View Full Version : Please help with my canopy. I'm stuck.
03/14/2006, 01:28 PM
I see people putting 250 watts of metal halide on their 20 high tanks...
I have a 30, and I'd like a 150 over it, because I want to keep a crocea clam.
Can you guys pleeeease help me with some suggestions?
I feel like my canopy is worthless to what I want it for.
03/14/2006, 01:29 PM
Look! I posted pictures!
03/14/2006, 03:55 PM
i think if you bought a pendant and cut out a hole in the top of canopy that would be easiest, this way the bulb is covered with uv resistant glass and you wont have to worry about thermal explosion of the bulb if it gets wet, im sure you can get one cheap on here used from someone....are you still gonna keep the vho's also, i would for actinics...?
03/14/2006, 04:40 PM
I'm not sure if I could cut a hole in the canopy and have room for the VHOs...
Maybe if I mounted them real close to the side corners of the canopy... but wouldn't that decrease their efficiency?
03/14/2006, 04:43 PM
I'd like to keep them to use them for actinics.
03/14/2006, 05:00 PM
yes it does, but when you have actinics, your not really using them for nothing more than just color so the effeciency of them would be obselete anyhows, to a certain extent that is....ill post my pics, i have mine almost completely to the sides of tank and they work just fine...ya know you should get a 250 pendant if you can find a used one, this way if your worried abouot losing lighting from the vho's then the 250 would be that much more wattage to help manage the amount of photons being produced
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03/14/2006, 05:02 PM
now there light 10 inches from the water they should be alot lower to get any growth, but im mainly using it just for color so it works good if you ask me, the MH are about 8 inches from water
03/14/2006, 06:03 PM
You should be able to raise the hood a little and I don't mind doing it for you and wire the stuff in there too but we have to wait at least a month when is nice out to do that. You can make a small box, put both your MH and VHO in there and hang if if is possible. How about FRD showing us his setup as is almost the same. I will see what I cand find for you later on. Having VHO and MH in the tank will cause too much heat and on top of that if you are putting one light then you should consider the center brace.
03/14/2006, 06:43 PM
with 5'' of clearence the mh will cook the tank. i would just get two more vhos with a total of 4 vho, 2 actinic and 2 daylight bulbs. you can have clams under vhos
another option would be to raise the lights with a new hood or hang them from the ceiling like this:
my lights changed from this picture but i put in 2 actinic vhos to supplement my 2 175 mh
on my sisters 40 breeder hood, i wanted to put 4 36'' lights in the hood so i had to do some space management in the hood because with endcaps the lights are 36 6/8'' and the tank is 36 1/4''. So that is another option putting 36'' for the added wattage.
03/14/2006, 07:06 PM
I like how tanks with pendant lights look, dislike the look of eggcrate, but I have a fairy wrasse. What do you mean by if I have one light I should consider a center brace? If you're really coming up this way I will count the days till you come and make you dinner!
I only have the Icecap 430, it will run 3 VHO bulbs max, I believe. I can't currently put the 36" ones on my tank because my canopy is too short. By like, 2".
Ooooh, is that a closed loop too FRD? Where did you get instructions from? Another powerhead crapped out on me today... It's so difficult to have powerheads in such a small tank.
The Ice cap 430 is god for a total of 12 feet of bulb, now that could be 4x 3 ft bulbs ot 4 2 ft bulbs, or 2 6 ft bulbs. you could easily run 4 s ft bulbs on an Ice cap 430
03/14/2006, 07:59 PM
well if she has a pendant she coould cut a holei n the top and hang it above the canopy this way the light will shine the whole tank and also will not heat b/c heat will be above canopy and she can have a fan diirectly at the pendant....i was gonna do that with a 1000 watter but decided it woould cook my center brace even though it was still 2 ft above tank...and with the reflector being pendant type the light will go down and not shine throughout the hole room.....unless its like 8 ft up like my top....but thats only if you dont want to remove you top and do like frd did with his....i like his setup, wish i could do that here personally, but i live the family life so when people come over they dont wanna see lights and hear the water noise coming from the tank...so i improvised a little, .,wish i could have an open top, that wouold make my life so much easier with heat control....hey frd how is evaporation with open top like that? damn mo, you get dinner and everything....wow, wish i was greek...lol...j/k
03/14/2006, 08:10 PM
I don't know how my apartment complex would feel about me hanging a pendant from the ceiling...
