What is up with the SW Coral Farmers Market

[saltyDDS]

I've been thinking about attending the SW Coral Farmers Market for one main reason: support aqua culturists and their captive grown products. As a hobbyist, I would like to do my small contribution in preserving our precious reefs. However, I've been discouraged lately with some of the threads and/ or posts by participating vendors. Just today, one posted a "Gem of the Sea" for $300 and another vendor with an Indo China (aka Fiji) stag for $200. Even Tong’s sell large full Fiji stag colonies for 80 bucks! There are other posts as well but can't do a search now because I'm too cheap to be a premium member.

I checked on SWCFM’s website and this is what it says:

Participating in this event will be representatives of some of the major non-profit aquarist clubs and hobbyist organizations located within the Southwest.

Am I wrong to think that the vendors are far from being non-profit? I realize that they have to make money to keep their operation going. BUT, $200 plus for a coral fragment is just insane. How can anyone expect the reef hobbyist to support the idea of aqua cultured corals if they price their homegrown products as such? This basically forces most of the hobbyist to purchase wild colonies, which furthers the destruction of international reefs.

LMK what you think.

BTW, I just have a little too much time this evening.:D I planned on attending my daughter's school recital but had another emergency patient to see. Of course they were late and now too much traffic with the rain. I'll wait it out but stir some discussion on here while waiting.

[dymaxiun]

AMEN!!!

[golfish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768020#post6768020 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by saltyDDS
Just today, one posted a "Gem of the Sea" for $300 and another vendor with an Indo China (aka Fiji) stag for $200. Even Tong’s sell large full Fiji stag colonies for 80 bucks!



IMO, this hobby started to go down hill about 3-4 years ago. Too many idiots with no talent, no patience and too much money. I have a hard time spending 20.00 on a frag, its not that I can't afford it, its that I don't feel I should pay for any coral frag, not one penny. I can't recall ever charging money for a frag. I bet I've given 200+ away, maybe more.

I kind of like what Steve is doing with the coral market. He's a lot more then the guy down the street with a fish tank...(wait, he is the guy down the street with a fish tank) I'd like to see this work out for him, for all of us...ramble, ramble:lol:

Doc, IMO, the problem is the buyers not the sellers. Hope to see ya tomorrow. I'll be the old white guy....No, Not Steve U.

[Vampire2]

Who is Steve that you mention?

[dznuts007]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768284#post6768284 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by golfish
IMO, this hobby started to go down hill about 3-4 years ago. Too many idiots with no talent, no patience and too much money. I have a hard time spending 20.00 on a frag, its not that I can't afford it, its that I don't feel I should pay for any coral frag, not one penny. I can't recall ever charging money for a frag. I bet I've given 200+ away, maybe more.


Agree

[SirLight1337]

once again agree with the doc. crazy crazy prices from everyone. hobbiests, stores, and all at the cost of wild colonies.

You know what i can honestly say? Ive been in the hobby for a pretty short time ( just over a year ) and in this time, ive never once received a free anything from anyone. 80 dollars for this FRAG, 20 dollars for this one etc etc... o well. ill stick with my softies that no one seems to want anymore.

[saltyDDS]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768284#post6768284 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by golfish
the problem is the buyers not the sellers.

I definitely agree with your statement and also realize that there are coral farmers out there who care for the environment. Unfortunatley they seem to be out numbered by vendors who are out for a quick buck.


Hope to see ya tomorrow. I'll be the old white guy....No, Not Steve U.

Are they giving senior discounts at the door?:lol:

[saltyDDS]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768371#post6768371 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by SirLight1337
ive never once received a free anything from anyone.

You should've attended Drewcipher and LPSgirl's frag swap/ get together a few weeks ago. A small group but a bunch of frags were exchanged with absolutely no money involved. Not sure if it'll be the same next time around.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768363#post6768363 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Vampire2
Who is Steve that you mention?

I believe he is referring to Steve Tyree of whom many limited edition corals are named after.

[Vampire2]

Amen! It's rain tomorrow.

[golfish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768371#post6768371 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by SirLight1337
Ive been in the hobby for a pretty short time ( just over a year ) and in this time, ive never once received a free anything from anyone.

That's because you live in Orange County:lol: ( I'm kind of kidding, a little)

I tell ya what. Go back and find my "got drums" thread. Look up each and every guy in the OC who got a FREE drum from me, send them a PM and tell them that golfish would like for them to give you a frag for free (equal or lesser value of course) for getting the drum..I'm not kidding, not at all.

Lets see what happens.

Oh, I think those drum cost about 150.00 new, so lets say 75.00 semi new.

[golfish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768414#post6768414 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by saltyDDS

I believe he is referring to Steve Tyree of whom many limited edition corals are named after.

Your are correct sir.

[Orochimaru]

Doc, IMO, the problem is the buyers not the sellers. Hope to see ya tomorrow. I'll be the old white guy....No, Not Steve U.

Though I agree with you about too many idiots with lots of money and yes the hobby is going down hill since. However, do you think it's all the buyers' fault? Do you think that buyers are the ones that came up with the "urban legend , Steve Tyree's LE"?

I don't have lots of money but I am sure those with lots of money didn't come up the Tyree's LE so they can pay more. Would you say the sellers are also contributing to the problem?

I mean, really why should my corals be any more valuable than yours just because some guy come into my house and call them LE? "A rose by any other name is still a rose."

[saltyDDS]

Tetra,

I completely agree with the point you are making. However, Steve Tyree, might trully be the exception to this thread. I've never met Steve personally but know of him through a little research. He actually does some good work for this hobby. I hope to pay his shop a visit some day.

About the Tyree stuff, I think it started from people who either received or purchased frags from Steve. They realized that the coral fragments came from a legitimate name so many cashed in on it.

[sam7leah]

How about some of the lfs? I use to go to a fish collection in Placentia all the time because he would sell coral at normal prices. I went in there about a month ago and I noticed his inflated prices on yumas and acans that he has. Before the same yumas he is selling for 65.00 a polyp he would sell for 15-25.00 I even bought a acan lord from him not knowing what it was back before they where the craze, I paid 49.99 for the colony now he is selling them for 300.00-500.00 a colony because some guy told him they are rare. I dont go there anymore. I really dont go to lfs anymore because they all seem to know what rare corals are even though they pay wholesale prices they mark them up by 600% because they know there is always a sucker out there.

Where is there a place that you can go and buy corals and not have to worry about getting taken? Does that place exist? I think I am going to go back to freshwater fish.

[golfish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768493#post6768493 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by tetra
Though I agree with you about too many idiots with lots of money and yes the hobby is going down hill since. However, do you think it's all the buyers' fault? Do you think that buyers are the ones that came up with the "urban legend , Steve Tyree's LE"?



No, I don't think its all the buyers fault. I just think their more of the problem, really THE problem. Just don't buy, I don't...



<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768493#post6768493 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by tetra


I mean, really why should my corals be any more valuable than yours just because some guy come into my house and call them LE? "A rose by any other name is still a rose."

I agree, that's why the buyer is the problem...I have a bridge for sale, are you interested?

[SteveOhh]

I guess I'm just picking a bad time to get involved in the "reef" hobby 'eh?

I'm planning on attending tomorrow, but I'm not bringing any of the credit cards, cause the "wifey" is already complaining about the $$ I'm spending in this "deep pockets" hobby.........

BTW, Fish Collection has always been good to me..........He's got the cheapest prices around on equipment too............offered me a 24 gallon Nanocube for $189 last weekend.... :D

[manaco]

Did not know SteveU is Tyree. Never met him but I think he's a cool guy.

[Orochimaru]

Salty,

How is tyree an exception? He might done some goods, but from what I've heard: he comes to your tank and call your corals LE and suddenly they are now of higher value? Is this not true?
Is there a magic wand that he uses that turn your corals into LE?


What right has he got to call them Tyree's? Those corals has always existed without the name tyree attached. What makes them any different now that they are tyree's? they are sitll of same colors and structures. Like I've stated before, unless he discovers that particular species how is that dfiferent than you calling it saltydds LE? Wy should tyree le be more credible or valuable than saltydds le if that is all he's doing? Don't tell it's because he's done more good for the hobby than you.

If tyree has done goods for this hobby, I applaused him for that and he should be respected but doesn't mean it's ok for him or anyone like him to go around calling corals this and that LE?

Ok, even if that is ok to call them tryee's LE. How do I know what I've bought down the line is a tyree's le? Are they any certificates that come with corals once they are tyree's le? I will believe it's tyree's if I bought it from tyree himself but how do I know if it's tyree's if I buy it from Joe smoe a few months later?

Don't you think all of this tyree's hype is more of a seller creating the problem than buyers?

[golfish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768699#post6768699 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by manaco
Did not know SteveU is Tyree. Never met him but I think he's a cool guy.

lol, the Steve I was talking about is Steve Tyree. SteveU is just another old white guy that I mentioned when I was talking about old white guys:lol: wait, Tyree must me an old white guy to most of you.:lol:

[Orochimaru]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768615#post6768615 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by sam7leah
How about some of the lfs? I use to go to a fish collection in Placentia all the time because he would sell coral at normal prices. I went in there about a month ago and I noticed his inflated prices on yumas and acans that he has. Before the same yumas he is selling for 65.00 a polyp he would sell for 15-25.00 I even bought a acan lord from him not knowing what it was back before they where the craze, I paid 49.99 for the colony now he is selling them for 300.00-500.00 a colony because some guy told him they are rare. I dont go there anymore. I really dont go to lfs anymore because they all seem to know what rare corals are even though they pay wholesale prices they mark them up by 600% because they know there is always a sucker out there.

Where is there a place that you can go and buy corals and not have to worry about getting taken? Does that place exist? I think I am going to go back to freshwater fish.

this all goes back to what salty was saying and I do agree, prices have gone through the roof the last few years.

[Orochimaru]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768716#post6768716 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by golfish
lol, the Steve I was talking about is Steve Tyree. SteveU is just another old white guy that I mentioned when I was talking about old white guys:lol: wait, Tyree must me an old white guy to most of you.:lol:

I thought personal attack is not allowed?:lol:

[Orochimaru]

I agree, that's why the buyer is the problem...I have a bridge for sale, are you interested?

I might be an idiot but I don't have a lots of money. So no, I will not buy your bridge.:D

[golfish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768715#post6768715 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by tetra

What right has he got to call them Tyree's?

mostly because he can....

I had a coral a long time ago. I called it a "Big Mac attack" I was asking 200.00 a frag...man, If I could only of found some buyers.

Your missing the point. Who cares who's name is on it. Bennet tort, Oregon tort, Tyree PM..Your picking out a single person and attcking him, why?

Steve didn't make the corals, the buyers made em.

Us old guys stick together..SteveU knows I'm just bustin his bio balls:lol:

[wsun083]

So what's the overall concensus on tomorrow's event. I will be in LA until tomorrow night and hadn't planned on going. Think it's worth the cover?

[Orochimaru]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768753#post6768753 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by golfish
mostly because he can....

I had a coral a long time ago. I called it a "Big Mac attack" I was asking 200.00 a frag...man, If I could only of found some buyers.

Your missing the point. Who cares who's name is on it. Bennet tort, Oregon tort, Tyree PM..Your picking out a single person and attcking him, why?

Steve didn't make the corals, the buyers made em.

Us old guys stick together..SteveU knows I'm just bustin his bio balls:lol:

nah, not picking on anyone, just want to get to the bottom of the tyree's le hype. Like you've said, there are lots of idiotic buyers with lots of money. I am sure if you call corals goldfish le, I would have the same questions.

As for "us old guys stick together..." I hope it's not a broke back mountain moment, is it?:lol: j/k

[SteveOhh]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768753#post6768753 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by golfish
SteveU knows I'm just bustin his bio balls:lol:

As long as you ain't busting my bio balls, all is good....... :D

[Orochimaru]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768784#post6768784 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by SteveOhh
As long as you ain't busting my bio balls, all is good....... :D

this is getting funnier by the minutes.:lol:

[golfish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768781#post6768781 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by tetra
buyers with lots of money. I am sure if you call corals goldfish le, I would have the same questions.

As for "us old guys stick together..." I hope it's not a broke back mountain moment, is it?:lol: j/k

hey hey hey, who's goldfish?

Broke back mountain? isn't that the new Clint Eastwood movie?

[Orochimaru]

I think there is a new wille nelson's song about cowboys also

[Orochimaru]

sorry, I should have call it big mac....hahahhaa

[Vampire2]

We have Vernon books that already named all of the corals why we have to call different name like LE or make up another name to make the corals more value and jack up the price.

[manaco]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768716#post6768716 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by golfish
lol, the Steve I was talking about is Steve Tyree. SteveU is just another old white guy that I mentioned when I was talking about old white guys:lol: wait, Tyree must me an old white guy to most of you.:lol:



Thanks for clearing that up. After re-reading it, you did mention two Steve's. The first one working the show, and SteveU afterwards.

[Orochimaru]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768819#post6768819 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Vampire2
We have Vernon books that already named all of the corals why we have to call different name like LE or make up another name to make the corals more value and jack up the price.

Though I do agree with you vamp., I also understand that if people are stupid enough to pay more for somehting with LE attached to it, it's their rights. As long as you and I and many here on this particular thread are not that stupid, then it's ok by me.:lol:

[manaco]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768837#post6768837 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by tetra
Though I do agree with you vamp., I also understand that if people are stupid enough to pay more for somehting with LE attached to it, it's their rights. As long as you and I and many here on this particular thread are not that stupid, then it's ok by me.:lol:

Well, to play the devil's advocate, some people aren't concerned about overpaying. In one respect, shopping around for days looking for a "good deal" just costs more when you consider that time has value.

