Pale Corals Low Growth rates

lcheesman · 03/05/2006, 09:57 AM

Hello,

I have been having problems with pale corals. Thought that the reef chemistry forum may be of some help. I have posted some pics on the below thread. It seems there is a lack of something...Very baffled.

http://reefcentral.com/forums/showth...5&pagenumber=2

Any help would be very much appreciated

steve the plumb · 03/05/2006, 10:30 AM

why don't you try the sps forum for help.It seems its the tips that are pale.If its the tips this is normal.Its coral growth if its just the tips.You will see it change to normal colours as growth continues.Its hard to tell from the pics

lcheesman · 03/05/2006, 11:06 AM

Hi,

It's not growth tips, the corals are pale all over through lack of symbiotic algae for one reason or another. It's the tips that are first to thin in tissue. It's not just the sps either it's all corals.

I am looking for perhaps some chemical insight into what could possibly be the cause. Too much of something...to little I don't know. The query started in the coral forum but I thought that perhaps someone may have come across a like situation. It's not bleaching either...I have added new coral frags and they have developed the same problem. It's not just a colour issue either..the corals lack any real vitality and show very low growth rates despite what I see as a suitable set of parameters.

These are my parameters.

Nitrate unreadable
Phosphate unreadable
Calcium 440ppm
Alk 9.6Dkh
Magnesium 1450
silicate 0
salinity 1.026
temperature 26c less than 1c swing now
water changes currently 25 gallons every 2 weeks
skimmer deltec ap850
2 cups of kent marine carbon
The ro di unit is at around 4ppm tds

PatMayo · 03/05/2006, 12:05 PM

I see nothing wrong with the parameters. You mag is a little high. You should probably target closer to 1350. I don't know if that would cause your problem or not.

You might also try making smaller more frequent water changes as well. I didn't see what size your tank was. Mine is a 90 and I do 8 gallon water changes each week. I think that less change at one time to the water chemistry is always better.

What about flow could that be an issue? I don't know I'm just throwing ideas out.

I hope someone can help. Maybe it's lighting?

You may have to experiment to find the real answer.

Regards,

Pat

lcheesman · 03/05/2006, 01:31 PM

Thank you for the suggestions. I'm not sure if mag would cause that either. The tank and sump combined have around 270 gallons so in theory I suppose they are reletively small water changes but perhaps still causing a disruption.

Lighting is 3 x 250watt 14k + 2 x 160 watt actinic vho + 2 x 58 watt linear actinic.

Flow is 2 x tunze streams @ 12000 lph each

I have read that a lack of iron and or nutients would cause the corals to pale, I have some small growths of macro/micro algae and the coralline has realy only just started to grow properly but it is still growing slowly?

I do know this though. If I use carbon or polyfilters or turn on low doses of ozone the corals become even more pale and within a week tissue thins considerably?

steve the plumb · 03/05/2006, 02:08 PM

with those paramaters you should be getting coraline.Its not the mag.My levels ac donif lack of iron is the problem.I also dose iodide

dandydan · 03/05/2006, 02:30 PM

I'll put my two penny worth in,

As said by well informed others, your ro/DI unit at 4ppm aint the best in the west, whether it has any bearing I dont know, but when mine went to 2 ppm I started seeing diatoms on sand, I replaced the resin and they seemed to clear up. Coincidence or not? This also depends how good your tds meter is of course.

Randy Holmes-Farley · 03/05/2006, 03:33 PM

I see no chemical issues either, although I agree that the DI should be replaced as soon is it rises above 0-1 ppm TDS:

Reverse Osmosis/Deionization Systems to Purify Tap Water for Reef Aquaria
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-05/rhf/index.htm

Have you seen these actual corals in other tanks to know what they otherwise might look like?

Do you know the lighting is suitable to see the more intense colors that you are hoping to see?

Randy Holmes-Farley · 03/05/2006, 03:35 PM

How did you try to measure phosphate?

lcheesman · 03/05/2006, 04:20 PM

Ok, I will make sure I keep a close eye on the tds in future and get that di cart replaced.

The phosphate was measure using the new deltec low range test kit.

