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View Full Version : Prolific stunt tanks all over YouTube !


jestronix
05/25/2018, 05:26 AM
Hi All,

Of late I've been checking across YouTube for reef tank ideas, layout etc. time and time again I come across what look like faked reef tanks, where the owners with more money than brains go out and buy fairly mature corals and arrange them like a bunch of flowers.

These tanks rarely exist more than a year and usually only show one or two videos. Their is no hint if calcification etc, they often claim to be zeotanks but never give any detail on their setups or reply to comments.

Comments on the videos are from those new to the hobby that are not really investigating what they are looking at. Everyone seems very fooled by these tanks. As a community we should call these tanks out where we can, I feel it takes away from the real art and challenges of keeping a reef tank, the knowledge and experience it takes to grow a tank out.

It's great for LFS and importers as this just means more business but after reefing for a decade I have an issue with these stunt tanks. It feels like you've just climbed Everest and some tool gets dropped off by helicopter, takes a few videos and pictures at the top and then zips off. I wonder if this is how professional cyclists feel in the age of falsely sponsored Lycra coffee drinkers ?

It's never going to go away, but I believe it's something we should speak up about when we can,ask for more videos and grow out shots.

I have nothing against people buying mature corals and setting them up in their tank, until they take claim for an insane reef tank on youtube for next to zero effort. Usually those tanks never end up here on the forum as we would call them out, but they are rife elsewhere outside of forums where they can't be challenged.

Rover88
05/25/2018, 06:52 AM
I actually recently started taking a skim over these kinda tanks as well, and while some seem to have very detailed explanations of their sumps and layouts and whats in them, others seem to more be focused on whats in the tank.

I took issue with a few that looked like someone just asked for one of every fish and dumped them all in. Even during the video, you could see fairly non-stop aggression in the background of a way overcrowded tank.

mcgyvr
05/25/2018, 07:12 AM
no thanks...
This is a hobby where you can choose how much effort or money you put into it.. Either side of the coin is just fine by me...

jestronix
05/25/2018, 09:10 AM
no thanks...
This is a hobby where you can choose how much effort or money you put into it.. Either side of the coin is just fine by me...

I know it's a bit like those fake blow off valves for non turbo cars :) it's their money lol some people are fooled and well some ain't :) long as no ones hurt I guess. Apart from errr the fish and corals that die in a few months.

sde1500
05/25/2018, 09:57 AM
I don't tend to ever really go through youtube watching reef videos, so not sure exactly what you are talking about, but what is the problem with buying mature colonies to set a tank up with? Honestly I can see the appeal, sure it is cool watching frags grow, but then it takes years to get a grown out tank, which is what most want to see. Do you have examples, because now I am curious. What makes them "more money than brains" for buying colonies?

Fourstars
05/25/2018, 10:05 AM
I'm to poor, I had to learn to grow them out.

oldhead
05/25/2018, 10:17 AM
I'm to poor, I had to learn to grow them out.

:thumbsup:

Aquavaj
05/25/2018, 02:42 PM
Meh, can't control what anyone does with their money. Shoot if I had that kind of money to just throw into a giant tank and have it looking great in a few weeks I would too. I'll even pay someone to come in and do the maintenance. So until that day happens I'm stuck doing it myself and looking for deals or go with secondhand stuff.

smartwater101
05/25/2018, 04:03 PM
Of course it's living creatures so it unfortunate, but an improperly stocked tank happens all the time.

We all make massive mistakes when we first get started. Impatience being one of the key factors. Some people just have more money to burn so the mistakes, relative to our tanks, seem even larger.

jestronix
05/25/2018, 06:09 PM
I don't tend to ever really go through youtube watching reef videos, so not sure exactly what you are talking about, but what is the problem with buying mature colonies to set a tank up with? Honestly I can see the appeal, sure it is cool watching frags grow, but then it takes years to get a grown out tank, which is what most want to see. Do you have examples, because now I am curious. What makes them "more money than brains" for buying colonies?

