Melev's new 280g Starfire tank thread - Page 32

TCU Reefer · 04/04/2007, 09:29 PM

Sounds good.

Hopefully it will keep growing at a rapid pace and we can clip a frag for you real soon.

So is the whole piece toast?

I guess it's a good thing you knocked off a tip of it that day.

melev · 04/04/2007, 09:36 PM

It is pretty much dwindling away, and I just don't think trimming off the final 1/4" tips will do a thing at this point.

raddogz · 04/04/2007, 10:18 PM

Wow - mystery disease w/the Tyree piece.

I guess I better start taking my frags of my bigger colonies a little more serious as anything can happen these days.

davidryder · 04/05/2007, 12:49 AM

Any progress on the sliding canopy?

Here is what I imagine:

Have you already determined something like that to not work?

melev · 04/05/2007, 12:56 AM

You have the basic idea. However, I don't have any wall to connect the two rectangular (keyboard slides) areas to, except at the very top. That isn't going work.

Instead, I'm pretty much planning to run lagbolts through the columns into the ends of the canopy, and the lagbolt will slide up and down in a vertical groove. That's what I think will work. I'm a bit nervous to try it, but eventually I'll just let the sawdust fly and see what happens.

davidryder · 04/05/2007, 01:04 AM

Ah I see... give it a shot, what's the worst that could happen?

davidryder · 04/05/2007, 01:06 AM

Actually, would it be possible to attach 2 2x4s to extend down to give you the medium to attach the slides to?

melev · 04/05/2007, 01:08 AM

No, because that would put them in the way. My main goal is clearance with nothing in the way when working in the tank.

davidryder · 04/05/2007, 01:22 AM

Right! Hmmm....

Would that still get in the way? It would repeat on the opposite end.

The bar that is labeled 'attached here' would move with the canopy as it would be attached to it. A cable could then be attached to the end of that bar then ran through an eyelet or pulley to your weight...

melev · 04/05/2007, 01:31 AM

That is an interesting thought. I'll have to mull it over.

Maybe an L shape so the bar can't get loose and begin to bend upward on the end where the cable connects.

davidryder · 04/05/2007, 01:47 AM

It would definitely take some thought on how to attach it securely but it might save some effort and cutting...

Here is a similar beam I was imagining:

I'm looking at the vertical material on the left.

That way you could use bolts to fasten it to the cable, and it certainly woudn't bend. There are variations of that frame material, but I had a hard time finding even that photo. There is building material without that base material on the bottom...

melev · 04/05/2007, 08:00 PM

That looks pretty hefty and a tad bulky but I understand the concept you're trying to explain. Thanks!

melev · 04/05/2007, 09:27 PM

While making some minor tweaks tonight, I thought I better test Alkalinity as that was the one test I omitted last week. Currently it is 9.9 dKH And this was with a brand new test kit as my old kit was several years old (hate to waste it if it isn't used up yet, but oh well).

So why are some of my corals unhappy, like the Tyree? I figured I better check the calibration of the refractometer next. A couple of years ago, Habib from Salifert was giving out calibration solution, and I still had a bottle that was unopened. After calibration, it appears my reef is at 1.022 sg currently, which is much lower than I prefer. So I mixed up some saltwater (4 cups : 5g) tonight and added it to the reef instead of using RO/DI to top off. I'll just do this every couple of days to bring the salinity up to where it needs to be. I wonder if the lowered salinity was the problem all along.

I also put a couple of drops of RO/DI on the refractometer to see what it read and got a reading of 0.

kendog261 · 04/08/2007, 06:28 PM

Glad to see the wood work coming along looks great.

I am re doing my sump/refugium and was wondering how deep do you recommend the sand to be in it. Also do you have any critters in your refugium?

kendog261 · 04/08/2007, 06:28 PM

Glad to see the wood work coming along looks great.

I am re doing my sump/refugium and was wondering how deep do you recommend the sand to be in it. Also do you have any critters in your refugium?

kendog261 · 04/08/2007, 06:29 PM

thats blows I just had my first double post

melev · 04/08/2007, 07:58 PM

For the refugium, I usually just suggest about 1" of sand so there is room for the macro algae to grow. A shallow sandbed leaves room for pods, worms and more to live and breed.

