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atitagain
10/11/2016, 04:39 PM
I moved from AZ to Oh and set my tank back up after a few months of being down.

When I took the tank down i pulled all the live rock and washed/dried/washed and dried out in the AZ sun with tap water. I bagged in and boxed it.

When setting up my tank again in OH i bought a RO/DI system, filled the tank, mixed in the salt and then added 20# live pink fuji sand and the rock from my previous tank. I let it sit for a couple days and then added a raw shrimp. It stayed in there for 72 hours and i pulled it because it was turing the water super cloudy and from the advice from other replies to a previous post about it.

It took a couple days and the water cleared up, while testing over the past week my nitrites have pretty much stayed steady at 4-5, nitrates at 80-100 and ammonia at .02 or less ppm and .25 or <.25mg/l. total time the tank had been up is about 3-4 weeks. I was doubting my salifert ammonia test kit (1.5 yrs old) so yesterday i bought the seachem ammonia badge. I started "safe" less then .02ppm. Well I had time on lunch break and read about "stalled" cycle since my nitrite/nitrate hasn't moved in 1.5 weeks. I stopped at the store and bought astons clear ammonia and a dropper. I added 25 drops waited 20 minutes and nothing is changing on the ammonia scale and I tested with the salifert and it still reads under .025m/l. what now? I am so confused. Did i not add enough ammonia? My Apex PM1 module crashed and a new one is on the way, i tested PH with salifert and it stated it was 7.6 which should be high enough to not cause an issue. :headwally:

bertoni
10/11/2016, 07:00 PM
Those level are high enough that some water changes might help. High nutrient levels, like ammonia and nitrite, might be able to inhibit the growth of bacteria. That seems fairly common when tanks get a very large dose of organics.

I would change at least half of the water, maybe 2/3, in 2-3 water changes, but doing it all at once is acceptable, although it might slow the cycling process.

Fizzman
10/12/2016, 12:26 AM
Hey, I'm no expert cuz I had my own tank cycling thread, however, I started a 24gal jbj tank so similar to yours. I just threw in a raw shrimp that I blended up(blending is a mistake I think), and it's been one week and one day. I put a CUC in there already(probably shouldn't have put a fish or a cleaner shrimp) but hermits are cheap. Ammonia is zero and nitrate is max out even after 50% water change. U have more for sure live rocks than I. Probably more rocks total than I if u used old Rock and had room for 20# more. I had 35# of maybe live rock. I was told before I started to cycle my tank to put the raw shrimp in and just watch it disappear while monitoring ammonia, like bertoni said, don't let ammonia get too high but 0.25isnt high. This way there is a constant supply for food for the bacteria, and just let the water be cloudy. As soon as it stops being clouding with the shrimp still in there, that's when you should put in another shrimp to and have the water be cloudy again. Once that clears or if the water doesn't get cloudy any more that's when u pay real close attention to the ammonia, nitrite, nitrate readings. I had to start my tank cycling thread cuz I didn't have the appropriate tests, and it really didn't go like I expected. Somehow my tank cycled already(I think, one more week of monitoring to be sure)

Fizzman
10/12/2016, 12:29 AM
So somehow I did something wrong but turned out right that my tank cycled in 1week (pending confirmation of course)

atitagain
10/12/2016, 08:04 AM
Couple of things:

Can anyone talk to if I added enough ammonia to drive a spike? I added 25 drops and zero ammonia change registered on seachem badge or salifert tester. Also, my only levels that are spiked are nitrite and nitrate. Why would a water change help the cycle when PH is still7.4/7.6?

nirtza79
10/12/2016, 10:38 AM
Couple of things:

Can anyone talk to if I added enough ammonia to drive a spike? I added 25 drops and zero ammonia change registered on seachem badge or salifert tester. Also, my only levels that are spiked are nitrite and nitrate. Why would a water change help the cycle when PH is still7.4/7.6?

Because high Nitrite inhibit bacteria growth as well as high Ammonia

atitagain
10/12/2016, 11:17 AM
Because high Nitrite inhibit bacteria growth as well as high Ammonia

My ammonia is "safe" on seachem badge and less than .025 mg/l on Salifert. Not debating, trying to understand

nirtza79
10/12/2016, 04:13 PM
My ammonia is "safe" on seachem badge and less than .025 mg/l on Salifert. Not debating, trying to understand

Nitrite, not Ammonia.

bertoni
10/12/2016, 06:54 PM
I agree that nitrite seems to inhibit bacterial growth at high levels.

atitagain
10/13/2016, 06:36 AM
I changed 4 gallons last night (already had it made up) and it dropped the nitrite level to 2ppm. Where should I go from here? Should I change another 4 gallons tonight? That Should drop the nitrate to 1ppm. If yes, then should I just let the tank run or add ammonia to see if it converts to nitrite and then nitrite drops and converts it to nitrate.

