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Old 10/29/2012, 08:04 PM   #326
herring_fish
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I see most hobbyists growing phytoplankton in 2 liter bottles. They harvest by splitting the culture and adding fresh replacement salt water. Everyone reports crashes despite meticulous cleaning.

My question is, are large batches of phytoplankton any less likely to crash?

I talked to a guy that said that he grew phyto in white 55 gallon plastic drums, outside in the summer, adding a seed culture and fertilizer or just adding fertilizer. He seemed to be a casual grower but he didn't worry about crashes. Unfortunately, I couldn't talk to him long enough to get any details. I don't know if he was making constant production or just making individual batches.


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Old 10/29/2012, 09:07 PM   #327
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Large batches are indeed equally likely to crash


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Old 10/29/2012, 11:11 PM   #328
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Bottles are fine,and they seldom crash.Check http://www.marinebreeder.org/forums/...hp?f=145&t=324


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Old 10/30/2012, 07:10 AM   #329
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The tricks to avoiding crashes, stable temps, good sanitation of equipment and culture media, using the right concentration of f/2, split often and start new cultures often to keep the phtyo in the logarithmic growth phase


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Old 11/08/2012, 03:42 PM   #330
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Thanks for the info/external website links. I am interested in starting a copepod hatchery and I think the last link listed in your post offers a cost effective and relatively inexpensive way to do so. Thanks again


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Old 11/11/2012, 06:53 PM   #331
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Great info!


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Old 11/20/2012, 12:09 AM   #332
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Two At Once?

Three pages back at #268, I posted a description of my rotifer tower that is a tube 6 inches in diameter and 6 feet tall. It is designed to be fed 2 gallons of total water from the main tank, spread out throughout the day automatically. That same amount of rotifer laden water returns to the display tank via gravity. Along with it comes the waste that my main tank has no problem processing so the 7 gallon plankton tower has relatively clean water cycling through it all the time.

I have been feeding it dead phyto and it works well. Lately, I got some live phyto from a local grower/dealer at a very reasonable price so I used it instead for a while. Of course live phyto makes for a cleaner running system.

Looking at my nice green tower, I thought:

1. What if I added lighting to the clear plastic tube and a little phyto fertilizer?

My algae scrubber loved its addition when I ran the light too much and over scrubbed. If I didn't add so much that I fowl the 7 gallon tower, my display tank should be just fine. I could just turn up the lights.Perhaps the live phyto and the rotifers would live together. Now we come to phyto crashes.

2. Would it still crash if the phyto density is lower and the bacteria filled main tank water is cycled through it?

If so, would it fowl the water in the tower and kill the rotifers too? If not, that addition of a lesser daily feeding of live phyto would seed the tower every day.

3. Would the bacteria from one crash hang around and continue to kill?


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Old 11/20/2012, 06:03 AM   #333
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herring_fish View Post
Perhaps the live phyto and the rotifers would live together.
That would be like trying to raise chickens in the same coop with foxes. Single fastest way to wipe out a phyto culture is to get rots in your phyto...and I'm talking just couple of rots getting into substantial phyto cultures via minor contamination. The rots reproduce much faster than phyto.


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Old 11/20/2012, 10:41 AM   #334
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True

Let's think in a lower order of magnitude. I'm not talking about growing phyto for substantial export. My thought was to encourage growth of the phyto in the tube that would help feed the rots. I would still have to dose in phyto but less.

I noticed that when I feed a lot, the green water takes a day or two to be consumed. If it multiplied a little, in the mean time, it would last longer and therefor cost less.

Yes? No?


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Old 11/20/2012, 11:35 AM   #335
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I don't think you'd ever really get enough sustained phyto growth in a continuous rotifer culture to have any impact on green water costs. Those little beasties are just too ravenous.


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Old 11/21/2012, 07:23 PM   #336
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Yeah, tell me about it. I had an 80 gallon rubbermaid filled with a great batch of thick nano. All it took was one drop of rotifer culture on my watch and 4 days to have 80 gallons of clear water and 10000000000000000 rotifers


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Old 11/23/2012, 12:17 AM   #337
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Thinking about culturing my own copepods! And in order to do that I need to culture my own phtyto... reading through the thread it seems as if Iso is the best phyto for me if I want to stick with feeding one type of algae to my pods? And I've read that you can't mix phytos, rots, brine, copepods, etc. But what about mixing different species of pods in the same culture? Will one species outcompete the rest like with phytos or will they live in harmony and all continue to breed? Lastly, what is a good source for iso phytoplabkton? Thanks, zack


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Old 11/23/2012, 07:40 AM   #338
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If one was only going to culture one phyto, Iso is indeed the best choice. It can be readily obtained from either Florida Aqua Farms or Aquatic Ecosytems. Pods are bit slow growing, so probably not as likely to be problematic for mixed pod species in culture.


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Old 11/23/2012, 11:06 AM   #339
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Correct me if I'm wrong, to culture iso I need: an iso algae disk, fertilizer, and a source of light? I've read that the bubbler isn't required, just shake the bottles up daily? A question on the light, I've been trying to figure out what type of light bulb to grow with but I can't really seem to figure it out... I think I'm going to try a single culture of the iso at first and just feed it to my reef to get a hang of it before I go full scale with 4 bottles and whatnot


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Old 11/23/2012, 12:13 PM   #340
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For the light, any decent "white" fluorescent tube will do. I like to use the ones that are closest to daylight in color temperature as possible. Just shaking can work on small cultures such as the typical subculture (generally under 100ml). Anything larger, such as 1L culture, and aeration is really needed IME. No airstone, just an open airline with nice big bubbles set for a nice rolling boil.