03/14/2006, 08:28 PM
are you planning on staying awhile? think of an idea to rig it in case you move and you can fix any damage to get your money back for security deposit...anyway if you go pendant your gonna add fans so figure an extra 75$ in fans, and that center brace i wouldnt worry about it with a 250, thats 6 inches from the brace, use a fan to cool each bulb and you will be fine, i places a sandwich baggy under mine about 3 inches from bulb, and it didnt melt, it was there for over an hour, now that center brace is a hard plastic.....i think the only thing to worry about would be the shade spots it will create...the mh wont penetrate through it but the other bulbs will shoot around it, you wont notice anything untill you add a coral directly under that brace and see slow growth...slowly but surely you will decide whats best for your situation of living....
03/14/2006, 08:45 PM
I plan on living here another 2 years until I graduate.
What center brace are you guys mentioning? I don't have a center brace, it's only a 30 gallon...
03/14/2006, 10:00 PM
that is a closed loop, right now i am overhauling it to make it work with my wavemaker and i am having trouble with my pump, of all things. i designed most of it myself so let me know if you have any questions
i personally like the open top because of heat issues and also the easy access to the tank, so thats what i would consider. but like spoon said there will be light that brightens up the room and you cant really have jumpers. if you are going to go with the mh then you are going to need a new hood or hang them
you could also put an "L" brace on the wall behind the tank and hang the lights that way
i get probably 1 gallon per day of evap.
03/14/2006, 10:11 PM
You're awesome. Thanks.
So I need a new hood. This really sucks. I paid my lfs store to build that one to match my stand... only 6 months ago.
On the up-side... Maybe I'll be happy with it 6 months after my new one. :) Do you know of a good website that details hoods for metal halides? I haven't found any... I'll definitely be making it for a 150 metal halide, and move my actinics to the side.. and then, put one, possibly two fans in the canopy, or have it all open back (with gutter screen) with one fan to move out the air.
Before I bug you with so many questions about that closed loop in particular... is there a website you particularly found helpful?
My tank is drilled for the overflow, but not for the return. I definitely would want some sort of wavemaker on it.. People with scwds say they restrict flow..
03/14/2006, 10:25 PM
places make them but they cost a fortune. maybe pendants are the way to go, no hood.
ask me all the questions about the CL that you want. as for links i got all my info from searching the forums here on RC back when the search worked
SCWD are only good for low flow, less than 800gph anything more and they are basically a valve. i made this mistake tring to run one with 1200gph. it worked good for a couple of months until it just stopped.
03/14/2006, 10:35 PM
Cons of a pendant:
which doesn't sound too bad if I could patch it up... and have really small things to hold the pendant... but.
I tried putting a nail in the wall for curtains, and they used plastic house siding painted the same color as the wall. That stuff would move when I tried putting the curtain rod up. Sucked.
I tried putting a hole in the wall for a shelf after I found the stud... I swear it just wouldn't go in! The nail went in like an inch and then stopped...?!
