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AugustWest
09/19/2015, 01:19 PM
It's been a long time since I started a new reef but just did due to a move. It's a 93 Gallon Marineland.

Started it 3 weeks ago. Added ammonia chloride and Dr Tims Bacteria to get the cycle started.

I have 50 lbs of Walt Smith man made dry rock along with 10 lbs of Manado Live Rock to seed it. The tank is barebottom.

I didn't want a ton of rock in the tank this time around so to compensate for so little rock and no sand I added 8"x8"x4" Marinepure Plate in the sump.

I have a Reef Octopus skimmer and am running activated carbon and Rowaphos passively in bags in the sump.

Ammonia has spiked and come down and Nitrite is about .25 at this time.

Last week I started getting some bacteria growth on the rock, started as white cottony slime balls and is now a white stringy growth.I've been blowing it off the rocks in hopes it will be removed by the skimmer and I'm running a filter sock.

My question , is it normal to have a bacterial bloom in a new tank? I am not dosing a carbon source and have not added anything to the tank that I haven't already mentioned.

Should I just leave it alone and let it run it's course? Anything I should be doing to get rid of it?

BeachVacationer
09/19/2015, 03:51 PM
Sounds like fungal issues. I've not tried it but perhaps pimafix will take care of it. How about a pic for proper ID.

AugustWest
09/19/2015, 04:27 PM
Pretty confident it's a bacterial bloom, thanks though.

gone fishin
09/19/2015, 04:33 PM
At this point I think I might just let it run its course. I would speculate it should burn itself out by the end of the cycle. Just my 2 cents worth good luck

AugustWest
09/19/2015, 07:20 PM
Yeah, I'm hoping it'll just run its course. Was just wondering if it's not uncommon to have a bacterial bloom during the cycle? Concerned if maybe it's something to do with the man-made Rock.

gone fishin
09/19/2015, 07:32 PM
I have not a had a bloom like you described during a cycle, I did have one like that while carbon dosing with vodka. I have zero experience with the man made rocks so I can't say one way or the other if this is causing any blooms like your describing.

StrangeDejavu
09/19/2015, 08:02 PM
I just finished cycling my 40 breeder with Dr. Tim's and i'm experiencing the same thing you described. I went with dry rock so I know it's not a hitchhiker of some kind. It's like webby, stringy snot that waves from the rock. My NWB-110 is pulling lots of snotty and foul smelling stuff, so I assume this is what i'm seeing on the rocks.

gone fishin
09/19/2015, 08:06 PM
Could be the Dr Tims I suppose. I have not used that particular product either.

Allentown
09/19/2015, 09:12 PM
I have seen that when re-using rock from other tanks, even after they were re-cured for a couple weeks.

Other than that source of carbon...I have also seen it when the tank was set up around the same time some weird dust/aerosolized or home improvement project was going on.

Other than those two..in a brand new tank, id be stumped.

Bent
09/19/2015, 11:07 PM
Is there a lot of glucose in that bacteria bottle?...

StrangeDejavu
09/20/2015, 12:23 AM
...I have also seen it when the tank was set up around the same time some weird dust/aerosolized or home improvement project was going on.

Funny you say that because my tank is right next to a bathroom which was just redone. There was a lot of dust from the tile and drywall patch while I was cycling, but I kept the door closed during the work. I'm real curious to see if OP also has this in common.

I also ran an AquaClear HOB packed top to bottom with filter floss, did a 20% WC, ran skimmer and am currently running ROX carbon in a BRS mini reactor and it's still there, so you got me.

AugustWest
09/20/2015, 09:58 AM
No home improvement projects going on currently but the house was just built, completed a couple of months ago.

My wife does use those "scentsy" wax air freshners although the tank is in another room. Was wondering if it could be related to that.

Allentown
09/21/2015, 06:03 AM
My money is on aerosolized particles then.


Like I said, we put in hardwood floors in the entire house about a week after we moved the 90 and set up the 225. That dust was every where and very thick.


Now both tanks are going through a cloudy water stage, the filter socks cycle clog frequently, the skimmers produce massive amounts of honey like skimmate, both tanks have undetectable ammonia and nitrate and the algae all completely died off in the 90.


I was u could tag Randy Holmes, I'd really like to know what substance in dry wall, floor dust doubles as a carbon source because to me....those symptoms can ONLY be a bacterial bloom.

