FlameAngel group.

[Jaken]

Here is a question from Sweden.

Three mounths ago I sold all my tangs and only kept my Flameangel.

The plan is to have 5 or 6 flameangels in my aquarium, it´s a 550 liter tank, 150*60*65 +sump.

I know that this is a risky project. And that they will fight a lot, but I´m going to give it a try.

My lokal dealer has ordered small speciments från Christmas Island to me and I will hopefully get them in September.

Here is my question. The flame that alredy is swimming in my tank is probebly a male.

Do you think I should:

a)sell the male and by 6 new small ones, and wait untill one changes sex to a male.

b)keep the male and buy 5 new small ones (hopefully females)

c)take the male out from the tank, buy 5 new ones and then a week later put the male back in the tank.

d)other suggestions?




Do you think they will kill each other?

[LargeAngels]

Greetings fellow Swede. Stockholm is my birth place.

Whatever you do DO NOT put the new ones in with an already established fish. Either remove him and keep him in a seperate tank and then re-introduce him after the others have settled or sell him. If you do re-introduce him there may be some severe fighting if one of the new ones is larger or the same size.

Pygmy's can be very aggressive towards their own kind and can kill them. Best way is to add them all at the same time and have one larger and the rest smaller. But keep a close eye and be ready to remove one or more that are really getting attacked. The more rock with lots of hiding places the better.

I have done this with two sets of multicolor trio's, pair of flame angels and a pair of potters. Here is a picture of one of the multicolor trios.

http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/11732multi2-med.jpg

[thor32766]

wow those multi colors are gorgeous!

[LargeAngels]

Thanks. I got them from Jeremy at Premium Aquatics.

[Rothie]

a would be my first chice and c would be my second.

[Sardaukar]

If you could pull it off, half a dozen flame angels would be a sight to behold.

[Jaken]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7919268#post7919268 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by LargeAngels


Whatever you do DO NOT put the new ones in with an already established fish. Either remove him and keep him in a seperate tank and then re-introduce him after the others have settled or sell him. If you do re-introduce him there may be some severe fighting if one of the new ones is larger or the same size.

Pygmy's can be very aggressive towards their own kind and can kill them. Best way is to add them all at the same time and have one larger and the rest smaller. But keep a close eye and be ready to remove one or more that are really getting attacked. The more rock with lots of hiding places the better.



There are a lot of hidingplaces in the tank it´s filled with LS and softcorals. I will show you guys a foto of the tank tomorrow. Thanks for all the suggestions. I will try to catch the male before I get the rest in late august/september, and then depending of the size of the new I will decide if I´m going to put him back in the tank or not. I told my local petstore that I want small specimens. My hopes are that they will be females.

LargeAngels: Your trio is marvelous. Do you speak Swedish? Pratar du svenska?

If you could pull it off, half a dozen flame angels would be a sight to behold.
I hope so to. Hopefully I will succeed.

Unfortunately no one that I know of in Sweden has tried this before so I will post all my questions here insted of my Swedish "home-forum":
Saltvattensguiden (www.saltvattensguiden.se/forumet)

My hopes is that you will help me achieve my goal.
I will post fotos, and keep you updated.


(I hope my english is not to bad)

//Jakob Sweden

[Angel*Fish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7919268#post7919268 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by LargeAngels
Greetings fellow Swede. Stockholm is my birth place.

Whatever you do DO NOT put the new ones in with an already established fish. Either remove him and keep him in a seperate tank and then re-introduce him after the others have settled or sell him. If you do re-introduce him there may be some severe fighting if one of the new ones is larger or the same size.

Pygmy's can be very aggressive towards their own kind and can kill them. Best way is to add them all at the same time and have one larger and the rest smaller. But keep a close eye and be ready to remove one or more that are really getting attacked. The more rock with lots of hiding places the better.

I have done this with two sets of multicolor trio's, pair of flame angels and a pair of potters. Here is a picture of one of the multicolor trios.

http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/500/11732multi2-med.jpg
Wow Large Angels - those are beautiful! Thanks for mentioning how you were able to get them. I plan on calling Jeremy myself. I've been looking for juvenile Herald's angels.

Large angels obviously has more experience with this than I, but how about obtaining 4 juveniles and quarantining them together in say a 55g w LR and a few macros for 3-4 days ----- then add the flame you already have to quarantine tank with them?

[Angel*Fish]

And --
<img src="/images/welcome.gif" width="500" height="62"><br><b><i><big><big>To Reef Central</b></i></big></big>

Kudos to the Swedes! I was at IKEA the other day and tried the Swedish meatballs w/lingonberry mmmm...so delicious! The desert was something called princess cake - quite yummy. And we had lingonberry fruit drink. All good :)

[Angel*Fish]

Oops! Double post -

[Jaken]

Angel*fish:
Thanks for the welcome.
IKEA is great. I always eat the meatballs when I go shopping at IKEA.
For how long time have you had you flameangle pair?

[LargeAngels]

Jaken: Yes, I speak Swedish and I'm told I still have a Stockholm accent. I'm usually over there once per year to visit relatives. My uncle is in Knivsta and my grandparents are in Sodertalje (not sure how to get the Swedish letters on this computer.)

Angel*fish: Yes, that is also a way to do it. Main thing is size difference and the best key to success is getting them at the same time so they all start out together. They are still getting used to their surroundings and that seems to lessen the aggression. Premium Aquatics has an excellent Marshall Island source. They just opened an IKEA around here in June. I make a trip all the time to buy food and candy.

[Angel*Fish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=7930307#post7930307 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by LargeAngels
Jaken: Yes, I speak Swedish and I'm told I still have a Stockholm accent. I'm usually over there once per year to visit relatives. My uncle is in Knivsta and my grandparents are in Sodertalje (not sure how to get the Swedish letters on this computer.)

Angel*fish: Yes, that is also a way to do it. Main thing is size difference and the best key to success is getting them at the same time so they all start out together. They are still getting used to their surroundings and that seems to lessen the aggression. Premium Aquatics has an excellent Marshall Island source. They just opened an IKEA around here in June. I make a trip all the time to buy food and candy.
Large Angels, which candies & cookies do you like? There were so many to pick from so we didn't get any. I love IKEA and from now on when we make the trip we'll plan on eating there> Those meatballs with the lingonberries are wonderful. I think I'll serve some lingonberries along side the dressing for Thanksgiving this year.

