Dry rock vs Live rock

[Gyaradoite]

I'm setting up a 100/120 gallon tank. I found out that live rock would cost a fortune so, will dry rock work the same?


Thank you, Gyaradoite

[kaz1961]

Sure, you could buy mostly dry rock and mix in some live rock to help seed it. Eventually it will all be live.

[Butch01]

How much research did you do before you bought the tank?? Live rock is expensive because it's alive.

[Bono]

Sounds like he's doing the research now by asking questions.

Welcome to Reefcentral BTW

[ryan_ferguson25]

Lots of people use dry rock only... add some bacteria additive and u'll b good to go.

[juniorrocketdad]

I understand the appeal of live rock,my tank was live rock but if I did another tank I would never go live again. Dry is much cheaper, comes pest free and makes aquascapijg much easier since you can do it with the rocks out of he tank

[gone fishin]

Sure, you could buy mostly dry rock and mix in some live rock to help seed it. Eventually it will all be live.

I agree 100%. good luck

[saf1]

You can buy dry rock, you can also make it. Do a quick search on youtube for indo-pacific sea farms. They have a decent video that covers how to make it, necessary three components, and the mix rate of each. Then form it up to the shape and size you want, and be done.

You can also buy aqua cultured, man made, live rock. As you said it is not for the feint of heart but in this case there is a reason for the cost. However, you do get what you pay for with the overall quality, extra good and bad things that come in the package(s), and quickness to turn around a tank from empty to full.

Lastly, if you choose to make your own or buy dry, you would go through the normal cycle process. Get tank set up how you want, verify leaks, flow rate, emergency drain, sump holds back flow, etc. Once done add in the sand if you are using it, then rock. Aquascape what you can see, finish on second day or so. Test water parameters within the first week, adjust by doing a change. Somewhere in the cycle and process you will add in a piece or two of shrimp or prawn you would get from the butcher and toss it in...

If you haven't, pick up a copy of Marine Aquarium Handbook by Martin Moe. Old, updated, not a lot of specific talk about fish or corals but it covers the cycle process one would see using a dead rock, sand, environment. It really is a great book that explains it step by step and what you should see over time. Progression.

I'll tell you what, this is the route I went with my 100 gallon. Sand, some dead rock, watched it. Then about 90 or so days later if not more added some live rock from Fiji back when we could do that, then dumped that in. I was amazed at what grew on the dead rock initially and again later with the addition of mother natures rock.

Best of luck.

[Green Chromis]

:fish1::fish1:I understand the appeal of live rock,my tank was live rock but if I did another tank I would never go live again. Dry is much cheaper, comes pest free and makes aquascapijg much easier since you can do it with the rocks out of he tank

:fish1: I'm just the opposite, I would never use anything other then, a very high quality live rock. All live rock is not the same, some are just rock that is placed in a holding tank with only live bacteria, while others are collected form reefs or designated area's that are full of life. This is the main reason I use a very high quality of live rock, I just enjoy looking at all the critters that come on the rock, mostly good by the way. Yes live rock is expensive, but after all this is your main source of biological filtration along with the live sand I collect from the outer reefs. Having a Reef Tank is not a cheap hobby, so expect to spend a lot of money on your system. :fish1:

[worldbook]

You can buy dry rock, you can also make it. Do a quick search on youtube for indo-pacific sea farms. They have a decent video that covers how to make it, necessary three components, and the mix rate of each. Then form it up to the shape and size you want, and be done.

You can also buy aqua cultured, man made, live rock. As you said it is not for the feint of heart but in this case there is a reason for the cost. However, you do get what you pay for with the overall quality, extra good and bad things that come in the package(s), and quickness to turn around a tank from empty to full.

Lastly, if you choose to make your own or buy dry, you would go through the normal cycle process. Get tank set up how you want, verify leaks, flow rate, emergency drain, sump holds back flow, etc. Once done add in the sand if you are using it, then rock. Aquascape what you can see, finish on second day or so. Test water parameters within the first week, adjust by doing a change. Somewhere in the cycle and process you will add in a piece or two of shrimp or prawn you would get from the butcher and toss it in...

If you haven't, pick up a copy of Marine Aquarium Handbook by Martin Moe. Old, updated, not a lot of specific talk about fish or corals but it covers the cycle process one would see using a dead rock, sand, environment. It really is a great book that explains it step by step and what you should see over time. Progression.