What size pump did you use for the CL? Would you recommend it? From what I hear, external is best... How many exits are there in the pvc tubing at the top? How *would* you put in a wavemaker? I wish I could afford those squirts. lol
03/14/2006, 10:47 PM
you could probably rig something up that attached to your stand and ran up the side of the tank and then at the top you could mount your lights to that, use like a 2 x4 or smaller.
one awesome way to find a stud is to use your magnet algea scraper. run it over the wall and it will grab when it findst the nail that is in the stud.
my pump is a blueline(panworld) 1200gph. external pumps are the best for higher gph. more efficient. my pump when running right is very quiet and if it wasnt for the cooling fan on it then you could barely hear it. there are 4 outlets coming from the wavemaker.
i will post pics after i finish my new closed loop.
on your tank you would probably only need 2 outlets, one on each side of the tank and maybe 1000gph pump on it.
03/15/2006, 08:01 AM
i have a custom built hood perfect for what your gonna do....i had 96 watt bulbs in it so its perfect sixe for those bulbs you have...its black with coat of polyurelthene, it looks good, even the top has openings for heat to dissipate through...if mo goes back that way someday ill bring it for you , ill get a pic of it, i know youll like it though.....you can have it i have no need for it now, its about 12 inches in height, perfect for you MH if you wanna have it inside the hood, you wouldnt even need a pendant then...
03/15/2006, 10:19 AM
I'm pretty sure the only way I can do something with wood is keep at least the shell canopy around the tank and then build off of that. I'm not sure how I could design it so it didn't look crummy.
96 watt bulbs... is that too long??
Don't get my hopes up! lol
03/15/2006, 12:15 PM
not the way i made the top, i had two holes in the side oval shapes so i could slide the bulbs in and then at the end i could slip on the wire connects fairly easy....it was pervfect, and as far as wood goes, i like it it has the natural beauty look, not like stainless steal tops even though stainless steal is alot better for heat transfer cuz wood holds alot of heat in, , and doesnt reflect light as the stainless steal tops, but its all on what y9ou wanna do, personlly i like the idea of "L" shape brackets you can by at a lowed for 5 bucks each and bolt it screw it to the wall and hang the pendant, that would mean you wouldnt have no top and you couldnt run the vho's but its up to you....i would usea 250 or 400watt pendant if you did it that way wouldnt have to worry about heat and the light is directed downward to the tank, sell your other bulbs and buy the pendant...just remember you can never have enough light...try the new 15 k bulbs great color they are, bluish white, my colors in my fish are bright now....i like em alot...
03/15/2006, 12:41 PM
it will work for you .....i didnt clean it up it was siitin 6 months...dont mind dirt
03/15/2006, 12:46 PM
You think I could put both a metal halide de & my vho's in that right? I think a reflector would help avoid light from shining out the top...
How much does it weigh do you think? I'm not as strong as I used to be to lift it up to get in the tank. :)
03/15/2006, 01:10 PM
its about 40 lbs, built to last, i know all them lights will work, i had 4- 2 ft zoo med bulbs and 2 96 pc's in there, yes a reflector will be your best bet, also helps with air flow to keep things cool, i could also drill a perfect size hole on the other side for you if you tell me what size..i have every tool known to man...any size circle up to 20 inches...i suggest 2 3 inch fans, on the other side blowing in a 2 3 inch fans blowing out...like i said you can have it....its also adjustable in lenght u can take out the 2 x4 to adjust the lenght up to 6 inches, so it would fit 29L or 30L or regular 29 short so it will work for you....the back is open so you can have filters and whatever else coming through the back
03/15/2006, 01:12 PM
i used reflector tape, you can get it at pet stores, ya know the design material that goes on back of tanks well they make a reflective stainloess steal color you can buy for 25 cents a foot, it works great, its sticky on one side like tape its easy and cheap and no light reflects out into the room
Spoon, your hood is only 30 inches long....Stephany needs a hood to fit a 36 inch tank......stephany, you can go to Lowes garden center and find a small hook that screws into the ceiling to hang the pendant on..... or like FRD said have someone bend you a small piece of qoarter inch steel square stock and screw it to the back of your stand(or side0 then you could mount the pendant to that........your Ice cap 430 will run 4 24 inch lights.....plenty of light for sps and clams...just my .02......remember spoon is the go Go Gadget man.....he will have you doing more than you really need to do....lol
03/15/2006, 08:51 PM
the hood is 30 iches but can make it 36 by removeing the 2x4's on the sides, its perfect fit for her tank, i would go the easyy way out and have no canopy if i could.....but sounds like she doesnt want that....just a thought
03/15/2006, 10:58 PM
I think... man... I think I want to tear my reef up I'm so frustrated between the lights and the flow. heh...
