Rookie mistake

[artiewylde]

I feel awful...I have been cycling my tank for almost 4 months now and thought I was ready for fish. Bought a really cool pair of clowns and both died. I suspect it was because of high salt levels....I have been topping off with SALT water and not fresh rodi. I was noticing the levels rising as the water circulated....I wish the person at the store would have asked me more instead of just handing me the fish. I know its just fish but I just feel awful. I'm going to be extra careful now and read more into it before fish. Just wanted to share.

[SexyRob]

live and learn, sorry for your loss.

[Jeff4777]

Yep top off with fresh water. Salt doesn't evaporate. Check your salinity. 4 months is more than enough time to cycled especially if you have LR

[artiewylde]

now I know....try again in a couple of weeks

[Member No. 1]

We all need to start somewhere. If you plan on getting into this hobby for the long run, my advise is start early with some good habits. One of which is learning how to check your water parameters, and to do it on a regular bases.
You will learn a lot, have a better understanding of water chemistry, and this will help to avoid bigger problems down the line.
Hang in there, you will be fine.

[Marchillo]

I wouldn't be too hard on the fish store on this one. The lfs can't assume that someone doesn't know not to top off with fresh RODI versus saltwater. And I'm not knocking you either. I believe my very first top off was also with saltwater. I'd blame the lfs if they told you it's ok to buy a powder blue tang for a 40g tank or to cycle a tank with a chromis.

Read through the stickies of getting started. There's a lot to know but once you know it things aren't that difficult. Don't beat yourself up over it.

[Sapelo]

So the next question is: do you know the salinity of your water and do you know what it is suppose to be?
You will need to make your salinity (hopefully in a quarantine tank) match the salinity of the water inhabited by any fish you purchase. If they are at 1.021 then you need to put them into water that is the same.
How are you measuring salinity now and going forward?
You should also be testing phosphates,ammonia, nitrates and nitrites.

[RayAllen3422]

Mistakes will happen. Everytime I am taking another step I re-read the stickies and search for threads about it. You will find this clarifies things and hopefully will save you some heart break. Good luck with the tank.

[philly_rfa]

I am new as well, i am sure i will be joining you and sharing some similar newbie goof ups in near future... As everyone said, live and learn...

[Pigpen17]

I feel your pain. My introduction to this site was from really messing things up with my first fish.

To avoid rookie mistake #2, after you have your tank parameters correct, start reading about setting up a quarantine tank for your new fish.

[jayball]

Do you have a set of tests and a refractometer or hydrometer? The salinity is the cornerstone of all the other levels and if you have been bumping that up for four months I have no idea where your alk would be.

[A.Astore]

That is a good point just made, because salt often has other aspects needed in a marine tank you may want to take a sample to the LFS and ask them to test everything to see where the other markers are. Yes, water changes and fresh water top offs will lower them slowly but it would be good to note so you are also watching those.

Do you have something to measure salinity as well as other levels that are critical for having fish survive? I would get in the habit of checking them regularly.

It is easy to make mistakes in the hobby but one of the best ways to learn is usually to mess it up once. It is only a major issue when you mess it up again because you didn't learn from the mistake the first time.

[rkrimple]

Total bummer, sorry for the loss. I am new to the hobby and was a bit uncertain about top offs as well. Awaiting my tank delivery still and slowly setting up my RODI station and QT tank. We learn a lot from our mistakes, at least this happened early on and not further down the road. Good luck moving forward.

[thelawnwrangler]

I feel awful...I have been cycling my tank for almost 4 months now and thought I was ready for fish. Bought a really cool pair of clowns and both died. I suspect it was because of high salt levels....I have been topping off with SALT water and not fresh rodi. I was noticing the levels rising as the water circulated....I wish the person at the store would have asked me more instead of just handing me the fish. I know its just fish but I just feel awful. I'm going to be extra careful now and read more into it before fish. Just wanted to share.

you have the right attitude about taking your responsibilities to these animals serious. Mistakes happen learn and go forward. No need to beat yourself up now. I have a beginner book you can have - it is a 3-4 hour read. PM and I can mail it to you.

I found it useful and I am ready to share it to the next person.

[Sk8r]

There's always a mistake to be made, no matter how advanced you get. What you try gets more complex, but there are always hitches. So sorry for the rough start. A good checklist to go over before starting out is the red-arrow sticky atop this forum. Check your procedures and understandings against that. Any time you hit an !uh-oh! while reading you've just saved yourself a mistake without the grief of it.

[artiewylde]

I do have a test kit and hydrometer, after spending a few hours , I got the salinity to 1.021...it was 1.026 after the fish died. I also wasnt filling it all the way so the reading was lower. Also got the Alkalinity at about 7 and calcium and magnesium is right at what the instructions recommend. Im going to test every other day for a couple of weeks , then try fish again. Thanks to everyone that replied.

[Kentech5]

1.026 is OK for fish normally. I keep my tank at 1.025. Did you acclimate the fish? I know a lot of stores keep salinity closer to 1.021

[artiewylde]

I drip acclimated util the water doubled in bag. I also had a wave maker set pretty high...maybe stressed them? They were very small. Dont know what else it would be. For now its just rock and sand. All I have in the sump is chemi pure and a little poly fil. Temp is 80

[Member No. 1]

How big is your tank?