For example, some choose to hire a gardener; others do the work themselves.

[Mchava]

you know I find this kind of odd that its always the same people complaing about the same thing. I am not say that one coral is better then the next one but when have you seen some of the stuff that steve tyrees has. When was the last time you saw a watermelon chalice? It becuase of people like steve that some of this coral are even around. Have any of you ever shop at whse to say that lfs jack up prices that much. Have you ever considered that maybe prices change becuase of other things like gas that people use for the boat they use for collecting corals or the airplane fuel that they use to fly the planes. Think about it how many people out there are paying almost $3 a gallon of gas yet last year is was less. As far as some of the other vendors selling stuff for that much. Its pricing that they chose you can buy or not buy that is how it works. Oh and as far as the $200 price on the indo stag. Have you talk to the person to see if its for frag or a whole colony? Cuase I have and it not for frags.

[F35-Joint Strike Fighter]

Tetra, just show us your Ultra Rare White SPS Limitted Edition. Oh wait, Auction Edition.

Whenever I post this pic up, ppl come accross and ask me that does that one come from Tyree?. Sorry Sir, it's from the Pacific Ocean or whatever ocean

http://www.dosnux.com/trung/geenpolysunset.JPG

[manaco]

Very Nice!

[F35-Joint Strike Fighter]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768905#post6768905 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by manaco
Very Nice!

Thanks!

Again, please do ask me is it from Tyree?

[manaco]

Btw, I don't disagree with Tetra with regard to overpriced corals. It really just depends on how much more a coral costs when it's considered a limited edition. 10-20% more is acceptable; beyond that may be excessive. Generic and name brand pharmaceuticals come to mind.

[fc.pride]

funny, i made a reference to this a while ago.
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=765683&perpage=25&pagenumber=4

Limited edit. frags and overpricing will always be there because of buyers and sellers who cash in on it. no one ever forces anyone to buy anything and the seller does not necessarily have to inflate prices. but thats the way it goes, it always comes down to profit. sad but true. someone once told me if you love something never get money involved b/c corruption is sure to follow and end your love for it. i personally like this hobby so i dont sell anything nor do i plan to, i have bought very expensive frags before because i thought they were really nice. did i really think they were worth it...prolly not. but hey i wanted it and had to pay to play.
bottom line is...we overpay for a lotta things in life for our happiness (e.g. laker tix, fancy cars etc.) corals will be no different. its always gonna be a catch-22. i go back to my cave now.:p

[Orochimaru]

f-16, are you sure it's not tyree's? Looks really nice! However, I am not one of those idiotic buyers with lots of money. Of course it's a free country and peeps can buy whatever they want.

No I have not seen any tyree's stuffs but I have seen some of gcarrol stuffs last year and they were great. now from what I've heard, they or at least some of them are tyree's le. How has steve contribute to keep these corals around? These corals were around last year in gcarrol's tank already and they are still around now.

As for the water melon, did steve tyree personally dive to that part of the ocean to retrieve that chalice and brought it to us? If not, shoudln't those people that dove there get credit for shipping it to tyree or whoever first own it?

[Orochimaru]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768940#post6768940 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by fc.pride
funny, i made a reference to this a while ago.
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=765683&perpage=25&pagenumber=4

Limited edit. frags and overpricing will always be there because of buyers and sellers who cash in on it. no one ever forces anyone to buy anything and the seller does not necessarily have to inflate prices. but thats the way it goes, it always comes down to profit. sad but true. someone once told me if you love something never get money involved b/c corruption is sure to follow and end your love for it. i personally like this hobby so i dont sell anything nor do i plan to, i have bought very expensive frags before because i thought they were really nice. did i really think they were worth it...prolly not. but hey i wanted it and had to pay to play.
bottom line is...we overpay for a lotta things in life for our happiness (e.g. laker tix, fancy cars etc.) corals will be no different. its always gonna be a catch-22. i go back to my cave now.:p

no need to go back to your cave. You've made a good point. If I over pay for a piece of coral, it's because I like it and not because it's LE. Why pay more when you can pay less for the same thing?

[manaco]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768941#post6768941 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by tetra
f-16, are you sure it's not tyree's? Looks really nice! However, I am not one of those idiotic buyers with lots of money. Of course it's a free country and peeps can buy whatever they want.

No I have not seen any tyree's stuffs but I have seen some of gcarrol stuffs last year and they were great. now from what I've heard, they or at least some of them are tyree's le. How has steve contribute to keep these corals around? These corals were around last year in gcarrol's tank already and they are still around now.

As for the water melon, did steve tyree personally dive to that part of the ocean to retrieve that chalice and brought it to us? If not, shoudln't those people that dove there get credit for shipping it to tyree or whoever first own it?

You make valid points Tetra. Tyree is just a spokesman for certain corals. Just like George Foreman is for grills.

[Orochimaru]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768939#post6768939 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by manaco
Btw, I don't disagree with Tetra with regard to overpriced corals. It really just depends on how much more a coral costs when it's considered a limited edition. 10-20% more is acceptable; beyond that may be excessive. Generic and name brand pharmaceuticals come to mind.

ok now it's my topic :lol:

[Mchava]

no he did not dive for it but its becuase of him that the piece was able to come out to the public. We would have never seen it but when he traded the coral and made it a LE we where able to view such coral. Other wise it would have died in someonce thank. Just look at what happened to the Len Sy cap. How many people want it but becuase it was never traded to others now that awsome coral is no more.

[Orochimaru]

ok, so far looks like we have two opposing opinions here. Nothing wrong with that. However, I have to ask, what do I or people like me have to gain from questioning tyree's le? Nothing.

Those who are defending LE corals, what do you have to gain from defending them? Is it because you do own some LE corals and waiting to rip the benefits? Of course, if you don't own any LE, my apolgy. If you do own LE corals, is it not a little bias?

[manaco]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768781#post6768781 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by tetra
nah, not picking on anyone, just want to get to the bottom of the tyree's le hype. Like you've said, there are lots of idiotic buyers with lots of money. I am sure if you call corals goldfish le, I would have the same questions.

As for "us old guys stick together..." I hope it's not a broke back mountain moment, is it?:lol: j/k


Tetra...

You know you love that movie! You've seeing it a dozen times with Kleenex tissues dissappearing rapidly!

:D

[Orochimaru]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768962#post6768962 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Mchava
no he did not dive for it but its becuase of him that the piece was able to come out to the public. We would have never seen it but when he traded the coral and made it a LE we where able to view such coral. Other wise it would have died in someonce thank. Just look at what happened to the Len Sy cap. How many people want it but becuase it was never traded to others now that awsome coral is no more.

So if you suddenly have the same piece of chalice delivered to you from the ocean, it should be less valuable than tyree'[s chalice? You would willing to pay more for tyree's and one from the ocean?

You are saying if tyree didn't make gcarrol's corals tyree le, they would die in Greg's tank? I don['t believe that. I do have lots more faith in greg than that. Greg's corals have always been great, why should they be any diff. now that they are LE? They are still the same corals with the same colors.

[Orochimaru]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768977#post6768977 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by manaco
Tetra...

You know you love that movie! You've seeing it a dozen times with Kleenex tissues dissappearing rapidly!

:D

I know, we went together.:lol:

[phatphisher]

i'm not a complainer but i agree with all the points made on the very first post by salty. i dont think a coral with the LE attached to it should be worth more than the same coral that came from john doe.

[manaco]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768999#post6768999 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by tetra
I know, we went together.:lol:

You owe two bucks for popcorn!

:D

[fc.pride]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6769017#post6769017 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by phatphisher
i'm not a complainer but i agree with all the points made on the very first post by salty. i dont think a coral with the LE attached to it should be worth more than the same coral that came from john doe.
it shouldn't if it is the exact same coral. but there are variations/morphs to a particular coral which may make it look prettier or may be harder to find. so then, the guy who finds this
diamond in the rough calls it le. then, the buyer wants it and the seller thinks "hey, ive got something here!" and the price spikes.
then we get a thread with 2 opinions and we have something to chat about after dinner with our gf/wives. le or not, if you really like it buy it then post a pix so we can check it out.

[myusername]

I feel it's time for me to chime in now. I have read most of this thread and after talking to Eric at Frag Farmers this is how Steve gets his corals. Besides promising to make it a limited edition he gets 2 frags from the hobbyist, one goes on ebay and the other he grows so that he can sell for a profit at a later date. And in return the hobbyist gets to chose a frag out of Steve's limited ediiton. These are my own personal thoughts on this. At first I was upset with it because I'm seeing another person taking advantage of new hobbyist getting caught up in the hype. But then later I realized he is an outstanding salesman. He has been able to sell his name and everyone falls in line for several years to buy one piece of coral. Multiply that times 30 corals and he is going to make a "prett penny". But I've also thought that it is now his fault because of this...it is mine and yours. We have not organized and planned a way to show hobbyist how and where to get to get corals at a decent price As well as a plan of how to teach new hobbyists on how to build a reef tank and what products to buy. Because at this point you have to go to the neighborhood fish store to get all of that type of information and depending on their abilities you will get a good to bad start. Most are not willing to tell you about outstanding sites like Reef Central or Zeovit to teach yourself but after you have spent lots of money to just get started and then start networking with other reefers then you realize how stupid you were on spending all that money. So if I had to say anything else it is that we need not to just have fractions of neighborhood hobbists joining together but they should all network so that we can all benefit from the knowledge and are working together to make this a better hobby.

[Orochimaru]

If there are variations and tyree is the only that has it, I am cool with that and yes I would buy it. Not because it has LE with it but because of the variations.

[Orochimaru]

myusername,

I do agree. I don't think it's steve tyree's faults but ours. If I can do what he does, I probably would. I ain't no angels.

However I will not pay more for Le nor do I think LE is better than non-LE.

[myusername]

This is my last post before I go to bed. Let me make it clear that I am not a Steve hater I just recognize that he is no longer a reef lover his is a business man and as a business man he is doing an outstanding job. Don't get me wrong, I do appreciate all that he is doing for the hobby and all that he is doing to contribute to the hobby but me being a family man and having two people working and raising two kids and trying to work my *** off just to pay the bills I wish I could catch a break and still love to continue in the hobby and to get corals at a decent price but the trend that tends to be now on getting a decent coral like the watermelon then I would have to sell my first born! With the amount of money that is spent on the expensive corals couldn't you buy a license and then go to the same locations where these guys are buying them from at a more decent price??? I have no idea but just wish that something like that were possible. I notice that when sometimes people state that they are having a hard time and don't appreciate the inflated prices that other reefers chime in and proceed to verbally chastise them and state something like 'this is not a cheap hobby so deal with it". That's not good enough anymore! It's time for me to go to bed so the best thing that I could say at this point is God Bless you all!

[saltyDDS]

I'm glad that the discussion is still going on but it was not my intent to single out a specific aqua culturist. I hope to continue this discussion even after the SWCFM event but lets try not to single anyone out.

How is tyree an exception? He might done some goods, but from what I've heard: he comes to your tank and call your corals LE and suddenly they are now of higher value? Is this not true?
Is there a magic wand that he uses that turn your corals into LE?


You are absolutely correct that he is not an exception. I do, however, give him more credit than others since he goes beyond just selling for profit.

you know I find this kind of odd that its always the same people complaing about the same thing.

I didn’t realize that I’ve been complaining too much.

When was the last time you saw a watermelon chalice? It becuase of people like steve that some of this coral are even around.

I saw an entire colony from Tongs for about the same price as what name tagged fragments are being sold for. I thank nature for having this coral around.


Have any of you ever shop at whse to say that lfs jack up prices that much.

Actually, I had a one-time opportunity to visit a wholesaler a few Sundays ago. They were closed so I had the run of the house. The wholesaler emailed me via RC stating that his employee needed dental work but didn’t have insurance or much money to pay. In exchange, I was offered the visit at wholesale prices. I guarantee you that LFSs do jack up the price. These so called aqua cultured and named after John Doe corals are just pure greed. I saw some pieces that are just out of this world but my tank situation just couldn’t accommodate any of them. I did check on the prices and they are not even a fraction of what people are selling them for.

ok now it's my topic :lol:

Sorry. I have to take the blame for this topic.

no he did not dive for it but its becuase of him that the piece was able to come out to the public. We would have never seen it but when he traded the coral and made it a LE we where able to view such coral. Other wise it would have died in someonce thank.

Sorry but will have to disagree with your statement. I’ve seen many successful coral growers but they never bothered to market their stuff for pure profit.

[myusername]

Hopefully this will be my last input on this. Someone once told me this phrase "do I want cheese with that wine?" And I say this not to everyone but only me and the reasons why that I come up with some type of suggestion to help the scenario or did I just whine? And here is my suggestion of how to help the reef community. First of all it's not all about me more than it's about the next generation of reefers. Since Mr. Tyree and I say "mister" because he is a businessman now, might want to put together a course on what it takes to successfully keep corals alive and growing, meaning the history of the hobby, the education of the tools of the trade, ie tank, chiller, calcium reactor, etc. I know that is a touchy issue because the biggest problem in this hobby is that everyone has their own opinion and their opinion is the ultimate opinion and that is not so. But since Mr. Tyree has all that experience and all that knowledge I would be interested in educating myself and seeing others educated to enhance this hobby. After the new reefers will go through this course they would have an option in buying a package that would set them up with tank, lights and so on. THen they would have an option to buying Mr. Tyree's limited edition for a lower price. I think that thought would help the overall reef community and it should definitely educate the next generation so that they could be prepared to not just buy experience coral but to also successfully grow it. In closing, I am not a hater I just see something that should be addressed and I hope I added to the overall reefing community by sharing my thoughts than whining about it.
Thank you.
Charles Moore

[manaco]

Charles...


