PDA

View Full Version : Anemone questions


Gordonious
08/22/2006, 10:40 PM
Could you guys please check out these two threads for me? The next question I am going to have is if any of you have the anemones or are planning on ordering from anywhere that has the anemone or other animals, lol.

<A HREF="http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=912851">Three anemone animals with 1-2 anemone </A>

<A HREF=” http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=912851”> Three anemone animals with 1-2 anemone</A>

PS
Thank you everyone for your help and support with all my posts and million questions. Many of you have been very helpful. Just hope to meet some more of you at the meetings, if you can make it next month. :-P

RBTA
08/22/2006, 11:13 PM
I have a RBTA, and soon a GBTA hopefully((supposed to have recieved it the last fish order for work haha XD)) Anyway, your lighting is on the low side. The best set up you could do would be the two 20watts and frankly, its not enough even for a BTA. Yeah sure it might live, and it might be ok at the very top but it will NOT thrive at all. It would need to be fed meaty foods like silversides very often. And its a bit risky.

And I know WPG rule is pretty much useless but if you can bring it up to about 3.5/4 it should be fine for a BTA. Most other anemones are too light demanded and would require MH, or very powerful T5s and VHOs. But you would be able to do a Condy anemone, now most clownfish won't go in one, but there have been a few stories of Clarkii's that will go in one.

If its possible to upgrade your lighting to a higher watt, then I would do that, otherwise I would just wait until you can.

But if you decide to go with BTAs ((generally the hardiest and easiest to maintain)) Shoot me any questions you have, I know a little bit haha. I'll go fetch you a link of a website that another member ((Finding Nemo)) has on keeping BTAs, its very informative.

Edit: The link http://www.karensroseanemones.com/

Gordonious
08/22/2006, 11:28 PM
Additional lighting would probably be far off from what I could afford right now, but if that is what I need then I want to start looking into it. Problem is it seems like the experts say you pick the lighting for the types of corals you going to get if you want to do it right.... Having only kept one coral and just starting to learn the different types kept in reefs I'm not 100% sure what I want to keep.
The big question to start I guess would be I I want to keep an anemone would it be a waist to keep one in a 20l with the lighting it would require. I guess what I mean to say is can I buy a lamp that will be small and focused and not much more then I need to save money? I have tried several times to look at nano tanks and what they are running them with, but when I start to read in the forums it becomes apparent that most people just spent a lot of money figuring more money spent the safer they are and they really don't know for sure if it will work.

I have took many bio classes and chem classes and plan on tanking organic chem and micro bio this semester. I really want to understand lighting and I think I have a pretty firm grasp on the technology, but as far as what is affordable and what the animals actually need there is just too much info for me to feel comfortable.

Feeding is one thing I shouldn't have a bad problem with. Since I've been looking into keeping mandarins for a while as well as corals that prefer low light/more feeding I've stocked up on some good foods and done my reading there. I started to compose a short list of some of the food I keep here at home.

Food list: (keep in mind some of this is for fresh some for salt)

Frozen:
Ocean Nutrition Formula One Frozen Food
Ocean Nutrition Formula Two Frozen Food
Ocean Nutrition Prime Reef Frozen Food
Ocean Nutrition Angel Formula
San Francisco Krill Flat Pack
San Francisco Brine cubes

Cold:
DTs Reef Phyto
Reef nutrition's arctic pods
Reef nutrition's tiger pods(to stock fuge 1 time when set up)
Sweetwater Zooplankton
Two Little Fishies MarineSnow Plankton Diet

Dry:
Ocean Nutrition Formula One Small Pellet Food(Wish I bought M or L)
Ocean Nutrition Formula Two
Formula Two
Kent ZooPlex Invertebrate Foods
Kent PhytoPlex
San Francisco Bay Brand Freeze-Dried Brine Shrimp
+various other cheap flake for fresh water use

Live: (on occasion)
Fancy tail Guppies (food with color ;-))
Baby and adult brine
Ghost shrimp

Gordonious
08/22/2006, 11:42 PM
If anemones are more light demanding and would require a better lighting system would the same light be able to support clams?

What I think I am going to do is in the near future set up a third display for my French angle leaving me with the twin 20longs to place with. I am thinking one will be a light intensive the other would have limited light for corals such as my gorgonians and possible sun coral/polyps?