I'll tell you what, this is the route I went with my 100 gallon. Sand, some dead rock, watched it. Then about 90 or so days later if not more added some live rock from Fiji back when we could do that, then dumped that in. I was amazed at what grew on the dead rock initially and again later with the addition of mother natures rock.

Best of luck.

Very informative. Reef keeping can be very expensive, but there are definitely ways to save money. I would rather save it in using dry rock than buying a cheap light or skimmer. Be patient with the dry rock, it will eventually rise from the dead.

[Michael Hoaster]

The problem with dry rock is that it is unencrusted. Every inch of surface area is ripe for algae coverage. With it, you are looking at a long, slimy algae phase. Not so with live rock. It is already completely encrusted, with stuff you want.

To keep costs down, just buy a lot less rock than is traditionally used. This will give your tank much more open space for coral growth and natural fish behavior. The wall of rocks look is dead.

My 180 gallon planted tank (not a reef) has ten pounds of live rock. I bought it from Gulf Live Rock. All their packages include shipping! Plus, you are getting ecologically sustainable farmed rock.

Sure, you can mix in some dry rock, but live rock brings so much biodiversity and stability to your tank, helping to get the bottom of the food chain started in your tank.

[saf1]

The problem with dry rock is that it is unencrusted. Every inch of surface area is ripe for algae coverage. With it, you are looking at a long, slimy algae phase. Not so with live rock. It is already completely encrusted, with stuff you want.

To keep costs down, just buy a lot less rock than is traditionally used. This will give your tank much more open space for coral growth and natural fish behavior. The wall of rocks look is dead.

My 180 gallon planted tank (not a reef) has ten pounds of live rock. I bought it from Gulf Live Rock. All their packages include shipping! Plus, you are getting ecologically sustainable farmed rock.

Sure, you can mix in some dry rock, but live rock brings so much biodiversity and stability to your tank, helping to get the bottom of the food chain started in your tank.

This is true. You can go with less, you can also mix and match, at the right time of course. Lots of options. But we all know about that dreaded word called budget :) It does take a lot more time when you go dry or LFS store bought rock, and go through the whole cycle. Been there once, probably won't do it again. Not because I'm impatient but because I'll be using aqua-cultured this go around.

There really is a nice learning / educational experience when starting with dry and nothing. How it is seeded, the process, various stages, etc. You are right though, it is along process when done right. But wow, the educational value alone does wonders.

This hobby requires a bit of patience when done right. What better time to learn about it while maybe saving a few bucks to divert to better quality infrastructure.

[Synden]

Dry rock can take decades to become fully live to the core of the rock. It will become live..eventually, but initially its only the surface of the rock that does so. Dry rock WILL go through a crazy algae phase within the first year of being in the tank and can last for an extended period of time.
Whenever possible use live rock imo.
That being said, dry rock isnt without its merits. The main, and really the only plus to using dry rock, is that it gives you the ability to build custom aquascapes that otherwise wouldnt be possible with live rock.
If you arent doing a custom aquascape, and just stacking rocks in the tank, then stick with live rock only.

[worldbook]

A word of precaution. Dry rock vs live rock is a hot topic that is debated often. When I am obtaining advice from this site or any other, I'm careful to scrutinize broad statements without the backup of actual research.

Happy reefing.

[JZinCO]

duplicate..

[JZinCO]

Here's how I see it:

Dry Rock
Pro: You can aquascape to your delight, drill it, stack it, play with it, beat it up with a chisel, etc. Also, as cheap as 2$/lb commercially. You can do any other prep work you want such as washing it in water or solutions.
Con: Well, obviously it has no life on it.

"Live" Rock
Pro: None that are unique to this kind of rock. Aquascaping is possible but a little more limited because one wouldn't want to keep it out of water for long (though you'll see in threads some debate as to how long is too long). I just wouldn't want to pay extra just to kill some off.
Con: Paying extra for some purple coloration that will come onto all rock, dry or live, eventually.

Aquacultured Rock
Pro: Full of life. Usually the same price as live rock; sometimes cheaper than 'live' rock because people are afraid of hitchhikers.
Con: Aquascaping is limited to positions suitable for the life. "Can't squash the clam..don't want to shade out the Ulva..This side is the bottom side because of the sponges and other cryptic creatures.." For me, hitchhiker fears are overblown and I often am more surprised than dismayed.