I can see that you're sincere and I, for one, appreciate your input.

[F35-Joint Strike Fighter]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6769017#post6769017 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by phatphisher
i'm not a complainer but i agree with all the points made on the very first post by salty. i dont think a coral with the LE attached to it should be worth more than the same coral that came from john doe.

I just would wonder that can Tyree serialize the Corals LE/AE before he sells it so can can known that coral belongs to him

[manaco]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6770484#post6770484 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by F18-Hornet
I just would wonder that can Tyree serialize the Corals LE/AE before he sells it so can can known that coral belongs to him

Would a signed photograph of Steve holding the coral suffice?
:rollface:

[Vampire2]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768939#post6768939 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by manaco
Btw, I don't disagree with Tetra with regard to overpriced corals. It really just depends on how much more a coral costs when it's considered a limited edition. 10-20% more is acceptable; beyond that may be excessive. Generic and name brand pharmaceuticals come to mind.

Hey,

One is exspensive and another one is cheaper but both are the same drugs (Trimox = Amoxicillin)

[manaco]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6771556#post6771556 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Vampire2
Hey,

One is exspensive and another one is cheaper but both are the same drugs (Trimox = Amoxicillin)

My point precisely. Some people's pride of ownership is higher when their preferred label is attached to their jeans.

[StoneyK]

I have to agree with golfish Plenty of reefers out there are very generous I have recieved tons of hook ups from private reefers not always free but ALWAYS wayyyyyy less than any retailer, which is understandable up to a point as retail shops have overhead to pay. But There are a retailers who take the price margin to the extreme IMHO. These days I go to Total Tropical in upland 85.99 per colony pretty much no matter what... and if you havent seen what they have recently your missin out. So obviously it is possible to get quality coral colonies for decent prices from retailers I guess some just choose to sqeeze every cent of profit out of every coral so they can make more money.
Its like you walk into town with a Huge purple lollypop, but no one in the town has ever seen a purple lollypop so even though you know you paid .50 cents you sell it for 10.00 Profitable yes, but ethical??? you decide...its a fine line and everyone has strong opinions here so if you disagree with me fine,Thats why its called an opinion...We all get our own. I dont try to sell corals too much
anymore never did it many times ever but now I prefer to trade or just give away frags... Give a frag get a friend! and you never know when they might hook you up with a cool frag in the same spirit... hahaha Coral Karma

[Konadog]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768284#post6768284 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by golfish
IMO, this hobby started to go down hill about 3-4 years ago. Too many idiots with no talent, no patience and too much money. I have a hard time spending 20.00 on a frag, its not that I can't afford it, its that I don't feel I should pay for any coral frag, not one penny. I can't recall ever charging money for a frag. I bet I've given 200+ away, maybe more. Mark, I'm a little late to this thread but I agree. My first coral tank was 90% stocked with traded or free corals.

http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/9086P1010005.JPG

Patients between trades to see if I could keep them, then trading them when they grew good.

[SteveOhh]

Not to take this thread off topic, but I picked up these beautiful pink zosa today at the Farmers Market.......

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v207/Whoad_Up/PinkZoas.jpg

[saltyDDS]

Not to take this thread off topic, but I picked up these beautiful pink zosa today at the Farmers Market.......

I didn't doubt that there will be some awesome corals on display but the selling price is what we're questioning. If you don't mind me asking, how much did that zoa frag cost you? Was the $25 entry fee worth it?

[SteveOhh]

I picked up 4 nice frags & spent under 50 bucks. These corals would have ran me over 100 at a LFS, so I'd say, yes the 25 bucks was worth it!!

[rbdesigns]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6772423#post6772423 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by saltyDDS
I didn't doubt that there will be some awesome corals on display but the selling price is what we're questioning. If you don't mind me asking, how much did that zoa frag cost you? Was the $25 entry fee worth it?

SaltyDDS,

I went and the entrance fee was not worth it. I'm not an SPS guy, so pretty much buying anything was out of the question. I saw people dropping 3-4 hundred at the Atlantis booth, others were charging like $120 a frag for SPS. Then there was one booth that had their price list, with two of them being $300. The only one who had nice prices between $10-25 was franky's reef. I spent a total of $30 bucks on some zoo frags. Each one costing about $10 at Your Reef.com. The pricing was visibly marked in sections of $10,15,20, etc. I saw the most people dropping money there because it wasn't steep like everyone else was. I think they had a 6 polyp frag of a red and grey lord for like $25.

Besides that there were too many people. To even look at the displays would take like 10-15 minutes. I took off after an hour being there.

[H22ATypeS]

I miss the days when frags were no more then 25 bucks for the good stuff....I remember getting frags for 5-10 dollars on average......This event was the biggest waste of time and money ever. I can't belive I ditched class today to go to this event.......

BIG :thumbdown:

Allen H.

[rbdesigns]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6772587#post6772587 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by H22ATypeS
I miss the days when frags were no more then 25 bucks for the good stuff....I remember getting frags for 5-10 dollars on average......This event was the biggest waste of time and money ever. I can't belive I ditched class today to go to this event.......

BIG :thumbdown:

Allen H.

I hear you. I've never been to any frag swaps and events, but thought it would be cool to see what went on. Man was that frustrating. When I left the event with three frags I thought it was cool, but them i remembered I payed for a ticket for me and my chic. So it came out to be for $30 each frag.

[H22ATypeS]

rbdesigns -- Mann I really hope you don't get discouraged about events in this hobby.....I know they'll be really good ones where it's not all about money...There's BBQ's, booze, softdrinks, etc....etc....etc......I know Kevin (raskal311) and Richard (Spartan) that I kinda introduced into this hobby has been to great events where they've enjoyed and it reflects in their tanks....

The best thing about it is it's FREE to enter....and everyone that comes brings food/drinks/frags/etc...with them to contribute!

Allen H.

[golfish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6772423#post6772423 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by saltyDDS
I didn't doubt that there will be some awesome corals on display but the selling price is what we're questioning. If you don't mind me asking, how much did that zoa frag cost you? Was the $25 entry fee worth it?

I spent 25.00 on raffle tickets. I won three frags worth well over 100.00 (their price) and still 5 chances to win the watermelon frag Steve had there. I think if you hung around until 4pm you could have bought a ton of frags for 10.00 each. Oh, I also picked up some nice freebies from some guys I haven't seen in years. I guess they recalled me giving them frags a long time ago.

Personally, I wouldn't pay 25.00 to go..15.00 maybe but not 25.00

FWIW, I traded a pump for a ticket.

[dattack]

Good suggestion. Always buy the frags at the end of some kind of frag swap. Usually cheaper and sometimes free.

[marcrothschild]

I thought the event was cool over all. The ticket collection was a joke. I stood in line for an hour before they opened the doors, and then it took quite some time to get in the door. But other than that, there were some sweet exotic corals available, and the prices were not too bad on some of them. I got a nice big ORA birdsnest for $20 aq crazy orange challice for $50 and a large frag of a crayola acro for $40. Add a 150gallon bucket of salt and I got out of there for under 2 bills. I had a good time, met some cool people, saw some sweet corals...and even took a few home. I thought it was a good event. When you complaine of the cost of the corals, imagine the work that goes into transporting all your corals and setting up a booth. What a PITA, people should be able to make a little $$ for their work. Most of the vendors were hard core hobbiests...Im happy to help support this awesome hobbie.
Marc

[StoneyK]

I ended up going at the last second and it was worth it got there at the last hour and went home with a bunch of freebies as well as getting some great prices for frags MUCH cheaper than I expected! at the end they were giving away some nice frags for $10. lots of familiar faces and friends all in all lots of fun will definately attend if they do this again.

[silverarrow27]

I enjoyed being there this morning. Stayed there for about 3 hours and walked out with seven frags which was well worth it for me. And I purchased my ticket early so I didn't get to pay the $25, thanks to the nice guys at inlandreefs.net for hooking me up! Overall enjoyable and will attend any future ones again!

[Old Yeller Tang]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6772712#post6772712 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by golfish
I spent 25.00 on raffle tickets. I won three frags worth well over 100.00 (their price) and still 5 chances to win the watermelon frag Steve had there. I think if you hung around until 4pm you could have bought a ton of frags for 10.00 each. Oh, I also picked up some nice freebies from some guys I haven't seen in years. I guess they recalled me giving them frags a long time ago.

Personally, I wouldn't pay 25.00 to go..15.00 maybe but not 25.00

FWIW, I traded a pump for a ticket.
Mark - Good job on the raffles! I didn't share that same luck but that lucky bastage Paul won the ER skimmer!:lol: Thanks for the pump! True reefers helping out friends!

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6772712#post6772712 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by manaco
For example, some choose to hire a gardener; others do the work themselves.
That's why I do my own yard and the money I save, I can buy frags!:lol:

The entry fee was well worth it for me! I met some new reefers and picked up some nice deals! The fact that it was held in the IE, meant the ticket fee is about the same as I would've spent on gas had I attended a swap in the LA area or in OC and I don't have to deal with traffic or spending another $25 on alcohol or a goodie that most of us bring to a swap. Most swaps I've been to, there's more selling than trading anyhow so not much difference IMO. The most I spent was $40 on a colony and thanks to ReeffTec, I picked up some very nice $5-$10 frags. The vendors were all cool and yes, they all had various pricing. I bought what I felt comfortable with so why complain about all these high prices. Your not gonna buy it anyway unless you really want it.
For those who say a coral is a coral and not an "LE" is like saying a car is a car, since they take us from point A to point B, so why do they range anywhere from $10k to over $100k? Anybody forcing you to buy the $100k car? Those that are fortunate to do so, more power too you! I guess some of you would call them dummies for spending so much on a car like you think of those who do so on expensive coral. I've had better luck keeping the $30 frag alive than the $60 wild colony. Yes, the colony is bigger but more risky and with a frag, you know what type of coral your getting.

[Old Yeller Tang]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768992#post6768992 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by tetra
You are saying if tyree didn't make gcarrol's corals tyree le, they would die in Greg's tank? I don['t believe that. I do have lots more faith in greg than that. Greg's corals have always been great, why should they be any diff. now that they are LE? They are still the same corals with the same colors.
Trust me, if someone didn't want Tyree to make his coral an "LE", all he has to do is say so.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768992#post6768992 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Ken
Mark, I'm a little late to this thread but I agree. My first coral tank was 90% stocked with traded or free corals.
Ah, the good ole' days, right Ken!;)

[Frankysreef]

I had lots of corals available for 10-50 dollars today, and it's funny the green sinularia sold out first.

By the way the Indochina Blue stag that someone misunderstood was a frag was a large colony.. ( people should read the posts before they comment on them ) It was just an accident in fragging that created the big colony. So I thought I would bring it.. Thick as my finger at the base... 10 branches... Sold 8 of the blue frags for 40-50 each..

I had lots of cheap frags available..and lots of people took advantage of my prices. Essentially I just cut what has overgrown and sell it to make room for more stuff...

Anyone check out my coffee can reflector :)

So some frags were 100-300 dollars... big deal, if you don't want them don't buy them.

I myself got lucky and got the Steve Tyree Purple Monster for $75. There are deals to be had... lots of people waited till the end to pick up the deals... U should have seen what people were selling at 3:30 and the prices just to not bring it home...

I was even selling corals 2 acros for $5.. If that isnt a deal .. I don't know what is... I had a great time even though they stuck me in the back.

Lots of people were selling great frags for $10.. so I wouldnt complain too much about the prices of anything... If you want good cheap frags.. come to an event, and wait till the end.

I got a blue millle from ********** that he usually sells for $65 for $40.

And talk about trading! all sorts of trading was going on by me and all the other vendors... for deals... I only bought 4 corals and I came home with 8 new ones.

So.. For those who didnt go...

U really missed out.

Frank

[golfish]

So Paul won that skimmer:lol: Luck of the Irish I guess. It sure looked bigger in the box didn't it Paul?

I have a question for all you complainers. I wonder how many of you have sold frags? How much did you charge? I'm talking about from your home, not frag swaps.

Ken, Sorry I missed your post. I'm sure your new tank will be even better, seeing how you have so many new friends. Ok, I'll remove the curse:bum: I mean I'll ask my wife too.

[turtlespd]

ME ME ME ME! ME WON ER! The box was a lot bigger than the skimmer though, lol

[turtlespd]

skimmer 300 bucks, frags free, food 60 bucks, talking smack about noobies...............Priceless!

[raskal311]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6772587#post6772587 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by H22ATypeS
I miss the days when frags were no more then 25 bucks for the good stuff....I remember getting frags for 5-10 dollars on average......This event was the biggest waste of time and money ever. I can't belive I ditched class today to go to this event.......

BIG :thumbdown:

Allen H.


$30 for two tickets and 4 hours of my time and left the place with two bags of frag plugs. I saw people selling 1'' frags of soli for $60!!! A buddy of mine got a 7" colony at coral oasis just 7-8 months ago for $70. I think I would have gotten more for my money if I went to Tongs instead of the swap.

