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Unread 11/04/2016, 07:01 AM   #1
peiloy3196
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Bryopsis possible solution

So its been an all out war for me with Bryopsis. Kent worked the first time. After a couple of months the Bryopsis returned. This time the kent did nothing. I got all the way up to 3000 with my mag and held it for weeks. All that it killed was my snails. Since then I have thrown everything at it. Low nutrients (To the point of my SPS's starting to bleach), high salinity, manual removal, Hydrogen Peroxide dosing in the tank, Hydrogen Peroxide Spot dosing in tank, Hydrogen Peroxide Kalk Slurry spot dosing. Nothing phased it and I now had a SW Planted Aquarium. This stuff was everywhere, covered all rock, sand, powerheads, returns and overflow. As a last effort I pulled every rock and sprayed with straight 9% hydrogen peroxide. It all died off and I thought that I won the battle. Two weeks later it came back on all of the rock and sand. I was ready to break down and then read about Fluconazole on another website. I figure what do I have to lose at this point and followed the instructions. Experiences that I found online were limited to a handful of websites in another language which I ran a google translator to understand. Well I am on the last day of the treatment and all Bryopsis has disappeared with no losses of fish or SPS. The true test is to see if it comes back. I don't know if everyone will have the same results that I have had as there is soo little information about it. So if you are going to try please know that there is a risk! I also don't know if it will work long term, but I will update later on.

So this is the method that I used: Fluconazole is a fungus medication and I used a generic named Forcan. On the websites I found two different dosages. One was 9mg/Liter and the other was 150 mg per 30 Liters. As there was so little documentation I erred on the side of caution and used the lower amount of 150 mg per 30 Liters. From what I read it works by blocking the synthesis of ergosterol as explained by Jose Mayo on the websites that I found who I think was the originator of this method. I don't even know what ergosterol is lol, so if anyone who understands this can chime in it would be helpful.

Day 1: I removed all activated Carbon. Removed GFO. Removed my skimmer cup, but kept the skimmer running to keep the water oxygenated. My lights consist of a Super Actinic Reef BML Strip, Four Sets of T5's (2 X Actinic, 1 X Coral Plus, 1 X Blue Plus), and Three 250 W MH Radiums. What I read is that the UV spectrum could break down the medication so I shut off all Led's and T5's. The only lighting I ran for the 15 Days was my Radiums for Six Hours a Day. I dont have a UV but from what I understand if you do it should be shut off. With the dosage of 150 mg / 30 Liters my 250 Gallon system worked out to 32 150mg Tablets. Now the 250 Gallon is not tank and sump volume but rather what I calculated my water volume to be after I catered for rock and sand displacement. I opened each capsule and put the contents of all 32 into a cup. I then mixed this with RO water to dissolve and pored into my sump. I monitored for any adverse reactions with my fish and coral but there were none. Truth be told my SPS had already taken a beating from all the Hydrogen Peroxide and Low Nutrients so I am not sure if they could have looked any worse.

Days 2-4: I did not notice much change but the Bryopsis also was not growing anymore. I also noticed that my tangs and Angels were more interested in picking at the rocks.

Days 5-14: The bryopsis started thinning out. It lost its feathery appearance and became single strands that were light green. I am not sure if they disappeared on their own at this point or were eaten by my fish which as the time went on picked more and more at the rocks. I also had reduced my feeding during the whole 15 Day period feeding every other day. Over this period I actually noticed my SPS starting to rebound, but I imagine that will be a long path to recovery.

Day 15: With all bryopsis gone in the main tank and noticing a few strands in the overflow I did a 20% water change and cleaned out my overflow sterilizing it with Hydrogen Peroxide. I turned back on my carbon and GFO. I also turned back on my T5's and LED's but only have them at 10% (My T5's are dimmable). I will be ramping them back up to full intensity over time as I do not want to light shock the SPS.

Things to Note:
1) I just finished this treatment, so only time will tell if the Bryopsis will return.
2) My Magnesium and Salinity were still high (2900 and 1.029) from previous Bryopsis eradication attempts so I don't know if that helped.
3) A few weeks before this treatment I pulled all rock and sprayed with 9% peroxide which knocked the Bryopsis all the way back. At the time of starting the treatment the Bryopsis was growing back in all areas but was still very short compared to the long flowing mass that it was previous to spraying.

I am not sure if my experience with this will help anyone but I am putting it here in case it can. If you are going to try please know is there is little information out there so it could be a risk.


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Unread 11/04/2016, 11:31 AM   #2
BlackTip
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Thanks for sharing. Please keep us updated with your progress.

I am curious, how many gallons of Kent M did you use to bring your mag to 3000? My total water volume is a bit more than yours (340g), and I used 4 gallon of Kent M to raise Mag to 1900. I used 2 or 3 more gallons to keep it at that level after water changes. I kept it at that level for 3 months. Bryopsis were all gone in the first month, but I kept it high anyway. Two month ago, I let the level of Mag drop down by doing regular water change, and the devil showed its ugly head again.