As far as algae goes, I've bought "live" rock from a LFS and it was so loaded with phosphates that I'm still dealing with algae. I also have rock that was aquacultured for 5 years and, for some reason can sit next to my algae filled "live" rock and algae would never attach to it. So for that reason, I wouldn't make generalizations but how different rocks attract nuisance algae.
There are other considerations as well. I think a higher %age of live or aquacultured rock leads to briefer cycling times (though the difference shouldn't mean much if you are diligently patient). Dry rock is great base rock. "Live rock" is great whereever and aquacultured rock is prime decoration. I've chosen to get a mixture, but if I were to start over I would have gotten some dry rock for bases and then all aquacultured rock.

[snorvich]

If I were planning a reef tank, I would go with 100% live rock despite the cost but if it were fowlr, I would mix in some dry rock. Dry rock often leeches phosphate.

[ssick92]

If I were planning a reef tank, I would go with 100% live rock despite the cost but if it were fowlr, I would mix in some dry rock. Dry rock often leeches phosphate.

+1

This is what I would do as well. Maybe don't need 100%, but I wouldn't go below 75%. It will also help your cycle be a lot faster too (~1 week).

[juniorrocketdad]

What do you all think about having a tank of mostly dry rock but putting some live rock into the refugium to speed up the cycle than taking out the live rock later

[homer1475]

If I were planning a reef tank, I would go with 100% live rock despite the cost but if it were fowlr, I would mix in some dry rock. Dry rock often leeches phosphate.

This +1

This go around I used all dry rock, and am still dealing with a ton of GHA 6 months later.

If I were to do another new tank, I would pony up for all live rock, probably TBS rock.

[Michael Hoaster]

A lot of good posts for ya! I'm curious as to what you'll end up doing. Good luck!

[Keelo]

You can go live rock and save money just have to be smart. I wouldn't buy it from the lfs. Rather go onto Craigslist or a local reef forum and look for some. Almost all the time people are tearing down or selling tanks and you can get the live rock for very cheap probably cheaper than dry rock.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[CStrickland]

You can go live rock and save money just have to be smart. I wouldn't buy it from the lfs. Rather go onto Craigslist or a local reef forum and look for some. Almost all the time people are tearing down or selling tanks and you can get the live rock for very cheap probably cheaper than dry rock.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I would be very cautious buying rock from a tank tear down. Did they quit the hobby because they have a baby on the way and need space and money, but the tank was rocking? Great. Did they epically fail, and the tank is overrun with aiptasia, whelks, aefw, ich, algae, dinoflagellates, and the rock is marinated in phosphate? Not great.

Reefcleaners.org sells dry rock for $2 a pound, free shipping, and it's cured of phosphate. My batch didn't leach any phos, and the owner was super-accommodating of my requests for shapes and sizes. I've had a bit of algae from the lack of encrustation, but nothing that got out of hand. I got about 3/4 of a pound per gallon (including sump) and have never had an issue with filtration (nitrates). That might also be due to using biospira and stocking slowly.

For new reefers, a local club is a fantastic connect to make. They will be a lifesaver if you have an emergency, and it's fun to make friends and see healthy tanks in person. Most are eager to help noobs get off on the right foot, including by donating some chunks of mature live rock to seed the tank. That way you can check for pests easily and it will be much "live-er" than anything an lfs will sell you.

[Grimreaperz]

I bought live rock from LFS. When I didn't know what I was looking for. It came with a lot good. But almost everything bad as well. I am now having to manage. Vertimid Snails, digitate and colonial hydroids. Bubble algae, Byropsis. If I do another tank. I will be going majority dry and a couple good live pieces.

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk

[mountainraised]

I would be very cautious buying rock from a tank tear down. Did they quit the hobby because they have a baby on the way and need space and money, but the tank was rocking? Great. Did they epically fail, and the tank is overrun with aiptasia, whelks, aefw, ich, algae, dinoflagellates, and the rock is marinated in phosphate? Not great.

Reefcleaners.org sells dry rock for $2 a pound, free shipping, and it's cured of phosphate. My batch didn't leach any phos, and the owner was super-accommodating of my requests for shapes and sizes. I've had a bit of algae from the lack of encrustation, but nothing that got out of hand. I got about 3/4 of a pound per gallon (including sump) and have never had an issue with filtration (nitrates). That might also be due to using biospira and stocking slowly.

