Growth Cycle ?????????

[MUCHO REEF]

Originally posted by Skeptic_07
It might not be season related. I have a theory that once zoas reach a sort of 'critical mass' where there is no more space for them to grow, they will start to die back or detach from the rock they are on. I bought a frag of eagle eye once and the polyps were detaching. i had healthy looking polyps rolling around the tank, open, not attached to anything. I could not understand this but it was fun to have lots of single polyps to glue in stupid places like on my snails and hermits. I put the remaining ones inbetween some rocks where the current couldnt blow them away. for a couple months no new growth. Now they are actually growing again. purely speculation but food for thought.

Plum forgot I even posted this. Lots of great feedback here though. I have never witnessed the "critical mass" theory. I've had and seen polyps grow around a rock completely until that reached the substrate only to begin to spread across the substrate unattached to any hard surface or rock at all. There have been numerous pictures posted right here in this threads as I recall over the years.

Skeptic07, do you think it's possible that the detached polyps were from fish or inverts nipping at them and not individual polyp detachment on their own?


It might not be season related. I have a theory that once zoas reach a sort of 'critical mass' where there is no more space for them to grow, they will start to die back or detach from the rock they are on. I bought a frag of eagle eye once and the polyps were detaching. I had healthy looking polyps rolling around the tank, open, not attached to anything. I could not understand this but it was fun to have lots of single polyps to glue in stupid places like on my snails and hermits. I put the remaining ones inbetween some rocks where the current couldnt blow them away. for a couple months no new growth. Now they are actually growing again. purely speculation but food for thought.

"Has anyone noticed an annual growth spurt with their polyps at any given time of the year annually, monthly, quarterly etc ?"

I haven't noticed any seasonal growth spurts in my system. My focus has always been consistency. If I maintain that consistency, my growth in most of my colonies is slow to moderate, others are rapid to sometimes out of control. So how is this explain. It's still my belief, and my opinion only, that polyps from different regions that are grown in captivity under like natural conditions, will reproduce faster than those from other regions whose environment is vastly different than that of their regions of collection. Hence the perfect explanation of why some polyps grow faster than others in the same system.

"What about growth or expansion during a full moon?"

Does anyone have a comment on the change in gravitational pull on the earth as it relates to coral growth and polyp expansion,? Hmmmm

"What about during summer over winter months, or vice versa? "

Again, I've noticed no changes.


Mucho Reef

[Skeptic_07]

Theres no way any nipping from fish was possible. the biggst fish i had at the time was a green clown goby. The frag i got was definitely from someone who just carved the polyps off the rock with a chisel or something and the bottoms of the stalks (which were almost 2" long) were very stiff and brittle. Over the course of 2 weeks since i bought the frag they slowly detached 1 at a time, some had detached in the bag and even more in the dip. It was really wierd because above the stiff brittle part, the polyps seemed fine. Even after they detached from the rock, they remained open and i could glue them wherever and they would survive. half my snails had polyps glued on them that week

[MUCHO REEF]

Growth Cycle ?????????


A topic of discussion. Would love to hear from each of you.

Has anyone noticed an annual growth spurt with their polyps at any given time of the year annually, monthly, quarterly etc ?

What about growth or expansion during a full moon?

What about during summer over winter months, or vice versa?

Any correlations at all with the above?


Mucho Reef

[MUCHO REEF]

Anyone ?????

[Jarred1]

Wow, this is a great topic. I haven't noticed any patterns, I do notice that the less I put my hands into the tank the better all my corals do.

[A. Grandis]

Ok, I'm sorry, but I don't believe in growth cycle in closed systems.
No to flame the thread! Just my opinion.

All of the influences are artificially/accidentally imposed to our home systems, so whatever happens will be a factor for changes in the growth/reproduction rates or death.

Seasons make differences in a system if all of the natural factors are applied, not only temperature and light cycle, if so. There is more than that to the whole picture when we compare to natural reefs.

Moon can be a factor if it really follows the real moon cycle, I guess.
I do believe that after a while the polyps kinda feel the cycle of the artificial moon light cycle, but nobody ever proved that it really makes a difference in all the cases.

I have an artificial moon light cycle in my system for many years and it is very hard to keep it with the natural cycle.

Interesting topic...

Grandis.

[SeanT]

Over the years I have noticed my zo's spread the most rapidly if I am lazy and don't siphon the tank or do water changes.
The other corals don't do as great but the zo's loooove a dirty, poop filled tank.

[MUCHO REEF]

Wow, just noticed how my reply from 4 years ago is both confusing and misleading as I did not use quotes from others post. So I am making the appropriete corrections by reposting the same reply in BOLD TEXT

"Skeptic_07 wrote

It might not be season related. I have a theory that once zoas reach a sort of 'critical mass' where there is no more space for them to grow, they will start to die back or detach from the rock they are on. I bought a frag of eagle eye once and the polyps were detaching. I had healthy looking polyps rolling around the tank, open, not attached to anything. I could not understand this but it was fun to have lots of single polyps to glue in stupid places like on my snails and hermits. I put the remaining ones inbetween some rocks where the current couldnt blow them away. for a couple months no new growth. Now they are actually growing again. purely speculation but food for thought."

Originally Posted by MUCHO REEF

Plum forgot I even posted this. Lots of great feedback here though. I have never witnessed the "critical mass" theory. I've had and seen polyps grow around a rock completely until that reached the substrate only to begin to spread across the substrate unattached to any hard surface or rock at all. There have been numerous pictures posted right here in this threads as I recall over the years.