My refugium has some snails in it and whatever snuck down there. It is mostly just macro algae, and a lot of (now useless) rock rubble. If it has algae attached to it, I can't use it in my reef because I don't want that spreading into the reef display.

melev · 04/08/2007, 11:08 PM

Update - treated for Red Bugs again last night. I was supposed to do it a week sooner, but didn't have the time or inclination. So there was a 14 day period between the first dosing and the second one. If any survivors were running about, they've had some time to grow larger. And hopefully die last night.

The salinity is up to 1.025sg as of tonight, and I poured in another bucket of saltwater to replace the evaporation from today. That should push it up to 1.026 as of tomorrow morning.

My refugium is full or cyano bacteria yet again. All I feed is Cyclop-eeze, Mini-Mysis, and Blood Worms each evening. Nori every other day, and that would be 1/2 sheet for the tangs to devour in about 5 minutes. Maybe the refugium bulbs are too old, as they've got to be about a year old now. Regardless, I hate cyano about as much as drywalling.

I'll probably treat with Chemi Clean or Red Slime Control soon.

After reading AquaBucket's thread about leaving the tank dark for three days, it got me thinking about trying it out as well. My tank grows this ugly brown stuff on the glass instead of the common green stuff many of us remove via cleaning magnets each day. If left unchecked, it covers more and more of the glass and bubbles begin to form. Ugh. Scraping the back glass, overflows and side panels as well as cleaning the front glass lets the skimmer export that vile stuff. I'm thinking the lights-out cycle might just resolve the problem without chemical intervention. I may try this out next week, once the tank is more stable.

And then this is something I'm considering....

My current lighting period is from 11:15am to 10:00pm. That seems rather long, and I'm thinking about staggering my lights more than 15 minutes apart. This is how it is now:

11:15am - MH1 On
11:30am - MH2 On
11:45am - MH3 On
12:00pm - VHO On

9:00pm - MH1 Off
9:15pm - MH2 Off
9:30pm - MH3 Off
10:00pm - VHO Off

What I'm leaning toward is 6 to 7 hour periods for the MH bulbs.

VHO - 12:00pm to 10:00pm
MH1 - 11:45am to 6:45pm
MH2 - 1:30pm to 8:00pm
MH3 - 3:00pm to 9:30pm

This way the tank would be fully lit from 1:30pm to 8pm daily. (It used to be lit 11 hours with all bulbs.) By staggering the lights, it simulates the sun moving across the sky more and still creates a heat-of-the-day period.

I think that photosynthesis will be fine with the shorter lighting period because of the way the light overlaps neighboring zones. It is less of a burden on the corals dealing with so much light for so long, and there should be enough time for the coral to process sugars for growth. A few benefits that jump to mind is less electricity consumption during the summer months, less time on the bulbs so they should last longer (PAR-wise), less heat in the fish room so the window a/c doesn't have to work as hard, and hopefully still a beautiful reef to enjoy.

Hop · 04/08/2007, 11:12 PM

Quote:

My tank grows this ugly brown stuff on the glass instead of the common green stuff many of us remove via cleaning magnets each day. If left unchecked, it covers more and more of the glass and bubbles begin to form.

My tank did this right about the time dinos formed. It never really went away, even after the dinos receded. I wonder if it's related? Probably not, but it may be something I'll watch for when I set things back up. So far in the 125 I'm only getting a light green haze and coraline, so I can't use it as a gauge

melev · 04/08/2007, 11:17 PM

See, that is what I think is happening. I think dinoflagellates are in the system, and are trying to take over. I'm trying to keep them at bay. I just tested my tank for Organics (Salifert kit) and they tested "very low" (or 1 drop which is perfect). Nitrates are less than 5ppm, PO4 is .03, carbon is replaced often and water clarity is awesome. The skimmer is doing a great job pulling crap out. Yesterday it got gutsy and collected over a gallon of skimmate overnight. Usually I get about a quart of skimmate daily.

Hop · 04/08/2007, 11:49 PM

I hope that's not the case!

Not sure if it helps, but when mine were first starting to take root, I noticed a slight brown, green fuzz on the back pane. I tried to keep that cleaned off and then I noticed a green/brown fuzzy slime growing in low flow areas deep in the holes on the undersides/low light areas of the rock. After that it took about a week and then it was covering my rocks and it was then easily identified, although being pretty new still I had no idea what it was. Didn't care as I thought it was part of the new tank algae phases. Thank goodness I didn't have any SPS at the time, it would have wiped it out.

