Electirc Shock Problems Please Help

[TX26257]

Ok I bought a used 90 gall and helped break it down so I know every thing was working just right but after getting how and setting it up the asm g3 is shocking the water. Why is this and how do I stop it

[artful-dodger]

This can be very dangerous!

If you're sure that it is only happening with the ASM on, then it is a voltage leak in the pump. Replacement is the only solution. I think the G-3 uses a Sedra 3500. (I just tore one of these pumps apart from a used ER yesterday and was a little concerned about the isolation of the motor windings.) I ordered a replacement from fishsupply.com.

add a GFI "breaker" to the circuit after you isolate and solve the problem. Also, using a titanium ground probe is a cheap safety step.

[TX26257]

so I need to get a new pump for the skimmer and then do something to the cercuit... shoot it was work ing just fine when I helped tear down the tank I wonder what happen any other suggestions

[AZDesertRat]

Make sure you have the tank on a ground fault protected circuit like in your bathrooms and kitchen. GFCIs can be purchased as a complete new breaker, an outlet replacement or a plug in type. If you have no electrical experience hire someone to do it or use the plug in type but get one right away.

[TX26257]

now I have unpluged the skimmer and every thing was pluged into a surge protecter. Is the surge protector not enough and what is this plug in you guys are talking about. will this fix my problem or will I need to get a new sump

[BC Sparky]

No a surge protector saves your equipmetn from power surges- a GFCI Receptacle or breaker protects you from any curent leaks.

[TX26257]

so when I put in the plug in type do you think that will fix the problem or am I still looking at a new skimmer pump also I guess I can get them at home depot

[Hop]

Depends... If you think your life is worth it..

Get a GFCI and replace the pump. You are messing with a rather embarrassing deadly situation;)

[Hop]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7887618#post7887618 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by TX26257
so when I put in the plug in type do you think that will fix the problem or am I still looking at a new skimmer pump also I guess I can get them at home depot

A GFCI plug is the type of outlet in your bathroom, with the test and reset buttons. They are easy to install, just make sure the breaker for the outlet is off and follow the instructions on the box.

[AZDesertRat]

I can almost guarantee you, that pump will trip a GFI circuit, replace it.

[Coral Dilema]

1. Your pump is bad, replace it.

2. The GFCI will save your life IF you install it.

[TX26257]

ok I am going to replace it its just that the pump/skimmer is only 8 months old

[Coral Dilema]

There are 3 wires that come out of your 110 volt breaker box. They are the Hot, Neutral, and Ground.

The hot wire is (unless someone wired it wrong) white. This wire has 110 volts of alternating current on it, this is where the power comes from.

The neutral wire (again, unless wired wrong) is black. This is where the current returns to the breaker box. For current to flow there has to be a complete path from the breakerbox, to the equipment and back to the breaker box.

The Ground wire (you know what goes here) is green. This is a protection wire that is hooked to the frame or metal casing of something it powers. This is there so ensure that if something were to break loose inside the electrical appliance and short out against the case, it would be shorted to ground and not to your finger.

The standard breaker on a breakerbox is going to be a 15 amp breaker. This means that more than 15 amps of current has to be pulled through the breaker before it will disconnect the power. It should be noted here that 50 milliamps (.050 amps) is lethal. The main purpose of a breaker in the breaker box is to prevent too much current from being drawn through the wires and setting your house on fire. Larger wire can carry more current so a breaker has to be installed in front of your house wire that is appropriate for the gauge of wire used in your house. That is why you never want to take a 15 amp breaker of of yoru breakerbox and replace it with a 20, you could overload the wiring in your house and set your house on fire.

OK, so we know that 50 milliamps is lethal, and a 15 amp breaker wont trip untill you have 15000 milliamps of current drawn through it. This brings us to why you NEED a GFCI protected outlet.

GFCI stands for Ground Fault Connection Interrupter. Basically, what it does is measure the amount of current that comes in to it on the hot wire and compare the amount of current that goes out on the neutral wire. All of the current going in on the hot wire must come out somewhere, if it doesnt come back through the neutral wire then it is going somewhere else, like through your arms or heart. The GFCI monitors the current in vs. current out. If it sees more than 4 milliamps of difference it disconnects the hot wire from the circuit, thereby saving your life.

If your not perfectly comfortable installing a GFCI outlet, pay someone to do it for you. Your putting hundreds and thousands of dollars into an aquarium, pay $10 for a GFCI and $50 for someone to install it for you if you cant do it yourself. If you get electrocuted who is going to take care of your reef?