Skeptic07, do you think it's possible that the detached polyps were from fish or inverts nipping at them and not individual polyp detachment on their own?[/B]


"Has anyone noticed an annual growth spurt with their polyps at any given time of the year annually, monthly, quarterly etc ?"

I haven't noticed any seasonal growth spurts in my system. My focus has always been consistency. If I maintain that consistency, my growth in most of my colonies is slow to moderate, others are rapid to sometimes out of control. So how is this explain. It's still my belief, and my opinion only, that polyps from different regions that are grown in captivity under like natural conditions, will reproduce faster than those from other regions whose environment is vastly different than that of their regions of collection. Hence the perfect explanation of why some polyps grow faster than others in the same system.

"What about growth or expansion during a full moon?"

Does anyone have a comment on the change in gravitational pull on the earth as it relates to coral growth and polyp expansion,? Hmmmm

"What about during summer over winter months, or vice versa? "

Again, I've noticed no changes.

Mucho Reef

[MUCHO REEF]

Originally Posted by A. Grandis

Ok, I'm sorry, but I don't believe in growth cycle in closed systems.
No to flame the thread! Just my opinion.


Hey man, no need to be sorry and in no way do or did I think you were flaming at all. Good to hear your reply.

All of the influences are artificially/accidentally imposed to our home systems, so whatever happens will be a factor for changes in the growth/reproduction rates or death.

Good point, I agree

Seasons make differences in a system if all of the natural factors are applied, not only temperature and light cycle, if so. There is more than that to the whole picture when we compare to natural reefs.


So if one makes lighting adjustments during the summer months for example, by slightly increasing photoperiod, minor temp adjustments and notating the Lunar Cycle, as it has been proven that the L cycle has an impact on coral growth/spawning, is it possible to influence said growth via these artifical influences/changes on an annual basis?

I agree with you, it's possible.


Moon can be a factor if it really follows the real moon cycle, I guess.
I do believe that after a while the polyps kinda feel the cycle of the artificial moon light cycle, but nobody ever proved that it really makes a difference in all the cases.

Hey AG, do you remember this thread from way back?

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...cs+only+growth

I wouldn't totally equate all actinics with being Lunar, we were both skeptical years ago. I say possible, but nothing I've read or seen was convincing. Until, I found a great article, I have searched all morning and can't find it, but I will soon. It was from a well respected reefer who ran actinics only with his zoa tank and had explosing continual growth. Now I am not totally convinced, but some of these bulbs today are putting out some serious and comparable PAR readings.

Photosynthesis is a must with these corals as we know. So I enjoy sparking good conversation from everyone just to see and hear what others have seen, heard, read, dicovered and experienced.

I have an artificial moon light cycle in my system for many years and it is very hard to keep it with the natural cycle.

Which type are you using my friend?

Interesting topic...

Yeah, lets keep it rolling

Grandis.

.

[Jarred1]

Originally Posted by A. Grandis

Ok, I'm sorry, but I don't believe in growth cycle in closed systems.
No to flame the thread! Just my opinion.

All of the influences are artificially/accidentally imposed to our home systems, so whatever happens will be a factor for changes in the growth/reproduction rates or death.

Seasons make differences in a system if all of the natural factors are applied, not only temperature and light cycle, if so. There is more than that to the whole picture when we compare to natural reefs.

Moon can be a factor if it really follows the real moon cycle, I guess.
I do believe that after a while the polyps kinda feel the cycle of the artificial moon light cycle, but nobody ever proved that it really makes a difference in all the cases.

In the wild the moon phases tells the corals when it is time for them to spawn. IMO the moon phases is the most critical thing our tanks are lacking.

I have an artificial moon light cycle in my system for many years and it is very hard to keep it with the natural cycle.

Interesting topic...

Grandis.

I was thinking about this last night and I was wondering if the water column has greater food density at different times of the year and if that has anything to do with growth in the wild.

[A. Grandis]

Originally Posted by MUCHO REEF

.

I'm been so busy lately!!! Hardly could come around here to check today.

Oh yes, MUCHO!!! I remember the thread! I still would love to hear more from them also. Please let us know about the article. Very, very interesting!!! Thanks very much!

About my moon cycle: it's a Lunar 500, and it's on for years... the bulb is a blue 25 watt incandescent and it's on since 1996, I believe. Old school. I've never had any spawning that I know of from any of the zoanthids in my system.
I did hear about others that had coral spawning in the past. My moon cycle is precise and looks good. Works great all the time, but still there is more to it, I believe. At least for the zoas, I guess.

Yes, keep it rolling...


Grandis.

[A. Grandis]

Originally Posted by Jarred1

I was thinking about this last night and I was wondering if the water column has greater food density at different times of the year and if that has anything to do with growth in the wild.

That's gonna be hard to figure out.
It would depend on so many other factors too.

Again, I really prefer to suggest a stable system than one with changes to reach some of the points in growth/reproduction. That's what I've learned all the past years. I did many changes and tried so many things to stimulate growth and many of the changes would end up in a problem for longer than I would like. Most of the problems were related to chemistry and excess growth of algae, so...

I do prefer to keep the system as stable as possible to be able to enjoy.

Still a very good topic!! I like it!!
Hopefully others will post to bring some more ideas and experiences.

I'll go back to work and be very busy this coming week.
I'll try to come here and see what people post.
Have fun!!!

Grandis.

[MUCHO REEF]

Originally Posted by A. Grandis

I still would love to hear more from them also.

Me too