I've kept corals for quite some time and I know these are not looking no where near their best..and if anything unhealthy. Some of the corals were previously kept in my old aquarium 2 years ago, they looked great then.

I'm not particularly bothered about intense colouring. The sps corals at the moment have pale pigmentation and have a very thin tissue coverage in some arreas normally the tips. A branch will die every so often due to this.

This is what concerns me.
I do know this though. If I use carbon or polyfilters or turn on low doses of ozone the corals become even more pale and within a week tissue thins considerably?

I think IMO the lighting should be ok
Lighting is 3 x 250watt 14k + 2 x 160 watt actinic vho + 2 x 58 watt linear actinic.

steve the plumb · 03/05/2006, 07:49 PM

How old are your bulbs?I am aslo using 14 k and 10 k bulbs with no problems what so ever.My mag is around 1400.I dose the iron for the calerpa.My tds is around 7 and so far no problems with any corals.I have r/o unit not r/o di.The iodide is for my inverts allthough I use it because the bottle says its good for inverts.I have no clue if the stufff works.It don't understand why using carbon would make your corals lose tips.Carbon is supopossed to clean the water.Do you feed your corals?15 years in the hobby you must be doing something right.Maybe the water from your ro/di isn't as clean as you think.Doesn't makes sense that all your corals fade.Must be some kind of polutent in the water causing a neagative reaction in the pigmintation of the corals.Can copper be leaching into the system via your water.Low levels maybe.I don't know just trying to give an idea.I have not seen this before,I have had some corals discolour in spots but never all.Even your brain looks bad.

lcheesman · 03/06/2006, 01:29 AM

Cheers Steve,

I think the best thing I can do at this point is get the di cartridge replaced. After reading the article Randy linked I beleive these di units could be trouble causing a negative effect if their replacement schedule isn't kept up with. Could copper cause this? Are'nt astrea snails highly sensitive to copper as I have around 20 of them.

The same ro/di unit was used on my old tank with no tds meter and everything looked great and grew fast.

Some observations, I have a gonipora that I have had for 4 years now, growing with full polyp extension everyday, Again, very pale though, Same as the discosoma that were blue, now light purple, a Caulastrea furcata Candy cane that had brown outters and bright green inners, now all light green, a porites that was dark brown to orange now a light Tan, a montipora cap was darl brown/purple now very light brown, a dark green lobophyllia that is now very light greeny/yellow.

I have some Briarium sp. green star polyps that I have always known to grow rapidly. They to aren't what I would call growing very well, in 2 years they have only increased about 30% in spread...they hold a bit of colour but not much.

Again, the colour is an indication of a problem that I have...not a disire to obtain radio-active colours.

Are we looking at something toxic?perhaps copper?

Other tan the diatom bloom mentioned by Dandydan has anyone else had visble problems when the tds was reading higher on their ro-di?

Oh yes and food - I feed sweetwater, cyclopseez, mysis, formula1 and a few other things all in small amounts

Randy Holmes-Farley · 03/06/2006, 07:44 AM

I do know this though. If I use carbon or polyfilters or turn on low doses of ozone the corals become even more pale and within a week tissue thins considerably?

I'm not a coral expert, but it sounds like maybe they are being starved. Perhaps back off a bit on the agressive nutrient control just to see what happens.

steve the plumb · 03/06/2006, 09:22 AM

I was just trying to make sense of this.I I am wondering why the corals would change colours to a negative pigmintation vs a positive one.Under 20k bulbs my corals changed colours,but they look better vs looking worse.I don't know if you have very low traces of copper its just a thought.I don't know whats wrong with the tank.I feed my corals almost every day.You have a good skimmer so I don't think your water is dirty.Are you over feeding your corals?If you are I would think that the skimmer would pick up the nutrients.There must be something wrong with the water quality maybe the resign.You might want to try buying some r/o water or maybe getting another unit or changing all the filters.I have a crappy 10 gpd coralife unit that I change the filters once a year.My membrane is over 7 years old.My tds is 7-10.I don't have a tds meter wich I think will be my next purchase.My friend had a problem with his ro/di unit.The water quality wasn't the best coming out but yet it was at 10 tds.He noticed that his corals wern't looking the best but none turned pale.The brain isn't a hard coral to keep yet yours is pale.My other friend uses regular tap water crappy lights and his brains are huge they seem to love it.Like I said again must be something in the ro water seems to me you know what you are doing as far as taking care of the corals you have had good results in the past there is no reason you shouldn't have good results in the future.Do you have very old pipes in your house?Do you notice rusty water coming from your taps?Are the pipes old galvanized?

lcheesman · 03/06/2006, 12:57 PM

cor blimey...thanks for that reply Steve..you've really got me thinking now.