Yes, that is also a way to do it. Main thing is size difference and the best key to success is getting them at the same time so they all start out together.

Thanks, I was trying to think of a good way for him to keep the one he already has , which I have assumed is an adult male, but I maybe assume too much.

[Jaken]

So now its finally time for me to update this thread.

Yesterday I finally got my new flame angels.

I purchased 5 of them. First i separated the tank in the middle so that my old flame wouldn't attack them immediately.
This morning when I woke up I saw that all of them ware at the same side, somehow the old one squeezed through the net during the night. There are no fighting at all. So I removed the net that separated them.

They are all eating doing well. Time will tell if it will work with 6 flame angels in the same tank.

http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/galler2.jpg
http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/galler.jpg
http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/fisk.jpg

[Joao Monteiro]

That´s simply beautiful !
Best of luck

[LargeAngels]

Awesome. I love pairs/groupls of angels.

Picture is a little fuzzy, but I looks like you do have some females there.

[Jaken]

Eyecandy. Some videoclips


video 1 (http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/loriculus 054MBR_Broadband_Stream.wmv) 32 sec 4,5 MB

video 2 (http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/loriculus 055MBR_Broadband_Stream.wmv) 10 sec 1,7 MB

video 3 (http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/loriculus 056MBR_Broadband_Stream.wmv) 13 sec 2MB

video 4 (http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/loriculus 058MBR_Broadband_Stream.wmv) 52 sec 7,3 MB

video 5 (http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/loriculus 059MBR_Broadband_Stream.wmv) 32 sec 4,5 MB

[Jaken]

http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/loriculus.gif

[sunfishh]

Jaken those videos were awesome :)

[zemuron114]

very nice looking. I havn't seen a harem of angels before!

[Angel*Fish]

Jaken, that is a thing of beauty! Thank you for posting.

[Outerbank]

Awesome videos!! Thanks for posting!

[toonces]

dude, you rock.

that is so cool! way to go!

[Jaken]

New videos.

Still no fighting. One of them is shyer then the other ones, I think it is a female, judging from the shape of the fins. The rest of them looks like males.
All of them are eating and no sign of desease.



NEWvideo1 (http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/lori 011.avi), 6,4 MB
NEWvideo2 (http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/lori 012.avi), 6,9 MB
NEWvideo3 (http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/lori 014.avi), 7,4 MB
NEWvideo4 (http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/lori 016.avi), 5,8 MB




What is the differense between a male and a female Loriculus?
Rounded fins= female?
Pointed fins=male?

colour?
http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/helbild.jpg

[LargeAngels]

Male has more black stripes and more blue on the fin
Females have less black stripes and less blue

[sunfishh]

The second set of videos is even better than the first

[Jaken]

This is what the germans say is the difference, male/female.
Centropyge loriculus
Männchen mit spitz ausgezogener Rücken- und Afterflosse, meistens mit kräftiger schwarzer und blauer Zeichnung in diesem Bereich. Bei den Weibchen und Jungtieren sind die Flossenränder fast völlig gerade. Es werden deutlich mehr Männchen importiert. Männchen werden sehr aggressiv gegen andere neu eingesetzte Centropyge. Zwei Männchen dulden sich auch in größeren Aquarien oft nicht.

(translated with babelfish).
Centropyge loriculus
Male with pointedly dorsal and anal fin, mostly with strong black and blue design within this range. With the females and young animals the edges of fin are nearly complete straight. There are imported clearly more males. Males become very aggressive against other Centropyge. Two males often do not bear themselves even in larger aquariums.


http://archiv.korallenriff.de/05Gu_3.html
Look at the difference of the fins.

Male
http://archiv.korallenriff.de/gu_centro_mann_1.jpg
Female
http://archiv.korallenriff.de/gu_centro_weib_1.jpg

[Angel*Fish]

Good photos -

The males usually look almost like they have a triangle of blue on each fin whereas with the female it is just a thin bit of blue trim along the caudal edge.


Plus notice how much thinner the female's black bars are.

[Jaken]

Angel*Fish do you have a closeup photo of your pair?

[adddo]

And i can tell you this tank is even more gorgeous in real life :)

I gotta come over and see the Flame's now that you've got them in the tank Jakob!

[Jaken]

Thanks You're always welcome Bjarne. You know where to find me.

[Angel*Fish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8626307#post8626307 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Jaken
Angel*Fish do you have a closeup photo of your pair?

No, not any good ones - but I intend to get some, my camera is dead & I think I'm getting a new one for my birthday next week ;)

When i do I'll post some - Here's the photo my avatar came from, FWIW:

http://reefcentral.com/gallery/data/505/5247125angels.jpg

[Spikehs]

I posted a question about a species only tank, and a flame angel only tank has really caught my eye after this thread! just awsome... Do you think it would be possible to introduce a pair or trio of flame angels into a 50gal tank? (36x18x18).. they would more than likely be the sole fish in there... thanks!

[sohalfr]

Awesome..... what size are they ? close to adults ar still juveniles ?

I've 2 pairs of pygmy angels in my tank, African and Potter's...
It's all the time a pleasure to see them evolve in the tank. Having a harem is a dream for me...
One day, I'll get one for sure :D or may be 2 harems... in 2 separate tanks.. or in a big tank of more than 1000 liters

[Jaken]

I posted a question about a species only tank, and a flame angel only tank has really caught my eye after this thread! just awsome... Do you think it would be possible to introduce a pair or trio of flame angels into a 50gal tank? (36x18x18).. they would more than likely be the sole fish in there... thanks!
Sorry, I can not give you an answer if your tank is large enough. I have only had my harem for 1 week. My tank is 150cm*60cm*60cm.

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8643383#post8643383 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by sohalfr
Awesome..... what size are they ? close to adults ar still juveniles ?

I've 2 pairs of pygmy angels in my tank, African and Potter's...
It's all the time a pleasure to see them evolve in the tank. Having a harem is a dream for me...
One day, I'll get one for sure :D or may be 2 harems... in 2 separate tanks.. or in a big tank of more than 1000 liters
Do you have any photos of your pairs? How can you tell the males from the females?

They are about 4 centimiters, the largest male is 6 centimeters.

[sohalfr]

Unfortunately I've no decent picture to show... :(

I've had the african flameback for more than 1,5 years and they mate almost each week :D. When they engage in courtship, the female blanches. Almost all the blue part turn to white !

