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Old 12/30/2016, 02:49 PM   #4051
trmiv
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I did a 4 day once and then a 3 day covered in plastic. It all goes away and then comes back.


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Old 12/30/2016, 07:54 PM   #4052
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trmiv View Post
I did a 4 day once and then a 3 day covered in plastic. It all goes away and then comes back.
which dino are you dealing with? photos?


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Old 12/30/2016, 08:02 PM   #4053
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neiltus View Post
which dino are you dealing with? photos?
Not sure. I posted them earlier in the thread

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showpo...postcount=4039


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Old 12/31/2016, 02:49 AM   #4054
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In my case there is a clear link between dinos and marine snow. I've been trying to spot if that is the case for other tanks as well.
It's quite difficult to eyeball the density of floating particles since it's all about reference. A dimly T5 lit reef tank with a bright background will not reveal them well compared to a bright small light source against a black background. The best general method would be to use a very bright (led) flashlight in total darkness. You would shine it from a side panel and watch the particles from the front panel.

The indirect indication in my tank is that the skimmer is not pulling the same amount of gunk as before. These things change slowly so reefers are unlikely to notice them. The current theory is that the marine snow gets to stay longer in the tank giving dinos ample time to feast as they flock on top of them on the sandbed. If you get my drift you'll see how the claims from Vibrant make sense to me. It's the poop converting properties I'm excited about, so as I mention 5 posts back, assisting it the best way you can seems to be a wise thing to do.

The guys at BRS seem to have dinos in their show tank and high particle count. How is it in yours?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vk0A...youtu.be&t=145


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Old 12/31/2016, 02:27 PM   #4055
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Soooooo DNA: What are your thoughts now on the link with dinos and marine snow. Presumably I'd think carbon dosing would encourage bacteria to consume this before the dinos could get to it?


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Old 12/31/2016, 05:11 PM   #4056
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Carbon dosing could help, but that's not always the case. At least some dinoflagellates can take up organic carbon directly, as well as perform photosynthesis using inorganic carbon. There are references to mixotrophic dinoflagellates that Google will find.


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Old 01/01/2017, 01:57 PM   #4057
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trmiv View Post
Not sure. I posted them earlier in the thread

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showpo...postcount=4039
Are these primarily on your sandbed, or live rock?


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Old 01/01/2017, 01:59 PM   #4058
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Sand, rocks, glass, pumps, overflow, snails, some corals, anything still for more than 5 minutes.

Here is what they actually look like on the sand




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Old 01/02/2017, 02:58 PM   #4059
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Anyone have success slowing down Dinos going 20k? I am a little unorthodox and run multiple 10k t5 tubes....i have had a 6 month Dino issue,although not severe. Lights out always seems to stress my sps too much because the tank isn't too stable to begin with the nutrient swings the Dino's seem to cause so I like to employ methods that are gentle as possible...tempted to run all blue and actinic bulbs to see if they slow down....think this would help?


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Old 01/02/2017, 03:06 PM   #4060
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Quote:
Originally Posted by koral_lover View Post
Anyone have success slowing down Dinos going 20k? I am a little unorthodox and run multiple 10k t5 tubes....i have had a 6 month Dino issue,although not severe. Lights out always seems to stress my sps too much because the tank isn't too stable to begin with the nutrient swings the Dino's seem to cause so I like to employ methods that are gentle as possible...tempted to run all blue and actinic bulbs to see if they slow down....think this would help?
Your answer is on page one.
Get to know what has been tried and then get creative.


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Old 01/02/2017, 09:54 PM   #4061
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DNA View Post
Your answer is on page one.
Get to know what has been tried and then get creative.
Thanks - I thought I was being creative...lol.

I looked at page 1, 250 MH 20k is much different than all T5 20k...crisp white vs. blue windex, that is if your running a radium vs t5 ati blue plus...nonetheless I may experiment. Dirty method, clean method, adding bacteria\diversity, dosing nitrate, etc. hasn't it cut it. Perhaps will invest in a UV.

Thanks for the help and great insight.


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Old 01/03/2017, 09:15 AM   #4062
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I'm running 20,000k MH on my tank, and dinos seem to love basking in its blue glory. I've had both 20K Hamilton and 20K radium over this tank and they don't care either way.


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Old 01/05/2017, 12:21 AM   #4063
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From some of the more experienced brothers on here. That read most or all of this . Can we get we get a re cap so far of the methods that seem to be working for most ?
Like dosing vibrant , black outs , cut lighting back , run dirty , etc etc

And things not do
Like water changes , some say not to run gfo ? And so on

I battling Dino's , I don't know the strain it's the stringy brown crap with bubbles .
On the rocks and sand , I blacked out the tank for 4 days 4 weeks ago and they came back !
Running a fuge with cheato , also a gfo reactor.
I'm not over feeding , nitrates at zero , phosphates at zero! All rodi filters are new.

I'm desperate I wouldn hate to have to tear down my tank .if I. Any beat them. And I don't want to dose chemicals that can hurt my fish .

I'm doing another 5 day black out ,and I just ordered some vibrant to dose .
A I run the blue leds 10hrs and white 4 hrs. I will also cut their timing down .

Any other suggestions ?