I have austins clear ammonia and a dropper. From on-line calculator it seems that a drop per gallon should drive the ammonia level to 2ppm's is this correct?

bertoni
10/13/2016, 01:47 PM
I'd do another 4 gallon change to get the nitrite below 1 ppm, and wait for a bit. Don't add any more ammonia. A tiny amount of fish food would be more than enough to keep any filter bacteria going, and another nitrite spike is just going to slow the process. The tank doesn't need any more nutrients.

atitagain
10/13/2016, 06:36 PM
I'd do another 4 gallon change to get the nitrite below 1 ppm, and wait for a bit. Don't add any more ammonia. A tiny amount of fish food would be more than enough to keep any filter bacteria going, and another nitrite spike is just going to slow the process. The tank doesn't need any more nutrients.

Copy, will do that tonight. I tested when I got home at nitrate is a tad bit over 1 and nitrate is about 60. Ammonia =zero. Got a new Salifert ammonia tester in mail today so I know it's zero.

I just have pellets for food, is that ok?

bertoni
10/13/2016, 07:07 PM
Yes, that's fine. This is a 30g tank, so a single pellet probably is overkill. Honestly, I wouldn't add anything until the nitrite hits zero for a day or so.

atitagain
10/14/2016, 04:55 PM
Yes, that's fine. This is a 30g tank, so a single pellet probably is overkill. Honestly, I wouldn't add anything until the nitrite hits zero for a day or so.

so I just got home from work and was prepping to change another 4 gallons since i couldn't get to it last night and thought let me test as a before/after. Well I test nitrite and went from 1/1.5 PPM to 0/.01 PPM nitrate. I wasn't expecting that. Does that mean the cycle is done? nitrate went from 60-70 to 25 PPM.

so a recap tank level didn't change for almost two weeks. The Ammonia was zero, nitrite was 4ppm and nitrate was 75-85ppm. I then changed 4 gallons two days and tested the next day. ammonia 0, nitrite 1/1.5ppm, nitrate 60/70 ppm. I checked it today as a baseline before another 4 gallon water change and i got 0/.01ppm nitrate, 25ppm nitrate. There has been no other changes besides hooking up my PM1 module last night.

so what direction should i go now? I should very that the tank is cycled correct? Should i add ammonia and ensure it converts to NO2 then NO3 and then major water change to drop the NO3?

bertoni
10/14/2016, 07:54 PM
Well, everyone has a different opinion as to when the "cycle" is over. I suspect the tank is ready for a cleanup crew, but I'd wait for a week of solid zero for ammonia and nitrite no greater than 0.1 ppm, which I think the tank is below? You meant 0.01 ppm nitrite?

Now would be a good time to add any mysid, amphipod, or copepod cultures. You could feed them tiny amount of fish food. If the tank is kept lit, a couple of snails might help with any algae. I wouldn't add any ammonia. It's just going to spike the nitrate level. Very tiny amounts of fish food should be fine.

atitagain
10/15/2016, 07:22 AM
Well, everyone has a different opinion as to when the "cycle" is over. I suspect the tank is ready for a cleanup crew, but I'd wait for a week of solid zero for ammonia and nitrite no greater than 0.1 ppm, which I think the tank is below? You meant 0.01 ppm nitrite?

Now would be a good time to add any mysid, amphipod, or copepod cultures. You could feed them tiny amount of fish food. If the tank is kept lit, a couple of snails might help with any algae. I wouldn't add any ammonia. It's just going to spike the nitrate level. Very tiny amounts of fish food should be fine.

thank you, no issue waiting another week i am going very slow this time. I had AEFW before i took my tank down from no QT'n everything so this go around I am QT'n everything which drive a couple questions if you still have the patients to answer after all you other help.

1) over the next few week while i set up my QT and place my order for CUC do I need to ghost feed the tank or anything? Is it necessary to keep the bacteria alive?

2) in the past once the tank was cycled I would do a 50% water change to reduce the nitrate, is this still common practice?

bertoni
10/15/2016, 06:28 PM
Ghost feeding probably is optional. I would feed maybe 1 tiny flake of food per day if I were worried, but I regularly let tanks sit without ghost feeding. You can ramp up any ghost feeding before adding any fish. That's a good idea, particularly if you are adding a large number of fish. Cleanup crew don't product much ammonia, so they are fine to add in reasonable numbers. The cleanup crew kits that are sold often are far too large for the recommended tank size.

I would do 2-3 20% changes, to avoid any sudden changes in water parameters and to avoid exposing live rock to air, but 1 50% change probably is safe enough.

atitagain
10/15/2016, 08:21 PM
Ghost feeding probably is optional. I would feed maybe 1 tiny flake of food per day if I were worried, but I regularly let tanks sit without ghost feeding. You can ramp up any ghost feeding before adding any fish. That's a good idea, particularly if you are adding a large number of fish. Cleanup crew don't product much ammonia, so they are fine to add in reasonable numbers. The cleanup crew kits that are sold often are far too large for the recommended tank size.

I would do 2-3 20% changes, to avoid any sudden changes in water parameters and to avoid exposing live rock to air, but 1 50% change probably is safe enough.

thank you very much Sir!! i have a 4 gallon water change set up (marked and know the grams of coral sea pro) so I will do a 4g change tomorrow and one on tuesday. I will start with about 1/4 CUC since there won't be much in the tank for them and feed a little bit of pellets every 2-3 days.