For the Potter's it's a little bit to early to say... They're in the tank since september. I bought 2 with different size, 3 and 6 cm. But they already start some courtship from time to time. The biggest one has a broader blue area on the body which is reported to be a male attribute.

Angels are protogynous hermaphrodites, so setting up a pair or a harem with 4/5 small pygmy angels (certainly all females) will lead to a sex change for the dominant one !

[Jaken]

Except for the colour and size of your Afrikan Flamebacks, are there any differences in the shape of the fins?

[scoutmaniak]

I know this is alittle late, but I think this is sweet!! Ive been told by everyone I know to NEVER keep more than one pygmy angel in a tank, no mater how big it is. And you guys have breeding pairs, and whole groups. I think the pygmys are one of the most beautiful fish you can put in an aquarium. This changes my whole look on how im gonna do my tank. I know you can mix tank bred clowns if you introduce them at the same time and give them some space, this seems to hold true for the angels as well. Thanks guys for posting all the great pics and info!!

Michael

[Jaken]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8644677#post8644677 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by scoutmaniak
Ive been told by everyone I know to NEVER keep more than one pygmy angel in a tank, no mater how big it is. And you guys have breeding pairs, and whole groups.

That is what I have read and been told to. "It´s impossible to have more then one or if you are lucky and get a pair they might get along."
Unfortunately there are a lot of presumptions in this hobby.

And I wanted to give this little experiment a shot anyway.

[LargeAngels]

Multiple angels, small and large, can be kept together, but sometimes certain angels will NOT tolerate others and there is consequences to this such as death. I have found that some angels, and fish, just have either a gentle or aggressive personality. Research and be carefull. But it can be done. How long they have been established, how big they are and color diffeence makes the difference. When I have more time I can share more of my experience.

I looked and my female flame has a rounded tail and my males have pointed fins.

[Jaken]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8648537#post8648537 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by LargeAngels

I looked and my female flame has a rounded tail and my males have pointed fins.

Thanks, just as i suspected.

[lvreefer]

Some additional info:

There are slight differences in both coloration and markings of this species based on the location of collection. Flames from the Marshall Islands are more red in color, with thicker black bars running vertically down the body. Flames from the Cook Islands are more orange in coloration with either small black bars, or only a few thin bars running vertically down the body. Christmas Island Flames are normally a red/orange coloration with thin black bars running vertically down the body. Flames from Tahiti are blood red and contain very little to no yellow.

also,
It is hermaphroditic, very difficult to breed in an aquarium, and has no distinguishable differences in color between male to female.

This does not discount any remarks about fin shape. I hope that it proves to be a telling sign of sex.

[lvreefer]

Oops also forgot about Hawaiian flames. They are always more expensive and generally have more red and purple. They aren’t collected as often since they are from Hawaii and they have to reserve the export counts for yellow tangs (roughly 52% annually come from Hi.)

[Spikehs]

I always thought flame angels couldn't change sex.... so if I was to get three for my 50gal (36x18x18), all very small, I would have a resonably good chance at success? opinions?

[Jaken]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8650557#post8650557 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Spikehs
I always thought flame angels couldn't change sex.... so if I was to get three for my 50gal (36x18x18), all very small, I would have a resonably good chance at success? opinions?

They are all born as females. They can change sex from female to male but not from male to female. If there arent a dominant male in the area one of the females will change sex to a male in just a few weeks. If a female is all alone in your local fish store or in a home aquarium it´s almost 100% male. It´s imported much more males then females they say. I think that the reason for this is that they change sex during the time of handling, transport, quarentine and alone in your local fish store.

ivreefer:
This does not discount any remarks about fin shape. I hope that it proves to be a telling sign of sex.

Where did you find this information?

In German litterature the shape of the fins is a known difference. I belive that the colour differences of the male and female is a random factor that can not be trusted 100 percent.

[LargeAngels]

Any updates?

[Angel*Fish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8650301#post8650301 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by lvreefer
Some additional info:

There are slight differences in both coloration and markings of this species based on the location of collection. Flames from the Marshall Islands are more red in color, with thicker black bars running vertically down the body. Flames from the Cook Islands are more orange in coloration with either small black bars, or only a few thin bars running vertically down the body. Christmas Island Flames are normally a red/orange coloration with thin black bars running vertically down the body. Flames from Tahiti are blood red and contain very little to no yellow.

also,
It is hermaphroditic, very difficult to breed in an aquarium, and has no distinguishable differences in color between male to female.

This does not discount any remarks about fin shape. I hope that it proves to be a telling sign of sex.

Are you talking about flames? Flames do indeed diplay sexual dichromatism -- IMO, people who think they don't either just haven't seen a female or don't know what to look for -you don't have to be concerned about the black bars - use the blue on the anal and rear of the dorsal fins.

[zemuron114]

The bars on flame angels has nothing to do with the sex. I've seen a 4" flame with 1 bar, and a 1" flame with 6 bars.. just doenst matter. The only difference i have gathered and seen that can distinguish between male and female are the fins (what was said before ^^)
and the amount of blue on the fins. I also had a large male with streamers! it was very cool. I had never seen one with streamers before. Ive been experimenting with potters pairs. so far i have 3 solid pairs that are doing well and are getting along.

[Jaken]

Here is a pic of the hole crew. I think that I only have 1 female. Look at the first and the second pic.
I have noticed som "dancing", but not with the one that I suspect is a female included. Will try to capture it on video later.

http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/female.jpg
http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/female2.jpg
http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/grupp.jpg
http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/grupp2.jpg

[Angel*Fish]

Holy cow! :inlove:

For those concerned about the bars - it's the thickness of each bar that will differ between males and females - not the number (And don't look at that first black bar that's more like a splotch) - But since there are regional differences in bar markings, it makes it more confusing.

BTW I didn't get a camera for my BD :rolleyes:

Jaken, have you seen spawning angels before?

[zemuron114]

beautiful!

[Jaken]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8687287#post8687287 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Angel*Fish


Jaken, have you seen spawning angels before?

Yes, but I have only seen it on video, and in books.

video: Centropyge fisheri spawning rise and gamete release (http://www.rcthawaii.com/assets/video2.mpg)

[Jaken]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8650301#post8650301 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by lvreefer
Some additional info:

There are slight differences in both coloration and markings of this species based on the location of collection. Flames from the Marshall Islands are more red in color, with thicker black bars running vertically down the body. Flames from the Cook Islands are more orange in coloration with either small black bars, or only a few thin bars running vertically down the body. Christmas Island Flames are normally a red/orange coloration with thin black bars running vertically down the body. Flames from Tahiti are blood red and contain very little to no yellow.