Pipes are copper pipes in the house.

seems to me you know what you are doing as far as taking care of the corals
I'd like to think so yes..although I am having doubts after a year and a half of the problem.

My other friend uses regular tap water crappy lights and his brains are huge This makes me feel bad, I work so hard to make the environment the best possible...not always got my hands in the tank but you know what I mean.

If one small dice size cube a day isn't overfeeding then no..I don't think I am.

What sort of reaction would excessive copper cause?

Randy, you may be right about the nutrients. The way I see it it is one of two things. Either:
There is a contaminent in the ro water or
There is a lack of something...which one and what it is, is the challenge.

Randy Holmes-Farley · 03/06/2006, 02:03 PM

What sort of reaction would excessive copper cause?

High enough kills inverts. I'm not sure what happens at sub-lethal levels.

steve the plumb · 03/06/2006, 02:06 PM

You are not feeding that much at all one cube is nothing.What size is your tank?Copper pipes are safe.They are much better than galvanized they don't accumulate rust even if they are old.The only thing that would show rust is your hot water wich you don't use for the fish tank.Even if you had alot of fish your skimmer is a good model it should be able to handle it.

Habib · 03/06/2006, 02:13 PM

Some observations, I have a gonipora that I have had for 4 years now, growing with full polyp extension everyday, Again, very pale though, Same as the discosoma that were blue, now light purple, a Caulastrea furcata Candy cane that had brown outters and bright green inners, now all light green, a porites that was dark brown to orange now a light Tan, a montipora cap was darl brown/purple now very light brown, a dark green lobophyllia that is now very light greeny/yellow.

Sounds like bleaching. There can be many reasons for that.

The simplest one to check is temperature.

Other causes can be heavy metals, too low nutrients such as phosphate, ammonia/nitrite/nitrate and iron.

Not enough flow can also cause bleaching.

lcheesman · 03/06/2006, 03:15 PM

Steve, the tank is around 270 gallons total including sump. I have 12 fish and do not see the need to feed anymore than I do...perhaps I should?

I'm so surprised I cannot find anyone that has had a similar problem.

Habib,
Temperature sits at 26c and does not swing by more than 1c.

"Other causes can be heavy metals, too low nutrients such as phosphate, ammonia/nitrite/nitrate and iron".???where to start??

I have some micro and macro algae growth, I can't see how I could have extremely low phosphate/nitrate with these growing?

Heavy metals seems like it could be a problem

I don't think flow is a problem there is plenty of that with tunze streams and 6000lph returns.

Iron was my initial thoughts but again, why would I have algae growing?

steve the plumb · 03/06/2006, 03:46 PM

Your tank is pretty big.You are hardly feeding the fish.I feed 3 times that in my 150 gal.I wouldn't worry about feeding some more the fish might be hungry.

Randy Holmes-Farley · 03/07/2006, 06:24 AM

Iron was my initial thoughts but again, why would I have algae growing?

I'm not saying this is especially likely to be it, but perhaps they sequester it faster than the corals can get it.

In any case, it is easy to dose for a week or two and see what happens.

lcheesman · 03/07/2006, 12:00 PM

Randy, I like the word sequester...I shall remember to use that one

Yes, I will get an iron supplement...perhaps Kent Marine and try that.

I have switched off my 2 actinc VHO's Philips 160watt maily because I believe these may be giving off harmful UV radiation. I Still have 2 standard tubes totalling 120watts of actinic.

They have been off for one day and I have noticed polyp extension on 2 sps corals that previously had zero. Perhaps coincidence but I am trialing this for one week until I try anything else.