The only two other sources I can point to would be either my reef crystals or my live rock which was previously ran with biopellets up until a month or so ago.

StrangeDejavu
09/21/2015, 09:09 AM
Got a pic of it before work this morning:

I use Red Sea Coral Pro salt and have never used biopellets before.

http://i.imgur.com/mR8aALSh.jpg

sculpin2
09/21/2015, 10:31 AM
I went through the same mess. Basically all I could do was water changes and add Dr. Tim's products. Eventually other bacteria outcompeted the goo species and things improved.

It may be an aerosolized carbon source, although I'm begining to wonder if it is not related to the use of dry rock.

Allentown
09/21/2015, 11:28 AM
My rock had been in a 90g reef for 3 years prior to being moved.

25G water change per week and changing carbon ever 10 days isn't helping that I can see. Changing the filter socks every 12 hours and running wet skimmate clears it up. I suppose it's possible the water changes and carbon are helping in ways I can't observe though.

fish are fine, nutrients test at 0, pH at 8.2 and my ORP is 405, by all accounts it's a very health fowlr system, just with cloudy water.

I used pink Fiji sand from BRS.

What sand did everyone else use?

StrangeDejavu
09/21/2015, 09:22 PM
I used pink Fiji sand from BRS.

What sand did everyone else use?

I also used Fiji Pink, but mine came from Amazon and Drs. F&S. I did not use the water clarifier that comes with the sand.

Allentown
09/22/2015, 11:53 AM
I also used Fiji Pink, but mine came from Amazon and Drs. F&S. I did not use the water clarifier that comes with the sand.

I did, big mistake. First and last time. I eliminated that as the culprit already due to it happening in other tanks I run that didn't get the clarifier.

Happening in multiple tanks with different equipment, stock and maintanence is what lead me down to find what's common between the tanks.

1) Air in the house
2) Rodi water
3) Salt mix
4) Food brands
5) some of the rock.

That's it....that's what the tanks have in common. Has to be one right? Other wise the issue would be limited to only 1 tank.

AugustWest
09/22/2015, 12:39 PM
Update on my tank. White stringy growth ( exactly like the pic a couple of posts up) seems to have slowed down

I have been blowing the rocks off a couple of times a day using a power head. Also have changed my filter sock daily. Ran some extra carbon. 20 Gallon water change.

Bacteria on the rocks has pretty much stopped growing back like it has previously. Filter socks are still clogging in less than 24 hours and water is cloudy now so i'm sure there is bacteria still present.

Hoping this is the end stages. If the water doesn't clear i'm debating on using Dr Tim's Waste Away, i've read of people having success with it. I'll update if I give it a try, have a bottle on the way from amazon.

nuxx
09/22/2015, 12:43 PM
Was weird on the two last tanks I setup, we had no bloom or real cycle.

Used dry rock and sand and added bottled bacteria.

Tank 1: 470 gallon + 200 gallon sump
Tank 2: 150 gallon + 75 gallon sump

Our last tanks always had them, but they were smaller and had live rock to start out with.

StrangeDejavu
09/22/2015, 05:32 PM
1) Air in the house
2) Rodi water
3) Salt mix
4) Food brands
5) some of the rock

Shouldn't be food because mine started while the tank was still empty. I got in there today and blew all of it off with a turkey baster, hopefully my skimmer will pick it up. I still need to pick up a sump sock for situations like this.

My water is clear, I just have the snot growth all over the rocks.

AugustWest
09/22/2015, 05:47 PM
The growth on my rocks seems to be done, I hope. Got home today and the water has a white smoky haze to it.....not sure if this is progress? I hope so, here's a pic

Cdodge1
09/22/2015, 05:59 PM
The growth on my rocks seems to be done, I hope. Got home today and the water has a white smoky haze to it.....not sure if this is progress? I hope so, here's a pic

Hmm well with a bare bottom, my guess would be just a bacterial bloom... but I know dry rock tends to have a lot of "dust" on it (Either way, it's no cause for worry). Sorry if you mentioned it already, but are you running carbon or anything? Other than that looks like the tank is coming around nicely!

AugustWest
09/24/2015, 08:11 PM
Looks like I spoke too soon. Still getting the stringy growth on the rocks, and the water is very cloudy. It actually looks like there is smoke in the water. Very strange .