You state that your tank has been cycling for 4 months. Over this course of time, did you check ammonia and nitrites and see them rise and fall as the tanks biological filter got established? If you didn't test, no way to be sure the tank did cycle and maybe it couldn't handle the two fish you put in.
Just because the tank has been running for 4 months, doesn't mean it has cycled and can support a fish load. Check to see what your ammonia and nitrite levels are. Both should be zero. When you add the next fish, monitor them to see if they rise. If they do, then your tank hasn't cycled.
As to salinity, for fish only, 1.021 is fine, but low. If you plan on down the road to keep corals, you will want it 1.025 -1.026.
So all said and done, I'm leaning toward the tank not finished cycling and a rise in ammonia that did the fish in, and not the salinity of 1.026 you said you had
Hang in there, keep us posted. You will win this battle.

[artiewylde]

I thought it already went through that....definitely had an ammonia spike and now at zero, I need to get a nitrate kit tonight and check that. Btw, I'm in Swansea, we're neighbors.

[Nina51]

So all said and done, I'm leaning toward the tank not finished cycling and a rise in ammonia that did the fish in, and not the salinity of 1.026 you said you had

even after such an acclimation as the op described, going from 1.021 to 1.026 would be enough to stress (and possibly kill) the fish, especially if they were very small. when you are increasing salinity, it has to be done over a much longer period of time than if you are decreasing.

hang in there, op. if this is the worst mistake you make in this hobby, you'll be golden! ;)

[Member No. 1]

even after such an acclimation as the op described, going from 1.021 to 1.026 would be enough to stress (and possibly kill) the fish, especially if they were very small. when you are increasing salinity, it has to be done over a much longer period of time than if you are decreasing.

hang in there, op. if this is the worst mistake you make in this hobby, you'll be golden! ;)

True, and I agree with this. Unknown though, is how long the fish were in the tank after he put them in did they die.
A slow rise in salinity from evaporation say a weeks time, from 1.021 to 1.026 should not have stressed a fish. We do it all the time when we buy fish. Some LFS keep fish only at, 1.018 and we drip accumulate the fish in an hour's time to 1.026 with little to no problems.

But he did say he had an ammonia spike after adding the fish. So I'm still leaning that way.

[artiewylde]

The spike was almost 2 months ago. The problem (at least I think) 2 things... when I checked the salinity before getting fish it was 1.023, then I topped it off with Salt water. I was also reading the hydrometer without filling it all the way up, so it gave a false reading...was actually close to 1.027. Fish only lasted a day. Thought everything was fine then checked on them after midnight and 1 was dead. The other the next night.

[PAXpress]

The spike was almost 2 months ago. The problem (at least I think) 2 things... when I checked the salinity before getting fish it was 1.023, then I topped it off with Salt water. I was also reading the hydrometer without filling it all the way up, so it gave a false reading...was actually close to 1.027. Fish only lasted a day. Thought everything was fine then checked on them after midnight and 1 was dead. The other the next night.

You may also want to look into ordering a Refractometer. I tried to use a hydrometer in the beginning and just couldn't trust it. Refractometer is really only about 25-30 dollars on amazon for a decent one and have not had troubles with SG since. Just my .02

[artiewylde]

So I finally got things straight and added a pair of clownfish to my tank. Been a week and they seem to be doing good. Im in the process of setting up a quarantine tank. I am wondering if or when I should add a clean up crew or a fish like a bullet goby to clean the sand.

[TONY_C]

So I finally got things straight and added a pair of clownfish to my tank. Been a week and they seem to be doing good. Im in the process of setting up a quarantine tank. I am wondering if or when I should add a clean up crew or a fish like a bullet goby to clean the sand.

I'm new here too and, like you, still have much to learn. From things I have read, shouldn't the CUC be added before adding fish?

Here's one of sk8r's blog entries http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/blog.php?b=702 You should check out all of his blog entries, they are all very valuable. I've read a few of them several times already.

[Capt.Nemo]

Yep top off with fresh water. Salt doesn't evaporate. Check your salinity. 4 months is more than enough time to cycled especially if you have LR

OOOOPS!!!

I had never heard that before, but it explains.

I had been doing religious water changes, getting the tap out and diluting with RODI salt from LFS. don't worry, I have no fish right now, Tomato's are in QT tank until mid April. I believe with all the changes and adding Protien Skimmer, I am caught up. only been topping off last couple weeks. home tests of water have been great, LFS testing other parameters, Alkalinity and Magnesium are high.
i had not been checking gravity.
i read this and checked.....1.032+ OUCH! could that be culprit?

yes or no, i can take another top off right now. going to store for STRAIGHT RODI and adding it.

glad no fish, but that could explain my brown out on Grape Frogspawn and Polyps.

[artiewylde]

Thats what was happening to me....salinity kept getting higher. Top off with fresh ro water only and it stays consistent. . Only use salt water for as water change. I learned the hard way.