ReefRacer · 03/07/2006, 12:23 PM

I agree with the folks that say too low nutrients and starving. I had the slow growth problem also. My tank was way understocked and I was feeding one strained cube per day. In fact my star polyps wouldn't grow and a spaghetti leather closed for months. The best thing I did was get rid of the calurpa in favor of chaeto and added more bioload.
I would trim the macro way back and feed more- just until you see growth on the glass increase. My .02.
Good luck
Mike

lcheesman · 03/07/2006, 01:16 PM

Thanks Mike,

I don't use a refugium and I don't use Macro algae for nutrient control. I am thinking or utilizing a refugium in the future mainly for it's ability to supply an abundance of Copepods and other microscopic crustaceans. The Macro algae growth which isn't massive is more a minor pain than anything. The glass needs cleaning daily to prevent a minute film building upon it.

I have 2 leathers both Sarcophyton and both growing nicely.

I take on board everything everyone says about nutrients and am currently experimenting with more food.

Happy reefing to you Mike and thank you for your suggestions.

lcheesman · 03/16/2006, 01:01 PM

Errr...

Would 29 centigrade temperatures cause bleaching and or issues with corals?

03/05/2006, 09:57 AM	#1
lcheesman Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 113	Pale Corals Low Growth rates Hello, I have been having problems with pale corals. Thought that the reef chemistry forum may be of some help. I have posted some pics on the below thread. It seems there is a lack of something...Very baffled. http://reefcentral.com/forums/showth...5&pagenumber=2 Any help would be very much appreciated

03/05/2006, 12:05 PM	#4
PatMayo Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Seattle Posts: 2,843	I see nothing wrong with the parameters. You mag is a little high. You should probably target closer to 1350. I don't know if that would cause your problem or not. You might also try making smaller more frequent water changes as well. I didn't see what size your tank was. Mine is a 90 and I do 8 gallon water changes each week. I think that less change at one time to the water chemistry is always better. What about flow could that be an issue? I don't know I'm just throwing ideas out. I hope someone can help. Maybe it's lighting? You may have to experiment to find the real answer. Regards, Pat __________________ 90 AGA Megaflow (Setup 1-24-06) 120 Lbs. Liverock EuroReef RS 100 Skimmer 2 X 150 MH 2 X 96 watt PC Actinic 2 Clarki Clowns (31 months old) 1 Niger Trigger (Owned 6 months) 2 Tunze 6055 PH Current Tank Info: 90 AGA Megaflow To Be Mixed Reef

03/05/2006, 02:30 PM	#7
dandydan Premium Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: UK Posts: 284	I'll put my two penny worth in, As said by well informed others, your ro/DI unit at 4ppm aint the best in the west, whether it has any bearing I dont know, but when mine went to 2 ppm I started seeing diatoms on sand, I replaced the resin and they seemed to clear up. Coincidence or not? This also depends how good your tds meter is of course. __________________ Dan the Man Current Tank Info: 560Ltrs actual, DIY LED lighting, Deltec TC2060 due to NPS

03/05/2006, 03:33 PM	#8
Randy Holmes-Farley Reef Chemist Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Arlington, Massachusetts Posts: 86,233	I see no chemical issues either, although I agree that the DI should be replaced as soon is it rises above 0-1 ppm TDS: Reverse Osmosis/Deionization Systems to Purify Tap Water for Reef Aquaria http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-05/rhf/index.htm Have you seen these actual corals in other tanks to know what they otherwise might look like? Do you know the lighting is suitable to see the more intense colors that you are hoping to see? __________________ Randy Holmes-Farley Current Tank Info: 120 mixed reef

03/05/2006, 03:35 PM	#9
Randy Holmes-Farley Reef Chemist Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Arlington, Massachusetts Posts: 86,233	How did you try to measure phosphate? __________________ Randy Holmes-Farley Current Tank Info: 120 mixed reef

03/05/2006, 10:30 AM	#2
steve the plumb Moved On Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Montreal, Canada Posts: 3,664	why don't you try the sps forum for help.It seems its the tips that are pale.If its the tips this is normal.Its coral growth if its just the tips.You will see it change to normal colours as growth continues.Its hard to tell from the pics