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Unread 11/04/2016, 11:42 AM   #3
peiloy3196
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackTip View Post
Thanks for sharing. Please keep us updated with your progress.

I am curious, how many gallons of Kent M did you use to bring your mag to 3000? My total water volume is a bit more than yours (340g), and I used 4 gallon of Kent M to raise Mag to 1900. I used 2 or 3 more gallons to keep it at that level after water changes. I kept it at that level for 3 months. Bryopsis were all gone in the first month, but I kept it high anyway. Two month ago, I let the level of Mag drop down by doing regular water change, and the devil showed its ugly head again.
It took me about 6 gallons to raise from 1500 to 3000 and a couple more to hold it there. It was at 1500 from the first time I brought up my mag. The second time around the Bryopsis did not even flinch.


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Unread 11/14/2016, 06:44 AM   #4
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Just a quick update to say that there is still no signs of Bryopsis and all is doing well in the tank.


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Unread 11/30/2016, 11:07 PM   #5
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Any further update? I'm just about ready to either nuke my rocks or try this since nothing else has worked so far...


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Unread 12/01/2016, 03:56 AM   #6
peiloy3196
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I am still free of Bryopsis. So far so good.


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Unread 12/02/2016, 08:16 PM   #7
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There would be a scientific basis for using fluconazole

Fluconazole is also known as Diflucan. Used in the medical field to treat yeast infections. Its mechanism of action is to block the formation of ergosterol in the cell walls. Similar to cholesterol in humans and other animals.

Cholesterol is vital to animals to form cell walls and ergosterol serves the same function in plants and yeasts. So Fluconazole would block the formation of cell walls in plants and fungi effectively killing them.

I would guess the question would be the effective dose. Maybe you have discovered something effective.


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Unread 12/06/2016, 05:26 AM   #8
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Neat to know why it may work. Now if I could just find a source. Maybe also run a small batch test before doing the whole thing...


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Unread 12/06/2016, 04:47 PM   #9
peiloy3196
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gorgok View Post
Neat to know why it may work. Now if I could just find a source. Maybe also run a small batch test before doing the whole thing...
If you do run a test or even do the full thing, take daily photos so that it is documented. I wish I had done it but it was a last ditch all or nothing for me and I really didnt expect it to work.


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Unread 12/14/2016, 03:26 AM   #10
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Bunch of searching makes it clear that you must have a prescription for that stuff... Meh. But with the knowledge of what it does, "block the formation of ergosterol," i searched for stuff that does that (basically things classified as drug class: Ergosterol synthesis inhibitor). Lamisil (Terbinafine) creams would do that, but thats 1% stuff and 99% something else, probably not great in water stuff. And granule or pill versions of that require a prescription again. Ketoconazole also seems to be the same sort of thing, which also requires a prescription, but one search got me to a fish specific version of it by chance, which doesn't need one.

So instead of searching for just the drug name(s), adding fish also seems to have brought up Thomas Labs who seem to actually be legally allowed to produce both Ketoconazole and Fluconazole medication for fish use only, without requiring prescriptions. No idea if either is safer than the other, but at least now there is a source. Will have to setup the test tank now.


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Unread 12/14/2016, 06:58 AM   #11
peiloy3196
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In my country a prescription is not needed for Flucanazole, so I didn't have any issues sourcing it. I am glad you found a source though. Please keep us posted on your findings. Also as an update I am still Bryopsis free.


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Unread 12/27/2016, 01:26 AM   #12
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I got overruled on testing the thing out on small scale instead of just going for it because of the 'long duration' of the treatment. But, so far i am happy enough with the results, nearing 6 days in.

I went for a dose of 1800 mg, into what i estimated as 95 gallons of tank/sump (75 and 40B). So roughly 19mg per gallon, which is just about the 5mg per liter figure. Considering the directions for Fish Flucon calls for 100mg for 5 gallon (20mg/g) it is probably a safe enough dose... Though i am only doing the one dose and letting it sit, not 5 consecutive ones (with partial water changes). Not that they intend it to be used for bryopsis.

I dosed at night, after turning off the skimmer and entirely removing an ATS and setting up the lights to stay off. The lights remained off just that first day, as i don't actually think much UV passes through the T5s... I put in some socks on the main drain as well to catch dieoff, and so far they have caught quite a bit of debris, on the 3rd sock in 6 days (well in ~4 hours more it will be).

I took only one picture before, and didn't look at it until now. Its pretty bad quality... But the tank was pretty bad too. Dosed some hours after this.


Same spot, Sunday daytime(~4.5 days in). I hadn't touched that spot manually at all. I did a bunch of other areas that are easier to reach. Same algae film on the glass too, which i removed today as i finally saw a reason to do so... It looks better now, but i forgot to take a picture today.


That heliopora is a trooper. It has been covered and 'rescued' all the time over this battle (honestly not sure how long it has been, a year or so at least). Still growing. It actually seems to have killed some of the stuff just encrusting over.