[GTR]

:wavehand:


SteveU

[golfish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6774003#post6774003 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by turtlespd
skimmer 300 bucks, frags free, food 60 bucks, talking smack about noobies...............Priceless!

now that's some funny poop:lol:

[golfish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6774073#post6774073 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by gtrestoration
:wavehand:


SteveU


Steve, it was good to see ya today.....:beer:

[golfish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6774061#post6774061 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by raskal311
$30 for two tickets and 4 hours of my time and left the place with two bags of frag plugs. I saw people selling 1'' frags of soli for $60!!! A buddy of mine got a 7" colony at coral oasis just 7-8 months ago for $70. I think I would have gotten more for my money if I went to Tongs instead of the swap.

let me guess, you live in OC:rolleyes:

[Vampire2]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6774061#post6774061 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by raskal311
$30 for two tickets and 4 hours of my time and left the place with two bags of frag plugs. I saw people selling 1'' frags of soli for $60!!! A buddy of mine got a 7" colony at coral oasis just 7-8 months ago for $70. I think I would have gotten more for my money if I went to Tongs instead of the swap.

That all you bought at the frag swap.:p

You should stay home to help me to make a new sump.

[F35-Joint Strike Fighter]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6774171#post6774171 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Vampire2
That all you bought at the frag swap.:p

You should stay home to help me to make a new sump.

You should have stayed home and help me to clean up my tank and got FREE corals. Just ask Vamire2, he got the Neon Green Toadstool and Sunset Momti FREE.

Thanks Vampire2 for your help.

[dodgerblew]

I have read this thread all the way through and want to share a few thoughts:

First off, I went to the Farmers Market and had a great time. I bought the ticket early so I saved some $$ and the selection was very good for SPS, LPS and softies. I thought the prices were very good for the frags I bought and if they weren't, I am still ecstatic with my corals. I did most of my biz with Eric( **********) and he as always gave me great deals. As for crowds, it was no worse to me then Dave's swaps, actually better, IMO. I also thought it was great to meet vendors from up north, Ming, Joleen, SniperSPS etc. I look forward to the next.

As for the arguments pro and con regarding the prices of frags nowadays and LE's, I have to agree with the thoughts of Roland (Old Yeller Tang) and his car analogy. I have no problem with LE corals. Steve travels all over to get these corals and obviously invests a great deal to propogate them. I don't feel he is just a biz man and not a true admirer of the reefs. I myself, prefer to buy LE frags that are not first generation from the wild colony and often several generations old and much more hearty then some of these wild imports. I don't mind paying higher $$ to people who paid high $$ in the first place. I recently paid $100+ for a 2.5" Soloman Is blue tort that is beautiful and now starting to RTN. If I pay $90 for a LE tort frag that is outstanding in color like an import and living in captivity for a long time and grows a beautiful colony in time, I don't see a bad investment.

I have a sellers permit as I have a side job of doing tank maintenance. I have been to the wholesalers and although you occassionally( luckily) time it right to find something spectacular, most corals you find are average. The real nice stuff go to big buyers, wholesaler buddies, etc. I only have 90 gallons to work with; I don't want ordinary. I want every square inch to be inhabited by shocking color and display.

We pay $500 for a skimmer, $650 for chillers etc, I am not understanding how we expect corals cheap. The hobby has grown, hence the prices. I have offered corals free to people and enjoy that, I love trading and I also like to see myself get my initial investment back on super hard to find corals.

I don't think labeling people who spend higher $$ on corals "idiotic buyers" responsible.

BTW- the watermelon alien eye was not found by Tyree, I believe, but by Ron J. who let Tyree have a frag.

[Konadog]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6773869#post6773869 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by golfish
Ken, Sorry I missed your post. I'm sure your new tank will be even better, seeing how you have so many new friends. Ok, I'll remove the curse:bum: I mean I'll ask my wife too. Thanks man :thumbsup: I'm feeling better already.

All this complaining about frag prices and we used to spend $30 on a $5 bag of sand knowing what it was worth! :lol:

[saltyDDS]

Since I started the thread, I will assume that the label of a "complainer" is on me. I have never sold a frag at home, office or anywhere. I make a decent living and don't need frag money to support my hobby. I actually gave away some cool frags at the get together in Marina Del Rey a few weeks ago. I brought some very colorful SPS pieces to give away but those who were interested were a no show.

I ask the "old timers" why is it that you post the following: I miss the good old days, I stocked 90% of my tank from either trades or freebies, you would never pay more than $20 for a frag, I’ve given away 200+ corals, etc? But yet you don’t seem to mind the monetary direction that this hobby is going to. Is it because the jacked up price doesn’t affect you much because you own or at least have a good source to get the “expensive” coral for its true value rather than the marked up market price? I, myself, would like the good old days back. I would like to attend a “swap” where people actually do swap rather than sell corals for $50 and up. I would like the "newbies" to have acces to the same corals without being jacked.

I don’t really know where this thread is going or if it will actually resolve any issues. However, I’d like to bring forward my concern on how money is affecting the hobby. Have you noticed an increasing amount of scams on Reef Central? Heck, even our own local reefers that we would like to think of as friends are now pulling scams on us.

For those who say a coral is a coral and not an "LE" is like saying a car is a car, since they take us from point A to point B, so why do they range anywhere from $10k to over $100k?

I think you missed the point on this one. We are trying to compare the same coral but one with the LE tag and the other doesn’t. A perfect example is the neon green polyp toadstool that I purchased as a Tyree Limited that cost me $125 for a quarter size frag. I also purchased a neon green polyp toadstool frag from Carson Tropical for $30. No one has been able to tell which is which. Actually just about everyone says they are exactly the same. Now you tell me why should the LE cost more than the Carson Tropical special.

[Vampire2]

As I know all the Green Neon Toadstool came from Tom Carson Tropical fish from beginning. He might doesn't know how to make money as other reefers (FRIST CLAIM ON THE TYREE LE LIST, THEN MAKE ON THE MONEY LATER THAT NOW THEY ARE DOING).

[saltyDDS]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6774003#post6774003 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by turtlespd
talking smack about noobies...............Priceless!

Funny how people forget where they came from.

[raskal311]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6774171#post6774171 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Vampire2
That all you bought at the frag swap.:p

You should stay home to help me to make a new sump.

I only bought it because I didn't want to spend all that time and money and have nothing to show for it. I guess I should have stayed till the end for the good deals. Ohh well

[Vampire2]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6774263#post6774263 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by F18-Hornet
You should have stayed home and help me to clean up my tank and got FREE corals. Just ask Vamire2, he got the Neon Green Toadstool and Sunset Momti FREE.

Thanks Vampire2 for your help.

F-18,

Thanks for your free frags of the Grren Toadstool and Sunset Monti.

http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/109061DSC_0010.JPG

Should I stamp LE and place a serial number on this coral to make sure is F-18 LE?

[Vampire2]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768895#post6768895 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by F18-Hornet
Tetra, just show us your Ultra Rare White SPS Limitted Edition. Oh wait, Auction Edition.

Whenever I post this pic up, ppl come accross and ask me that does that one come from Tyree?. Sorry Sir, it's from the Pacific Ocean or whatever ocean

http://www.dosnux.com/trung/geenpolysunset.JPG

I also just received this free frag from F-18 today. He paid me for putting in my LE list.

[turtlespd]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6774500#post6774500 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by saltyDDS
Funny how people forget where they came from.


You know what? i was a noobie at one time. However, i did have the respect noobies lack today. I dont mind noobies at all, they are the ones making the hobbie grow but one too bad everyone has gotten so selfish and want all for nothing. If you were around in the past you would know what im talking about. Things have changed and were just poking fun. If offended you cause you fall under the noobie status, sorry, thats the facts. If your a noobie with the respect and knowledge then you will fit right in and will be showered with corals. I dont know who the heck you are and i never met you but im just making a general statement we all feel about the new guys. Just be glad you dont live in the OC, lol

Oh btw MARK! Im from the OC and half viet too! Dont trust me, i may steal, backstabb, lie, cheat and beat someone down for a coral, lol. Hummm, i wonder why i havent heard about reefers buying corals with conterfiet mula, lol.

[Mchava]

hey vamp why not post your own picture. Since it looks like all of the other pics in your gallery are from other sources. And this picture is realy old. lets see since July05. Why not show what you actualy got?

[Vampire2]

In my gallery and red house!

[Mchava]

you know I did check your gallery and if iam not mistaken that picture of the toadstool that your got today was posted on Fri Jan 13 2006 here is the link from your gallery.
http://reefcentral.com/gallery/showphoto.php?photo=149001&papass=&sort=1&thecat=500

[Mchava]

oh and based on your camera picts it was taken on 109061DSC_0010.JPG (1-09-06)

[saltyDDS]

i was a noobie at one time. However, i did have the respect noobies lack today... but too bad everyone has gotten so selfish and want all for nothing. If you were around in the past you would know what im talking about....

.... I dont know who the heck you are and i never met you but im just making a general statement we all feel about the new guys.

I understand your point and do agree with it. I just found your post a little derogatory.

And yes, we have not had the opportunity to meet. I hope to run across you all someday so I can be "showered" with corals.:D

[saltyDDS]

oh and based on your camera picts it was taken on 109061DSC_0010.JPG (1-09-06)

you know I did check your gallery and if iam not mistaken that picture of the toadstool that your got today was posted on Fri Jan 13 2006 here is the link from your gallery.

And this relates to this thread because.....?????

[myusername]

http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/65641SouthWestern_Coral_Farmers_Market_023.jpg

[silverarrow27]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6773859#post6773859 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Frankysreef
I had lots of corals available for 10-50 dollars today, and it's funny the green sinularia sold out first.

By the way the Indochina Blue stag that someone misunderstood was a frag was a large colony.. ( people should read the posts before they comment on them ) It was just an accident in fragging that created the big colony. So I thought I would bring it.. Thick as my finger at the base... 10 branches... Sold 8 of the blue frags for 40-50 each..

I had lots of cheap frags available..and lots of people took advantage of my prices. Essentially I just cut what has overgrown and sell it to make room for more stuff...

Anyone check out my coffee can reflector :)

So some frags were 100-300 dollars... big deal, if you don't want them don't buy them.

I myself got lucky and got the Steve Tyree Purple Monster for $75. There are deals to be had... lots of people waited till the end to pick up the deals... U should have seen what people were selling at 3:30 and the prices just to not bring it home...

I was even selling corals 2 acros for $5.. If that isnt a deal .. I don't know what is... I had a great time even though they stuck me in the back.

Lots of people were selling great frags for $10.. so I wouldnt complain too much about the prices of anything... If you want good cheap frags.. come to an event, and wait till the end.

I got a blue millle from ********** that he usually sells for $65 for $40.

And talk about trading! all sorts of trading was going on by me and all the other vendors... for deals... I only bought 4 corals and I came home with 8 new ones.

So.. For those who didnt go...

U really missed out.

Frank

It was nice meeting you today Frank, I bought one of your blue indochina frags and gave you a heads up about something before I left. :lol: Very nice piece I must say! :bum:

[myusername]

That was a test, of the SouthWestern Farmers Market.

[Vampire2]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6774796#post6774796 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Mchava
oh and based on your camera picts it was taken on 109061DSC_0010.JPG (1-09-06)

Yes, it's old picture of the colony, but I do not have picture of the current one that I just received it today. It seems the same size and color but do not show any serial number of LE. Do you find any serial number to indentify the LE from this coral? LMK which LE is this? F-18 or Tyree Le.

[myusername]

http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/65641SouthWestern_Coral_Farmers_Market_027.jpg http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/65641SouthWestern_Coral_Farmers_Market_026.jpg

[myusername]

http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/65641SouthWestern_Coral_Farmers_Market_025.jpg http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/65641SouthWestern_Coral_Farmers_Market_021.jpg

[myusername]

http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/65641SouthWestern_Coral_Farmers_Market_019.jpg http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/65641SouthWestern_Coral_Farmers_Market_018.jpg http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/65641SouthWestern_Coral_Farmers_Market_017.jpg

[myusername]

http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/65641SouthWestern_Coral_Farmers_Market_016.jpg http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/65641SouthWestern_Coral_Farmers_Market_015.jpg http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/65641SouthWestern_Coral_Farmers_Market_014.jpg

[myusername]

http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/65641SouthWestern_Coral_Farmers_Market_011.jpg http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/65641SouthWestern_Coral_Farmers_Market_010.jpg http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/65641SouthWestern_Coral_Farmers_Market_008.jpg

[myusername]

http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/65641SouthWestern_Coral_Farmers_Market_007.jpg http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/65641SouthWestern_Coral_Farmers_Market_006.jpg http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/65641SouthWestern_Coral_Farmers_Market_004.jpg

[dodgerblew]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6774881#post6774881 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by myusername
That was a test, of the SouthWestern Farmers Market.
you passed :D

[myusername]

http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/65641SouthWestern_Coral_Farmers_Market_003.jpg http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/65641SouthWestern_Coral_Farmers_Market_002.jpg
I hope every one enjoys the pic's. It took some time figure how to post them agin. and I HAD A GRATE TIME. "THANKS"

[Brewen]

Just wondering who was able to get the second lime in the sky frag from Greg in the 1 dollar raffle. loven the frag a bought in the auction. Nice addition to my tank. Brewen

[turtlespd]

Charles,

Oh no you di int! when did you take those pics? Good thing you didnt catch pics of the contraband!

[turtlespd]

Oh yeah, for those who left early. At the end of the day a few people blew out corals for 10 bucks, yes 10 bucks. Im not talking about common things but, cali torts,selago, nice milliporas!