03/05/2006, 11:06 AM	#3
lcheesman Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 113	Hi, It's not growth tips, the corals are pale all over through lack of symbiotic algae for one reason or another. It's the tips that are first to thin in tissue. It's not just the sps either it's all corals. I am looking for perhaps some chemical insight into what could possibly be the cause. Too much of something...to little I don't know. The query started in the coral forum but I thought that perhaps someone may have come across a like situation. It's not bleaching either...I have added new coral frags and they have developed the same problem. It's not just a colour issue either..the corals lack any real vitality and show very low growth rates despite what I see as a suitable set of parameters. These are my parameters. Nitrate unreadable Phosphate unreadable Calcium 440ppm Alk 9.6Dkh Magnesium 1450 silicate 0 salinity 1.026 temperature 26c less than 1c swing now water changes currently 25 gallons every 2 weeks skimmer deltec ap850 2 cups of kent marine carbon The ro di unit is at around 4ppm tds

03/05/2006, 01:31 PM	#5
lcheesman Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 113	Thank you for the suggestions. I'm not sure if mag would cause that either. The tank and sump combined have around 270 gallons so in theory I suppose they are reletively small water changes but perhaps still causing a disruption. Lighting is 3 x 250watt 14k + 2 x 160 watt actinic vho + 2 x 58 watt linear actinic. Flow is 2 x tunze streams @ 12000 lph each I have read that a lack of iron and or nutients would cause the corals to pale, I have some small growths of macro/micro algae and the coralline has realy only just started to grow properly but it is still growing slowly? I do know this though. If I use carbon or polyfilters or turn on low doses of ozone the corals become even more pale and within a week tissue thins considerably?

03/05/2006, 02:08 PM	#6
steve the plumb Moved On Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Montreal, Canada Posts: 3,664	with those paramaters you should be getting coraline.Its not the mag.My levels ac donif lack of iron is the problem.I also dose iodide

03/05/2006, 04:20 PM	#10
lcheesman Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 113	Ok, I will make sure I keep a close eye on the tds in future and get that di cart replaced. The phosphate was measure using the new deltec low range test kit. I've kept corals for quite some time and I know these are not looking no where near their best..and if anything unhealthy. Some of the corals were previously kept in my old aquarium 2 years ago, they looked great then. I'm not particularly bothered about intense colouring. The sps corals at the moment have pale pigmentation and have a very thin tissue coverage in some arreas normally the tips. A branch will die every so often due to this. This is what concerns me. I do know this though. If I use carbon or polyfilters or turn on low doses of ozone the corals become even more pale and within a week tissue thins considerably? I think IMO the lighting should be ok Lighting is 3 x 250watt 14k + 2 x 160 watt actinic vho + 2 x 58 watt linear actinic.

03/05/2006, 07:49 PM	#11
steve the plumb Moved On Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Montreal, Canada Posts: 3,664	How old are your bulbs?I am aslo using 14 k and 10 k bulbs with no problems what so ever.My mag is around 1400.I dose the iron for the calerpa.My tds is around 7 and so far no problems with any corals.I have r/o unit not r/o di.The iodide is for my inverts allthough I use it because the bottle says its good for inverts.I have no clue if the stufff works.It don't understand why using carbon would make your corals lose tips.Carbon is supopossed to clean the water.Do you feed your corals?15 years in the hobby you must be doing something right.Maybe the water from your ro/di isn't as clean as you think.Doesn't makes sense that all your corals fade.Must be some kind of polutent in the water causing a neagative reaction in the pigmintation of the corals.Can copper be leaching into the system via your water.Low levels maybe.I don't know just trying to give an idea.I have not seen this before,I have had some corals discolour in spots but never all.Even your brain looks bad.

