Help Tank Crashing And Have No Clue Why

[CorbetJackson50]

Well here this last week my tank has been acting a little weird. First of all i noticed my frogspawn was not happy and not opening all the way. Then i notice one of my 3 brains was deflated real bad and my rhoadactis (sp) and giant mushroom were not opening as much as normal. I have also noticed that one of my clown fish has a small white spot by his eye, looks like a an open wound from hitting a rock or something, im not to worried about it, also one of my yellow tangs has a few tiny black spots on him smaller than ich, last but not least the raoyal gramma's skin looks weird not really noticeable and not easy to describe but kinda looks like it is blotchy but you really have to look at him to even notice. All the fish seem to be acting normally eating well etc.

The only thing i can think of that might have caused this is that i have noticed an outbreak of red flatworms about 3 weeks ago and now there are not nearly asa many, so what ever is killing my flatworms is messing up my tank or the flatworms are just dieng and there toxins are messing my tank up. It has been about a week and nothing has changed i have done 2 20g water changes and have notice no change for the worse or the better any ideas what is happining in my tank?


specs.
SG 1.025
temp 81.5-82.5
ph 8.4
calc 440
phosphate 0
amonia 0
nitrite 0
nitrate 0
90 AGA tank
8 x 65w pc 6 10k 2 actinic with 8 LED moonlights
30g refugium (DIY HOB) well it sits on shelf behind tank because 30g is to much for HOB
modded sea-clone 150 (works better than my remora or turbo floater)
150lbs live rock
120lbs live sand (arag-alive)
inhabitants:
many type zoas
many type shrooms
yellow polyps
button polyps
3 open brains
6.5" crocea raised from 2"
x-mas tree worm colony in porites
finger leather
ricordia
GSP
frogspawn
RBTA
toadstool leather
gold stripe maroon
royal gramma
2 yellow tangs
mandairin
purple firefish

[CorbetJackson50]

one more thing i can think of is that i bought a new bottle of DT's i got it the day after my lfs got it, it smells a little stonger than my previous bottle could this maybe be somthing.

[Avi]

Well...a bit of a mystery here, Corbet. Your water readings are all good and there's still something in the water that is causing a lot of problems. From all that you've posted, I'd be inclined to think it is something related to the DTs, as unlikely as that may be. Introducing a toxin into the water wouldn't show a change in your water quality readings immediately but would stress the fish and that may explain why each of the fish that you describe show different "symptoms," rather than the signs of one particular disease causing consistent symptoms.

Without any other explanation, I'd immediately run an adequate amount of a good quality carbon in a high flow area of the sump or in a reactor, if possible.

Also, do additional water changes.

[CorbetJackson50]

Avi I am so glad someone posted i am by no means a newbie in this hobby but i have never really had anything like this happen i have been lucky to have no real problems with my tank and i dont run carbon in my tanks i do have some and will add it. is there anyway i can check the DT's to determine if that may be the culprit. It seems that i have to shake the DT's much more to get the sediment off the bottom.

[CorbetJackson50]

Also something that has me stumped is that one brain is suffering big time, i am affraid it wont make it but the other two are normal.

[Avi]

Well, as far as those open brains are concerned, they seem to act differently than one another. I had a number of them when I switched over from PCs to MHs. They were all equadistant below the lights on the substrate, yet while there was some bleaching in all of them, a year later the one that had a lot more bleaching than the others is still bleached, while the others have fully recovered. That's obviously not the same causative factor but I'd guess that it does show that they react differently and with different degrees to the same stimuli.

Anyway, I don't know how you could "test" the DTs other maybe to take it to some lab to see if they can determine if there is any toxin as the result of it's seemingly unusual consistency or whatever the cause of that might have been.

So, I'd do as we discussed....carbon and waterchanges and make sure you have a good flow in the tank...for its cleansing effect on your coral.

Please post as to the outcome of this difficulty you're having.

[CorbetJackson50]

Well i added the carbon and i left the house for a coupe hours and when i came home my skimmer colection area a gallon jug was overflowing. my skimmer had taken that much out in about 2.5 hrs, it was not dry as usual but amber color wet skimmate, any idea why adding carbon would make this happen?

[Avi]

I'd think it's because the carbon is removing something from the water column that that the skimmer normally does, so the color of the skimmate is different since it's depleted of some component. Anyway, that's all a sign that something is happening and that's good news since you want things to be different from what was happening.

[CorbetJackson50]

i guess this is true i also got a better look at my royal gramma his skin looks like it might be falling off. he also looks a little fatter than usual but he doesnt really look bloated. I really want to know what is going on in my tank!

[Avi]

I'd say that the key thing to look for is whether the fish are still taking food. If they are...and I hope they are....that's an excellent sign for things getting back to the way they had been before this problem arose. Are they?