[dattack]

Wow. This is the most Paul has ever posted in a year. He must have been very happy to win that skimmer!

[turtlespd]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6775140#post6775140 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by dattack
Wow. This is the most Paul has ever posted in a year. He must have been very happy to win that skimmer!


Shssssshhh, im trying to get my post count up.

[Orochimaru]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6774829#post6774829 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by saltyDDS
And this relates to this thread because.....?????

I agree with you salty. wouldn't you say it's thread jacking? Way off base. :confused:

[Old Yeller Tang]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6774374#post6774374 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by saltyDDS
Since I started the thread, I will assume that the label of a "complainer" is on me. I have never sold a frag at home, office or anywhere. I make a decent living and don't need frag money to support my hobby. I actually gave away some cool frags at the get together in Marina Del Rey a few weeks ago. I brought some very colorful SPS pieces to give away but those who were interested were a no show.
You do have the right idea being a hobbyist. You sound just like some of the "ole' timers"!:) We here, in the SoCal area are fortunate to come around nice reefers and help one another out so it's easy to get frags for free or dirt cheap. Others in different parts of the country aren't so fortunate and have to pay the going rate for some corals. When I first got into the hobby, there were some reefers selling what I thought were a bit too high(above the $50 range) and that was for validas and stags! The selection today is much more incredible and if the going rate for those stags and validas back then were so, then the much more beautiful corals we see today are justified by supply and demand. The route your taking is good though because people always remember those who offered them the free frag and you will be rewarded some day for your generosity.:thumbsup:
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6774374#post6774374 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by saltyDDS
I ask the "old timers" why is it that you post the following: I miss the good old days, I stocked 90% of my tank from either trades or freebies, you would never pay more than $20 for a frag, I’ve given away 200+ corals, etc? But yet you don’t seem to mind the monetary direction that this hobby is going to. Is it because the jacked up price doesn’t affect you much because you own or at least have a good source to get the “expensive” coral for its true value rather than the marked up market price? I, myself, would like the good old days back. I would like to attend a “swap” where people actually do swap rather than sell corals for $50 and up. I would like the "newbies" to have acces to the same corals without being jacked.
And that's what some of the ole' timers did having swaps for just this reason. You meet nice reefers and remember what they did for you and at the next swap, you hope to return the favor. I remember my first swap at Larry's! A great start for something that just snowballed into the swaps we have today. I felt like I was the only person who brought softies and pretty much had no takers!lol I had a toadstool nearly 18" high and a brain coral the size of a football and still couldn't give them away! I think today though, a lot of the newbies expect high end corals for free! When I was a newbie, I took whatever was offered to me and was ecstatic about it. One reason why I haven't gone to a swap in some time! Too many new faces with the wrong idea and not enough of the familiar faces who share ours! Nowadays, I do pick and choose because I have built up nice connections over the years. But due to the problems I'm having with my new tank, I do feel like a newbie all over again!lol
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6774374#post6774374 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by saltyDDS
I don’t really know where this thread is going or if it will actually resolve any issues. However, I’d like to bring forward my concern on how money is affecting the hobby. Have you noticed an increasing amount of scams on Reef Central? Heck, even our own local reefers that we would like to think of as friends are now pulling scams on us.
I've seen your concerns on this matter. I think we all just need to be more careful who we deal with. I dealt with a reefer here that you were chastising and I saw what your talking about but dealing with this reefer myself, I didn't feel cheated and whatever I sold him, he could do whatever he likes to do with it. I think it's just more trouble for them trying to move so much equipment. I would never go thru all that trouble myself.


<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6774374#post6774374 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by saltyDDS
I think you missed the point on this one. We are trying to compare the same coral but one with the LE tag and the other doesn’t. A perfect example is the neon green polyp toadstool that I purchased as a Tyree Limited that cost me $125 for a quarter size frag. I also purchased a neon green polyp toadstool frag from Carson Tropical for $30. No one has been able to tell which is which. Actually just about everyone says they are exactly the same. Now you tell me why should the LE cost more than the Carson Tropical special.
Supply and Demand! Once again, we are fortunate here in SoCal to have many sources for certain corals. Others unfortunately, do not. Like I mentioned earlier, back when I started, stags and validas were marked up pretty high and today's corals blow them away! F-18 and Vampire(his username for today) talk about how they give these so called "LE's" away for free! I'm sure if I pm'd them right now, it would not be free for me! I did just that to some reefers when I was a newbie and was very surprised when they responded, " c'mon over"! They are still very good friends today!:bum: Yeah, I have connections! And if I can ever get my tank going in the right direction, I'll be their connections as well!:beer:

[Old Yeller Tang]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6775118#post6775118 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by turtlespd
Oh yeah, for those who left early. At the end of the day a few people blew out corals for 10 bucks, yes 10 bucks. Im not talking about common things but, cali torts,selago, nice milliporas!
Paul - You mean $5! Reef Tec Designs and Franky's Reef were selling nice frags for $5! Shweet!

[Old Yeller Tang]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6772507#post6772507 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by rbdesigns
Each one costing about $10 at Your Reef.com. The pricing was visibly marked in sections of $10,15,20, etc. I saw the most people dropping money there because it wasn't steep like everyone else was. I think they had a 6 polyp frag of a red and grey lord for like $25.

Besides that there were too many people.
Props to Your Reef.com! I really liked the way their setup was because you knew the price w/o asking. I picked up a couple of gems from them as well. As for the crowd, glad most left early cause the good stuff was yet to come!:D

Also want to give thanks to John(Badmort), Reef Tec Designs, Anthony(AquaDesignz), Mark & Paul of course and a big thanks to Steve Tyree for putting this event together.:smokin:

[Old Yeller Tang]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6773859#post6773859 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Frankysreef
U should have seen what people were selling at 3:30 and the prices just to not bring it home...

I was even selling corals 2 acros for $5.. If that isnt a deal .. I don't know what is... I had a great time even though they stuck me in the back.

Lots of people were selling great frags for $10.. so I wouldnt complain too much about the prices of anything... If you want good cheap frags.. come to an event, and wait till the end.

Frank
Was packed early on and glad most left early!lol

Frank - Like my real estate agent once told me, "Location, Location, Location"! I noticed Eric(**********) and Atlantis had the best spots right up front and had the most crowds. They were so busy, I never had a chance to check out their display. I figured I could always see Eric's shop anyways since he's close to home but really wanted to see all the NoCal vendors especially!
A'right, now to go get 3 more hours of sleep!lol

Roland

[viveros1231]

I have to agree with what Roland is saying. I for one have experianced these old guys generousity. I beleive there is three kinds of reefers on this board.
1.old school reefers who do it as a hobby.
2.reefers who buy stuff to resell and try to stock their tanks basically free.
3.and newbs, who will eventually become either of the two mentioned above.

I myself was number two. It is an expensive hobby. I will admit I used to buy colonies of zoos frag it up and sell frags on nano-reefs.com to make some cash back and stock my tank for free. I now just buy what I like and let it grow out. I have tried to stay away from this board as much as possible. I feel in the past it was a bit to political. I felt like there was a arguement on the so cal forum every other day. anyhow, I quit reefing for a while I am not getting back into it and try to keep a low profile on here now.


I just wanted to jump on the bandwagon of this thread and say that their is many reefers on here who hook it up.

Just to name a few that i have dealt with

Eric aka **********. I have always been treated like a friend by him. I see some people on here bash him for the prices of his corals but I say to myself where else can you go and find anything that looks close to what he has.

John aka Badmort. Killercorals.com John is the man! I have always and will continue to support him he hooks me up sick!!! John I still have your water container and will be returning it shortly = )

Roland aka old yeller tang. when i first got into sps roland posted a frag of blue tort for sale. i jumped on it right away. I went to house just to get the blue tort. I came home with like a frag of everything he had in his tank. I was so amazed with his genorousity. I want to return the favor bro. I have a frag of the neon green toad for you let me know when you want to pick it up. I would offer more but just starting back up. = ) I wish i has some of that sps i had gotten from you but i killed it like a newb!

I also think like roland said if i where to ask to get a frag from Vampire(i cant believe no one can figure out who this is! ) of his neon green toad, or the chalice he has in his avatar it would not be cheap.

I think their will always be people complaining about pricing. I think you just need to look around and find someone who has quality stuff to buy from. I would rather buy a 40.00 dollar frag then a 40.00 wild colony because the frag that i buy will more then likely thrive in my tank. I have never had a good experiance with wild sps. ( thats just me though)

I think people sometimes are to serious on these boards. I love this hobby and I belive I will always have a tank running. I think some of us just need to relax and chill out.

haha it 5am and i appoligize if what i wrote makes no sense!

time to go to bed!

[JenDub]

well put...I couldn't agree more:D

[dodgerblew]

Well said Richard.

Echoes my thoughts as well. I remember my first swap at Dave's and Roland gave me freebies in addition to what I had reserved. Unfortunately, my light didn't equal Roland's and I killed it. Sorry Roland. Give my corals some time and I'll be glad to return favor. I can also guarantee you that Roland hasn't a clue who I am. But I remember him.
Next swap at Dave's it was you Richard and your brother who did me right. I believe it was the swap when you were entering in the world of SPS and you reserved every SPS offered. I scored some pretty nice zoas that day! Next time, my time to help you bro!!
I recently started playing hardball and set up a SPS tank and it was great scoring awesome frags for trades and NO $$. Garrick (slobound) set me up!! I met up with Garrick at the swaps too. I have continued to work out deals with him and we have become friends. Funny thing is I thought I got the better end of the deal with what I traded him and he happily feels he scored on my stuff. Roland is "right on" Doc. Keep meeting people! The reef peeps I still deal with and call my friends are the ones I met early on at swaps and picked their brains and were good to me and now I look for them to "share" my stuff with and be good to. Eric's the hard one. No matter what I want to share with him, he has one better!! :)

[GTR]

First... :thumbsup:
<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6775742#post6775742 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Old Yeller Tang
a big thanks to Steve Tyree for putting this event together.:smokin:

Second... Lot of nice people at the swap on both side of the tanks...:thumbsup:

Third.... if there was no money behind this hobby driving it the influx of livestock would come to a screaming halt. We'd soon be trading the same 20 corals with absolutley no chance for new pieces coming in. I don't think I can wait for evolution to bring something new. :lol:

Fourth...Maybe some sell frags at the real high prices to offset those given away to their friends. :)

Fifth... Glad I stayed out of the pictures which BTW are nice for those unable to attend.

SteveU

[sps_addict]

I agree. The swap good.
There were tons of nice stuff there from vendors as well as hobbiest.
I was able to pick up some nice frags from Eric (**********), Steve (Garretts Acropolis), Frank (Franky's Reef), and YourReef.com.

I agree with YourReef.com their display was nice, I was able to see how much each coral was and didn't have to ask. That was something that was nice. Notice to vendor's and hobbiest for the next one, organizing frags by prices is a good thing. It saves both ends time.

The best looking frag tank though had to be Eric's. Got to get me one of those to grow out my frags. All in all it there were a lot of really nice frags, good people, oh and I was able to see the new vortex pump first hand.

[ejocam]

I thought the event was pretty cool and successful. Ming and Joleen from Atlantis had some awesome stuff and I couldn't resist. We ended uo trading for 9 corals ( I still have to pick more :) It looked like everyone enjoyed themselves, I know I did and I'm not even one of the Ol' Timers:eek1: :lol:

Steve and Art, great job. I'm sure learning from this one will make the ones in the future even better. You got our support.

Thanks to all who stopped by our booth and supported us, we really appreciate it. ;)

[Old Yeller Tang]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6775870#post6775870 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by SOREVIV476
Roland aka old yeller tang. when i first got into sps roland posted a frag of blue tort for sale. i jumped on it right away. I went to house just to get the blue tort. I came home with like a frag of everything he had in his tank. I was so amazed with his genorousity. I want to return the favor bro. I have a frag of the neon green toad for you let me know when you want to pick it up. I would offer more but just starting back up. = ) I wish i has some of that sps i had gotten from you but i killed it like a newb!

I also think like roland said if i where to ask to get a frag from Vampire(i cant believe no one can figure out who this is! ) of his neon green toad, or the chalice he has in his avatar it would not be cheap.
Thanks Richard for the kind words!:o Remember when someone was selling those red yumas and mentioned how Tong's was selling them for $120 a head, so I posted I'd sell the one I had for half the price? When you pm'd me of wanting it, I was hoping you'd show up for it cause I was just going to give it to you. I'd still do so today but the darn yuma jumped rock and never to be seen again!:(

Also, I usually put things up for sale not to make money but to upgrade or to add to my reef. I'm glad my new tank is complete and the only things I'm selling now are equipment I'm no longer or can't use. I definitely want to clear up the reef room from unneeded mess.

BTW, I think they figured out Vamp cause I thought I saw "Moved On" by his name but then again, I'm sure he'll come back as the "Mummy"!:rolleyes:

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6775870#post6775870 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by dodgerblew
Echoes my thoughts as well. I remember my first swap at Dave's and Roland gave me freebies in addition to what I had reserved. Unfortunately, my light didn't equal Roland's and I killed it. Sorry Roland. Give my corals some time and I'll be glad to return favor. I can also guarantee you that Roland hasn't a clue who I am. But I remember him.
Rik - I never ever forget a face but will occasionally forget the name. I still remember you and saw you at the swap and was going to say hi but never got around to it due to all the commotion. Next time, I'm sure!

