View Full Version : CP + Tim's Nit. Bacteria + First Defense
Jongalt26
05/09/2016, 03:46 PM
I posted a few days ago in regards to my DT being infected with ich. I planned on treating in a 93 gal hospital tank (just finished setting it up yesterday). Im adding Dr. Tim's tonight and my first fish tomorrow. CP is arriving tomorrow.
I initially planned on running Hypo but I have to go out of town for 5 days next week. I was very concerned about maintaining water quality while i am out of town. I do have someone staying at my house but she has no experience with aquariums at all. I spoke with a local aquarium service dude about servicing my tank while I was gone and he told me about CP and how effective it has been for him.
After deliberating i decided i am going with CP bath and i picked up some food pellets as well. Maybe they fish will eat them lol.
So in my research I couldnt find answers to the following:
1. I read from a post from a year ago that nitrifying bacteria (Dr. Tims) may reduce the efficacy of the CP. Has anyone found that to be the case?
2. I dont have any bio filtration in the tank except a new sponge for the sump and Dr. Tims. From what ive read CP will not soak into the live rock. I have some seeded marinepure that i could add to the tank to help, should I add that?
3. I wont have any lights on but i have skylights in that room, will natural light be a big problem?
4. I have some Dr. Tims First Defense stress juice, is there any reason why i shouldnt add that to the water?
Thanks
Jason
jbvdhp
05/09/2016, 04:17 PM
Murphy's Law usually always applies, so I hope too many things won't go wrong for you.
1)IIRC, CP doesn't mess with bio filtration but DOES kill any algae, but I don't think your HT has algae anyway.
2)If you have anything that is bio ready, I would add it; I know your fish have ich, but does the seeded stuff come from the same tank too?
3)UV will degrade the CP as far as we know, can you block out as much light as you can that's coming from it? Does the skylight provide any direct lighting to the tank or is it indirect? I'd be wary even with indirect, natural lighting...
4)I hope someone will help you here
ThRoewer
05/09/2016, 06:28 PM
Bacterial starters are suspected to break CP down into an ineffective form - I wouldn't use it with CP.
Deinonych
05/09/2016, 07:12 PM
Bacterial starters are suspected to break CP down into an ineffective form - I wouldn't use it with CP.
+1
Personally, I didn't find CP to be all that effective against ich. TTM is much more reliable, and it can be done in 12 days.
m0nkie
05/09/2016, 07:29 PM
and imo nothing good comes out of leaving in the middle of treatment... if you haven't pulled the fish out, I'd leave them inside the DT until you are back. Increase frozen food feeding and increase cleaning. It will build their immunity to fight off ich. treat after you come back. I recommend TTM also
krullshards
05/09/2016, 10:20 PM
Bacterial starters are suspected to break CP down into an ineffective form - I wouldn't use it with CP.
Any idea what the rationale behind this is? Ostensibly bacterial starters are just bacteria colonies that you add to your tank, no? In some cases it's live, active bacteria along with some ammonia used as food for the bacteria to survive in the bottle and in some cases (Seachem Stability) the manufacturer claims the bacteria are dormant until they hit the water in the aquarium.
It's surprising for me to hear that there would be any interaction (positive or negative) with CP and bacteria starters, but not CP and naturally occurring or established bacteria.
ThRoewer
05/09/2016, 10:40 PM
Well, bacteria process all kind of things. There is certainly the possibility that some eat CP.
No idea what's different, but there are quite a few reports about being ineffective and in many cases bacterial starters were used. I simply wouldn't take the risk, but rather do more water changes and redoes the replacement water.
Dmorty217
05/10/2016, 06:14 AM
I posted a few days ago in regards to my DT being infected with ich. I planned on treating in a 93 gal hospital tank (just finished setting it up yesterday). Im adding Dr. Tim's tonight and my first fish tomorrow. CP is arriving tomorrow.
I initially planned on running Hypo but I have to go out of town for 5 days next week. I was very concerned about maintaining water quality while i am out of town. I do have someone staying at my house but she has no experience with aquariums at all. I spoke with a local aquarium service dude about servicing my tank while I was gone and he told me about CP and how effective it has been for him.
After deliberating i decided i am going with CP bath and i picked up some food pellets as well. Maybe they fish will eat them lol.
So in my research I couldnt find answers to the following:
1. I read from a post from a year ago that nitrifying bacteria (Dr. Tims) may reduce the efficacy of the CP. Has anyone found that to be the case?
This is suspected but not confirmed. I personally don't follow the recommended amount on the ich shield bottle. The bottle calls for 30mg per gallon or .6 per 20g when every disease book I have read says 15mg per liter or 60mg per gallon with a active infection.The directions on the bottle are too low to work even if a fish doesn't show a infection. 10mg per liter is what is recommended for fish without a active infection.
2. I dont have any bio filtration in the tank except a new sponge for the sump and Dr. Tims. From what ive read CP will not soak into the live rock. I have some seeded marinepure that i could add to the tank to help, should I add that?
I use Marinepure and Sera Siporax in my QT/Hospital tank and have for years, and use CP all the time. When the QT isn't being used the media is dried and put back in the sump of the DT for the next time.
3. I wont have any lights on but i have skylights in that room, will natural light be a big problem?
Direct sunlight on the tank will be a problem, anything else should be fine
4. I have some Dr. Tims First Defense stress juice, is there any reason why i shouldnt add that to the water?
Not familiar with this product
Thanks
Jason
Not sure what I did to make the color only work for one question
Jongalt26
05/10/2016, 02:57 PM
Thank you very much for the responses. I've spent a lot of time doing additional research and coming up with a new gameplan.
First off to answer some questions, yes all live rock that i have and marinepure will be coming from contaminated tanks. (I do have some pukani curing which should be done soon though)
Direct natural lighting will hit my HT. The only way to correct this would be to cover the tank during the day.
I dont have enough equipment and my fish load is too high for me to do TTM (juv. porc puffer, midas blenny, 2 clowns, hippo, 2 firefish, rabbitfish, algae blenny, purple tang, flame angel, diamondback goby)
So after much thought here is how i think i should proceed, please let me know if you have any suggestions.
Right now I have 4 fish that are showing signs of ich, the rest are not.
My QT is in a windowless room and is a 29gal with a HOB Filter - aquaclear 70 gal. The filter has carbon, a sponge as well as biomax (looks like Fluval biomax ceramic rings (http://www.bigalspets.com/bio-max-insert-for-aquaclear-70-300.html)). I also have some LR in the tank. (mostly for LR storage as opposed to filtration)
Currently my QT & it's inhabitant, a purple tang is infected with ich.
Im going to do a 50%+ WC tonight on the QT, I'll remove the carbon (leaving the biomax rings, sponge & live rock). I'll add in the CP and only the fish showing ich symptoms. Im going to dose the CP at the suggest 15 mg/l (which is confirmed via an article on the advanced aquarist website Link (http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2013/2/fish))
I'll add Dr. Tims to my hospital tank and will feed that with ammonia until i get back from my trip. Once im back i'll move the rest of my fish from my DT to my HT (starting my 76 day fallow period on my DT) and will run hypo there where i can monitor it daily.
This way i can get treatment to the fish that need it most and if the CP doesnt work then they can join the rest of the fish part in the hypo HT tank.
Thanks
J
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