View Full Version : LM3 not returning to run state after power restore
08/04/2005, 03:16 AM
I have my LM3 + RPM pumping RO to my kalk reactor and supplying additional top up water to my system.
My controller cuts power to the pumps when the kalk reactor mixes and settles. When power is restored, the LM3 doesn't always return to the run state.
Is there a proceedure to ensure that it will?
Thanks in advance
08/04/2005, 10:48 AM
Here are the programming rules:
1. All parameters are saved as soon as they are changed.
2. If the "A" pump is in RUN mode, when power is restored, the program starts with the ON part of the "A" cycle.
3. If the "A" pump is in ON mode, when power is restored, the program turns the "A" pump on.
4. If any other pump is running when the power goes off, the program restarts with the "A" cycle.
Which of these rules is being violated?
08/04/2005, 03:57 PM
I leave pumps A and B in the run mode all the time. Power is cut twice per day. 75% of the time, the pumps return to the desired state, but the balance of the time, when power is restored, the LM3 is in all pumps off mode
08/04/2005, 04:44 PM
I've never seen one do that. The program hasn't changed in three years so I'll have to look into the start-up code closely to see what could possibly be geting missed.
In the meantime, I guess you can send it back and we will re-program it with the existing code. I know you're in Canada and that's a hassle.
The same mechanism that remembers the parameters also remembers the run state. Do any of the values on the LCD screen change unexpectedly?
One more question -- If it comes back up in ALL PUMPS OFF and it gets powered down again, does it ever then turn back on properly, or is it always dead from then on?
08/04/2005, 07:24 PM
The pump parameters are maintained without issue including the run state of the pumps.
It is the state of the run/stop button that is intermittently lost when power is cut and restored.
When it has come back up in ALL PUMPS OFF mode, I have always pushed the run/stop button after noticing the problem. I cannot wait the 12 hours to see if the next power cycle restores the correct state because I rely on the pump to feed my kalk reactor.
I am doubtful that reprogramming will resolve the issue because it is intermittent and the programming must be very basic.
I am wondering if it could be how power is restored to the device. It is plugged into a Neptune DC8 which uses Triacs instead of relays for switching. Any thoughts on this?
When I initially started this thread, I was wondering if a certain screen needed to be displayed on the pump for the run/stop button state to be remembered. Now it seems like this is a bigger fish.
08/04/2005, 08:31 PM
That is a great clue! I have never tested it with a triac-based controller.
I would try plugging and unplugging it straight into the wall, say 20 times, and see if it EVER messes up.
If this is a real problem, I am sure someone else will eventually call me with the same complaint, so I need to come up with a fix. Triac outputs are often, but not always noisy. If the Neptune is just being a 12-hour timer for the LM3, and not under some kind of sensor-feedback-control, then please consider using a $6 lamp timer to control the LM3.
08/04/2005, 08:50 PM
I use an LM3 switched off and on by a Neptune through a DC4, and mine has no problems with state changes - sounds like something is wrong,
08/04/2005, 08:50 PM
I also have a DC4HD which is relay based. I am planning on testing it with that, but I would have to move a light over to the DC8 and may max out the current with that.
I use the Aquacontroller to turn off the LM3 1 minute before the kalk mixes and restore power 1-1/2 hours after mixing is complete. The Aquacontroller also kills the LM3 if the max run water level in the sump is reached or the pH of the water gets too high. A power bar timer will not be sufficient.
It sounds like you think the triac switching may be the issue, so I'll let you know how I make out with my test.
08/04/2005, 08:52 PM
the DC4 is also relay based, so if this issue is triac related, which seems to be the case, I wouldn't expect you to have this problem.
08/09/2005, 05:10 PM
I was having a similar problem with a CO2 solenoid and the Neptune rep (Curt) made me aware of some information that explains the problem. He indicated that there is a 5V leakage with triacs. I added and additional 12V load to the outlet powering the LM3 on the DC8 and was unable to make it fail.
The solution for my problem, should it come up in the future, is to use the DC4/DC4HD or add a small load to the DC8 circuit.
Thanks for your help
08/09/2005, 05:41 PM
Great idea and this probably explains it, but I'm not sure what you mean by a "12V load".
My idea of a small load would be a 10-20 watt light bulb in a socket with an AC cord and plug on it, plugged into a 3-fer along with the LiterMeter's power supply.
08/09/2005, 06:16 PM
I used an extention cord and plugged in the LM3 with another device that has a 12V transformer.
08/09/2005, 07:25 PM
Thank you for your diligence and resolution to this perplexing problem!
08/09/2005, 09:10 PM
:thumbsup: glad to help
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