My Flame angels are from Christmas Island.

http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/flame.gif

[Angel*Fish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8691236#post8691236 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Jaken
My Flame angels are from Christmas Island.

http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/flame.gif
Jaken, they look like they are getting along ok. If these "non- super males" change chromatically, you might possibly be the first to document it in flames.


What a cool video/photo - I'm going to have to learn how to do those,,,

Christmas Island has good safe collection methods I believe - they have an awareness of saving the environment & ecology that you don't find in lots of other collection areas. Humans have only lived there since 1888 (or similar date).

[fishybuisness]

Jaken hows it going whit the Flame angels ?

Have you seen any late nigth activity or somekind of a change in behaviour ?

[skippyreef]

Excellent thread.

I am looking at doing some groups of Cherubs and other small angels.

I have heard that the Multicolors are hard to get to eat though. Any wisdom that could be passed on here would be hlpeful :)

[Jaken]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8746047#post8746047 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by fishybuisness
Jaken hows it going whit the Flame angels ?

Have you seen any late nigth activity or somekind of a change in behaviour ?


There are no big changes in their behavior. Some chasing around, circling and displaying of fins but nothing more then that, jet.

Nothing new to report. They are all doing well and still no fighting or nipping on corals. I try to give them a mixed diet.

This is what I feed my flame angels:

Ocean Nutrition Formula 1 granular food
http://www.tritonakvarium.se//Graphics/Products/180_s.gif
Ocean Nutrition Formula 2 granular food
http://www.tritonakvarium.se//Graphics/Products/182_s.jpg
Fauna Marin - Ultra-Health granular food
http://www.tritonakvarium.se//Graphics/Products/385_s.jpg

frozen artemia + Sera Fishtamin
http://www.tritonakvarium.se//Graphics/Products/303_s.jpg + http://www.zoo-ove.de/images/product_images/thumbnail_images/2740_FISHTAMIN_100.jpg
frozen Ocean Nutrition angel formula
http://www.tritonakvarium.se//Graphics/Products/299_s.jpg
frozen Ocean Nutrition formula 1
http://www.tritonakvarium.se//Graphics/Products/300_s.jpg
frozen Ocean Nutrition formula 2
http://www.tritonakvarium.se//Graphics/Products/301_s.jpg

[LargeAngels]

Most of my angels also love spectrum pellets.

[Jaken]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8756544#post8756544 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by LargeAngels
Most of my angels also love spectrum pellets.


We don´t have that brand in Sweden.

[LargeAngels]

What about Hakari S pellets?

[Joao Monteiro]

Or, perhaps, Dainichi.
My flame loves them

[Angel*Fish]

For my angels, I go down to the Keys once a week with my snorkel & scrape the LR on the patch reefs. I feed some immediately and keep the rest alive in a separate 55g tank with halides. I used to use pc's on that tank, but found the food stays alive better with the halides for some reason. I keep some extra frozen just in case I have to show houses over the weekend and subsequently miss my snorkel trip.

My fish have never had pellets or other dried food.









































Sorry, I'm just so competitive :lol:

[Rothie]

Large Angels-
Are you talking about the Florida Keys?That seems like a long trip every week.

[Angel*Fish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8759573#post8759573 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Rothie
Large Angels-
Are you talking about the Florida Keys?That seems like a long trip every week.
Do you mean "Angel*Fish"?

Yes, that would be quite a drive from my home here in Houston -lol - I was just kidding - I've never even been to the Keys :D I did make reservations once to rent an island off of Marathon key once (together with another family). But the Island owner ran over a child with their car in New York City which somehow resulted in the loss of our reservation. :confused:

[Jaken]

Thanks for all the food tips. I´m pleased with the food mix I use at the moment.

I´m currently testing the Fauna Marin Ultra Health food. I´m impressed of the content, with omega3.

Do you have Fauna Marin products in USA?
http://www.faunamarin.de/eng/

A novel granular food for marine fishes. Supports the immunal system and strengthens the fishes. Ideal as an initial food after import, transport, or other stress situations.
Ultra-Health is highly accepted, even by finicky eaters. It contains high concentrations of Omega-3-fatty acids, highly unsaturated fatty acids, vitamins and herbal extracts, which are immediately and fully available to the fishes. Suitable for all ornamental fish.

Contents:
Protein 54%
Fat 23%
Fibre 1,7%
Ash10,8%

Additives, per kg:
Vit.A 339.620 I.E.
Vit.D3 3.000 I.E.
Vit.E 506 mg (as alpha-Tocopherolacetate)
Vit.C 795 mg
Vit.K3 63,6 mg
Vit.B1 31,8 mg
Vit.B2 79,5 mg
Vit.B6 31,8 mg
Vit.B12 159 mcg
Folic acid 7,95 mg
Ca-D-Pantothenate 159 mg
Biotine 79,5 mcg
Nicotinic acid 477 mg
Choline Chlorid 795 mg

Antioxidants:
BHT,BHA,Propylgallate

[Felixc]

Any new development with these Flames Jaken?

[IPowderBlueTang]

Great awesome post! Love the Flame Angels.

[Jaken]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8958496#post8958496 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Felixc
Any new development with these Flames Jaken?


They display spawning behavior in the evenings. But no eggs yet, I think they are only training.

Some new videos. (I Hope you all have broadband...)

http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/blue.gif

http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/blue2.gif


Video1, 2mb - jan 2007 (http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/blue 022MBR_Broadband_Stream.wmv)

Video2, 1,3mb - jan 2007 (http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/blue 020MBR_Broadband_Stream.wmv)

Video3, 1,1mb - jan 2007 (http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/blue 018MBR_Broadband_Stream.wmv)

Video4, 0,6mb - jan 2007 (http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/blue 015MBR_Broadband_Stream.wmv)

Video5, 1,0mb - jan 2007 (http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/blue 010MBR_Broadband_Stream.wmv)

[adddo]

Woohoo ;)

[Felixc]

I am excited, my group is arrive in a few days. I hope to have as good success as you.

[Jaken]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=8995406#post8995406 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Felixc
I am excited, my group is arrive in a few days. I hope to have as good success as you.

