PDA

View Full Version : Does raw new sea water contain ich?


rogeragrimes
12/02/2015, 12:25 PM
I read in one of my marine aquarium books that all (or nearly all) in the wild marine fish contain ich? Is that true?

Second, I live in Key Largo, FL, on a ocean fed canal (it goes ocean-to-ocean...very healthy). I use the water from that for water changes. Could I be introducing ich into my tank by using the raw sea water?

tmz
12/02/2015, 01:28 PM
No its not true but many do whether from nature or congregate confinement on their way to your tank from gathering to wholesalers to lfs.

A free swimming crytocaryon parasite only lives in the water for a few days of it's life cycle before starving without a fish host. Anything is possible but getting ich from natural salt water poses very minimal risk,IMO. If you are concerned,however, keep it fishless for a week before adding it to the tank.

bertoni
12/02/2015, 03:13 PM
I agree that the risk of disease is low. I might still filter the water or treat it in some way, though, out of general caution. On the other hand, lots of people are very successful with fresh seawater. It's a personal choice.

ThRoewer
12/02/2015, 07:13 PM
Natural saltwater should be fine if you take it out during daylight hours.
If you want to be sure not to get ich with it, just store it for 24 to 48 hours in a container you can later sterilize. After a day or two all free ich phases have either died due to the lack of fish to infect or settled down to the substrate.

Another option would be to pump it through a 5 micron filter - none of the parasites gets through that.

rogeragrimes
12/02/2015, 08:52 PM
Thanks everyone for the replies.

ThRoewer>"Another option would be to pump it through a 5 micron filter - none of the parasites gets through that."

Would a 5-micron filter kill too much beneficial stuff from NSW or be perfect for keeping the good stuff in and the bad stuff out?

rogeragrimes
12/02/2015, 08:55 PM
ThRoewer>"Natural saltwater should be fine if you take it out during daylight hours. "

Why would nighttime be different?

bertoni
12/02/2015, 09:08 PM
A 5 micron filter would leave bacteria and viruses in the water, but remove most other single-celled organisms.

Mouse
12/02/2015, 09:30 PM
ThRoewer>"Natural saltwater should be fine if you take it out during daylight hours. "

Why would nighttime be different?

At night many many many critters and organisms move up from the depths to feed on the rich waters at the surface, and many many others do the same to eat them. The Ocean is a whole different place once the lights go out

rogeragrimes
12/02/2015, 09:56 PM
At night many many many critters and organisms move up from the depths to feed on the rich waters at the surface, and many many others do the same to eat them. The Ocean is a whole different place once the lights go out

As a diver for nearly 20 years and living by a ocean-fed canal for the last 4 years, I definitely know diurnal rhythms. But the things we put in marine aquariums live and thrive with these same rhythms.

I've got to think TR was thinking of something else.

tmz
12/07/2015, 10:33 AM
Specific to marine ich( cyrtocaryon irritans): the parasite decysts ,"hatches", at night( studies suggest 2am to 9am) from the tomont phase which sticks to surfaces and is thus unlikely to show up in water gathered at the surface.

When a tomont decysts it spews out hundreds of theronts, the free swimming phase. Theronts need a fish to infest or feed on within 48 hours or so to survive and infest them in round 5 minutes once they find one.

Theronts , the smallest stage of the parasite life cycle range in size and may vary but as measured in one study they range from 12 to 48 microns so fine filtration would be required if theronts are in the water ; they would die without a fish if the water was stored for a few days before use.

This fact summary by Snoravitch may be of interest for those interested in more detail:

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2383310

There are potentially other patogens, pests and toxins that may warrant filtration, though.

billsreef
12/08/2015, 06:14 PM
Having worked with flow through raw water systems, there is a risk of a variety of disease issues. Fairly small when batch collecting, but a still a risk. Either filter down to 1 micron (it's not just ich to worry about), bleach sterilize, UV, or store in the dark for a month to be absolutely certain.

rovster
12/08/2015, 09:39 PM
Having worked with flow through raw water systems, there is a risk of a variety of disease issues. Fairly small when batch collecting, but a still a risk. Either filter down to 1 micron (it's not just ich to worry about), bleach sterilize, UV, or store in the dark for a month to be absolutely certain.

Does the water need to be circulated for that month? Wouldn't there be a die off that would foul the water or is that negligible? Is there a preferred method for prepping NSW for aquarium use?

Buzz1329
12/08/2015, 10:16 PM
I'm sure I'm missing something here, but if risk of ich in NSW dissipates in a few days without fish, what's with the fire and brimstone commandments not to put any fish into a tank that has had a fish that has had symptoms of ich for 72 days ?

Thanks,

Mike

tmz
12/09/2015, 09:05 AM
The free swimming stage, theronts, last only a few days without a fish to invade. The encysted phase, tomont usually hatches the theronts within a couple of weeks but encysted tomonts have remained viable, according to one study, for as much as 72 days. Tomonts stick to surface areas, usualy the substrate and rock near where fish rest for the night,though almost any surface will do. They are very unlikely to be in water gathered at the surface.

tmz
12/09/2015, 09:29 AM
I don't personally use NSW; since, I don't live near a source,it's not a practical option to consider for me. I'm not sure I would use it if it were available. On one hand ,the diversity ,trace elements etc .are intriguing; on the other hand, the risk of pathogens and pollutants is concerning.

I do keep a small powerhead running in stored artificial salt water to keep it oxygenated ;some brands batches of salt mix add organics which may decay;others may include them inadvertently, giving a food source to bacteria which deplete oxygen. Bacteria use oxygen . In stagnant water this often leads to anoxic conditions suited to sulfate reducing bacteria and the toxic H2S ( hydrogen sulfide ) they produce.

Buzz1329
12/09/2015, 07:24 PM
The free swimming stage, theronts, last only a few days without a fish to invade. The encysted phase, tomont usually hatches the theronts within a couple of weeks but encysted tomonts have remained viable, according to one study, for as much as 72 days. Tomonts stick to surface areas, usualy the substrate and rock near where fish rest for the night,though almost any surface will do. They are very unlikely to be in water gathered at the surface.

Oh. Makes sense. Thanks.

Mike

tmz
12/09/2015, 09:51 PM
You are welcome