03/06/2006, 01:29 AM	#12
lcheesman Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 113	Cheers Steve, I think the best thing I can do at this point is get the di cartridge replaced. After reading the article Randy linked I beleive these di units could be trouble causing a negative effect if their replacement schedule isn't kept up with. Could copper cause this? Are'nt astrea snails highly sensitive to copper as I have around 20 of them. The same ro/di unit was used on my old tank with no tds meter and everything looked great and grew fast. Some observations, I have a gonipora that I have had for 4 years now, growing with full polyp extension everyday, Again, very pale though, Same as the discosoma that were blue, now light purple, a Caulastrea furcata Candy cane that had brown outters and bright green inners, now all light green, a porites that was dark brown to orange now a light Tan, a montipora cap was darl brown/purple now very light brown, a dark green lobophyllia that is now very light greeny/yellow. I have some Briarium sp. green star polyps that I have always known to grow rapidly. They to aren't what I would call growing very well, in 2 years they have only increased about 30% in spread...they hold a bit of colour but not much. Again, the colour is an indication of a problem that I have...not a disire to obtain radio-active colours. Are we looking at something toxic?perhaps copper? Other tan the diatom bloom mentioned by Dandydan has anyone else had visble problems when the tds was reading higher on their ro-di? Oh yes and food - I feed sweetwater, cyclopseez, mysis, formula1 and a few other things all in small amounts

03/06/2006, 07:44 AM	#13
Randy Holmes-Farley Reef Chemist Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Arlington, Massachusetts Posts: 86,233	I do know this though. If I use carbon or polyfilters or turn on low doses of ozone the corals become even more pale and within a week tissue thins considerably? I'm not a coral expert, but it sounds like maybe they are being starved. Perhaps back off a bit on the agressive nutrient control just to see what happens. __________________ Randy Holmes-Farley Current Tank Info: 120 mixed reef

03/06/2006, 09:22 AM	#14
steve the plumb Moved On Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Montreal, Canada Posts: 3,664	I was just trying to make sense of this.I I am wondering why the corals would change colours to a negative pigmintation vs a positive one.Under 20k bulbs my corals changed colours,but they look better vs looking worse.I don't know if you have very low traces of copper its just a thought.I don't know whats wrong with the tank.I feed my corals almost every day.You have a good skimmer so I don't think your water is dirty.Are you over feeding your corals?If you are I would think that the skimmer would pick up the nutrients.There must be something wrong with the water quality maybe the resign.You might want to try buying some r/o water or maybe getting another unit or changing all the filters.I have a crappy 10 gpd coralife unit that I change the filters once a year.My membrane is over 7 years old.My tds is 7-10.I don't have a tds meter wich I think will be my next purchase.My friend had a problem with his ro/di unit.The water quality wasn't the best coming out but yet it was at 10 tds.He noticed that his corals wern't looking the best but none turned pale.The brain isn't a hard coral to keep yet yours is pale.My other friend uses regular tap water crappy lights and his brains are huge they seem to love it.Like I said again must be something in the ro water seems to me you know what you are doing as far as taking care of the corals you have had good results in the past there is no reason you shouldn't have good results in the future.Do you have very old pipes in your house?Do you notice rusty water coming from your taps?Are the pipes old galvanized?

03/06/2006, 12:57 PM	#15
lcheesman Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 113	cor blimey...thanks for that reply Steve..you've really got me thinking now. Pipes are copper pipes in the house. seems to me you know what you are doing as far as taking care of the corals I'd like to think so yes..although I am having doubts after a year and a half of the problem. My other friend uses regular tap water crappy lights and his brains are huge This makes me feel bad, I work so hard to make the environment the best possible...not always got my hands in the tank but you know what I mean. If one small dice size cube a day isn't overfeeding then no..I don't think I am. What sort of reaction would excessive copper cause? Randy, you may be right about the nutrients. The way I see it it is one of two things. Either: There is a contaminent in the ro water or There is a lack of something...which one and what it is, is the challenge.

03/06/2006, 02:03 PM	#16
Randy Holmes-Farley Reef Chemist Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Arlington, Massachusetts Posts: 86,233	What sort of reaction would excessive copper cause? High enough kills inverts. I'm not sure what happens at sub-lethal levels. __________________ Randy Holmes-Farley Current Tank Info: 120 mixed reef

03/06/2006, 02:06 PM	#17
steve the plumb Moved On Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Montreal, Canada Posts: 3,664	You are not feeding that much at all one cube is nothing.What size is your tank?Copper pipes are safe.They are much better than galvanized they don't accumulate rust even if they are old.The only thing that would show rust is your hot water wich you don't use for the fish tank.Even if you had alot of fish your skimmer is a good model it should be able to handle it.