Nice pics btw, Charles!
You should've posted a pic of yourself so everyone could know who you are and see that your much better looking than that other reefer you were talking about!:lol: I see you caught Mark laughing it up with Tracy Gray and Paul wearing his Angel's Cap and thanks for leaving my mug out!lol

[XeniaMania]

There will always be a hobbyist view and seller view on this. I also saw Acans go for $400 on Ebay, then they dropped to $300, then $200 and so forth. There is a term called "Early Adopters" which are those who are willing to pay more just to get it first. It all comes down to values of the hobbyist. I'd give away Red Sea Xenias because they're everywhere. But why should I give up a xenia that took me 5 yrs to hunt down with no one else in the market with it? I read earlier about the "Gem of the Sea" for $300, it's pricey, but how many people have it? How many frags can be produced in a month? And I'm sure the original intent for holding this Farmer's market was for non-profit orgs, however, I'm sure they had to pay to get in there, so most likely, it was the businesses who anted up and forked out the money to support the market, and they need to make enough to cover that too. I bought a cespitularia from Atlantis yesterday, I really doubt anyone would "give" a coral like that. Anyways, just my views as a hobbyist, salesperson, and business owner.

[dodgerblew]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6777046#post6777046 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Old Yeller Tang
Rik - I never ever forget a face but will occasionally forget the name. I still remember you and saw you at the swap and was going to say hi but never got around to it due to all the commotion. Next time, I'm sure!
I saw you too Roland but you and another were definitely involved with SniperSPS and I had my son with me whose sole purpose in going was an hour in a half each way of uninterrupted PSP play without his sister buggin him and a trip through a drivethru for lunch:lol:. The swap and all my visits with people I know to him were a bore, I did look for you later on but didn't see ya. But the fact you did remember only proves the point. People "do" help and remember they do. Incredible and shows our community is still close and the "it's a small world" still exists. I am thankful to the people who have helped me and I look forward to helping others.

Eric,
My frags are awesome!!!!!!!!!!!! I can't tell you how thrilled I am with my tank today. I am having a hard time peeling myself away to get to church:lol:

Todd of AWExotics,
Same to you and the Superman monti. The polyps never retracted, even in shipping home and acclimation. Thank you. BTW, people, another person who has treated me great over the years. LMK when ORA has the purple pillow.

[ChaoticReefer]

Just trying to faces onto nicknames, dodgerblew, you were the tall guy with a long goatee, right?

[dodgerblew]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6777814#post6777814 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by ChaoticReefer
Just trying to faces onto nicknames, dodgerblew, you were the tall guy with a long goatee, right?
No. I am short, 5'7", and am about 30 Lbs overweight. Not painting a pretty pic but I'm honest:lol: I was wearing a dodger blue pullover wind jacket and navy warm-up pants and I had my 9 yr old son with me. I spent most of my time with Eric, Joleen and Anthony. HTH

[ChaoticReefer]

Ahh ok, there was another guy with a kid around that age too.

[dodgerblew]

I was there about 11-1. Howboutu?

[pookstreet]

Wow, looks like I missed a good one this time. And it was so close too. Diaper duty sucks :mad2:

It would have been nice just to see some of the reefers again and to meet new ones, whether old timers or newbies. In the end, I believe we are all the same in the pursuit of setting up our own "perfect" reef tanks. There are those that always seem to do things that try to bring down this beloved hobby of ours, but fortunately, those individuals are far and few in between. I can say that almost all of those I have met in person are genuinely friendly and extremely helpful.

I have been in this hobby for a long time, just relatively new to RC. But I have always considered myself a newbie b/c I always learn something new when I talk to another reefer. That's what I enjoy as part of this hobby is meeting others that share the same passion.


Roland,

If you are ever out this way, LMK. I think my red/blue monti is doing fine now and the colors are slowly coming back. I'll have a frag ready for ya.

[ChaoticReefer]

exact opposite as you. I was there 9:15-11 and 2:30-4:00. I wanted to get there before the crowd took everything. And I had to return for the watermelon auction and raffle.

[dodgerblew]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6778587#post6778587 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by pookstreet
Wow, looks like I missed a good one this time. And it was so close too. Diaper duty sucks :mad2:

But I have always considered myself a newbie b/c I always learn something new when I talk to another reefer. That's what I enjoy as part of this hobby is meeting others that share the same passion.
Amen

[drake66]

they were selling watermelons? arent they out of season? :D

[golfish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6774649#post6774649 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by turtlespd
You know what? i was a noobie at one time. However, i did have the respect noobies lack today. I dont mind noobies at all, they are the ones making the hobbie grow but one too bad everyone has gotten so selfish and want all for nothing.

Pretty much wraps it up for me..good post Paul.



<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6774649#post6774649 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by turtlespd
If your a noobie with the respect and knowledge then you will fit right in and will be showered with corals.

Yup, that's pretty much the way it works....That's Old School..



<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6774649#post6774649 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by turtlespd

Oh btw MARK! Im from the OC and half viet too! Dont trust me, i may steal, backstabb, lie, cheat and beat someone down for a coral, lol. Hummm, i wonder why i havent heard about reefers buying corals with conterfiet mula, lol.


Liar, you've never been to OC and I know for a fact you grew up in West Covina. What does being half Veit have to do with anything? You told me your were Irish....lie lie lie lie:lol:


Man, Tony has it going on. I perdict that is 2 years he'll have the nicest tank in So Cal...

BTW, if anybody see's a 60 gal drum on the freeway, can you call Tony and let him know where its at:lol:

[turtlespd]

ok let me claify, came to this country and live in Cudahay , i can even spell the city anymore, then we moved to West covina....then Diamond Bar......then Chino Hills..El Monte. Somewhere in all that mix i had residence in OC. I am sooo ashamed to admit im from OC but its all good. We got a few good reefers out here.

Ill keep an eye out for Tonys drum on my way back to OC tonight, lol.

[JenDub]

Hey Paul,

Didn't realize you were at the swap, I would have liked to meet you in person! We need to create a face cheat sheet for those events that bridge the gap between net & reality =) ~Charles~ (aka the dingleberry in the jendub booth pic for those who didn't know)

[SkinyChinaMan]

gosh.. the good old days.. how i really miss those days..
I really enjoyed this event and got to see alot of the old and new faces. Eventhough i didn't have a booth or brought anything for sale, I enjoyed the labor free day and just helping out different guys. Hey, even i bought two frags! and yes, they are all $50+ hahaha.. Anyhow, congrats on Paul winner the skimmer, and maybe next year when Steve is ready to do this again, I will get a booth right in between Eric and Joleen so i can share some of their crowds.

[F35-Joint Strike Fighter]

Skinnychinaman,

Is the eel from your Avatar "Japanese Dragon Eel"? Looking cool.

[SkinyChinaMan]

F18 - my avatar was my old male Hawaiian Dragon, It shortly passed away when i introduce him with a female.. I guess it was shocked by the ugliness of dull color on the female dragon.. hahaha

[Badmort]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6780039#post6780039 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by SkinyChinaMan

I really enjoyed this event and got to see alot of the old and new faces. Eventhough i didn't have a booth or brought anything for sale, I enjoyed the labor free day and just helping out different guys.

LOL Anthony was lugging water and stuff around for people helping them..
Good to meet new folks and hang out with everyone.
Thanks for the Hooters chicken wings Paul lol


John

[turtlespd]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6779656#post6779656 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by JenDub
Hey Paul,

Didn't realize you were at the swap, I would have liked to meet you in person! We need to create a face cheat sheet for those events that bridge the gap between net & reality =) ~Charles~ (aka the dingleberry in the jendub booth pic for those who didn't know)


Jendub,

Yeah i was there. I was one of the tall asians but i think its my irish half that gives me the height. If you look at the pics Charles posted im the guy with the Angels baseball cap hanging with Roland, John, and Mark. I did have the chance to meet new people but damn it was so crowded we had to leave and go to hooters for some R&R, we also had to bring some differnt type of R&R for those who had to stay, lol. I honestly was going to talk to you guys buy damn everytime i was over there i saw a bunch of people so i sat back down with John.

[turtlespd]

Thanks for the Hooters chicken wings Paul lol...
John [/B][/QUOTE]

No, no thank you for allowing me a place to hide from the crowds.
I had a fun time just kicking it. I came there expecting to leave with nothing but somehow i ended up with more things than expected along with new friends.


Ay, did you forget about Marks nice gesture! What woudl you eat chicken with if you couldnt down it with a nice cold one!

Paul

[Badmort]

Yeah I forgot about that ice cold frosty beverage = ) Thanks

That was great when you won the skimmer

[Frankysreef]

Sounds like everyone had a great time... Next time I'll pay the extra 10 bucks, and get a better spot...

They moved us around a couple of times , so I didnt know where they would put us..

I was first next to greg carrol, then I was next to garrets acropolis... then I was stuck in the back...

I had just as many frags as some of the big guys.. too..

But KUDOS to Steve for setting it up, and Kudos to Greg Carroll for convincing me to come!

I met lots of old friends and made lots of new friends...

My corals just keep getting better and better... I sell off the old and bring in the new...

My goal is lots of beautiful colors in my tank, and I am slowly getting there...

Something to be said about buying frags from known reefers...

NO FLATWORMS or RED BUGS...

If you buy imports off the plane, you are taking a chance unless you QT...

I've never had em, and hopefully never will

[Old Yeller Tang]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6780158#post6780158 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by SkinyChinaMan
avatar was my old male Hawaiian Dragon, It shortly passed away when i introduce him with a female.. I guess it was shocked by the ugliness of dull color on the female dragon.. hahaha
Wow! I guess it happens to the wild kindom too! We already know Men don't live as long as Women in the human race and we men know the reason why!:lol:

[F35-Joint Strike Fighter]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6780158#post6780158 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by SkinyChinaMan
F18 - my avatar was my old male Hawaiian Dragon, It shortly passed away when i introduce him with a female.. I guess it was shocked by the ugliness of dull color on the female dragon.. hahaha

The reason I asked because I saw Tong's has one too. Just beautiful eel (and beautiful $$ too). Too bad, you coudn't keep him alive.

[SkinyChinaMan]

yeah... I was really sad to see it pass away.. the funny thing was that he died shortly (3 days) after i introduce the female with him.. only God knows what he has been doing for 3 days straight that caused him to die all the sudden for no reasons... ^_~

[myusername]

to turtlespd.

Pual, you now you paid the judges off to get the skimmer. yes Im still a hater. you no that was my skimmer. lol lol

[raskal311]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6775870#post6775870 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by SOREVIV476
I have to agree with what Roland is saying. I for one have experianced these old guys generousity. I beleive there is three kinds of reefers on this board.
1.old school reefers who do it as a hobby.
2.reefers who buy stuff to resell and try to stock their tanks basically free.
3.and newbs, who will eventually become either of the two mentioned above.

I myself was number two. It is an expensive hobby.

Same here #2 but I wouldn't say free!!!! maybe cut my cost by 20-30% which i'm happy with. But I haven't been doing too much frag selling lately. I need to start again because I spent over $600 in the last 6 weeks on corals :( Man Jeff's 9 for $199 is killing me.

[turtlespd]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6781934#post6781934 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by myusername
to turtlespd.

Pual, you now you paid the judges off to get the skimmer. yes Im still a hater. lol lol


You know what was funny about the whole thing. If you ask Steves sister she will tell you i did try to slip them 50 bucks to hold my number in their hand and pull it out of the bowl as a joke:rolleyes: lol.

You know atelast one of us won instead of someone we didnt know.

[myusername]

from : old yeller tang,

Nice pics btw, Charles!
You should've posted a pic of yourself so everyone could know who you are and see that your much better looking than that other reefer you were talking about! I see you caught Mark laughing it up with Tracy Gray and Paul wearing his Angel's Cap and thanks for leaving my mug out!lol



Im still a newbe, after I help out abit. I will post a pic of me. but if you look at my avatar. Thats me throwing some one.

[F35-Joint Strike Fighter]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6781899#post6781899 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by SkinyChinaMan
yeah... I was really sad to see it pass away.. the funny thing was that he died shortly (3 days) after i introduce the female with him.. only God knows what he has been doing for 3 days straight that caused him to die all the sudden for no reasons... ^_~

Amen! sorry for hi-jacking this thread a little bit.

[myusername]

I worked at Hugo's booth and had a grate time and it was nice making new friends. I cant wait for the next one. I would like to Thank all the reefers that I spend some time with. at the Farmers Market.

[kokob007]

Just wondering who was able to get the second lime in the sky frag from Greg in the 1 dollar raffle. loven the frag a bought in the auction. Nice addition to my tank. Brewen


ME! me! I won Both frags from gcaroll, really nice guy. also bought frags from reeftecdesign for $10, got 4 from them great guys.
overall it was good day talking to other reefers, i didnt mind paying for the ticket,picked up 8 frags total. now I need a bigger tank. which will be coming in 2 weeks.

[turtlespd]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6782275#post6782275 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by kokob007
ME! me! I won Both frags from gcaroll, really nice guy. also bought frags from reeftecdesign for $10, got 4 from them great guys.
overall it was good day talking to other reefers, i didnt mind paying for the ticket,picked up 8 frags total. now I need a bigger tank. which will be coming in 2 weeks.

were you the guy that asked for the heat pack?

[atlantisaquarium]

I know I'm joining this thread a bit late but I had a loong ride home! :p

We had such a great time! SoCal hobbyists are so friendly and welcoming; we weren't sure what to expect, and everyone was so helpful and accomodating to us.