That´s great Felix. How many will you buy?
Hopfully you will get more females then I did, think I only have two.

Snap a lot of pics (and videos).

[Angel*Fish]

Wow! Fabulous video! Thanks for posting :)

[Felixc]

I ordered 6 but I haven't decided on how many I actually want to pick up. It will be a last minute decision once the fish arrives. I will definately post some pictures.

Jaken,
Are your angels fighting? Or is it just sexual display that they are put on.

[Jaken]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9000432#post9000432 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Felixc

Jaken,
Are your angels fighting? Or is it just sexual display that they are put on.

No, they are not fighting.

But the large male sometimes do chase the smaller ones, but just for a few seconds and then they are "friends" again. I think they are just doing this to keep the hierarchy and social structure within the group, a completly normal behaviour.

In the evenings there is a lot of sexual display.




I´m happy that you all like my photos and videos. Do you experts in here think they will spawn eventually?

[Angel*Fish]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9002192#post9002192 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Jaken
No, they are not fighting.

But the large male sometimes do chase the smaller ones, but just for a few seconds and then they are "friends" again. I think they are just doing this to keep the hierarchy and social structure within the group, a completly normal behaviour.

In the evenings there is a lot of sexual display.




I´m happy that you all like my photos and videos. Do you experts in here think they will spawn eventually?

It looks like spawning is immanent - but I have no experience with so many all together ;) . What have you determined as to sex? I'm very curious (& surprised) to know if the large male allows any male mating behavior other than his own.

Since Potter's angels have now been shown to reverse sex, it seems logical to suspect that if you have any males, they will revert to female. If so, I hope you're documenting this! :D

[Steven M]

Thank you for taking the time to share with us. Now I have hope that I can get a pair.

[scoutmaniak]

Amazing!! That is all I can say!! Im on the look for a pair now. My 100 gallon has been running for over a month now, so im starting to get a fish list going. Im gonna read up, follow this thread, and look around to see if I can spot the difference. Then in a few months ill make the move. Gotta love the flames, LOL.

[purpletang26]

cool videos i was wondering if you had any hardcorals sps, i want to put a group in my tank but i have a dominated sps. also if possible how many can i put in my 857gallon.
thanks

[Jaken]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9097117#post9097117 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Steven M
Thank you for taking the time to share with us. Now I have hope that I can get a pair.

No problem. Good luck with your pair.


scoutmaniak
Amazing!! That is all I can say!! Im on the look for a pair now. My 100 gallon has been running for over a month now, so im starting to get a fish list going. Im gonna read up, follow this thread, and look around to see if I can spot the difference. Then in a few months ill make the move. Gotta love the flames, LOL.

I am currently reading a german book that has a very good chapter written by Frank Baensch (http://www.rcthawaii.com/) on the topic of breeding and raising Centrophyge.
But it does not exist in English yet, only in german.

Nachzuchten für das Korallenriff-Aquarium.
(Breeding for the coralreef-aquarium)
http://www.ms-verlag.de/index.php?34&backPID=34&begin_at=10&tt_products=751
http://www.ms-verlag.de/uploads/pics/nachzuchtenfuerdaskorallenriffaquarium.jpg



purpletang26
cool videos i was wondering if you had any hardcorals sps, i want to put a group in my tank but i have a dominated sps. also if possible how many can i put in my 857gallon.
thanks


No I don´t have SPS, ony a few LPS, Calustra and Euphyllia and a lot of sofies. I can not help you with the maximum number you can put in your tank. My tank is 540 liter (140 US Gallon).

I don´t know if the larger the tank nessecarily means that you can put more flames together then I did. Just my thoughts.

[chillaxe123]

do you think this could be done in a smaller tank say 55 with like 3-4 angels. also is there any other species that this could be done with:D

[BlueNWhite]

Sorry if this has already been clarified or confirmed, but does the "male with thicker black lines, more blue and 'pointed' fins" rule still hold true? Do they start off as males or females? And finally, do they ever change back?

I apologize if I am repeating things here.

Thanks,
Raymond:)

[scoutmaniak]

I think on page 2 or three it is said. But yea, the pointed fins with more blue will be the male, and the more rounded light colored fish will be the female. The all start as female, and no one is sure if they can change back.

[Jaken]

Info from the book Nachzuchten für das Korallenriff-Aquarium.
Chapter: Herzogfishe der Gattung Centrophyge, Frank Baensch.
I translated the info from german to english.
My german is bad and my english even worse. Not a good combination.
I hope me spelling isn´t to bad :)

-----------
Info on the social structure and territorium of a centrophyge-harem.
Centrophyge are born as females and can change sex to male.
Harems are normaly run by a large dominant male, one to four sexually active females and up to nine unmature females.

The size of the territorium in the nature is between 2x3 to 4x6 meter.
Centrophyge harems have a size based hierarkik structure. The male is always the largest individual an displays his dominans thrue jerky swimming and circling. All females in the harem spawns only with the domiant male, the order of spawning is based on the size and rank of the female. Agressions between yhe females are rare, but sometimes the smaler females try to disturb the larger females during spawning.

The dominant male patroles the territory regularly and defends it, the male chases not only eggeating fishes away but also “bachelors�.

The sexchange is controled by the social structure, the sexchange from female to male is “prevented� by the existance of a dominant male. In the case a dominant male doesn´t exist, the highest ranking female will normaly make the sexchange. In seven days she will start the transition and in twenty days she will be a fully funktionable male.


Two or more centrophyge will only coexist if they match socially. Dominant males will probably kill subordinate males or females that are in the status of a sexchange. Two females of the same size and strength may also under the restrained conditions of an aquarium to death fight over a higher social rank. To form a harmoning Centrophyge pair, you should buy a large male or female and a small female. A trio with a much smaller female will peacfully interact.

If a larger harem is put in a aquarium smaller then 350 liter ( 91 gallon), fighting may become a problem.

The best way is to put the fishews together in a 100 liter tank at your LFS and observe if they can coexist in harmony. Individuals that atacks each other vigorusly will probably never form a pair.

------------------------

So this is what the Centrophyge expert Frank Baensch thinks on the topic of pairing and the social structure of dwarfangels...



I don´t know if i just were lucky when I formed my flame angel harem.


Or if the dominant male do accept smaller males in his harem.
Or maybe the ones that I think are males actually are females.

Or if the small males do have the ability to change sex back to female, contrary to what the litterature says...

So many questions, so little knowledge.

