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Unread 06/15/2016, 11:20 PM   #1
johnfallon135
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breeding clown fish questions!

1. my friend just got a mated pair of clown fish and was hoping on any tips on what to do? he has a side 20 gallon tank should he leave the parents in his main display tank then take the eggs out to the 20 gallon after or could he leave the parents in the 20 gallon with the eggs? will the parents eat their eggs?

2. also how long does it take for the eggs to hatch? 7 days? anything he should do in the mean time?

3. finally he just has a regular ocellaris mating pair. does having a designer clown mating pair increase the chance for more designers?

thanks.


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Unread 06/16/2016, 02:06 AM   #2
farfromsea
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Can't really answer most of your questions properly except the last one... so wit many of the "designer" clownfish they are just the result of mutations during development although some of them are purposeful crosses of one "color" with another.

Look at this info on the Picasso for example: http://www.orafarm.com/product/premi...sso-clownfish/ even when they breed 2 picassos although some of the offspring look like Picassos, most of them just look like "regular" clownfish!

I think it is safe to say in your case your friend will just be getting a lot of regular clowns and if he is lucky a few mutated ones with color variations, but the chance of that is pretty low IMO. If designer clowns is the goal I would either (a) get designers after reading carefully how they were made to make sure you have the correct pair or (b) just cross your fingers and hope you get some funny looking ones you can mate later on for the next generation

best of luck!


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Unread 06/16/2016, 02:30 AM   #3
ThRoewer
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Leave the parents in the DT and let them care for the eggs - if they eat them they had usually gone bad - or you didn't feed your fish enough.

After about 7 to 9 days, when the yolk is almost gone and the eyes are very silvery the larva are ready to hatch. At this point you take the eggs out and transfer them to the larva tank. Ideally you convince the fish to lay the eggs on a small rock or ceramic shard that you can easily remove. Best is usually to give them a ceramic flowerpot - clownfish love them as anemone surrogates and like to put their eggs on the inside.

Unfortunately much of the offspring of designer clowns is not culled like it should be (ideally the "good" designer offspring should also be culled together with the parents), but rather sold as regular clowns to further pollute the gene pool.


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Unread 06/16/2016, 02:41 AM   #4
johnfallon135
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thanks is there anything i should know when taking them out? i dont' want to put a pot in my display tank if they lay the eggs on my live rock can i just scrape them off? also is there anything i should know when putting them in the other tank? should i turn off my powerheads or skimmer? if you're saying take them out 7-9 days then they should hatch the next day in the other tank right?


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Unread 06/16/2016, 03:01 AM   #5
ThRoewer
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No scraping off! That will destroy the eggs. Best is to place a smooth rock or a piece of a ceramic where they usually lay their eggs.
Transfer the eggs the night before the hatch with water from the parents tank to the larva tank. Best is to keep a journal and let the firs few nests go. This way you can figure out how long it takes and will know the next time when to take the eggs out.
Alternatively you could use a larva catcher and try to get some of the larva out of the tank before they get eaten or chopped up by the pumps.


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Pairs: 4 percula, 3 P. kauderni, 3 D. excisus, 1 ea of P. diacanthus, S. splendidus, C. altivelis O. rosenblatti, D. janssi, S. yasha & a Gramma loreto trio
3 P. diacanthus. 2 C. starcki

Current Tank Info: 200 gal 4 tank system (40x28x24 + 40B + 40B sump tank + 20g refugium) + 30x18x18 mixed reef + 20g East Pacific biotop + 20g FW +...
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Unread 06/16/2016, 03:09 AM   #6
johnfallon135
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could i have a skimmer and powerheads running on low of course on the other tank? how many eggs do parents usually have and what's the success rate usually? 20%?


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Unread 06/16/2016, 03:11 AM   #7
johnfallon135
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how successful are larva catchers?


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Unread 06/16/2016, 03:18 AM   #8
johnfallon135
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also what do you feed the babies? do i have to feed them phyto plankton?


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Unread 06/16/2016, 09:54 AM   #9
ThRoewer
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I haven't tried larvae catchers but rather collected them manually with a scoop and a flashlight. That works pretty well, only downside is that you have to say up at night and wait for the eggs to hatch.

To raise the larvae you will need a good amount of rotifers. If you don't have a good and productive culture going, I wouldn't bother to collect any larvae and rather get the food cultures going first.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk


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Pairs: 4 percula, 3 P. kauderni, 3 D. excisus, 1 ea of P. diacanthus, S. splendidus, C. altivelis O. rosenblatti, D. janssi, S. yasha & a Gramma loreto trio
3 P. diacanthus. 2 C. starcki

Current Tank Info: 200 gal 4 tank system (40x28x24 + 40B + 40B sump tank + 20g refugium) + 30x18x18 mixed reef + 20g East Pacific biotop + 20g FW +...
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Unread 06/16/2016, 11:20 AM   #10
D-Nak
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Most of your questions can be answered here:

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=86


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Unread 07/06/2016, 12:31 PM   #11
johnfallon135
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In the clown hatchling tank there should be nothing but a airline tube and heater right? Could I have live rock to help with the ammonia and nitrates? How fast will I have to water change a batch of hatchlings in a 10 gallon tank?