Nothing wrong with buying mature colonies, it's almost obvious in most accounts that this is their first tank, they throw in all sorts of fish, usually overcrowded and corals that last a year and just keep buying mature colonies as each one dies. Like a really expensive bunch of flowers. To people watching their videos it appears reef keeping is easy. What's easy is just buying more mature colonies. Long term reef keeping is hard! Growing out tanks like these is hard! Not once do I see them comment and go, "thanks for the nice comments but this tank is new and I really only just got into reef keeping", it sets the stage for fly by night tanks and a wasteful approach to the hobby.

Some in mind are, check their other videos, usually nothing. Impressive looking tanks but that's it. Maybe they lasted a few months, also check between videos most corals are swapped out if they last more than a few months.

https://youtu.be/lsmM1WjAQNA

https://youtu.be/k3VtjwOOiKs

https://youtu.be/ktAB4BQXTdw

https://youtu.be/xbdIrhXOMaw

sde1500
05/25/2018, 06:21 PM
3rd and 4th look a little stuck together. If you have tips for identifying how itís obvious that those first two videos you linked are their first tanks and thrown together from mature colonies Iíd love to hear them. Iím not seeing it.

Anemone
05/25/2018, 07:46 PM
3rd and 4th look a little stuck together. If you have tips for identifying how itís obvious that those first two videos you linked are their first tanks and thrown together from mature colonies Iíd love to hear them. Iím not seeing it.

I agree. The second tank even had frag racks and was growing out frags. And the most easily "suspect" tank IMO, #4, had some frag plates growing out. I don't see how anyone can immediately identify these as "stunt tanks."

Kevin

top shelf
05/25/2018, 08:34 PM
Hi All,

It's great for LFS and importers as this just means more business but after reefing for a decade I have an issue with these stunt tanks. It feels like you've just climbed Everest and some tool gets dropped off by helicopter, takes a few videos and pictures at the top and then zips off. I wonder if this is how professional cyclists feel in the age of falsely sponsored Lycra coffee drinkers ?


That may be true but they don't get the same reward at the end of the day. Or at least that's how I see it anyways. You get the satisfaction that you made something out of nothing. They may learn nothing from the experience but you get to take away knowledge and use it in the future.

It's just like that spoiled person everyone knows. They get everything handed to them while you work hard for everything you have. Most of those people don't appreciate what they have but you know you worked hard for it and it will always mean more to you because of it.

top shelf
05/25/2018, 08:40 PM
I know it's a bit like those fake blow off valves for non turbo cars :) it's their money lol some people are fooled and well some ain't :) long as no ones hurt I guess. Apart from errr the fish and corals that die in a few months.

Heck I own a turbo car and still don't have a bov, my car recirculates the excess and monitors it. Still just as fun to drive though lol but agreed coral and fish should not be viewed as so easily replaceable.

NO3
05/25/2018, 08:46 PM
Fake NEWS....and now Fake TANKS?

What in the wide wide world of sports is going on here? :rollface:

jestronix
05/25/2018, 08:56 PM
First tank at the end of the video, there's a coral near the back wall, looks to be on with putty with not one coral showing calcification at the base. Corals on what look to be unnatural leans in places. Hidden bases of almost every coral. They only show videos all from the same year, nothing for 5 years on the first one. Things look placed and jammed.

On the second video, at 2:55 you'll see fresh putty on the base of the coral, he has chosen corals in places that have come with base rock where possible, but fresh putty raises eyebrows. You'll see him try and film just the tops but in this part of the video you'll see a number of corals with fresh putty. 4:22 more fresh putty! And more. Then look at the glimpse of the frag rack, those are just bits he's broken off where he had mounting issues, they don't look to be growing or calcified. U can just see fresh putty on those. Also no videos for years after, no grow out proof.

I'll take into account these people may have just uploaded the tank at a point in time, but from a viewer perspective fresh putty and the jammed nature of the tanks looks highly likely these were stunt tanks.