This is what I'm looking at. I'll just have to pull out the "lift" top part of my hood and re...screw the VHO's somewhere.
03/15/2006, 11:02 PM
BMAC, is that what you were talking about today ?
Similar.....you can see the one I was describing at :www.aquadesignz.com
03/15/2006, 11:51 PM
03/16/2006, 09:15 AM
Those are cool, I'd really wish I could get it with a 10k bulb. Do you think they would ship it out?
It looks like the hardware that attaches it to the back of the tank is a little sturdier.
This is how the other hardware looks.
I am sure they would ship....
03/16/2006, 05:01 PM
thats an awful small bulb, do you think that would be enough for a 30 gallon...what is the wattage on that item? there pretty nice, and compact...
03/16/2006, 05:08 PM
i think shes better off adding 2 more vhos....didnt you say she could run 4 2 ft bulbs...? and if she has 2 now, ....
03/16/2006, 05:14 PM
how much are they? for a 150
03/16/2006, 05:18 PM
03/16/2006, 07:47 PM
It is 260 for the first kind,
220 I think for the second kind. with free shipping
I would get the one with the 150watt double ended metal halide.
I've already got my vho setups though.
03/16/2006, 08:20 PM
wow, hard to beleive noone has one layin around, not using it....
03/16/2006, 09:05 PM
if your ballast can have 4 2' bulbs on it then go that way. your tank is shallow enough that you can keep sps and clams. check out hellolights.com get 2 pairs of endcaps and 2 bulbs for under $60
Stephany, i think i am going to try and make the trip north on the 26th...i have extra endcaps I would give you....FRD you up for makin that trip ?
03/16/2006, 09:43 PM
I think with the Icecap 430 (what I have)
I can only do 3 lamps max.
You guys I really appreciate all the helpful advice and offerings about my mess of a "custom" canopy.
Thank you very much...!
03/16/2006, 09:45 PM
But wait, it says this here:
The little brother to the 660, the 430 can also drive all VHO, HO, CFL and standard fluorescent lamps.
One ballast can operate any combination, up to 4 lamps, with a total not exceeding 330 Watts.
03/16/2006, 10:17 PM
Stephany I can get some pics of how I set up my canopy up on my 29. I have a pendant, 150w 14k ushio and 2 65w actinic pc's stuffed under it. I would think the pc's are a bit wider than VHO's. It barely fits but works well. Acro growth is out of this world!
03/16/2006, 10:25 PM
bmac, i might go
have to check to see if i am doing anything that weekend
Stephany, I have ran 4 3 ft bulbs on a 430 ballast.....you would be fine running 4.....the 430 can handle 12 ft of bulb.....the 660 does 16 ft.........
03/18/2006, 08:34 AM
Here is how I managed to modify my canopy to hold a 150w pendant and the two 65w pc's. It is a tight fit.
03/19/2006, 06:40 PM
Oooh... I think I'd need a table saw, or something to do that. ALthough it looks really nice.
I guess I will put two more VHOs in the canopy. I think I will do two 10k, one 14k (already have) and one actinic? (already have).
I have to order special wiring, right?
03/20/2006, 06:20 AM
steph...PM bmac he has some caps for 2 more vho's all you need its a 4 wire nuts, 4 screws a screwdriver and some electrical tape.....see if hes getting rid of them?...:) and i would go with both actinics since vho's are true actinics compared to PC's,and two 10k...that would work extremely well for you...
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