[whatevva]

The hot wire is (unless someone wired it wrong) white. This wire has 110 volts of alternating current on it, this is where the power comes from.

This is 100% WRONG!! The BLACK is ALWAYS the "HOT" wire and the WHITE is a grounded Current Carrying Neutral. The Ground wire will be bare or green.

GFCI stands for Ground Fault Connection Interrupter. Basically, what it does is measure the amount of current that comes in to it on the hot wire and compare the amount of current that goes out on the neutral wire. All of the current going in on the hot wire must come out somewhere, if it doesnt come back through the neutral wire then it is going somewhere else, like through your arms or heart. The GFCI monitors the current in vs. current out. If it sees more than 4 milliamps of difference it disconnects the hot wire from the circuit, thereby saving your life.

This is also incorrect!! The GFCI does not need current to trip. It senses resistance from Hot to ground or from Neutral to ground and trips if the resistance is less that 3 ohms. The GFCI WILL NOT TRIP from a fault between Hot and Neutral.

I don't like starting arguments, but when advice is being given from people that are not qualified, people can get hurt. My advice is to seek a professional electrician and let him install the proper equipment. It could save your life.

[AZDesertRat]

Its also Ground Fault Circuit Interrupter not Connection.

[schristi69]

Just go to Home Depot and get a small extension cord that has the GFCI built into it. Then connect all your power strips through that.

[TX26257]

ok I am going to get the gfci breaker.... which I have no problem doing. a very cheap way to protect my self.... I just wish I was not replacing my pump which is only 8 months old..... hey is the sedra 5000 the one I should go with

[TX26257]

so any suggestions on the pump

[xrunner1234]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7889692#post7889692 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by whatevva
This is 100% WRONG!! The BLACK is ALWAYS the "HOT" wire and the WHITE is a grounded Current Carrying Neutral. The Ground wire will be bare or green.



This is also incorrect!! The GFCI does not need current to trip. It senses resistance from Hot to ground or from Neutral to ground and trips if the resistance is less that 3 ohms. The GFCI WILL NOT TRIP from a fault between Hot and Neutral.


I'm not sure how the standard GFCIs are designed but I believe that they measure differential current with a core. If they are not equal it trips.

[BC Sparky]

That is correct- they actually put the Hot and Neutral both through the same current transformer (doughnut)- any current difference between the two results in a current on the secondary tripping out the mechanism.

That being said- I think the cord connected GFCI would be the best idea- no way to screw up the wiring. There are some things one should know when changing a breaker with the GFCI type and you should know the difference when changing out a receptacle to a GFCI (difference between line and load). If you want step by step instructions for either type feel free to PM me.

As for the pump- would it not be under warrantee if it is only eight months old???

[TX26257]

ok now get this I went and got a plug in gfci and thought I would try the skimmer again and guess what no shock what could this be... I promise I am not crazy

[eastcoaster1]

I faced a similar situation with my Sedra skimmer pump. When I put my hand in the sump I could feel a slight electrical current. Not a shock, but not pleasant either.
I figured I would need to replace the pump but the problem turned out to be the power strip I was using.
The strip was old and it had its share of salt creep and saltwater splashes over the years so I’m sure there was plenty of corrosion on the internal connections.
Once I replaced the power strip (with a GFCI receptacle as recommended by many savvy folks on this site) and cleaned the corrosion from the pump plug the electrical current in the tank stopped.
I'm not an electrician so I can't say for sure how the electrical current was getting into the tank, but my guess is that all the corrosion and salt creep allowed the current to somehow pass between the ground, hot and neutral connections.
Don’t know, but you might give it a try. Check the plug and if it’s not nice and bright sliver use some steel wool or emery cloth to polish it up.;)

[drstupid]

eastcoaster-

i had the same thing just happen with my old tank, i had a cheap UPS behind the main pump, it's been in service maybe three years. i felt a mild current in the water the other day, even with a grounding probe in the tank. after experimenting, it was definitely the UPS causing the problem; the pump and all other HW are fine running on a different strip.

powerstrips near saltwater seem to be a bad idea.

texas-

wrt GFI, if you're not wiring circuits, i'd recommend getting two plug in GFI's. run your main pump off of one, and everything else off the other. that way you won't lose your main circulation if one of your other random electrical devices trips the circuit.

if you are wiring, branch your circuit to multiple GFI outlets.

[BC Sparky]

Can't explain the vanishing pump problem... but glad your problems are gone and that you will be protected from future electrical issues.