The only things that don't seem so happy are a pair of clowns that had begun to reside in a huge swaying mass of the stuff on one of the taller rocks. There are just a few sickly strands left and they keep trying to push back into it... But then again clowns never look happy with their frowny faces. Hopefully in another ~10 days this stuff will be utterly destroyed and they can get a proper host.



Last edited by Gorgok; 12/27/2016 at 01:33 AM.
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Unread 12/27/2016, 06:23 AM   #13
peiloy3196
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I'm glad that things are working for you. Did you shut off the skimmer completely or just remove the cup?


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Unread 12/27/2016, 04:41 PM   #14
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I shut it down completely. With only 5 fish and a large overflow with high turnover im not worried about oxygen. Stocking wise the tank has been on hold for about a year to try and deal with this garbage. Finally see some light.

Looking better and better. This is 6.5 days or so.


I haven't tested my mag recently, and have done a water change or two (before this) since i was last keeping it high, but i imagine it will be close to 2000 still. I will test today.

I didn't pull any rocks and spot treat or such before this. I have plucked at some of the heavier spots and just ripped masses out of the tank. But that is just reducing mass not killing roots. All the killing power is just from this treatment.

I do have enough of the stuff to do a second round should that be the case, but so far that seems unlikely.


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Unread 12/27/2016, 04:43 PM   #15
peiloy3196
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I am glad it is working for you too! Bryopsis almost killed the hobby for me and ever since doing the treatment I am finally able to enjoy my tank.


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Unread 12/29/2016, 07:44 PM   #16
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Mag tested at around 1800 or so, so its not really high, nor as high as i expected. But that just means the mag, which didn't do anything to this problem, wasn't part of the final solution either. Its all down to this Fluconazole.

Yesterday, day 7.


Today, day 8. That chiton is in no hurry it seems...


Still see some short fuzz around, but even in these two pictures it does seem to be receding. Maybe its just a hopeful view though.


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Unread 12/29/2016, 07:53 PM   #17
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Bryopsis made me restart my tank. It killed all my coral.


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Unread 12/31/2016, 06:07 PM   #18
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Yesterday, day 9. I'd say the little fuzz is also disappearing. Honestly this treatment almost seems like magic. Put it in and wait and its all gone...


Today, day 10.



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Unread 12/31/2016, 06:22 PM   #19
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Alright I'm gonna try this. I have a small test tank where I got Mag up to 2500+ and the Bryopsis didn't care so lets see if this works.

Did you dose using the Fish Flucon product or source it somewhere else?


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Unread 12/31/2016, 08:04 PM   #20
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So this will kill all algae correct if i was reading right, I'll keep an eye on this as i have some bryopsis aswell going wild in my tank


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Unread 12/31/2016, 09:13 PM   #21
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I am not sure if it will kill all algae, but it definitely worked on my Bry. I am still free of it.


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Unread 01/01/2017, 09:57 PM   #22
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I asked cuz i use an ats for filtration, so i might cut Gfo and carbon and try this with the scrubber online and see if it kills everything or not. That will pretty mich definitively answer that question.

Curious if this will effect coral at all? I have some higher end sps stuff id hate to lose. But i guess I might try it since my bryopsis keeps spreading at this point.

Thanks for the Thomas labs link.

Well after reading more it effects all algae, so ill shut down the scrubber too i guess.

I don't have a huge outbreak but its on the fringe if being an issue. Thanks for this, you should consider posting this in the chemistry forum aswell.


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Unread 01/02/2017, 07:12 AM   #23
peiloy3196
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atraperegrinus View Post
I asked cuz i use an ats for filtration, so i might cut Gfo and carbon and try this with the scrubber online and see if it kills everything or not. That will pretty mich definitively answer that question.

Curious if this will effect coral at all? I have some higher end sps stuff id hate to lose. But i guess I might try it since my bryopsis keeps spreading at this point.

Thanks for the Thomas labs link.

Well after reading more it effects all algae, so ill shut down the scrubber too i guess.

I don't have a huge outbreak but its on the fringe if being an issue. Thanks for this, you should consider posting this in the chemistry forum aswell.


Yeah I definitely wouldn't risk the scrubber while running this. I also have high end SPS. My Bry was so bad that I lost some pieces and was losing others. This treatment was a savior for me. From the day of dosing it none of my SPS got any worse, and within a few days I could actually see a difference with some of them starting to rebound.


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Unread 01/02/2017, 08:03 AM   #24
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I didn't realize how expensive those tablets were. Comparing to our tanks it's a drop in the bucket, but still...pricey.


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Unread 01/02/2017, 08:06 AM   #25
peiloy3196
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Quote:
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I didn't realize how expensive those tablets were. Comparing to our tanks it's a drop in the bucket, but still...pricey.


I know it seems expensive but compared to what I spent trying to eradicate Bryopsis, loses of SPS, months of heavy maintenance in trying to eradicate and months of hating my tank because of it all, for me it was a drop in the bucket.


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