I am running carbon but just passively in a bag in the sump. Ammonia and Nitrite now both test 0.

Think I'm going to dose the Dr Tim's Waste Away. Filter sock clogged in a couple of hours today. Just glad there's no livestock in the tank to worry about .

Wondering if a very large water change would help? I have another 15 gallons mixed up for a water change tomorrow.

Any other ideas on what could be causing this or suggestions n what to do?

Allentown
09/25/2015, 10:31 AM
I added fish during this bacterial bloom for two reasons 1) Was hoping fish + food would help tip the balance away from the type of bacterial that produce slime and 2) I reasoned it was a good time for fish....based on the tank being so full of one type of bacteria would make it that much harder for things like ich and velvet to gain a foot hold (that's how it works in humans colonized with non harmful bacteria).

At any rate, there is a danger. The bloom could become so dense that it reduces the available dissolved 02 and the fish get hypoxic. Shouldn't happen if you are skimming and have lots of circulation though.

StrangeDejavu
09/26/2015, 01:33 AM
I hope mine ends soon. My return pump was completely clogged, causing the water level in my Beananimal external box to drop until it started sucking in air. ATO was going crazy thinking water level was down so it would add water, had to unplug it last night. I got in there after work and blew off all the rocks with my RW-4 on powerhead mode and max speed. While everything was stirred up, I dropped a pump in and did a 20% WC. Once I refilled, I ran both pumps at 100% with a sump sock and skimmer skimming wet. We'll see how it goes...

Here's the sponge from my Eheim 1260. This tank is literally weeks old, so it's alarming how quickly my return was clogged by this bacteria.

http://i.imgur.com/pcZHUqxh.jpg

peiloy3196
09/26/2015, 09:49 AM
I had a similar problem with a tank in my office last year. Cloudy water and string growth on the rocks after cycling. I figured it would clear up, but it did not for months even after adding fish. Eventually I ran a small submersible uv. I think it was called green machine or something like that. Everything cleared up in a couple weeks after adding it. I had never used a uv unit before that in any aquarium and I pulled it after the cloudiness cleared up. I have not had the issue since. I don't know if it was a coincidence as I do not use uv normally but just gave it a shot as I was out of ideas.

StrangeDejavu
09/26/2015, 11:13 AM
Think I'm going to dose the Dr Tim's Waste Away.

I'm very curious if it will work or not. Through my own reading, I saw it used as a cure for this in a few different threads. Only downside is it causes an ammonia spike, and I have a Banggai Cardinal in the tank. :/ If it works for you, then I may consider it and just dose with Prime or something similar to deal with ammonia.

StrangeDejavu
09/27/2015, 12:16 PM
I feel like i'm making progress with mine, but it may be too early to tell. 2 - 3 times a day I blow off the rocks with a powerhead and run my RW-4s on max to keep it suspended and get caught in the sump sock. I'm changing the sock out every 24 hours and skimming wet. Whenever it's caught up in the water column, my skimmer goes crazy, the top starts rattling and it fills rapidly. Nasty stuff, I just hope I can beat it without the aid of some product. Please keep us posted on your progress as well, OP. There's little to no information on this stuff out there. What little there is, it remains a guessing game.

AugustWest
10/01/2015, 09:08 AM
Update. Ended up adding a UV Sterilizer ( Coralife 18 watt UV ) hooked it up last night and tank was clearing up in a couple of hours. Woke up today to a crystal clear tank. Hopefully that's the end of this.

I did end up adding a dose of Dr Tim's last week but didn't notice much if any improvement. I didn't have as much as a slime problem as I see in those pics above but I'd imagine the UV might be a good option for that too.

AugustWest
10/01/2015, 09:10 AM
Here's a pic

Allentown
10/01/2015, 09:31 PM
I started doing 15g water changes per night, skimming wet, I reduced the speed of the pumps to reduce strain on them. I actually increased my feedings. As of today it was 80% clear.

I replaced my GAC tonight and it immediately cleared up almost to 100%.

I think part of my issue was dust from the sand bed. The 90g was clearing up and now seems to be regressing and getting cloudy again.

Ugghh.

StrangeDejavu
10/03/2015, 06:15 PM
Be sure to keep us updated on the UV treatment and whether or not it's effective long term or not.