I noticed that water changes only fueled the growth and a salt mix specialized for "reef" only fueled the problem. Time, reduced lighting period and zero water changes for nearly ten weeks while I was away, nipped the problem. Wish I could be more helpful, but I was so busy then that every thing took care of itself for the most part.

Last time I read about dinos, there was research in regards to higher, stabilized pH values, but I think that the 3 day blackout may work well. I have used the blackout method on FW planted tanks for years with success.

Aquabucket · 04/08/2007, 11:57 PM

Marc,

I would be highly surprised if your dinos are there after the 3 day blackout. You will also want to run a fair amount of activated carbon during the blackout. When I first started treating dinos in my tank It was with Maracyn. An old timer recommonded I try it and said to leave the lights off for three days and add an airstone to keep O2 levels up.

The Maracyn kind of left my corals in a bit of a funk and the tank was a little milky but the dinos were gone. Too bad they came back a couple of months later. After reading more about the merits of using Maracyn and the need for dinos to feed off light I decided to try the 3 day black-out without the Maracyn and they never appeared again. What was really different this time though was the stunning clarity of my water and how well my corals responded afterwards.

I have have also discovered that in my system a 3 day black out period will annihilate diatoms and keep them away for extended periods of time.

I would not even hesitate to go 4 days if I had a serious problem with dinos again.

Good luck and I hope you see positive results!

melev · 04/09/2007, 01:20 AM

Thanks for the input so far.

kwaters · 04/09/2007, 01:38 AM

Marc,

I just noticed that you have "professional stripper" as your occupation...do you do that while working on tanks? LOL

Kris

bleedingthought · 04/09/2007, 04:39 AM

Marc, have you tried increasing the internal flow in your fuge? Mine used to gather up a lot of cyano but now it is clean since I redid things and made sure that there's not too much flow going through it, just a good bit of flow inside of it to keep things moving. But also, I only use chaetomorpha as a macroalgae. HTH

04/04/2007, 09:29 PM	#776
TCU Reefer Premium Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Fort Worth, TX Posts: 1,044	Sounds good. Hopefully it will keep growing at a rapid pace and we can clip a frag for you real soon. So is the whole piece toast? I guess it's a good thing you knocked off a tip of it that day. __________________ Steve - DFWMAS Member Click on the red house to view my build thread Current Tank Info: 215g starboard SPS in-wall, AC Jr, 3 x 250w MH's, 10k Reeflux, 320w VHO actinics, closed loop w/ Sequence Dart and OM 4-Way, Tunze wavebox, VorTech, 2x modded MJ 1200's, ASM G4 recirc/meshwheel, Geo 618 Ca reactor, custom Melev sump, Mag 9.5 return Last edited by TCU Reefer; 04/04/2007 at 09:40 PM.

04/04/2007, 10:18 PM	#778
raddogz Premium Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Bay Area Posts: 3,167	Wow - mystery disease w/the Tyree piece. I guess I better start taking my frags of my bigger colonies a little more serious as anything can happen these days. __________________ Eileen If at first you don't succeed, failure may be your style. - Quentin Crisp Current Tank Info: 180g Reef

04/05/2007, 12:49 AM	#779
davidryder Claris or Elliot? Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Nightopia Posts: 2,750	Any progress on the sliding canopy? Here is what I imagine: Have you already determined something like that to not work? __________________ A rolling stone gathers no moss... Current Tank Info: 90g mixed reef, corner overflow (Mag 9.5), 25g refugium (Mag 5), 15g refugium, Orbit 260w pc, Pan World 50PX-X (Closed loop), AquaC EV-120 (now skimmerless)

04/05/2007, 01:04 AM	#781
davidryder Claris or Elliot? Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Nightopia Posts: 2,750	Ah I see... give it a shot, what's the worst that could happen? __________________ A rolling stone gathers no moss... Current Tank Info: 90g mixed reef, corner overflow (Mag 9.5), 25g refugium (Mag 5), 15g refugium, Orbit 260w pc, Pan World 50PX-X (Closed loop), AquaC EV-120 (now skimmerless)

04/05/2007, 01:06 AM	#782
davidryder Claris or Elliot? Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Nightopia Posts: 2,750	Actually, would it be possible to attach 2 2x4s to extend down to give you the medium to attach the slides to? __________________ A rolling stone gathers no moss... Current Tank Info: 90g mixed reef, corner overflow (Mag 9.5), 25g refugium (Mag 5), 15g refugium, Orbit 260w pc, Pan World 50PX-X (Closed loop), AquaC EV-120 (now skimmerless)

04/04/2007, 09:36 PM	#777
melev Moved On Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Ft Worth, Tx Posts: 43,217	It is pretty much dwindling away, and I just don't think trimming off the final 1/4" tips will do a thing at this point.