Eric, you are such a genuine and cool person! I'm so glad we were finally able to meet you and check out your shop...and trade for some awesome frags. ;) We'll definitely have to hang out when you're up in April. Tell your wife I said HI!!

JenDub!! A girl I could hang out with outside of the hobby! If I don't see you in April, I'm sure I'll see you in the summer for the NorCal farmer's market.

Anthony It was great to meet THE POKER STAR! haha Really friendly and yes really tall. Especially for being asian. :D

Ron (ReefTec) Didn't get to talk with you too much, but we've talked enough on the phone!! Glad to finally meet you in person, you're just as cool as you are on the phone.

It was a bit busy, so we weren't able to go around and introduce ourselves to everyone. Tracy (booth next to us) was awesome, AWexotics were great to meet.

Also put some faces on some of our customers! Brandon and Rik, it was so nice to finally meet you guys! I have to agree with you Rik, your son looked ready to go home to his PSP. Curt, who hung out ALL day. 8 hrs a true fanatic. :) I'm sure I'm forgetting people, but it's almost 4am and I should really get to sleep.

Once again, thank you to everyone, especially DeeDee, who helped us out. We had such a great time, we're still smiling!!!

Joleen

[dodgerblew]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6782667#post6782667 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by atlantisaquarium
Also put some faces on some of our customers! Brandon and Rik, it was so nice to finally meet you guys! I have to agree with you Rik, your son looked ready to go home to his PSP. Curt, who hung out ALL day. 8 hrs a true fanatic. :) I'm sure I'm forgetting people, but it's almost 4am and I should really get to sleep.
Joleen,
It was nice meeting you too. Your friendliness on the phone is no act when we chat. You are a very nice person. I give my word I will make it out your way. If anything big is happening up that way, let me know. My wife has never been to the Bay area. Hmmm...Hey babe, you want to go to san Francisco?? Thae area is beautiful and has sooo much to offer. We can just hang out, you and me, whatdya say :lol:

As for my son, he didn't need to go "home" to his PSP, he needed to go to the "car". He kept telling me he had to go to the bathroom but we kept on jabbering away. Patience is an important lesson to learn and I look for opportunities to be a good parent:D . Actually, he had a good time if you ask him. He loved the tank of jellyfish and I love spending time with him. My oldest son was his age I remember and it's like I woke up one day and now he's 21. Glad ya got back ok. Say "hey" to Ming.

[dadevil23335]

Damn, was this event this past weekend? I'm so bummed to miss out on it, my tank was ready for some stuff too! Plus I didn't get to hang with some of my throwback homies! Especially Paul and his stash of Hooters chicken wings! doh!

[rockindacheeks]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6774843#post6774843 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by myusername
http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/65641SouthWestern_Coral_Farmers_Market_023.jpg

I missed out on this? I knew i shoulda gone! LOL

[snslarison]

Hello there...:love1: :lol:

[Bebo77]

lol, you should get out more...

[kokob007]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6782338#post6782338 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by turtlespd
were you the guy that asked for the heat pack?

No not me.

[Kurt448]

Hey all, I was also at the farmers market...pretty much was there all day. I thought it was a great event and it was nice to meet some new people and of course see all of the corals. I spent way more than I should have, but I came home with lots of great corals...if only I had room for them in my tank. The raffles were nice, as two of my friends each one stuff (purple monster and Eric's undata) which both somehow ended up back in my tank :)

Towards the end, it was like being a kid in a candy store with all of the $10 frags. I picked up two torts, a turaki, M. confusa, and some Green birdsnest frags, mostly for friends and co-workers of mine who are starting out in the hobby.

Curt, who hung out ALL day. 8 hrs a true fanatic.
Ha, ha...yes Joleen I am addicted, what can I say. Again, it was nice to meet you and see Ming again. Good luck if you guys get that new store space!

were you the guy that asked for the heat pack?
Turtlespd, that might have been me, at the end I asked for a heatpack that some gentleman gave to me. Who ever that was thank you by the way. My styrofoam box was nice and toasty when I got back home.

[golfish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6784628#post6784628 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Kurt448

Turtlespd, that might have been me, at the end I asked for a heatpack that some gentleman gave to me.

That could have been Paul because he is a Gentelman. When we went to Hooters for lunch he kept his eye's closed the whole time we were there:lol:

[turtlespd]

funny guy

[AWExotics]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6774374#post6774374 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by saltyDDS
Since I started the thread, I will assume that the label of a "complainer" is on me. I have never sold a frag at home, office or anywhere. I make a decent living and don't need frag money to support my hobby.

I am just curious... What do Dentists make per hour? I lost part of my front tooth in a hockey game. I had a dentist charge me around $300 to replace part of the tooth with some sort of veneer. It took him 30 min. I am sure I could have found it cheaper or even more expensive. I went to a Dentist I trusted and from whom I would get professional service and quality work.

Yes, Dentists, have worked hard to attain the knowledge and training neccessary to perorm at their chosen profession. They can charge what the market will afford.

There are alot of people who are in the Reef Business, who share the hobbyists passion for the hobby and have worked hard to obtain their knowledge and experience neccessary to perform at their chosen profession. They too should be able to charge what the market affords.

It is a normal of our society that rare items are generally more expensive than common. You married men.... just think about that suppossedly rare diamond on your wives' fingers....What did that cost? Oh but it's mined by 13 yr old children who regualrly are injured and lose years of life to make pennies mining for that diamond. Mining destroys the environment, ruins lives and for what..... A beautiful smile behind a white veil.... NOOO... for some rich families gluttonous habits...I see this complaining here and yet the captive propagation businesses are protecting the natural reefs we all love. Sure as in any market, there are scams and the artists who make them. Selling coral frags at prices people are willing to pay is by no means dishonest nor is it a scam.

As alot of you know, I am a LFS. I do propagate corals and support the captive propagation efforts of companies like ORA, and alot of the Offshore aquaculturing farms. In a perfect world I do not believe we should ever removed more than one colony of any color morph of any coral species. What I mean is ... Captive propagation lessens the load floating over our natural reefs. With Captive Propagation we are also able to get corals that seem to bounce back so much easier from water quality fluctuations or temperature swings. Those cheaper colonies collected from our oceans take time to adjust to captive life. I have personally had corals sit in my shop for 4 years brown and dull. No one buys it and it barely grows.The suddenly 4 years later, it awakens from its slumber color beautifully and all the sudden ever customer wants it and I want to frag it. Is it worth the extra money to buy a coral well adjusted to captive life. In nearly full beautiful color, ready to encrust and grow in our tanks???? How many wild colonies need to be killed only because they were ripped from nature to be a piece of decoration in our shallow world? I too am ashamed at how money affects this hobby. Most people want to by the wild collected colony cause it is 1/2 1/31/4 or even 1/1oth the cost of a healthy Captive propagated frag. Only then does it die and then it is tried again, until the reefer is successful or until they decide the coral" Just doesn't live in captivity." All for what did we take off the reefs some true marvels of nature... Oh yeah.. All TO SAVE A BUCK or TWO!!!


Sure noone wants to be ripped off or to even feel like they are. I know Steve Tyree, and he is a knowledgable professional who practices TRUE Captive Prpagation. He can charge what the market affords, based not only on the customers ideas on value but also on his own ideas that he enjoys his work and wants to support himself while enjoying what he does.

Retailers in this business ulitimately have to earn a living or move on. We all know what it costs to run a reef tank. Equipment, Electiricty, food, additives, salt. etc etc .. it costs money to grow corals. Some corals like an old "Green Bali Slimer" don't bring in much revenue to justify the space, light energy, and calicium it takes to grow it. Some corals are cheap and others will demand a higher price until the supply increases faster than demand.

I too want to thank Steve for putting on this event. I met alot of new faces in this hobby , and saw quite a few of you old timers. There were alot of cool vendors there and I was happy to see so many different corals being farmed. I ended up coming home with about 15 new additions to my systems. New corals to grow and hopefully add to the propagation process soon.

I am sorry to rant but the beginning of this thread was frustrating to read. I was not trying to pick on Dentists in any way. I know what my prices are, and I know the size of most my frags. I charge what I feel is fair. I know this business is still young and in time we will gain some standards, spoken or unspoken, that vendors and buyers will both expect of the corals. Events like this one are needed to continue the growth in this end of the hobby.

I had a great time at the swap, and will be attending more as they come up.

Todd

[dodgerblew]

Amen, again!

[dymaxiun]

GREAT POST!!!! GREAT! AMEN!

[turtlespd]

Todd,

How long have you been holding that in for? lol.

btw. You gotta down a extra beer, you did a party foul and brought some warm beer.

[Frankysreef]

Todd is right on the money here.... How many thousands of dollars have each of us spent on our tanks...

Yet to try to save a few bucks to get wild frags.. is it worth it...How much does it cost to rid your tanks of red bugs or flatworms... ?

At least when u buy a frag at one of these events... you know that it is a high quality frag..

The wild frags that I have are frags from imported colonies that died and were fragged .. So I try to save them.. Most live but you never know the growth form or color.

It saddens me sometimes to go to the LFS and see the wild colonies struggling to survive..

You new guys in the hobby also gain invaluable experience talking to us.

What we must do as reefers.. is grow and expand our propogation efforts so that the frag industry can be self sustaining, so people will have no need to cut wild colonies.

Now off to have fun getting my hands wet in trying to find the best location for all my cool frags that I got.

F

[Old Yeller Tang]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6785966#post6785966 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by dymaxiun
GREAT POST!!!! GREAT! AMEN!
Wow! Someone's teetering on that fence!:lol:

Good to see you back in again, Todd!

[ChaoticReefer]

I think it should, also, be pointed out that old timers have experienced cheap coral effects in a reef tank. With this experience we have built up an "ideal" reef tank in our minds, so we are willing to pay few extra bucks to get to that point with our tanks. Tanks that are in books that drop your jaw weren't built upon cheap corals. They were built upon carefully selecting the corals. When you start being selective you really have to put your wallet where your mouth is.

This hobby isn't cheap and it probably never will be, so I suggest people get use to paying more for a better quality coral.

Also, these high price corals are usually slow growers, therefore, its growth rate can't keep up with the demand. With these slow growth rates you have to make the hobbyist want to frag, that will ruin the look, the small colony. Only way you can do that is by offering a price that he/she can't refuse. And the buyer has to try to make his money back down the line too.

[jetaero]

I personally thought these prices were great. If you've ever bought online... You'd know that these prices were right around the same as those online. I enjoyed the event thoroughly.

[Old Yeller Tang]

Hey Josh,

It was nice meeting you. Another good point you brought up! For those who have always wanted to buy online from these vendors but couldn't stand paying the extra shipping fees, this was a good chance to come and pick & choose and not have to worry about overnight delivery and what can go wrong with it. Still bummed I never got to see Atlantis' display.:(

Roland

[NicoleC]

Tanks that are in books that drop your jaw weren't built upon cheap corals. They were built upon carefully selecting the corals. When you start being selective you really have to put your wallet where your mouth is.

I disagree. Some of the most stunning tanks I have seen have been built around high quality live rock and "cheap" corals that have been given the time and care to blossom into fully grown specimens.

On the other hand, I've seen a lot more tanks full of very expensive corals that are perpetual frag tanks, and will never be anything but that because of the mad urge to constantly chop them up to try and recoup the initial investment.

Personally, I don't find the packed-to-the-gills look very attractive. The bets thing I ever did for my tank was take out half the corals. And I've got a couple more that need to go at the next swap.

[ChaoticReefer]

I disagree. Some of the most stunning tanks I have seen have been built around high quality live rock and "cheap" corals that have been given the time and care to blossom into fully grown specimens.

Your statement supports my opinion. In order to grow out you can't frag corals. When you say "no" to people they get mad and start offering you money until you can't refuse the amount they offer or you will be a fool.

In my opinion, the best tanks are colorful corals that are growing into each other. Like you, I done like tanks that are full of colonies that actually are frags. We each have our own taste.

[raskal311]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6785697#post6785697 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by AWExotics
I am just curious... What do Dentists make per hour? I lost part of my front tooth in a hockey game. I had a dentist charge me around $300 to replace part of the tooth with some sort of veneer. It took him 30 min. I am sure I could have found it cheaper or even more expensive. I went to a Dentist I trusted and from whom I would get professional service and quality work.

Yes, Dentists, have worked hard to attain the knowledge and training neccessary to perorm at their chosen profession. They can charge what the market will afford.

There are alot of people who are in the Reef Business, who share the hobbyists passion for the hobby and have worked hard to obtain their knowledge and experience neccessary to perform at their chosen profession. They too should be able to charge what the market affords.

It is a normal of our society that rare items are generally more expensive than common. You married men.... just think about that suppossedly rare diamond on your wives' fingers....What did that cost? Oh but it's mined by 13 yr old children who regualrly are injured and lose years of life to make pennies mining for that diamond. Mining destroys the environment, ruins lives and for what..... A beautiful smile behind a white veil.... NOOO... for some rich families gluttonous habits...I see this complaining here and yet the captive propagation businesses are protecting the natural reefs we all love. Sure as in any market, there are scams and the artists who make them. Selling coral frags at prices people are willing to pay is by no means dishonest nor is it a scam.