For new reefers, a local club is a fantastic connect to make. They will be a lifesaver if you have an emergency, and it's fun to make friends and see healthy tanks in person. Most are eager to help noobs get off on the right foot, including by donating some chunks of mature live rock to seed the tank. That way you can check for pests easily and it will be much "live-er" than anything an lfs will sell you.

How does this base rock compare in density compared to pukani rock?

[Keelo]

I would be very cautious buying rock from a tank tear down. Did they quit the hobby because they have a baby on the way and need space and money, but the tank was rocking? Great. Did they epically fail, and the tank is overrun with aiptasia, whelks, aefw, ich, algae, dinoflagellates, and the rock is marinated in phosphate? Not great.



Reefcleaners.org sells dry rock for $2 a pound, free shipping, and it's cured of phosphate. My batch didn't leach any phos, and the owner was super-accommodating of my requests for shapes and sizes. I've had a bit of algae from the lack of encrustation, but nothing that got out of hand. I got about 3/4 of a pound per gallon (including sump) and have never had an issue with filtration (nitrates). That might also be due to using biospira and stocking slowly.



For new reefers, a local club is a fantastic connect to make. They will be a lifesaver if you have an emergency, and it's fun to make friends and see healthy tanks in person. Most are eager to help noobs get off on the right foot, including by donating some chunks of mature live rock to seed the tank. That way you can check for pests easily and it will be much "live-er" than anything an lfs will sell you.



Well this can be true of all live rock since we don't know what is on it. Just because it's from the ocean doesn't it make any more clean than live rock from a local reefer. To have better judgement you can always join a local reef club and buy from people there that are selling directly from their tank. Either way as long as you cure and meticulously inspect the rock you should be fine. If you can get live rock that has been well established for 2.00/lb vs dry rock for the same price I would take live rock any day of the week!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[liverock]

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2601218

[alcimedes]

I picked up 160 lbs. of live rock from a local hobbyist who was converting his tank to freshwater to put his turtles in come winter time. He was selling it for $1 per lb. It was cheaper than dry 'live' rock.

Since I only lived 20 min. away, the rock was hardly out of the water at all.

I was able to check out the rock before the tank was broken down, and it was gorgeous. If you can check it ahead of time for algae, apistea, mojano's etc. and it looks good, it seems like a fantastic way to go.

I had already ordered 40lbs of life rock from an Amazon vendor.

That rock arrived in damp newspapers. It had a few bad algae hitchhikers on the rock, but otherwise has been full of beneficial life.

I know there are people way more experienced with reef tanks than I am, but so far I've been very happy going the tons of live rock route, and even though my tank is very new, there have hardly been any algae problems at all.

[CStrickland]

How does this base rock compare in density compared to pukani rock?

It's denser. It's the type of rock that is mined from the ground in a part of Florida that was a reef a long time ago. I don't think anything but Pukani is comparable to Pukani density.

[liverock]

It's denser. It's the type of rock that is mined from the ground in a part of Florida that was a reef a long time ago. I don't think anything but Pukani is comparable to Pukani density.

Pukani is the lightest rock available, and reason being it is not rock, but coral skeletons...I have it under production on the live rock lease. Harvested a few hundred pounds yesterday.

Pukani is neat as it also comes in larger sizes than any other traditional rock/coral, and is great for larger tanks, as small rock just does not look right in large tanks.

Richard TBS
www.tbsaltwater.com

[Timfish]

I would never think of setting up a system without a good quality wild or maricultured live rock. The cryptic sponges and other "stuff" you get are critical for establishing a healthy, mature reef ecosystem. You do not need to get an outrageous amount though, I typically use about a 1/4 lb per gallon mixed with local honeycomb limestone. See my posts in this thread http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2600731 for my thoughts about the "pests" that come in on live rock and the real threat to corals in reef systems.

[mountainraised]

With all this dialogue, I myself went with a 50lbs order of Marco's rock after weighing the pros and cons. It was economic and even though they offer a WYSIWYG aquascape, you can still provide notes on the rocks you are looking for, so its very close to a WYSIWYG, I would consider is WYAFIWYG (What You Ask For Is What You Get). With a fully customizable aquascape at my finger tips and a true zero impact on the ocean, I felt going with a dry-harvested option provided me with an option that best matched my values. This way I get exactly what I want in the foundation, and like many, I have years to enjoy this hobby, I am not looking for instant gratification.

Thank you all for your input.