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Unread 08/09/2016, 10:39 AM   #12
hbrochs
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Read

Google "Pickle's Clownfish breeding thread"

This will answer all of your questions.

Howard


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Unread 12/10/2018, 12:24 AM   #13
johnfallon135
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2 years later i've read his article lol however he doesn't explain why he doesn't use any live rock in his initial fry tank? i understand he wants a empty tank to clean it easier from ammonia build up but live rock can only help, no?


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Unread 12/10/2018, 12:41 PM   #14
Uncle99
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Make sure you have plenty of Rotifers, gut loaded with phyto and Selcon.
You need this as a first food, I usually start to ween onto pulverized flake in 10 ish days


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Unread 12/10/2018, 12:44 PM   #15
Uncle99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnfallon135 View Post
2 years later i've read his article lol however he doesn't explain why he doesn't use any live rock in his initial fry tank? i understand he wants a empty tank to clean it easier from ammonia build up but live rock can only help, no?
No, live rock just gets in the way, regular water refreshes is easier.
It's just a rearing tank, after metamorph, can be transferred to a holding tank.


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Unread 12/10/2018, 01:30 PM   #16
D-Nak
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Not to mention that it's hard to have "clean" live rock. You want the larval system as clean as possible including not having little nasties that could come on the live rock -- parasitic protozoans, hydra, etc.


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Unread 12/11/2018, 01:11 AM   #17
johnfallon135
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so how often are water changes needed since there are no live rock? daily 20% after the first few days or so?


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Unread 12/11/2018, 01:13 AM   #18
johnfallon135
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle99 View Post
Make sure you have plenty of Rotifers, gut loaded with phyto and Selcon.
You need this as a first food, I usually start to ween onto pulverized flake in 10 ish days
could i use any flake and pulverize it? cause any other alternatives seems very pricey especially this,

https://jaysclownfish.com/products/tdo-chroma-boost-b2


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Unread 12/11/2018, 01:18 AM   #19
johnfallon135
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also why are breeding tanks better wider and not taller? is it a aeration advantage or is it space?


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Unread 12/18/2018, 12:51 PM   #20
zeeter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnfallon135 View Post
could i use any flake and pulverize it? cause any other alternatives seems very pricey especially this,

https://jaysclownfish.com/products/tdo-chroma-boost-b2
No. There have been very few successful cases of feeding crushed flake to fry. Rotifers are also very difficult to maintain without a concerted effort. They basically eat and poop, thus giving off a ton of ammonia. This means frequent water changes.

Edit: In addition, the heater in the fry tank needs to be completely wrapped in electrical tape so the light doesn't shine through. The fry will be attracted to the light and burn themselves up - adding to the bio-load.

Even if given a proper amount of rotifers they need to live through metamorphosis. Giving them a near perfect rearing as fry will increase their chance, but expect some die-off.

Then you need to start feeding them live brine shrimp.

IMHO, if you're not doing this for a business it's not worth the trouble.


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Unread 12/18/2018, 01:43 PM   #21
D-Nak
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No. There have been very few successful cases of feeding crushed flake to fry. Rotifers are also very difficult to maintain without a concerted effort. They basically eat and poop, thus giving off a ton of ammonia. This means frequent water changes.

Edit: In addition, the heater in the fry tank needs to be completely wrapped in electrical tape so the light doesn't shine through. The fry will be attracted to the light and burn themselves up - adding to the bio-load.

Even if given a proper amount of rotifers they need to live through metamorphosis. Giving them a near perfect rearing as fry will increase their chance, but expect some die-off.

Then you need to start feeding them live brine shrimp.

IMHO, if you're not doing this for a business it's not worth the trouble.
This.

The hardest part of rearing the fry is the first couple of weeks where rotifers are required. If it wasn't somewhat difficult, then everyone would be raising clowns and they would be as cheap as freshwater guppies.


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Unread 12/19/2018, 09:21 AM   #22
shred5
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I highly suggest this book:
Clownfishes: A Guide to Their Captive Care, Breeding & Natural History
by Joyce D. Wilkerson

It was my bible when breeding clownfish.


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Unread 12/19/2018, 09:29 AM   #23
shred5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nak View Post
This.

The hardest part of rearing the fry is the first couple of weeks where rotifers are required. If it wasn't somewhat difficult, then everyone would be raising clowns and they would be as cheap as freshwater guppies.

Yea I do not think people get that. I did freshwater breeding and saltwater is way different. It is a challenge just to grow the food. Thankfully some of these newer copepods might help out with some species.

People think that they can just ramp up breeding as these bans on fish keep coming. Was something like half a million yellow tangs alone come from Hawaii. I just wonder how many clownfish alone are being bred a year?

I think everyone think well tomorrow we can just start breeding millions of additional fish. The investment alone would be staggering.


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Unread 12/31/2018, 07:01 AM   #24
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Good luck; you need to read pickle’s guide on the clay-boa forum. Reed mariculture has great products and is where you can find all that you need from rotifers, rotifer good, culturing bucket setup, TDO chromoboost. You may also want to hatch brine shrimp eggs and feed baby brine starting somewhere day 3-5. It is easier than rotifers.


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