Thought I was making progress with mine- wrong. After the 6 hour cleaning marathon last Saturday, my tank was almost sterile. I skimmed wet and changed the sump sock out every 2 days. I was also doing 20 - 25% WCs instead of my normal 10%. None of that mattered, it just came back with a vengeance. On top of the long, stringy snot waving from the rock, it also started growing in my sandbed. I tried siphoning it out with a gravel vac but it was too heavy, it just tumbled. I went after it with a turkey baster and it was pulling 6 x 2 inch sheets out from under the sand. This stuff in substance is like jelly, so dense and thick that it was clogging the turkey baster opening preventing any actual effective removal. I had to use a tooth brush, twirl it and drop it in a cup. I also added my first dose of Dr. Tim's Waste Away at 1/2 dose, left skimmer off for 30 minutes then back on. Crossing my fingers.

AugustWest
10/07/2015, 11:35 AM
Wow, that sounds nasty ! Mine never got that bad. Tank is still crystal clear, little bit of bacterial growth on the rocks still.

StrangeDejavu
10/07/2015, 12:37 PM
So Saturday (Oct 3rd) I did a WC and cleaned the return sponge again. Sunday there was explosive growth over night, which is a trend i'm seeing after I do my water changes. Starting to suspect organics in my salt (Red Sea Coral Pro) or the live Phyto from Algaebarn that I dose after every WC. Monday morning rolls around (Oct 5th) and my overflow is gurgling, sump is full and the Tunze alarm is going off. Not something you want to hear first thing Monday morning. This stuff. is. Satan. I just did my first full dose of Dr. Tim's (first two doses are halved, then third on is full). I'm noticing the stringy snot floating around in the water column, almost like it's dislodging itself. Coincidence? Not sure, but i'm crossing finger and toes.

AugustWest
10/14/2015, 05:43 PM
Just bumping this back up. Water has been clear since I added the UV sterilizer but I am still getting white stringy bacterial growth on the rocks.

My original thought that it may have something to do with the dry rock appears to be wrong. The bacterial growth is even worse on the couple of Live Rocks I added to seedt He dry.

I have been doing 2 15 gallon water changes per week. Doesn't seem to help nor does it make the growth any worse. Thinking of stopping the water changes all together .

The 2 Clownfish and couple of Corals I have are doing fine. Tank is now running for 7 weeks.

Water tests as follows:
Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0
Nitrate 0
Alkalinity 9 dkh
Calcium 420
Magnesium 1300
Phosphates 0.02

Anything else I can do or should I just let it run its course?

StrangeDejavu
10/17/2015, 11:53 AM
Update on mine:

Making some progress finally. The yellow sludge that coated every surface of my tank is retreating thanks to Dr. Tim's Waste Away. If you scroll up, you'll see the sponge on my return pump. That color slime coated everything in my tank. Every baffle, glass pane, rock surface was yellow from this slime. Even the body on the skimmer that was directly in the water was yellow. I've been dosing per the Coral article (minus the Refresh) and i'm seeing big improvements. The dry rock is no longer slimy like an ice cube, glass is becoming clear again and skimmate isn't such a concentrated yellow/brown color anymore. I'm still battling the stringy bacteria but even this seems to have eased some, not a whole lot, but some. My tank has also been cloudy since the day I started dosing Dr. Tim's, so I can't say for sure if this is related to the problems or not. I'll post another update in a few days. :)

AugustWest
10/17/2015, 12:32 PM
Glad it's helping. What dosage of Dr Tim's are you using and how often?

StrangeDejavu
10/17/2015, 02:13 PM
I'm dosing per Dr. Tim's instructions in Coral magazine. He recommended 5 mL per 10 gallons for the first two treatments, then 10 mL per 10 gallons after that, each dose being on an every other day basis. I have enough left for one more dose, but I do plan on picking up some more.

StrangeDejavu
12/13/2015, 04:03 PM
Just thought i'd post an update for anyone else currently dealing with this, or those who might find this thread in the future.