[chillaxe123]

do you think three potters angels can coexist in a 55 gallon?

would i need to get a large one and two smaller ones?

[Jaken]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9112496#post9112496 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by chillaxe123
do you think three potters angels can coexist in a 55 gallon?

would i need to get a large one and two smaller ones?

Sorry but I can not help you. I have no experience with Centrophyge Potteri. I recomend that you search the webb and read everything you can find about them. There is a lot of info out there.



My personal opinion is that no fish should live in a tank smaller then 100 gallon.




Here is some info on PottersAngel from Wetwebmedia.
http://www.wetwebmedia.com/pottersangel.htm

Swimming room should include a good four to six feet

This species needs room (at least a hundred gallons), with lots of spaces, crevices to dart through and out of the way, and a paucity of too-active fishes kept with it.

[Jaken]

Update!

They have now started spawning.
No more training, its the real deal.

I have seen the white cloud from the eggs and sperm.

[scoutmaniak]

OH SWEET!!! Do you have any plans to raise the fry?? I tried a pair of flames a few days ago, but they arived DOA sooooo ill just have to try again...

[Angel*Fish]

That's wonderful! Good for you! (and your fish ;) )

How many are spawning & with who?

[scoutmaniak]

UPDATES, NEED UPDATES!!

[FishGuy5]

What's the latest???
Any new news?
Anyone ever gotten lucky pairing w/ just 2 angels? I had one i thought was female in my tank and added a new one that is definately male. Was not a good intro...the original one went to harassing the new one. Was able to remove the original one and leave the new one in the tank. Should I try to put the original one back in? If so, when?

Thanks

[elmer240]

Do the flames nip at your corals bad?

[Jaken]

OH SWEET!!! Do you have any plans to raise the fry?? I tried a pair of flames a few days ago, but they arived DOA sooooo ill just have to try again...

That sux, better luck next time.

No plans trying to raise the fry yet. I have read everything I could find about raising dwarfs and I know that it is hard/impossible.

I´m still in the learning process of raising clownfishes A.Nigripes, (Black-footed Clownfish).
At the moment I do not have the time or the money to try to raise the flame angels.


<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9495692#post9495692 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Angel*Fish
That's wonderful! Good for you! (and your fish ;) )

How many are spawning & with who?

The dominant male is spawning with two or possibly three females.


Anyone ever gotten lucky pairing w/ just 2 angels? I had one i thought was female in my tank and added a new one that is definately male. Was not a good intro...the original one went to harassing the new one. Was able to remove the original one and leave the new one in the tank. Should I try to put the original one back in? If so, when?[quote]

All single dwarf angels are males. Bying another male was not good.
I do not think you should put them back together in the same tank.


[quote]Do the flames nip at your corals bad?
Until now they did not nip at any of my corals. But now they have started to nip on my Caulastrea furcata (candy coral). But that is only because I have been at work a lot lately and have not fed them as often as I used to.







I would like to get a hold of the following articles that Frank Beansch wrote for FAMA. If anyone has them on computer please send me a messege.

Baensch, Frank. 2002. The culture and larval development of three pygmy angelfish species: Centropyge fisheri, Centropyge loriculus and Centropyge flavissimus. FAMA 12/02.

Baensch, Frank. 2003. Marine copepods and the culture of two new pygmy angelfish species. FAMA 7/03.

[scoutmaniak]

Thanks for the update!!! Sounds like you have alot of fun commin up, lol. Black foot clowns should keep you busy!! Ive had better luck with my next pair of flames. They seem to be pairing up nicely!! I have the 2 flames, a coral beauty, and a majestic all in the same tank with NO fighting. It is so beautiful to see all those angels getting along!! Good luck with your flames in the future,

Michael

[mattsilvester]

Jaken,

Thanks so much for sharing, and well done all round - the set up looks fantastic and the hareem is spectacular. You have inspired me! I am now considering a hareem of dwarf angels for my 8x2x2 tank (not sure what species yet).

Have you had any problems at all with aggression?

Scoputmaniak - I see you have a pair of flames - well done to you too..... any pics of the pair?

cheers,

Matt

[Jaken]

Thanks for the positive feedback.


Mattsilvester.
There has been no problems with agressions so far.

Now I have had them for 4 months and I dont think there ever will be a agression problem as long as the dominant male is alive. If/when he dies the others might start fightinging for leadership.

[FishGuy5]

I got real lucky and had a friend pick me up a small Flame at the wholesaler. It is the size of a medium clown fish. Put it in to my tank and my 2 Flames have been cohabitating for over a week now. They're not "buddies" and don't hang out together, but they also don't show any agression to each other at all. The bigger one is definately a male with the sharp back blue fins and heavy markings. This is my second try at this....hopes it continues to work out. The first time I tried this was with a larger Flame w/ the physical characteristics of a female Flame. It was pure disaster....I had to pull it out within 30 minutes. Time will tell. I've heard of "mated pairs" of Hawaiian Flames going for $200/pair.

[Jaken]

BBCoach good luck with your Flames


I have never seen a mater pair for sale here in Sweden. The price for one Flame Angel from X-mas island is 100-120 $ here om Sweden.


If a mated pair would cost 200$/pair here in Sweden, I would consider it as cheap.

[rylin123]

awesome thread.. whats the word on these fish being sps safe? would love to try it in my tank but am concerned about my sps

[FishGuy5]

Thanks Jaken!! The mated pairs are actually being net caught in Hawaii and shipped to California.

My Flames leave my SPS frags alone...but the bigger one tore up my Scolomia. It also was nipping on my Brain. The original Flame I had that I was trying to pair up was an AWESOME citizen....left all corals alone. A buddy of mine also has a Flame in his reef with tons of super nice SPS and it leaves his corals alone.

[FishGuy5]

Thanks Jaken!! The mated pairs are actually being net caught in Hawaii and shipped to California.

My Flames leave my SPS frags alone...but the bigger one tore up my Scolomia. It also was nipping on my Brain. The original Flame I had that I was trying to pair up was an AWESOME citizen....left all corals alone. A buddy of mine also has a Flame in his reef with tons of super nice SPS and it leaves his corals alone.

[FishGuy5]

Thanks Jaken!! The mated pairs are actually being net caught in Hawaii and shipped to California.