I read a bit about sun coral before, but have some questions on that as well. I see they require a good amount of feeding, would they do better with intense light next to an anemone or low light next to the gorg? And would they eat live shrimp if I started a culture of something like ghost or mysids?

RBTA
08/22/2006, 11:58 PM
Well sun coral are non photosynthetic, so I believe it would be better to place them in a lower lighted area, say under a rock cave or something. From what I have read they do not like intense lighting or being out in full blast of it. Its possible they will eat it, once their tentacles are out I think, I've never kept one so I don't know, but never hurts to try.

Also some of the foods would work for an anemone, but they are not as nearly nutricious as what silversides would be for an anemone, so if you get one I stringly suggest getting silver sides to feed them.

And to the question whether or not the same light would be able to support clams? Once again it depends on the anemone, if you look up the needs for clams like corcea and maxima ect. You will most definately be able to support atleast a BTA with that lighting, and most likely a LTA. Sebae anemones are hard to keep so are most carpets and the ritteri anemones. I would stay away completely from the ritteri, they do horrible with shipping and it is extremely hard to find a healthy one to begin with. I would also stay away from carpets. They can be hit or miss with eating fish. Some people don't mind though, b/c it is their show piece, but I wouldn't want to find my clowns going down its mouth. But thats just my opinion, save for the ritteri. Many here will tell you to stay away, they require intense conditions. High lighting, heavy flow, crystal clear water. And so on. BTAs are also accepted hosts by almost all the kinds of clownfish in captivity.

Gordonious
08/23/2006, 12:37 AM
I did not realize the second link was not working. I swear it is Microsoft's fault.
<A HREF="http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=912852">Which anemone for me? </A>

I plan on posting about this on the first link up top, but thought I would put it out here as well. I was reading that captive bread clowns are less likely to take up a host. I was planning on getting both of my clowns as captive bread.(Black and White morph of a A. ocellaris. and probably a normal color captive bread A. ocellaris) I really what is going to happen if one were to take up the host and the other didn't. Keeping two together one would likely become the dominant female, the other a male, but I have to ask if an orange and black would pair up. And if they paired up what if only one wanted to live in the anemone...


Could I keep two species of anemone close together? Then leaving the possibility the crab will host one the clown in the other? Though they may still defend there homes from anyone in either anemone. ............AAAhh. the possibilities are endless.

In all likelihood I'll try to do this and the clowns will pick on the crab till it dies then the anemone will only live half year. Err. Perhaps it is bed time for me.

Thanks a lot for your help RBTA. Like I said I've just started to read, but need a direction to go in my research and you have been very helpful. (BTW how is the yellow gorg doing, did it make the trip? Seen any polyps? So you know mine love marine snow. )

Jon

wds21921
08/23/2006, 03:27 AM
My Saddleback took immediately to my condi as soon as it went into the tank. He guards it against anything that even gets close to it (Powder blue tang, six line wrasse). Doing well under VHO too but I may have to get some Silversides soon.

RBTA
08/23/2006, 01:31 PM
The gorg is doing great, though its having a bit of trouble staying in one spot.. My algae blenny likes to pick the bugs off all my new frags I got, resulting in them getting knocked over.

Ok so about the clowns. Its not neccessarily true that captive bred will host less. I had a captive tomato that took only 8minutes to find the BTA. Now about the one occ clown only hosting. Well if one starts to host and the other not, well its most likely the female that uses it. And once the clowns pair up or start to pair up, the male will try to get in there too, even if it is only to sleep at night. And eventually the female will let him in. It is said that once a clown has let the other sleep in the same anemone, you can consider them a pair.

Now for the 2 species of anemone. It is possible to keep 2 kinds in the same tank, I've seen it done. But in more cases they can unleash chemical warfare on each other too. I personally rather not take the risk of that. But I do know you would be able to keep multiple BTAs in one tank, no matter what the color. Not sure about the other anemones, I haven't dealt much with them being as right now I'm just working with BTAs.

Also if the anemone is big enough, there might not be any quarreling among the clowns and crabs. Or you could possibly try puting an anemone ((talking BTA wise anyway)) on either side of the tank and introduce the crab first on one side so it sees that anemone and not the other one? And since clowns don't usually jump right into an anemone ((Though the perc I had for a short time jumped into my rose, until it realized "Big Momma" ((Haha my old tomato)) lived in there)) I would just get them after you get the crab and the crab has a bit of time to settle in and claim "his" territory?