[CorbetJackson50]

Yes the fish still eat like pigs! I did notice the royal gramma swimming weird the other day he would do little quick circles kinda like a dog chasing its tail but i havent seen this anymore

[mr pink floyd]

good luck, im tagging along and hoping your tank gets better, there is nothign i can think of that will cause it, I use Dt's too, no problems, and I also haev to shake the phyto off the bottom alot...

so idk, once again good luck

[Lpsfanatic338]

Just wondering, how did you mod your seaclone?

[Avi]

I may be the eternal optimist but I think that this is something that will pass. I don't know if it had anything to do with the DT's Phyto or not. But I'm inclined to think that by process of elimination it was either that or something else that also killed the flatworms. It just doesn't seem like it could be anything but some stressing toxin...because the chemistry that you have is, otherwise, too good. If you can post a photo of your reef, Corbet, it'd be cool.

[CorbetJackson50]

http://www.shutterbook.com/photos/91177494248_8492.jpg
http://www.shutterbook.com/photos/29257990851_8492.jpg
http://www.shutterbook.com/photos/30490489774_8492.jpg
http://www.shutterbook.com/photos/85723159785_8492.jpg
http://www.shutterbook.com/photos/90347864176_8492.jpg
http://www.shutterbook.com/photos/61327917097_8492.jpg

[CorbetJackson50]

these are all pics of my tank about 2 or 3 weeks ago when it was healthy the seccond pic you can see the frogspawn above tang on left and the brain bellow the same tang. the giant mushroom is bellow the tang on right. And in the same pic the rhodactis (sp) and orange zoa colony to the left of the tang on the left. ALl of these corals are the ones suffering.

[Jamie2337]

How old are your bulbs? Do they need replaced?

Have you taken your water to the LFS for testing just to be sure your test kits arent off?

Any metal fittings in your plumbing? Do you use RO/DI water?

[CorbetJackson50]

bulbs are less than 3months all 8 of them replaced right after new years, water has been tested by 2 LFS's no metal fittings, do have titanium heater but it is good, i do use RO/DI water

[Avi]

I may be stretching it here...but has your substrate been disturbed recently. There are toxins that might be released if anaerobic areas are suddenly exposed. It's just a stab in a situation that is otherwise perplexing.

[onefin]

I agree with Avi, run the carbon, if your skimmer is producing more skillmate something is going on, i would think the carbon is gonna help, i run carbon 24/7 my tank is going on 10 years old, i'm tagging along, let us know.

[CorbetJackson50]

Avi i have not disturbed the substrate at all only what the hermits and snails do and that isnt going to penetrate to the anaerobic areas of the sand bed so im still puzzled. I am going to go buy more RO water tonight and do another water change.

[twizttid1]

I'm surprised no-one mentioned alkalinity.....

Symptoms sound like a little episode I had with my corals behaving as you describe.....although all other chem levels were good, my alk was a little low.....

Fixed the alk and everyone came to.

Alkalinity is the key.

[CorbetJackson50]

alk was the first thing i thought of because i use oceanic salt which has low alk and have had issues with low alk before but tested good. Does anyone know anything about purigen? i have some laying around that i have never use i was thinking about adding it.

[Avi]

I have used Purigen to remove traces of copper from a tank to prepare it for a freshwater tank. I believe it did work for that. It can't hurt to try.

[cuong]

Why is your sand bed green in colour ? I would do more water change around 20% every couple days now if i were you.

[CorbetJackson50]

my sand bed isnt green it is black/white crushed oreo looking sand. One other very interesting thing about all of this is that other than the rhodactis and giant mushrooms all my other shrooms look better than ever.

[onefin]

Glad to hear your tank is getting back to normal, good luck.

[izzy_real]

Corbet,

I was reading your post, and noticed that you had some mushrooms and leathers in your tank. Perhaps chemical warfare was also a factor in your system, and adding the carbon helped remove some of the toxins.

Just out of curiosity, how did you mod your sea clone?

izzy

[CorbetJackson50]

Chemical Warfare, im not sure what you mnean by this? As far as the sea clon i cut down the inner riser tube about 2.5" and i put a new air valve on it. I also dropped an airstone to the bottom.

[CorbetJackson50]

well the one brain did not make it everything else seems to be rebounding slowly. I just wish i knew what happened to cause all this. one of the lfs store owners said this was happening to a few people in the area, they think it is in the local water suply.

[izzy_real]

All corals have a way of fighting for space. Some grow to shadow other photosynthetic animals on the reef, and others, like Xenia, simply over grow everything. Zoanthids sting, mushrooms sting, and leathers, will secrete poison into the water column. Some of the worst leathers are in the Cabbage leather family (Sinularia Dura) Other corals, like certain mushrooms, will also dump toxins in the water in response, and the next thing you know, you have corals dying, and flesh floating around the tank. Allelopathy is what us reef geeks call it.

If I were you, I'd leave the skeleton of your brain in the tank. Some brains, like trachyphyllia, a I think lobophyllia as well, often times six months down the road produce small daughter colonies on their skeletons. Who knows, you get lucky and have babies, or better, your's may grow back. I had species of brain grow back! The funn thing is, when I brought it home, it was nothing but a slimy skeleton.


izzy