04/05/2007, 12:56 AM	#780
melev Moved On Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Ft Worth, Tx Posts: 43,217	You have the basic idea. However, I don't have any wall to connect the two rectangular (keyboard slides) areas to, except at the very top. That isn't going work. Instead, I'm pretty much planning to run lagbolts through the columns into the ends of the canopy, and the lagbolt will slide up and down in a vertical groove. That's what I think will work. I'm a bit nervous to try it, but eventually I'll just let the sawdust fly and see what happens.

04/05/2007, 01:08 AM	#783
melev Moved On Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Ft Worth, Tx Posts: 43,217	No, because that would put them in the way. My main goal is clearance with nothing in the way when working in the tank.

04/05/2007, 01:22 AM	#784
davidryder Claris or Elliot? Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Nightopia Posts: 2,750	Right! Hmmm.... Would that still get in the way? It would repeat on the opposite end. The bar that is labeled 'attached here' would move with the canopy as it would be attached to it. A cable could then be attached to the end of that bar then ran through an eyelet or pulley to your weight... __________________ A rolling stone gathers no moss... Current Tank Info: 90g mixed reef, corner overflow (Mag 9.5), 25g refugium (Mag 5), 15g refugium, Orbit 260w pc, Pan World 50PX-X (Closed loop), AquaC EV-120 (now skimmerless)

04/05/2007, 01:31 AM	#785
melev Moved On Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Ft Worth, Tx Posts: 43,217	That is an interesting thought. I'll have to mull it over. Maybe an L shape so the bar can't get loose and begin to bend upward on the end where the cable connects.

04/05/2007, 01:47 AM	#786
davidryder Claris or Elliot? Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Nightopia Posts: 2,750	It would definitely take some thought on how to attach it securely but it might save some effort and cutting... Here is a similar beam I was imagining: I'm looking at the vertical material on the left. That way you could use bolts to fasten it to the cable, and it certainly woudn't bend. There are variations of that frame material, but I had a hard time finding even that photo. There is building material without that base material on the bottom... __________________ A rolling stone gathers no moss... Current Tank Info: 90g mixed reef, corner overflow (Mag 9.5), 25g refugium (Mag 5), 15g refugium, Orbit 260w pc, Pan World 50PX-X (Closed loop), AquaC EV-120 (now skimmerless)

04/05/2007, 08:00 PM	#787
melev Moved On Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Ft Worth, Tx Posts: 43,217	That looks pretty hefty and a tad bulky but I understand the concept you're trying to explain. Thanks!

04/05/2007, 09:27 PM	#788
melev Moved On Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Ft Worth, Tx Posts: 43,217	While making some minor tweaks tonight, I thought I better test Alkalinity as that was the one test I omitted last week. Currently it is 9.9 dKH And this was with a brand new test kit as my old kit was several years old (hate to waste it if it isn't used up yet, but oh well). So why are some of my corals unhappy, like the Tyree? I figured I better check the calibration of the refractometer next. A couple of years ago, Habib from Salifert was giving out calibration solution, and I still had a bottle that was unopened. After calibration, it appears my reef is at 1.022 sg currently, which is much lower than I prefer. So I mixed up some saltwater (4 cups : 5g) tonight and added it to the reef instead of using RO/DI to top off. I'll just do this every couple of days to bring the salinity up to where it needs to be. I wonder if the lowered salinity was the problem all along. I also put a couple of drops of RO/DI on the refractometer to see what it read and got a reading of 0.

04/08/2007, 06:28 PM	#789
kendog261 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Bothell, Wa. Posts: 73	Glad to see the wood work coming along looks great. I am re doing my sump/refugium and was wondering how deep do you recommend the sand to be in it. Also do you have any critters in your refugium?

04/08/2007, 06:28 PM	#790
kendog261 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Bothell, Wa. Posts: 73	Glad to see the wood work coming along looks great. I am re doing my sump/refugium and was wondering how deep do you recommend the sand to be in it. Also do you have any critters in your refugium?

