Who runs the simplest system here?

[Fourstars]

I just read your signature! I'm just trying to get to a 150 gallon tank at this point. I'd love to see your setup sometime, but i think i'll not invite my kid. She can be really Downer.

[Timfish]

10 years. 4 small powerheads. No sump/refugium, no skimmer, no reactors or autodosing, no ato. (Baking soda or CaribSea's aragamite added occasionally with water changes.) 5%-10% water change every 2-3 weeks, evaporation is replaced at the same time (and I'm using tapwater).

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-eCQSVdqBQA

And here's a system with just a sump:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=OBtbZVhHQ-g

[Fourstars]

The tank has been set up 10 years that way? That sure is impressive and encouraging as I'm moving in that direction.

[IowaReefer]

I have a 60 cube, no sump, HOB skimmer, HOB refugium for cermedia pellets, a couple power heads, Chinese LED black box, and a heater. Essentially unchanged setup for 10+ years and keep everything from finicky fish to acropora to softies to anemones.

PM me if you want more details.

[Reefheart]

Originally Posted by Timfish

10 years. 4 small powerheads. No sump/refugium, no skimmer, no reactors or autodosing, no ato. (Baking soda or CaribSea's aragamite added occasionally with water changes.) 5%-10% water change every 2-3 weeks, evaporation is replaced at the same time (and I'm using tapwater).

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-eCQSVdqBQA

And here's a system with just a sump:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=OBtbZVhHQ-g

Impressive tanks, Tim and you kept them for that long.

Now that's truly simple and low maintenance in every sense of the word.

But do you have prune the soft corals often to avoid them overgrowing your other corals?

[PuckHucker]

Originally Posted by Constantine

If I was in your shoes, I would put together the most power hungry system possible. Then put together a nice sciencey presentation with graphs and everything showing how plant life requires carbon dioxide, and you are actively saving the rainforest.

My kind of response^

Darn kids think they know everything 😂😂

[PuckHucker]

Currently running about 155 gal Frankenstein system with nothing more than t5s, a bit of led and a bit of extra flow. Have a nice skimmer but don’t run it because I don’t need to yet. ATO, couple heaters and that’s about it. I like simple too

[Pslreefer]

180 with the diy miro 8 bulb t5, drains into a 8 gallon algae barrel that’s gravity fed into a cryptic 40g food grade tub as a refugium filled with rock, sand and an eshopps psk-300skimmer, ato with a 10g reservoir, no heater, 2 jebao ow powerheads with a mag 9.5 return pump.

Just a budget minded simple setup.

[Pslreefer]

Originally Posted by Timfish

10 years. 4 small powerheads. No sump/refugium, no skimmer, no reactors or autodosing, no ato. (Baking soda or CaribSea's aragamite added occasionally with water changes.) 5%-10% water change every 2-3 weeks, evaporation is replaced at the same time (and I'm using tapwater).



https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-eCQSVdqBQA



And here's a system with just a sump:



https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=OBtbZVhHQ-g

Looks great!

I really want to go skimmerless but the majority/all of tanks that I have seen , keep lps and softies. Do you have any acro dominated mixed reef tanks no skimmer?

[Reefheart]

Originally Posted by Pslreefer

Looks great!

I really want to go skimmerless but the majority/all of tanks that I have seen , keep lps and softies. Do you have any acro dominated mixed reef tanks no skimmer?

There is a thread on another forum about a skimmerless acro tank but they perform water changes weekly and replace filter pads every couple of days, so I'm not sure if thats better or worse.

[Fourstars]

SPS do better and have better color without a skimmer on the tank. The current thought on running a reef is mainly driven by equipment manufactures to increase their bottom line. Of course, if your lazy, or insist on a large bio load and/or sand bottom, and/or avoid your tank maintenance then a skimmer is a must.

[shred5]

I might be in this category. I have a 100+ gallon horse trough/rubbermaid tub.
It has liverock and some marcos growing in it for nutrient control and that is it.

I have a ATO on it. I dropped in a heater and some circulation pumps.

Honestly the best system I have ever run since my early days in the hobby in the late 80's early 90's.
Growth and color is off the chart.

It has me rethinking things since this was a hold tank for corals till the new system is done. Stuff has been in there almost a year now.

[Turtlesteve]

Originally Posted by Pslreefer

Looks great!

I really want to go skimmerless but the majority/all of tanks that I have seen , keep lps and softies. Do you have any acro dominated mixed reef tanks no skimmer?

I'm focusing on SPS / Acros in my skimmerless system....so far so good.

[Timfish]

Originally Posted by Pslreefer

Looks great!

I really want to go skimmerless but the majority/all of tanks that I have seen , keep lps and softies. Do you have any acro dominated mixed reef tanks no skimmer?

Originally Posted by Fourstars

. . . The current thought on running a reef is mainly driven by equipment manufactures to increase their bottom line . . .