And if you go with the occ clowns I don't think you have to worry about them picking too much on the crab. Occ clowns are one of the less agressive species of clowns. And I think they would only pick on the crab if it came really close to them. Though it is different with every clown, its hard just to go by species.

I'm glad to help any way I can.

Gordonious
08/23/2006, 02:09 PM
If I did two anemones I would like to try to do two very different looking ones if possible. We will see what kind of lighting I can afford.
Do you think the anemones could be kept in a 20long, or will they get to big to fast and not be able to be kept small enough?
In my situation what sort of light might I be looking at? I would be lighting one of my 20L only and since I badly want to get an anemone what would be the difference in cost for getting something that could support an anemone and a clam? If so could I keep the clam close to the anemone as long as they didn't crowd each other? (maybe keeping the anemone lower and the clam up on a piece of LR raised above it?)

I also have yet to build a hood for my tank though my brother has sworn he would help me do so when I am ready. So what ever lighting I come up with I could custom build a hood for it.

If I were to set up a my 40g breeder and put four 36" fluorescent lamps on top. Would there be any corals that are photosynthetic I could keep in there?

Gordonious
08/24/2006, 06:04 PM
PLEASE. Help me out, I am pulling my hair out and no one is giving me straight answers on my thread about lighting.

<A HERF="http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=913943">20Long reef lighting for anemone</A>

logans_daddy
08/24/2006, 07:03 PM
i thought you were given some pretty good info so far. here is what i can tell you from experience, i have had several BTA's.

- it is imperative that you have a mature tank, at least 6 months old with great water quality.

- you will need at least T5, VHO, or PC lighting. since the tank is only 13" high you can probably get away with 2 X 65 watt bulbs if you go with PC or something similar with T5 or VHO.

-the anemone will need medium intermittant flow with strainers on all inlets if you use PHs.

these are bare minimum requirements. even though the BTA is considered the easiest anemone to care for this does not mean it is an easy animal to care for. make sure you can provide for all of its needs before you buy one. i see so many people on RC proudly post pics of there anemone not realizing that the creature is near death(often bleached white). btw, if you attempt to get another copperbanded butterfly, they can not coexist in the same tank. the CBB will kill your anemone inside of a week.

shawn:bum:

Gordonious
08/24/2006, 07:34 PM
I understand the CBB. The one I had before killed my old anemone with in 20 minutes... aiptasia that is, lol. :-D

If I were to do a retro fit T5, VHO, or PC lighting. What are all the parts I would need? Ballasts? Reflectors? Bulbs? Mounting Brackets? .... I seriously went on foster and smith and got exciting looking at there retrofit section before I realized I was just looking at the reflectors. Is a ballast a requirement regardless of the route I go?

Would something along these lines work? http://www.drsfostersmith.com/Product/Prod_Display.cfm?pcatid=13637&N=2004+113345

Would these two 65 watt bulbs support the type of anemone that would likely make a good host and brightly colored clams?

I'm trying to get a ball park idea of what I am looking at tonight. Tomorrow I am thinking about going on an LFS trip. If the lighting for an anemone is going to cost me $600 then it is going to take me at least 8 months to put away that money and is unlikely. In that case during my trip I may pick up some fish and a couple of crabs.
If it is likely to cost me less then $200 and I can get what I really want, then I'm not spending a dime or going to the LFSs because I don't want to find out two days later I had just going to a store that had the perfect lighting for me.

logans_daddy
08/24/2006, 09:56 PM
i think that lighting would be bare minimum only because your tank is so shallow. more would be better. i dont think that would be nearly enough for clams but mmbuna would know better than me. maybe he will help you with the type of care clams need.

maybe you can get a fixture like that for actinics and get a MH pendant or MH retro for the clams/anemones?

shawn:bum:

Gordonious
08/24/2006, 10:07 PM
If just the MH would cost me more then $200 I wouldn't even be able to afford just that. Everything else comes in 24" or 30" accept VHO which don't seem to come in 30". If the next thing under MH would be VHO and I couldn't do that then my choices are MH or barely keeping things alive... May look like this is going to be out of my budget.

Gordonious
08/24/2006, 10:32 PM
Every where I turn more aspects to consider. I think I may need to look at some of the lights in the store. Easier then sorting through the info for the delma I am currently facing. I am not sure the that CF really come in 30" either. My NO that I am using now are 30" with 24" bulbs. Looking at replacement bulbs for CF I find 21" 22" - 34" bulbs.