As alot of you know, I am a LFS. I do propagate corals and support the captive propagation efforts of companies like ORA, and alot of the Offshore aquaculturing farms. In a perfect world I do not believe we should ever removed more than one colony of any color morph of any coral species. What I mean is ... Captive propagation lessens the load floating over our natural reefs. With Captive Propagation we are also able to get corals that seem to bounce back so much easier from water quality fluctuations or temperature swings. Those cheaper colonies collected from our oceans take time to adjust to captive life. I have personally had corals sit in my shop for 4 years brown and dull. No one buys it and it barely grows.The suddenly 4 years later, it awakens from its slumber color beautifully and all the sudden ever customer wants it and I want to frag it. Is it worth the extra money to buy a coral well adjusted to captive life. In nearly full beautiful color, ready to encrust and grow in our tanks???? How many wild colonies need to be killed only because they were ripped from nature to be a piece of decoration in our shallow world? I too am ashamed at how money affects this hobby. Most people want to by the wild collected colony cause it is 1/2 1/31/4 or even 1/1oth the cost of a healthy Captive propagated frag. Only then does it die and then it is tried again, until the reefer is successful or until they decide the coral" Just doesn't live in captivity." All for what did we take off the reefs some true marvels of nature... Oh yeah.. All TO SAVE A BUCK or TWO!!!


Sure noone wants to be ripped off or to even feel like they are. I know Steve Tyree, and he is a knowledgable professional who practices TRUE Captive Prpagation. He can charge what the market affords, based not only on the customers ideas on value but also on his own ideas that he enjoys his work and wants to support himself while enjoying what he does.

Retailers in this business ulitimately have to earn a living or move on. We all know what it costs to run a reef tank. Equipment, Electiricty, food, additives, salt. etc etc .. it costs money to grow corals. Some corals like an old "Green Bali Slimer" don't bring in much revenue to justify the space, light energy, and calicium it takes to grow it. Some corals are cheap and others will demand a higher price until the supply increases faster than demand.

I too want to thank Steve for putting on this event. I met alot of new faces in this hobby , and saw quite a few of you old timers. There were alot of cool vendors there and I was happy to see so many different corals being farmed. I ended up coming home with about 15 new additions to my systems. New corals to grow and hopefully add to the propagation process soon.

I am sorry to rant but the beginning of this thread was frustrating to read. I was not trying to pick on Dentists in any way. I know what my prices are, and I know the size of most my frags. I charge what I feel is fair. I know this business is still young and in time we will gain some standards, spoken or unspoken, that vendors and buyers will both expect of the corals. Events like this one are needed to continue the growth in this end of the hobby.

I had a great time at the swap, and will be attending more as they come up.

Todd

eye opening

[AWExotics]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6786083#post6786083 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by turtlespd
Todd,

How long have you been holding that in for? lol.

btw. You gotta down a extra beer, you did a party foul and brought some warm beer.

lol...I hold nothing in =)

Yeah I ran out of room for the ice chest with ICE and beer so I sent out an employee for some beer last minute

I will improve my beer selection at the next one =)

Todd

[AWExotics]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6789615#post6789615 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by raskal311
eye opening

hmmm is that good or bad lol

[drake66]

I think i should visit your shop Todd, i'm a good 45min away :) can you pm me your addy?

[dodgerblew]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6789851#post6789851 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by AWExotics
lol...I hold nothing in =)

Yeah I ran out of room for the ice chest with ICE and beer so I sent out an employee for some beer last minute

I will improve my beer selection at the next one =)

Todd
Todd, thanks for the frags. The monti is awesome. LMK when you are heading AV way and you can check out the new tank.

[AWExotics]

[violation]

[AWExotics]

oops PM sent sorry all

[raskal311]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6789886#post6789886 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by AWExotics
hmmm is that good or bad lol

i'll be willing ot spend a bit more on frags now so good for you bad for me :D

[AWExotics]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6789945#post6789945 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by dodgerblew
Todd, thanks for the frags. The monti is awesome. LMK when you are heading AV way and you can check out the new tank.

Rik,

Will do. I coach hockey in LA so one of these days I will head out towards Palmdale before heading into LA.

Thanks for the business and I hoipe they work out for you.

[AWExotics]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6789963#post6789963 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by raskal311
i'll be willing ot spend a bit more on frags now so good for you bad for me :D

Well I don't have all that uber high dollar stuffs.... But I like it all =)

Todd

[drake66]

woo! now when to go.....

[Bigmike]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6785697#post6785697 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by AWExotics
I am just curious... What do Dentists make per hour? I lost part of my front tooth in a hockey game. I had a dentist charge me around $300 to replace part of the tooth with some sort of veneer. It took him 30 min. I am sure I could have found it cheaper or even more expensive. I went to a Dentist I trusted and from whom I would get professional service and quality work.

Yes, Dentists, have worked hard to attain the knowledge and training neccessary to perorm at their chosen profession. They can charge what the market will afford.

There are alot of people who are in the Reef Business, who share the hobbyists passion for the hobby and have worked hard to obtain their knowledge and experience neccessary to perform at their chosen profession. They too should be able to charge what the market affords.

It is a normal of our society that rare items are generally more expensive than common. You married men.... just think about that suppossedly rare diamond on your wives' fingers....What did that cost? Oh but it's mined by 13 yr old children who regualrly are injured and lose years of life to make pennies mining for that diamond. Mining destroys the environment, ruins lives and for what..... A beautiful smile behind a white veil.... NOOO... for some rich families gluttonous habits...I see this complaining here and yet the captive propagation businesses are protecting the natural reefs we all love. Sure as in any market, there are scams and the artists who make them. Selling coral frags at prices people are willing to pay is by no means dishonest nor is it a scam.

As alot of you know, I am a LFS. I do propagate corals and support the captive propagation efforts of companies like ORA, and alot of the Offshore aquaculturing farms. In a perfect world I do not believe we should ever removed more than one colony of any color morph of any coral species. What I mean is ... Captive propagation lessens the load floating over our natural reefs. With Captive Propagation we are also able to get corals that seem to bounce back so much easier from water quality fluctuations or temperature swings. Those cheaper colonies collected from our oceans take time to adjust to captive life. I have personally had corals sit in my shop for 4 years brown and dull. No one buys it and it barely grows.The suddenly 4 years later, it awakens from its slumber color beautifully and all the sudden ever customer wants it and I want to frag it. Is it worth the extra money to buy a coral well adjusted to captive life. In nearly full beautiful color, ready to encrust and grow in our tanks???? How many wild colonies need to be killed only because they were ripped from nature to be a piece of decoration in our shallow world? I too am ashamed at how money affects this hobby. Most people want to by the wild collected colony cause it is 1/2 1/31/4 or even 1/1oth the cost of a healthy Captive propagated frag. Only then does it die and then it is tried again, until the reefer is successful or until they decide the coral" Just doesn't live in captivity." All for what did we take off the reefs some true marvels of nature... Oh yeah.. All TO SAVE A BUCK or TWO!!!


Sure noone wants to be ripped off or to even feel like they are. I know Steve Tyree, and he is a knowledgable professional who practices TRUE Captive Prpagation. He can charge what the market affords, based not only on the customers ideas on value but also on his own ideas that he enjoys his work and wants to support himself while enjoying what he does.

Retailers in this business ulitimately have to earn a living or move on. We all know what it costs to run a reef tank. Equipment, Electiricty, food, additives, salt. etc etc .. it costs money to grow corals. Some corals like an old "Green Bali Slimer" don't bring in much revenue to justify the space, light energy, and calicium it takes to grow it. Some corals are cheap and others will demand a higher price until the supply increases faster than demand.

I too want to thank Steve for putting on this event. I met alot of new faces in this hobby , and saw quite a few of you old timers. There were alot of cool vendors there and I was happy to see so many different corals being farmed. I ended up coming home with about 15 new additions to my systems. New corals to grow and hopefully add to the propagation process soon.

I am sorry to rant but the beginning of this thread was frustrating to read. I was not trying to pick on Dentists in any way. I know what my prices are, and I know the size of most my frags. I charge what I feel is fair. I know this business is still young and in time we will gain some standards, spoken or unspoken, that vendors and buyers will both expect of the corals. Events like this one are needed to continue the growth in this end of the hobby.

I had a great time at the swap, and will be attending more as they come up.

Todd


Im confused, is this a discussion about capitalism vs. communism, or are we still talking about coral? :D :rolleyes: Either way Im disappointed I did not get to go. But all you guys did miss the 5+ inches of snow in Big Bear over the weekend! :rollface:

[Badmort]

[badbones]

I unfortunately (maybe fortunately as would have spent a small fortune) was not a able to make the event. For those that don't know me, I have been keeping tanks for over 15 years and predominately SPS for the past 6. I myself have a different take on the frag subject. I will normally buy frags from reputable people/stores mainly because the success rate is far greater than buying a wild colony. I do sell frags as well and many here have bought, traded or have even been given frags by me.

When I sell my frags I try to have pride in what I offer. I strive to make sure that every frag I sell is attached and encrusted over the attachment point. This takes time. Sometimes weeks to months, depending on the coral. This way I know when it leaves my house it was disease free and the buyer will have great success. Is this worth charging more for a frag? I say Yes. I don't force anyone to buy my frags. I even make generous deals and give them to people that can not afford them that just want something special in there tank. I also enjoy helping out the younger ones starting out and that way we can all guarantee there will be an interest in the hobby with the young.

Yes I have sold fresh cut frags and don't normally do it, but I always tell the buyer. I also do not frag to make money, but to maintain the growth in my tank. For those who have seen my system, they can tell you that I clearly have colonies that grow out of the water.

I personally don't buy into the whole LE, Special, One of a Kind pieces. I buy what I like and will pay the price (with in reason) for that piece.

Now for the part of the hobby I really don't care for. It's those that buy a colony (usually wild) just before these events and HACK them up to sell them as frags. They usually look awesome when you buy them and in a short time they RTN or change drastically with the adjustment to artificial lighting. This type of practice is a shame and does nothing for the hobby other than pure greed for the seller.

Now back on tract. There is a cost to TRUE aquacultured frags like those before me have stated. This is time, equipment/supplies expense and a true knowledge of the hobby. As the old phrase goes you get what you paid for...

In closing, there are a number of truly honest hobbyists and business's's out there. To keep this hobby going, there has to be a price which is dictated by the supply and demand. So if you like it, buy it.

Tony

[SEAREEF]

This was a fun swap .It was great seeing my regular customers along with meeting new people and seeing friends . john Hugo,Anthony ,Charles

Turtle sps it was great meeting you thanks for the Hooter Wings also I ate some of Johns .

Roland It was great meeting you also glad I could twist your arm into getting more frags . kokob007 glad you liked your frags any time bro



Ming And Joleen are way cool anxiuos to do more trading with Ming ,Tim is also very cool ..nice to meet Dee Dee as well

Charles k and Jen Dub Thanks for intoducing your self .

Thanks for the trade Todd

Tracy Evans Great To meet you Thanks for coming by .Also Tahnks to Steve for putting it on

[fc.pride]

seemed liked a cool event. too bad i had to work. anyone now if there is another one planned?

[raskal311]

Quick questions I buy a lot of wild colonies and find that I don't have a problem with loosing much at all, maybe less then 5%. I could probably cut this number down even lower if I don’t make decision to buy risky pieces just because price was right. My loss rate of wild LPS is much higher maybe in the 10-15% range maybe even 20% and this is also due to me willing to buy risky pieces due to price. What is everyone’s lost rate at?

[turtlespd]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6791870#post6791870 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by raskal311
Quick questions I buy a lot of wild colonies and find that I don't have a problem with loosing much at all, maybe less then 5%. I could probably cut this number down even lower if I don’t make decision to buy risky pieces just because price was right. My loss rate of wild LPS is much higher maybe in the 10-15% range maybe even 20% and this is also due to me willing to buy risky pieces due to price. What is everyone’s lost rate at?

Wow, 5% is very low but what do you consider success?. Either you know what you are doing or RC polls int he past have proven incorrect. Either way if WC does works for you then stick with it. Im sure you can find many nice pieces but i can guarentee, you will not be finding a few choice pieces that been captive.

[SuperNerd]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=6768284#post6768284 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by golfish
IMO, this hobby started to go down hill about 3-4 years ago. Too many idiots with no talent, no patience and too much money.

Are you referring to certain hobbyists or the retailers?

p.s. Sorry for reviving this one. I didn't realize the conversation ended over 9 months ago.

[IsaaX]

I think he's referring to certain hobbyists. I would have to TOTALLY agree with golfish.

[Frankysreef]

There is a new one coming up Feb 14th and I have been growing out some of my really special frags for this one.

[SteveOhh]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8612075#post8612075 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Frankysreef
There is a new one coming up Feb 14th and I have been growing out some of my really special frags for this one.

Great..................it's on Valentine's Day.................another reason for the wifey to say that my reef means more to me then she does.... :( .................but I'll be there ;)

[Frankysreef]

sorry it is feb 18th

[Bionicle]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8612170#post8612170 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by SteveOhh
Great..................it's on Valentine's Day.................another reason for the wifey to say that my reef means more to me then she does.... :( .................but I'll be there ;)

Hey Steve,

Be a man :)

[SteveOhh]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8612311#post8612311 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Frankysreef
sorry it is feb 18th

Even better news........................

"Honey, for Valentines day I want a $500 gift certificate to the Coral Farmers Market!!"

How's that sound?????

Steve :D

[SteveOhh]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8612406#post8612406 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Bionicle
Hey Steve,

Be a man :)

It don't have nothing to do w/ being a man.......................it has to do w/ "basic survival instincts"..................:lol:

[JenDub]

hehe, too funny!

PS- must have dug deep to find this thread =)