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Old 01/11/2017, 12:25 AM   #4064
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As an ex-Dino sufferer, I'll just point to my recent posts in another forum and present this concept - "algae is your friend"

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...77420&page=370

Same water, two zones:

Algae zone
 photo 62AF83E1-FE30-48D0-9648-B0D556F15A77_zps8gmqd8ff.jpg

Coral zone
 photo 4A261F16-3008-4CFA-B046-391D6D9C3977_zps6ftrjkvz.jpg

Here'a what mine used to look like

 photo C64EE2BF-AD68-4075-B149-3DF317D5E5B1_zpsn8ov3ei5.jpg


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Old 01/15/2017, 07:46 AM   #4065
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Got Vibrant in the mail last Friday.

Two weeks earlier I decided to finish what I had left of Algea-X / Dino-X.
Now that I only have three stamp sized patches of visible dinos left in the sump it should be a good indication if it works or not on a minuscule dino problem. In two weeks it has killed all my mini starfishes, the ones that lurk in their holes and put their tentacles out. It also killed my sponges. It left my ostreopsis dinoflagelles alone and the little algae I have left also.

Vibrant has had 48 hours in the tank. The skimmate is much lighter brown in color and there seems to be more of it. I think I'm seeing a bacteria bloom in the water column and the floating particle count there may have reduced a bit. I did not expect fast results so lets see what happens in a couple of weeks.

---

If you missed it I'd like to urge you to go back a page and read my posts from there.
I've successfully beaten dinoflagellates with a method that makes a lot of sense.

This thread has a big reader audience so I hope someone will take the health related issues further.
The effects are subtle, but very real to me. Reefers, sailors and people living in coastal areas need to know the facts on this.


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Old 01/15/2017, 01:43 PM   #4066
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The cure you mention is removing marine snow by removing sand and most rocks and all corals?


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Old 01/16/2017, 12:55 PM   #4067
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karimwassef:

The dirt trapping capability of sand is amazing.
It has to be removed.

Porous rocks will also hold loads of it.

Your corals will not experience stability while you are doing this.
Reduced lighting is also advised to reduce production of organic matter.
---

I've been at this mother of all pests for way to many years and have tried and tested so many things it's hard to figure out new ones. This one is the most logical and effective by far.
Since 99.99% of my dinos are gone and the remaining three stamp sized patches are probably less than what the average tank has you may call it a cure.

I'll call it success, for now.



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Old 01/16/2017, 05:14 PM   #4068
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Maybe the issue is truly the health of the sand...

I keep a thick sand bed but it's a vibrant mass full of worms. That's been a key to successfully keeping my sandbed.

Your remedy works for you. No question. But I keep a sandbed while getting rid of dinos... the difference is likely in the biofauna in the sandbed.

We tried water transfusions and live rock exchanges. Have we ever tried a sand bed transplant? Like a bone-marrow transplant.


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Old 01/16/2017, 07:21 PM   #4069
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I added sand from my non-dino mature display to my bare bottom qt tank that had dinos. Also moved some little bags of rubble that seeded in my main tank first. This along with getting my nutrients up enough to get some algae and bio diversity I feel is what got me over the hump.


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Old 01/16/2017, 08:19 PM   #4070
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I didn't think much of it but I added some worms directly to my sand early on. They were in a display in a LFS. I asked how much and the owner said he'd just give me a baggie of sand from that tank if I bought something... so I bought something.


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Old 01/18/2017, 03:38 PM   #4071
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I posted this in a different thread but perhaps it is more relevant here. I have a relatively mild outbreak, but they are persistent. I have tried or am doing; bacterial dosing, reduced photoperiod, vibrant (1 month), peroxide (6 weeks), manual removal via filter floss.

It is hard to say, but the only things that I can truly say have helped are lights out and manual removal. If the other methods have, it has been subtle for me.

I may try dosing phyto and pods, hoping to further crowd out the dino and grow some other algae.

I have not tried dino-x or removing the sandbed. I guess those will be next on the list.


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Old 01/18/2017, 04:43 PM   #4072
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It might depend on the species but for me getting algae to grow was key as that brought on biodiversity. What's your no3 and po4 tests?
Do you have sand bed? My po4 wouldn't show up on test kits. Over feeding helped but I ended up dosing liquid phosphate to actually get readings. Feed the food chain from the bottom up. Can try just over feeding fish, but there's also mb7, Oyster feast, reef chili, phyto, etc


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Old 01/19/2017, 07:05 AM   #4073
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Thanks Kurt. I have never once registered phosphate in my system. I may dose a bit to bring it up to detectable levels.

I do have a sandbed. Getting rid of it would be a next step as well.


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Old 01/19/2017, 09:00 AM   #4074
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I just hate the idea of people giving up sand beds because they don't have the right life in it. I would rather cure the sandbed than kill it.


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Old 01/19/2017, 09:31 AM   #4075
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I'd really like to have a sandbed and hopefully I can have one in the future.
Since removing it will get rid of loads of accumulated organic waste there is no choice for reefs plagued with dinos.
I'd like to stress that the rocks and other affected areas have to be dealt with as well.

Critters in the sand are very likely to help, but do they stand a chance against the dinos in the battle for organic nutrients.
An ecosystem is very complex and finding the correct balance is not easy.
That's why I would think the next logical step after the dinos are gone would be to get a large sample from nature.


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