,PO4 x.