Look around at veteran reefers tanks, you'll see natural growout, many videos over the years and usually forum and TOTM mentions etc. and you'll usually get a peak at the bases to see some serious calcification.

tanks like reef in the sky :) https://youtu.be/ilr39MpTjjM I believe, look at the growout, other videos to support over the years etc

Fresh putty on numerous bases shows these tanks haven't been around long enough to convince me anyway. If I can't see supporting videos or a forum thread then for me I have to rely on what I can see, and all I can see is the ability to buy and place coral. Maybe I'm too cynical :)

Anemone
05/25/2018, 11:01 PM
Maybe I'm too cynical :)

A couple of those tanks have large Monti Cap corals. Have you ever tried to move a large monti cap in a tank, much less buy one and put it a new tank? They break. These aren't broken.

And as I mentioned above, the first tank had a frag grow out rack on the side. "Stunt tanks" wouldn't include a frag grow out rack (with encrusting frags).

It appears you are basing most of your opinion on the fact that these folks don't post multiple videos over time. I don't find it unreasonable for someone to post a single video of something and not return to post dozens of more videos of the same thing. But, maybe that's just me.

Kevin

jestronix
05/25/2018, 11:34 PM
A couple of those tanks have large Monti Cap corals. Have you ever tried to move a large monti cap in a tank, much less buy one and put it a new tank? They break. These aren't broken.

And as I mentioned above, the first tank had a frag grow out rack on the side. "Stunt tanks" wouldn't include a frag grow out rack (with encrusting frags).

It appears you are basing most of your opinion on the fact that these folks don't post multiple videos over time. I don't find it unreasonable for someone to post a single video of something and not return to post dozens of more videos of the same thing. But, maybe that's just me.

Kevin

What's thoughts on all the fresh putty ? Can you pick a time in the vid to help me pick out the encrusting frags ? I've often bought frags that are encrusted and sat them on my frag rack first while I pick a spot to put them. I've moved a few large corals in my time, it can be done, just not easy. Dozens of videos isn't what I'm looking for, I'm looking for at least one follow up video in those 5 years of nothing :) and where the corals are in the same spot and not new.

As I state not every tank will be a stunt tank, nor did they set out to be a stunt tank, but they on appearance have become a stunt tank lol

I don't think we should be closed to the idea that these stunt tanks exist and the motives of some reefers .

Either way I'm not going to believe all the sps reefs I see are the real deal and last any longer than 6 months to a year.

Look for grow out, look for encrusting matured colonies, look for natural grow patterns , plates on a massive tilt are a give away. ask about their lighting or their setup, usually nothing is ever replied.

jestronix
05/26/2018, 07:43 AM
Here's a veteran reefer with some very very nice acros with huge encrusting bases. One look at a tank like this and you know the difference. Actually a great setup with T5 doing its thing :)

https://youtu.be/NyPxtZTqqSc

aurora.k
05/26/2018, 10:22 AM
I know it's a bit like those fake blow off valves for non turbo cars :) it's their money lol some people are fooled and well some ain't :) long as no ones hurt I guess. Apart from errr the fish and corals that die in a few months.



Yes, that is an important point that you made nicely. Iím all for live and let live, but it is terrible to just let everything die. And frankly for each live-caught fish successfully purchased, others die in transit so it is quite irresponsible to increase demand without being prepared. (I only buy captive bred/ Aquacultured and I try not to be too judgmental on here as I know folks on this forum are responsible and care for their fish, but I did feel compelled to weigh in on this point)

That said, I am working hard on my tank - upgrading to a new tank that is fishless cycling right now, but then I do want to buy some mature corals when the tank is ready for them in what feels like forever from now.... I am fine cheating... Iíll also eventually pay someone to take care of my tank, so thereís that sacrilege, too... [emoji15]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

sde1500
05/26/2018, 11:32 AM
Sorry I just donít see how putty on a couple bases (who doesnít have that arenít we all always seeming to add corals), plus no follow up videos leads to the conclusion these are tanks where everything is dumped in and later all dies. I just donít see it.

jestronix
05/26/2018, 08:37 PM
Sorry I just donít see how putty on a couple bases (who doesnít have that arenít we all always seeming to add corals), plus no follow up videos leads to the conclusion these are tanks where everything is dumped in and later all dies. I just donít see it.