So if a 30" CF only contains a 22" bulb then 24" VHO is an option again. Can I hang these CF figures somehow? I am going to build a hood soon. I mean if the price is the same I'll get one that fits find with or with out a hood. But would a 30" fixture get in the way of building a hood? NO often fit on the inside rim of the plastic trim on most tanks. But CF fixtures are usually held above right?

Gordonious
08/24/2006, 11:05 PM
Now to find out about clams... <A HREF="http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=914347">20Long with clams and anemone</A>

kaptken
08/25/2006, 09:52 PM
Gordon check out this place for DIY parts and retro's Ive used their VHO stuff and its pretty good. they have some new HQI retros that look just great, the ARO brand electronic ballasts are their own , made to their specs. nice.
http://www.hellolights.com/

Gordonious
08/26/2006, 01:11 AM
My heart is screaming MH, but my brain is telling me it isn't happening. :-( I had been thinking though that it would be impossible to do just the MH and nothing else, but I am starting to think the MH alone would work. I could even leave one of the little strips I have on it now as well if I wanted.

Now if I go crazy and look at MH, what light temp do I want to go with? (http://www.hellolights.com/15hqicoaqpep.html) 10,000K... 20,000K? I could put an antic in a fluorescent strip and would probably want to do that so I can leave it on longer then the MH at night and am. I don't know if having the fluorescent strip as well would affect the light temp, K thingy, I would want to get or if because of the W difference it wouldn't even matter.

Again anemone I am thinking faze one. My dreams include a BRIGHTLY colored clam as well. Sometimes it's a good thing, sometimes it's a bad thing, but I usually don't let a lot stand between me and my dreams. Now my credit card bouncing might stand in the way though.

wds21921
08/26/2006, 10:39 AM
Rome wasn't built in a day Jon lol.
Take your time.

Cash and space are what keeps many of us limited or turns us into creative DIYers. If it weren't for those two important factors, I think over half the club would probably have 300 gallon tanks, well me at least lol.

Within a few years you'll be amazed at how much stock your going to wind up accumulating.

Your lights are probably going to be an an ongoing issue. With many seperate tanks your going to want to always have the best but our wallets always dictate the reality of that factor.

Work with what you have, improve where you can afford and research, research, research. :)

Shnabbles
09/14/2006, 07:36 PM
If your going to upgrade your lighting go straight for MH... 10k - 20k is more of a coloration scale... 20k being more blue 10k being more white.. with your size tank (dont know the measurements) you could probally get away with just 1 150 watt MH that would give you 7.5 watts per gallon.

With that you could keep just about anything "lighting" wise...

In my experiance anenomes are much easier to keep then clams. Clams require very very clean water, and they will suck up your calcium very quickly, you would probally need to get a cal reactor or something along those lines.

kaptken
09/14/2006, 08:06 PM
Jon, I wouldn go with that corallife pendant. it has had some problems and is not well suited for a rectangular, long tank. I would get one of these new set-ups from hellowlights. the ARO ballasts are their own custom manufactured brand, and they seem to work very well. efficient, cool running and nice light from what i have heard. havent heard anything bad about them. i know their ARO VHO ballast is just great. and this HQI set up will cost less with bulb. its hard to find replacement bulbs for the corallife pendant, most places stopped selling them. go for a nice universal system of high quality. the ARO system can run any 150-175 HQI bulb. the coral life can run ony theirs.
http://www.hellolights.com/15hlmhrekith.html
I need to get one of these soon for a frag tank.

Gordonious
09/14/2006, 10:09 PM
I had looked at those for a little while. I had narrowed it down pretty far as to what I wanted to get, but honestly have forgotten what I was seriously looking at. When school started and my loan money did not come in I seriously was thinking I was going to have to drop out of school and sell all of my fish stuff. Any upgrades to my tanks in the next couple months will be things in the $5-10 range. :-(

Thanks for your comments though, I will return to this thread one day and upgrade my lighting. Just isn't in the cards at the moment.

Jon

kaptken
09/14/2006, 10:31 PM
I often have the same problem,
my plans are bigger than my wallet. just not much sense in getting something not quite as good when the time comes. but, now you have some info for the future. no problem. you will just explore low light tank species. for a while. just as good. i have one ten gallon tank with just the 15 watt strip light on it. it grows stuff when i put them in there. right now its used to clean up some misc. rock. trying to get the macro algea off it.