03/06/2006, 02:13 PM	#18
Habib CEO of Salifert Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Holland (Europe) Posts: 19,447	Some observations, I have a gonipora that I have had for 4 years now, growing with full polyp extension everyday, Again, very pale though, Same as the discosoma that were blue, now light purple, a Caulastrea furcata Candy cane that had brown outters and bright green inners, now all light green, a porites that was dark brown to orange now a light Tan, a montipora cap was darl brown/purple now very light brown, a dark green lobophyllia that is now very light greeny/yellow. Sounds like bleaching. There can be many reasons for that. The simplest one to check is temperature. Other causes can be heavy metals, too low nutrients such as phosphate, ammonia/nitrite/nitrate and iron. Not enough flow can also cause bleaching. __________________ Proud owner of the very rare YET (Yellow Elephantis Tang) from the Lord Bibah Islands. "Ice cream, steaks, and Bailey's Irish Cream all help promote healthy immune systems. Why else would I love to naturally eat them packed with fat as they are?" - R. Holmes-Farley, 2012

03/06/2006, 03:15 PM	#19
lcheesman Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 113	Steve, the tank is around 270 gallons total including sump. I have 12 fish and do not see the need to feed anymore than I do...perhaps I should? I'm so surprised I cannot find anyone that has had a similar problem. Habib, Temperature sits at 26c and does not swing by more than 1c. "Other causes can be heavy metals, too low nutrients such as phosphate, ammonia/nitrite/nitrate and iron".???where to start?? I have some micro and macro algae growth, I can't see how I could have extremely low phosphate/nitrate with these growing? Heavy metals seems like it could be a problem I don't think flow is a problem there is plenty of that with tunze streams and 6000lph returns. Iron was my initial thoughts but again, why would I have algae growing?

03/06/2006, 03:46 PM	#20
steve the plumb Moved On Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Montreal, Canada Posts: 3,664	Your tank is pretty big.You are hardly feeding the fish.I feed 3 times that in my 150 gal.I wouldn't worry about feeding some more the fish might be hungry.

03/07/2006, 06:24 AM	#21
Randy Holmes-Farley Reef Chemist Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Arlington, Massachusetts Posts: 86,233	Iron was my initial thoughts but again, why would I have algae growing? I'm not saying this is especially likely to be it, but perhaps they sequester it faster than the corals can get it. In any case, it is easy to dose for a week or two and see what happens. __________________ Randy Holmes-Farley Current Tank Info: 120 mixed reef

03/07/2006, 12:00 PM	#22
lcheesman Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 113	Randy, I like the word sequester...I shall remember to use that one Yes, I will get an iron supplement...perhaps Kent Marine and try that. I have switched off my 2 actinc VHO's Philips 160watt maily because I believe these may be giving off harmful UV radiation. I Still have 2 standard tubes totalling 120watts of actinic. They have been off for one day and I have noticed polyp extension on 2 sps corals that previously had zero. Perhaps coincidence but I am trialing this for one week until I try anything else.

03/07/2006, 12:23 PM	#23
ReefRacer Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Jacksboro, TN Posts: 279	I agree with the folks that say too low nutrients and starving. I had the slow growth problem also. My tank was way understocked and I was feeding one strained cube per day. In fact my star polyps wouldn't grow and a spaghetti leather closed for months. The best thing I did was get rid of the calurpa in favor of chaeto and added more bioload. I would trim the macro way back and feed more- just until you see growth on the glass increase. My .02. Good luck Mike

03/07/2006, 01:16 PM	#24
lcheesman Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 113	Thanks Mike, I don't use a refugium and I don't use Macro algae for nutrient control. I am thinking or utilizing a refugium in the future mainly for it's ability to supply an abundance of Copepods and other microscopic crustaceans. The Macro algae growth which isn't massive is more a minor pain than anything. The glass needs cleaning daily to prevent a minute film building upon it. I have 2 leathers both Sarcophyton and both growing nicely. I take on board everything everyone says about nutrients and am currently experimenting with more food. Happy reefing to you Mike and thank you for your suggestions.

03/16/2006, 01:01 PM	#25
lcheesman Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 113	Errr... Would 29 centigrade temperatures cause bleaching and or issues with corals?