If you look at the last tank above, this is a tank that shows real grow out and encrusted bases. I saw not one coral in those other tanks that showed evidence of this. I expect to see one or two new putty bases in even the best long term tanks. As you said "who doesnít have that arenít we all always seeming to add corals".

I can't convince anyone that all the corals died in those tanks because we never saw those tanks again :) leading one to think the tanks went on to live happily ever after or ..... the unthinkable and unseeable happened... they died.

I build that view in my mind due to more than just a couple of mature colonies having fresh putty and other bases are all hidden in the videos.

The moment I see encrusted bases I know this is a hard earned tank, not a bouquet of colourful insta corals that fell out of someone's wallet. Or... if I see a video of the tank a year later and it's grown out. I'm not calling out tanks that haven't had 3-5 years of time to post at least one follow up video.

jestronix
05/26/2018, 09:04 PM
Yes, that is an important point that you made nicely. I’m all for live and let live, but it is terrible to just let everything die. And frankly for each live-caught fish successfully purchased, others die in transit so it is quite irresponsible to increase demand without being prepared. (I only buy captive bred/ Aquacultured and I try not to be too judgmental on here as I know folks on this forum are responsible and care for their fish, but I did feel compelled to weigh in on this point)

That said, I am working hard on my tank - upgrading to a new tank that is fishless cycling right now, but then I do want to buy some mature corals when the tank is ready for them in what feels like forever from now.... I am fine cheating... I’ll also eventually pay someone to take care of my tank, so there’s that sacrilege, too... [emoji15]

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm upgrading to a new tank soon too :) I'll buy a couple of mature colonies as well for mine. Ill also have some of my grown out encrusted corals that I'll be moving across. I just hope someone gives me a few years to show the grow out videos afterwards before they say I'm cheating :).

I try not to call out any tank that hasn't had a few years to at least show a second video or pics in a forum so I think we will be safe :)

I've just seen it down at a couple of our local LFS where some guy will rock in asking all these beginner questions and buys up a heap of mature colonies and random fish. The LFS loves this, it's how they make money. Not all LFS are like that, some try to educate the customer, I've seen some sales guys stop people in their tracks and shift the buyer into a more sensible approach. I can just bet on previous experience that some these tanks perish pretty quickly when they go nuts as a beginner and the LFS lets them, or they buy it all online. I think some of those tanks I've shown are those sorts of tanks.

Having someone look after your tank isn't an issue, or cheating. Its great as you still get to enjoy the hobby.

lapin
05/27/2018, 08:03 AM
There is really nothing wrong with buying mature corals. How many reefers cant keep the tanks they have and need to part them out. Thats where I get most of my corals. As mentioned above, a "staged" tank prob wont look like that after some time unless it undergoes a remodel. To each is own. Its unfortunate that some people might think they can easily do this and end up disappointed, and creatures die.
You just cant believe everything you see on the internet.
If you are like me the fun is in the journey once you get to the end of the road the big fun is over. To most, a tank build here is not building a tank, but actually doing the decorating, and then its mostly the good parts. How many treads show the ugly stuff as part of the build? Most times its posted in "Help- How to get rid of ????"
ok im done......

d2mini
05/27/2018, 08:19 AM
Back in the day, full colonies is what you bought.
We only started buying little nubs because they cost the same or more than it used to cost for colonies!

Actually, i like buying frags and watching them grow vs buying colonies, but there is truth to the above and some people are the opposite and would rather buy colonies.