My Flames leave my SPS frags alone...but the bigger one tore up my Scolomia. It also was nipping on my Brain. The original Flame I had that I was trying to pair up was an AWESOME citizen....left all corals alone. A buddy of mine also has a Flame in his reef with tons of super nice SPS and it leaves his corals alone.

[triggerman41]

nice pics

[triggerman41]

nice pics

[deadmanh]

.

[Jaken]

Update!

Unfortunately one of the angels died this summer. I was in northern Sweden trout fishing for two weeks when it hapened and my girlfriend was taking care of the tank so I don´t know why it died.


So now I only have five flameangels :(

[Rothie]

Thanks for the update!

[kcw1099]

Congrats on the angels doing so well.

[gman107]

did you investigate the girlfriend? did she have motives? has she done this before? j/k your angels are great

[ivgonmad]

Great Thread!!

Anybody ever try something like this with Coral Beauty Angels?

Any idea of how to differentiate between a male and female C.B.?

[petrol]

Fabulous!!:fish1:

[Felixc]

how about a new year update for us?

[flameangel88]

I would like to see some new pix/video as well.

[mattsilvester]

update sounds very good...... escpesially since I am thinkign of gonig down this road :D

[Gwynhidwy]

Yes, an update would be wonderful!

[adddo]

Jaken has had problems with his PC lately, im sure he'll update when he's got that fixed.

[flameangel88]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=9000432#post9000432 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Felixc
I ordered 6 but I haven't decided on how many I actually want to pick up. It will be a last minute decision once the fish arrives. I will definately post some pictures.

Jaken,
Are your angels fighting? Or is it just sexual display that they are put on.


Felixc:

While we wait for Jaken to update can I get a update on how your group is doing?

[Felixc]

My group never materialized as the LFS only brought in 3. Instead I went with 4 purple tangs (2"). I am glad I did, they are stunning as they have grown to about 3" now. There was a little bickering on the first day but nothing serious and have gotten along since. Sometime in November I added six little yellow tangs (2"), of course this was after I quarantined them in my frag tank and they were acustomed to prepared food. The day I added them to the main tank, the 4 purples beat the snot out of them. You name it, torn fins, body cuts and chasing them relentlously for 12 hours. By the next day, the purples had given up on the chase and bacame civilized. As time when on the two groups became one and every fish was happy in the presense of each other.

Unfortunately that didn't last long. In January I went on vacation for 5 weeks and had my father take care of the tank. Everything went well until week four when my father decided to adjust the CO2 in the reactor. Somehow he ended up emptying a new 10lb cylinder within a couple days. When I arrived home, I discovered 6 yellow tangs, one purple, and a chevron had sucuum. With the remaining fish just barely hanging on, I did a huge water change and recalibrated the system. The 3 purple pulled through and have been in good shape since. A week ago, I went to replace the yellows and acquired 4 of them. They're in the quaratine process right now.

Back to the thread though. I have been searching for 4 healthy with good markings flames recently and I think I am going to do it this time. What's been hold me back is the sizes of the flames that has been available lately. I am particularly interested in only 2" and smaller. I guess I'll ask the LFS again.

Here's 4 of them before the yellows were added.
http://members.shaw.ca/ruwilling1/4purple.jpg

[flameangel88]

Thanks for the update and the PTs are beautiful. Best wishes on your upcoming FA group.

[BMW///M3]

felix...do you have all those in your 100g?

[Felixc]

yup, and more. I love my groupies and I wish I had a bigger tank.

[flameangel88]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11962610#post11962610 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Felixc
yup, and more. I love my groupies and I wish I had a bigger tank.

Same here I wish I upgraded to a bigger tank. I've 6 FAs group started last October after seeing THIS thrd. I've a picture in the reefhotspot vendor forum with a recent video update.

[BMW///M3]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=11962610#post11962610 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Felixc
yup, and more. I love my groupies and I wish I had a bigger tank.

So you had EIGHT zebrasoma's in an 100G? Wow, what a great, responsible reefkeeper you are.....:rolleyes:

[Felixc]

Oh...another one of you:rolleyes: Those comments are a waste of people's time and thread space, so just moving along.

[Jaken]

I posted some new videos on my "homepage" under ->videos -> my fishtank.

I have som more fishes in the tank now.

4 Ps. hexataenia (sixline wrasse)
1 A. Pyroferus. (Chocolate Surgeonfish)
5 C. Loricula (dwarf flame angel)

http://www.fellsman.se/jaken

http://www.fellsman.se/jaken/tv.jpg (http://www.fellsman.se/jaken)

[eshagha]

:)

[flameangel88]

That's a beautiful tank you have there and great to see your flame angel group doing well. How difficult was it to get your group of 4 sixline wrasses to get along so well?

[Felixc]

Any plan on replacing your lost angel? I think six was a nice group you had, five is OK too!

I recently introduced 4 flames and lost one 2 weeks later due to mysterious disease. The remaining 3 are doing well and getting along with every other fish nicely. I am starting to think odd number fishs is the way to go as every time I've tried 4 or 6, it has dwindle down to 3. Maybe coincident?

[flameangel88]

I read somewhere here on RC that odd numbers may be the way to go with a group but glad I still have all 6 FAs that I started last October after reading this thrd.

[Jaken]

I have no plan of replacing the lost angel. It would be great to have a harem of 10 or more individuals but as a polarbearhunter I do not earn enough money :) The price of one Christmas Island Flame Angel here in Sweden is about 150$...

I do not share the opinion that the group coexist better in odd number of individuals then in even.

The wrasses has only been in the same tank for two week and they do NOT coexist as beatifully as they do in the video now one week later. Two of them are hiding in the LR and only come out to eat. Hopefully they will calm down.

[adddo]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12323864#post12323864 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Jaken
I have no plan of replacing the lost angel. It would be great to have a harem of 10 or more individuals but as a polarbearhunter I do not earn enough money :) The price of one Christmas Island Flame Angel here in Sweden is about 150$...

Polarbears are getting harder to come by nowadays here in Stockholm.

[mattsilvester]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=12323864#post12323864 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by Jaken
I....as a polarbearhunter I....

Not a job I would fancy doing myself, but interesting all the same ..... there can't be too many folks in your line of work Jaken?

Just out of curiosity, what is the "market" for polar bears? i.e. is it fur, trohpy, meat...... I'm baffled :confused: ...... and very interested to know!!!

[sonofstarstamps]

Hi There,

Any updates?

Hows it all going is the group still together.

What has been your experience your the last year?