04/08/2007, 06:29 PM	#791
kendog261 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Bothell, Wa. Posts: 73	thats blows I just had my first double post

04/08/2007, 07:58 PM	#792
melev Moved On Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Ft Worth, Tx Posts: 43,217	For the refugium, I usually just suggest about 1" of sand so there is room for the macro algae to grow. A shallow sandbed leaves room for pods, worms and more to live and breed. My refugium has some snails in it and whatever snuck down there. It is mostly just macro algae, and a lot of (now useless) rock rubble. If it has algae attached to it, I can't use it in my reef because I don't want that spreading into the reef display.

04/08/2007, 11:17 PM	#795
melev Moved On Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Ft Worth, Tx Posts: 43,217	See, that is what I think is happening. I think dinoflagellates are in the system, and are trying to take over. I'm trying to keep them at bay. I just tested my tank for Organics (Salifert kit) and they tested "very low" (or 1 drop which is perfect). Nitrates are less than 5ppm, PO4 is .03, carbon is replaced often and water clarity is awesome. The skimmer is doing a great job pulling crap out. Yesterday it got gutsy and collected over a gallon of skimmate overnight. Usually I get about a quart of skimmate daily.

04/08/2007, 11:49 PM	#796
Hop Carpe Noctem!!! Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Western Colorado Posts: 8,548	I hope that's not the case! Not sure if it helps, but when mine were first starting to take root, I noticed a slight brown, green fuzz on the back pane. I tried to keep that cleaned off and then I noticed a green/brown fuzzy slime growing in low flow areas deep in the holes on the undersides/low light areas of the rock. After that it took about a week and then it was covering my rocks and it was then easily identified, although being pretty new still I had no idea what it was. Didn't care as I thought it was part of the new tank algae phases. Thank goodness I didn't have any SPS at the time, it would have wiped it out. I noticed that water changes only fueled the growth and a salt mix specialized for "reef" only fueled the problem. Time, reduced lighting period and zero water changes for nearly ten weeks while I was away, nipped the problem. Wish I could be more helpful, but I was so busy then that every thing took care of itself for the most part. Last time I read about dinos, there was research in regards to higher, stabilized pH values, but I think that the 3 day blackout may work well. I have used the blackout method on FW planted tanks for years with success. __________________ Hop Current Tank Info: 300-gallon in-wall system (mixed reef)

04/08/2007, 11:57 PM	#797
Aquabucket Premium Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Green Bay, Wi. Posts: 4,455	Marc, I would be highly surprised if your dinos are there after the 3 day blackout. You will also want to run a fair amount of activated carbon during the blackout. When I first started treating dinos in my tank It was with Maracyn. An old timer recommonded I try it and said to leave the lights off for three days and add an airstone to keep O2 levels up. The Maracyn kind of left my corals in a bit of a funk and the tank was a little milky but the dinos were gone. Too bad they came back a couple of months later. After reading more about the merits of using Maracyn and the need for dinos to feed off light I decided to try the 3 day black-out without the Maracyn and they never appeared again. What was really different this time though was the stunning clarity of my water and how well my corals responded afterwards. I have have also discovered that in my system a 3 day black out period will annihilate diatoms and keep them away for extended periods of time. I would not even hesitate to go 4 days if I had a serious problem with dinos again. Good luck and I hope you see positive results! __________________ "Just a drop in the bucket" Last edited by Aquabucket; 04/09/2007 at 12:23 AM.

04/09/2007, 01:20 AM	#798
melev Moved On Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Ft Worth, Tx Posts: 43,217	Thanks for the input so far.

04/09/2007, 01:38 AM	#799
kwaters Premium Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Newberg, Oregon Posts: 364	Marc, I just noticed that you have "professional stripper" as your occupation...do you do that while working on tanks? LOL Kris __________________ Pacific North West Marine Aquarium Society (PNWMAS)-Secretary Kris Waters Current Tank Info: 110 gallon tall

04/09/2007, 04:39 AM	#800
bleedingthought Registered Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Acworth, GA Posts: 422	Marc, have you tried increasing the internal flow in your fuge? Mine used to gather up a lot of cyano but now it is clean since I redid things and made sure that there's not too much flow going through it, just a good bit of flow inside of it to keep things moving. But also, I only use chaetomorpha as a macroalgae. HTH __________________ -Thiago-