I have to agree with Fourstars. Feldman, et al, published research on skimmers a decade ago showing little difference between skimmer brands/design AND provided two different potential metrics for skimmers so they could be compared just like we can compare gph/lph for pumps and PAR for lights. The skimmer manufacturers still haven't made any attempt that I can see to provide us consumers with any objective way to compare skimmers.

My tanks tend to be heavy on the zoa, Euphilia, Sinularia and Sarcophyton since when I started these are what did well under 40 watt T12 fluorescent bulbs and I'm still growing the same corals. As far as adding acros or montis I don't have any more of a problem than adding new types of zoas or chalices or Euphilia. If you want an example of acros grown without skimmers may I suggest Steve Tyree.

[Timfish]

Originally Posted by Reefheart

Impressive tanks, Tim and you kept them for that long.

Now that's truly simple and low maintenance in every sense of the word.

But do you have prune the soft corals often to avoid them overgrowing your other corals?

Thank you! All corals need to be dealt sooner or later with when you keep systems for decades. The Xenia and GSP is obviously thinned out the most often.

[Timfish]

Originally Posted by Fourstars

. . . don’t you think it’s best to leave these organisms on the reef? . . .

I would point out we're creating an economic incentive for 3rd world people living on subsistance fishing to adopt sustainable practices to conserve thier environment. If we look at how reefs function, unsustainable fishing practices that remove sharks and large herbivores like parrotfish are destroying reefs very quickly, much faster than global warming is. Temple Grandin gave an excellent example of what happens when you remove economic incentives in her book "Animals Make Us Human" With good intentions one of the African countries outlawed big game ranches that maintained animals for hunters. Once the economic incentive was removed to conserve the animals and land it took only a few years for the population of large mammals to dwindle to a fraction of what they were when they could be hunted.

[newbie2014]

I have a bare bottom, sumpless 40G with five fish and 3 medium size RBTA. Corals are softies and LPS. Two mp10s for flow, CBB for light, and an Tunze ATO. I took the skimmer and reactor off line about 2 yrs ago. 15-20% WC every 4-6 weeks. 2-part dosing by hand every 2-3 days.

[WVfishguy]

Remind your daughter that the attendees of the last climate change conference flew there in their private jets.

That should make the hobby look downright green.

[Green Chromis]

Originally Posted by Fourstars

SPS do better and have better color without a skimmer on the tank. The current thought on running a reef is mainly driven by equipment manufactures to increase their bottom line. Of course, if your lazy, or insist on a large bio load and/or sand bottom, and/or avoid your tank maintenance then a skimmer is a must.

Hi, where did you get your info from about protein skimmers and SPS corals?

[Fourstars]

Originally Posted by Green Chromis

Hi, where did you get your info from about protein skimmers and SPS corals?

Your requesting scientific papers for my claim?

[WVfishguy]

Originally Posted by Fourstars

SPS do better and have better color without a skimmer on the tank. The current thought on running a reef is mainly driven by equipment manufactures to increase their bottom line. Of course, if your lazy, or insist on a large bio load and/or sand bottom, and/or avoid your tank maintenance then a skimmer is a must.

I find this statement bizarre.

[Fourstars]

It is! I must of been drunk when I wrote that. Interesting article about what is in skimmate on advanced aquarist by Ken S. Feldman. I struggled with one of my tanks, adding phosphate and nitrate every week till I finally just took the skimmer off line. The only export I’m using on that tank is cheatomorpha. Huge improvement in all coloration and not having to dose anymore.

[Scrubber_steve]

Originally Posted by Fourstars

It is! I must of been drunk when I wrote that. Interesting article about what is in skimmate on advanced aquarist by Ken S. Feldman. I struggled with one of my tanks, adding phosphate and nitrate every week till I finally just took the skimmer off line. The only export I’m using on that tank is cheatomorpha. Huge improvement in all coloration and not having to dose anymore.

Feldman also made the observation that sensitive coral like sps don't do well in systems that don't purify the water via skimming &/or GAC. In other words, high DOC is a problem for sensitive corals. Maybe you just keep softies?

[Fourstars]

No, it’s a mixed tank with SPS, bird nest, Acropora, millipora, Montipora. I’m in the process of setting up a SPS only tank and will try running it the same way. Only been running skimmerless for about six months, so we’ll see it I have issues and go back to skimming. I forgot to mention I do run carbon.

IMG_0213.jpg

[Scrubber_steve]

Originally Posted by Fourstars

No, it’s a mixed tank with SPS, bird nest, Acropora, millipora, Montipora. I’m in the process of setting up a SPS only tank and will try running it the same way. Only been running skimmerless for about six months, so we’ll see it I have issues and go back to skimming.

Attachment 398553

OK, so you don't skim or use GAC. How many fish are you feeding? Feeding fish = DOC.
Perhaps you have few fish, or do a lot of water changing to control DOC?

Or do you have a lot of fish, & do little in water changes, & you suggest that DOC build up is not a problem for sps in your tank?