Regards,
Frankie

[McSassy]

Here we are trying to save polar bears as they are becoming endangered, while there are hunters out there...errrrrrr. Whatever man.

[addo]

<a href=showthread.php?s=&postid=15724752#post15724752 target=_blank>Originally posted</a> by McSassy
Here we are trying to save polar bears as they are becoming endangered, while there are hunters out there...errrrrrr. Whatever man.

lol

[Cantonesefish]

Polar bear hunter = this is not a joke?? ( or a euphemism?)

[Jaken]

of course i don´t work as a polar bear hunter. I work with marketing. Got your attention didn´t I :)
I´m just spinning on the prejudice that polarbears roam the streets of sweden.

Moved recently and had a mishap, the the flames didn´t suvive.

RIP :(

[Jaken]

of course i don´t work as a polar bear hunter. I work with marketing. Got your attention didn´t I :)
I´m just spinning on the prejudice that polarbears roam the streets of sweden.

Moved recently and had a mishap, the the flames didn´t suvive.

RIP :(

[flameangel88]

So sorry to hear about your loss. I'd a battle with velvet couple of months ago and lost 3 FAs. I'm left with 1 male and 2 females. They are doing so well I don't want to add only more to mess it up.

Hope you'll get a new group again.

[LamboBoy]

I'm getting a harem of Flame Angels (1 male and 3 females) this coming Thursday. Currently I have an aggressive Purple Tang, 3 Yellow Tangs and a Hybrid PBT that I just introduced into my tank 2 nights ago.

The Purple Tang loves to chase the Yellow ones but it leaves the PBT alone. Have a few other fishes but they are not aggressive.

Here is a pic of the tank, I hope that they all get along since this tank is not a reg. rectangular tank. Just added more LR to the bottom of the tank so this pic is a little outdated.

I'll take some pics of the FA once they get settle in.

[jnc914]

Lamboboy- Great looking circular tank. Can't wait to see the harem of Flame Angels. :thumbsup:

[michealprater]

Looking forward to it. I bet cleaning the glass on that tank is crazy!

[massman]

So you had EIGHT zebrasoma's in an 100G? Wow, what a great, responsible reefkeeper you are.....:rolleyes:

Try 10. 6 yellow and 4 purple.

Not my personal stocking choice, but I have seen worse.:eek1:

[stunreefer]

Lamboboy- do you have a tank thread anywhere? Would love to see more on your display... also interested in how you clean the glass!

[flameangel88]

Very nice looking tank and your FA trio will be a great addition.

[LamboBoy]

Lamboboy- do you have a tank thread anywhere? Would love to see more on your display... also interested in how you clean the glass!

No. I do not. What would you like to see? It's very hard to take good pics from up close because the tank is curved.

I keep my Solaris on pretty low power, under 25% and only from 12-6pm then from 6-9pm, only actinic blue's. Let me tell you, at 100%, the lights are super bright, too bright to even look at it.

I clean my glass with a Mighty Magnet with a Magic Eraser cut in half thick wise and it works like a charm. I've not seen any algae on any acrylic surface yet and that's because I clean my glass once a week no matter what.

I have 2 filtration system hooked up to it, a refugium with a separate sump and a closed looped system that is hooked up to a big canister filter from Aquanetics, running 3000 gph thru it. I clean that once a week so it doesn't become a nitrate factory. Plus I do a 60 gallon water change every 10 days

Almost the whole bottom of the tank is filled with LR since the middle is not real, very little crushed coral as substrate. It was super hard to set up the rocks since I had to use a 36" grip thing plus I could barely see what I was doing from the top. On top of that, I had to be really careful so I wouldn't scratch the tank with the rocks.

To clean the tank, I first blow a strong water jet (made it with a water pump hooked up to some hoses and a acrylic tube) on the rocks and nooks and crannies then I vacuum the tank with a 36" acrylic tube hooked to a hose.
Once I fill two 30 gallon garbage cans, I stop.

I think have everything set up pretty good, very easy to do water change.

BTW, the tank's circumference was so wide that we had to cut the doors off to get the tank in the house and once in, we had to cut the floor open and use a casket lowering device from a cemetery, to lower the tank and stand into the basement. In the middle of freaking winter no less!!

[Jacob D]

Nice flames everyone. What do you guys think about these fish?

Male?
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2750/4538680721_54d8bb747b_o.jpg


Female?
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2683/4539310820_fd867fae88_o.jpg


I have a couple others that I need to get pictures of still...

[flameangel88]

I would say the one in the first pic is not fully transitioned to a male yet but I could be wrong.

Here's a pic of my male
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i287/reeftankpix/DSC_4856.jpg

[LamboBoy]

Lamboboy- do you have a tank thread anywhere? Would love to see more on your display... also interested in how you clean the glass!

Here is a video of my tank with the Flame Angels.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y6GXEoMQp1w

The harem came in on Thursday 5/6 with a huge Emperor Angelfish. He was supposed to be 4-4.5" but it showed up a around 6-7". They are all getting along great as you will see in the video.

So far they are all eating but the Emperor will only eat pellets (Ocean formula 1-2 and New Spectrum). I've tried every frozen food so far to no avail, I hope he comes around. Is it ok for him to just eat pellets for now?

[extreme5450]

keep pumping him full of the new spectrum pellets. It dosn't get much better then him eating only new spectrum. I feed it exclusivly to my angels , they just love them and they grow fast and healthy

[LamboBoy]

keep pumping him full of the new spectrum pellets. It dosn't get much better then him eating only new spectrum. I feed it exclusivly to my angels , they just love them and they grow fast and healthy

That's good news. I'll do that, thanks.

[sonofstarstamps]

Just started my harem.

Added 3 specimens to my established flame angel which had been in the tank 2.5 years. Tried to pick 3 females out of 12 fish that were in stock at the LFS.

All getting along very well, tok about 3 hours to settle into a group.

Will be looking at purchasing more live rock to make more nooks and crannies in the near future and then will add a further 6-8 specimens if i can source them all at once.

All fish already eating very well, was surprised how easy they took to all food including NLS pellets.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S84cvQdd-g4

[Jaken]

those ware the days

http://www.fellsman.se/loriculus/flame.gif[/QUOTE]

[petrol]

Wonderful!!

[DamianOz]

How is this tank going? how did the flame angels get up with maturity?

[urbanrat84]

Bump - we need the endings to all the stories!! For posterity!