I was making great progress with Waste Away until I made the mistake of adding a fish without QT. It died in 48 hours, symptoms suggested flukes so I dipped its body in DI water. With confirmation of flukes, I dosed the tank with PraziPro. Ughhhhhh... lol. Apparently the solution used to keep the praziquantel dissolved is a huge bacterial food source, found this out after I dosed. Over the next week or two, I lost all progress and the stringy bacteria reached levels 5 to 10x worse than before. There was so much bacteria in the water column, my sump socks would clog, turn honey color and overflow 45 minutes after putting them on. This next part will really gross you guys out.

http://i.imgur.com/KhHoh0Nl.jpg

Yes, that's a 1 gallon pitcher of skimmate. That's 3 days worth of skimming on the "dry"est setting my skimmer could be set for. I turned to a gallon pitcher because my skimmer cup would overflow while I was asleep and drip everything back into the sump. I removed the rubber plug and pushed a rubber hose over the drain and allowed the cup to drain into the pitcher behind the tank stand. Keep in mind I have 55 gallons worth of tank volume, with only 1 fish so this is almost 100% bacteria being skimmed out.

Anyway, i've kept up on my weekly 10% WCs and have been dosing Waste Away every 2 days per Dr. Tim's instructions. About 95% of the stringy bacteria in my DT has disappeared. The only spot it was still thriving was my refugium, where my macro was yellowing and dying from lack of nutrients. I just tossed all macro and siphoned the refugium so we'll see. If Waste Away continues to improve this problem then I will post an update in a few weeks.

slief
12/13/2015, 04:37 PM
Just thought i'd post an update for anyone else currently dealing with this, or those who might find this thread in the future.

I was making great progress with Waste Away until I made the mistake of adding a fish without QT. It died in 48 hours, symptoms suggested flukes so I dipped its body in DI water. With confirmation of flukes, I dosed the tank with PraziPro. Ughhhhhh... lol. Apparently the solution used to keep the praziquantel dissolved is a huge bacterial food source, found this out after I dosed. Over the next week or two, I lost all progress and the stringy bacteria reached levels 5 to 10x worse than before. There was so much bacteria in the water column, my sump socks would clog, turn honey color and overflow 45 minutes after putting them on. This next part will really gross you guys out.

http://i.imgur.com/KhHoh0Nl.jpg

Yes, that's a 1 gallon pitcher of skimmate. That's 3 days worth of skimming on the "dry"est setting my skimmer could be set for. I turned to a gallon pitcher because my skimmer cup would overflow while I was asleep and drip everything back into the sump. I removed the rubber plug and pushed a rubber hose over the drain and allowed the cup to drain into the pitcher behind the tank stand. Keep in mind I have 55 gallons worth of tank volume, with only 1 fish so this is almost 100% bacteria being skimmed out.

Anyway, i've kept up on my weekly 10% WCs and have been dosing Waste Away every 2 days per Dr. Tim's instructions. About 95% of the stringy bacteria in my DT has disappeared. The only spot it was still thriving was my refugium, where my macro was yellowing and dying from lack of nutrients. I just tossed all macro and siphoned the refugium so we'll see. If Waste Away continues to improve this problem then I will post an update in a few weeks.

Save yourself the headache and get a decent UV filter. You will never have a bacterial bloom like that again. A good UV is 100% effective against bacterial blooms and will solve the issue overnight and prevent them in the future. It will also improve your water clarity, improve your ORP and help with water born parasites. I've never had a bacterial bloom on a tank with UV filtration ever and I've been running UV filters for 20 years now. Stop wasting your time and money on chemical or additive treatments and get a decent UV filter like an AquaUV Classic 8 watt or 15 watt unit.

StrangeDejavu
12/13/2015, 06:00 PM
Save yourself the headache and get a decent UV filter. You will never have a bacterial bloom like that again. A good UV is 100% effective against bacterial blooms and will solve the issue overnight and prevent them in the future. It will also improve your water clarity, improve your ORP and help with water born parasites. I've never had a bacterial bloom on a tank with UV filtration ever and I've been running UV filters for 20 years now. Stop wasting your time and money on chemical or additive treatments and get a decent UV filter like an AquaUV Classic 8 watt or 15 watt unit.

I almost pulled the trigger on one but decided not to. Someone in a different thread was dealing with this same "mysterious reef slime" that Dr. Tim wrote about in Coral magazine. He ran UV and it cleared up, but as soon as he turned off the UV it came right back. While that may have masked the problem in my situation, I was more concerned with the root cause and why the slime was there, etc.