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Old 11/23/2012, 12:45 PM   #341
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Okay that sounds right. But for culturing my copepods ill need an endless supply of phyto, correct? The setup with 4 2-liter bottles should suffice, right? Take 2/3 of each culter per day and when you finish with the last one, the first should be replenished? Thanks zack


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Old 11/29/2012, 12:05 AM   #342
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That depends on what species of copepod you want to culture. How prepared are you to produce the species you select? What do you want to achieve with your culture? I am reading about culturing live food for larval fish. Copepods and amphipods stand out to me as the most practical because of papers I have read showing that diet has little impact on the fatty acid profiles of the studied animals. Suggesting that these animals have the ability to synthesize these acids and can be fed foods that save time and money. The real constrains are their life cycle and optimal stocking densities. With that said the harpacticoida copepods are better suited for alternative feeds. Regardless of what you culture at some point you will need to either split your culture or separate adults from subadults from ... or you will be feeding a culture that can longer yield proportionately to what you are feeding it.


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Old 12/11/2012, 12:04 PM   #343
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Having read all 14 pages

Having read this entire thread I am ready to start and now have the following questions.

First my plan is to use 1L Voss bottles as my growing chamber. I have a 18" T5 growing light. I am planning on using my Phyto2 bottles to start my phyto farms. Growing 2 different types of Phyto(Nano and Tetra). I will start with one bottle of each type then grow it out to 4 bottles of each.

What should I use for fertilizer? I know of locals using Miracle Gro but have read about Guilards F2 which seems out of production now. What is my better than Miracle Gro option nowadays?

I am a home brewer and the process of growing microfoods seems very similar to growing yeast. I do not want to wipe out my bottles of the Phyto2 so can i start with a small culture like 1/4 liter in the Voss bottle and add the appropriate fertilizer and a sample of the Nano and Tetra then grow that for a week, then add more 1,019 salt water and fertilzer to create 1/2 Liter, then later step it up to a full liter once that is green?

We have had a healthy population of copepods from our sump before but am not sure if the wrasse ate them all or our lack of feeding has lessened the population. I would like to add some Pods soon would Tigre be best?

Is it possible to order some rotifers when I order the other items and wait to start the batch until my Phyto farm is producing?


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Old 12/11/2012, 12:36 PM   #344
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Guillards or a modified Guillards are still readily available. I use the modified Guillards f/2 from Florida Aqua Farms, which is also sold through Aquatic Ecostyems (who also sells other brands of Guillards). It is the way to go. Forget the Miracle grow nonsense. As for ordering Rots at the same time, get the resting rotifers (sort of like brine shrimp cysts) and you'll be able to wait till the phyto is going well to start them. All supplies and starter cultures you could want are available from either the two places I mention, with FAF usually being slightly cheaper.

BTW, the same dedication to sanitation you need for brewing will serve phyto culturing very well


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Last edited by billsreef; 12/11/2012 at 12:44 PM.
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Old 03/09/2013, 11:55 AM   #345
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I wish someone would make a plug-n-play HOB culturing device or the like. One that was almost crash proof somehow. Supplying exclusively huge amounts of live pods and even live phyto to a reef tank would probably change the whole business.


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Old 03/11/2013, 11:00 PM   #346
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algagen has pure starter cultures for nano and isochrysis galbana .I use 3 liter soda bottles they cost a dollar each. F2 [kent] from aquatic ecosystems 1 ml per liter, havest 75% of the culture on day 5 to 6 for maximun nutitional value. I then refill with fresh sea water made with ro/di H2O SG 1.020. Illuminate for 16 hrs/day I USE A 6500K CFL WITH A CLEAR LENS.


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Old 03/30/2013, 10:09 AM   #347
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Can someone tip me off to what a good source for buying small affordable hobbiest quantities of an amonia nutralizing compund? One of the Aqua culture places sells a 5 gallon bucket of the powder for $40 plus shipping. I'd like to buy a smaller supply. This would be for supporting concentrated rotifer cultures in order to reduce the likelyhood of a crash.

Thanks


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Old 03/30/2013, 11:21 AM   #348
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Nice thread


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Old 04/04/2013, 10:02 AM   #349
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quicktater View Post
Can someone tip me off to what a good source for buying small affordable hobbiest quantities of an amonia nutralizing compund? One of the Aqua culture places sells a 5 gallon bucket of the powder for $40 plus shipping. I'd like to buy a smaller supply. This would be for supporting concentrated rotifer cultures in order to reduce the likelyhood of a crash.

Thanks
There are rotifer feeds with it in it already, but I am unaware of ClorAm-X powder being sold in anything less then 5lb. You can get it in liquid form from Hikari, but you'll be spending a lot more on that then the 5 lb container. It really doesn't go bad though so its just one purchase and your set for loooong time.


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Old 04/16/2013, 02:53 PM   #350
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Phyto culturing in 5/gal cardboys...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hey all, just a heads up about larger culture containers, I grow 3 types of phyto, tet, iso and nano (30/gals) and I've had cultures last for 2 1/2 months until the density starts to lower and I'll start them over (usually compete with bacteria). It takes about three weeks for the densities to increase enough to split (2 1/2 gals) and I replace the phyto with 2 1/2 gals of sterilized culture water @ 1.020. I light them 24/7 and built a station that holds the lights and frames out of pvc that holds the carboys. This is a change from when I was culturing phyto with 3mil 17 liter bags from FAF but this was extremely time consuming. I feed 10/gals of Rot's (plicatilis) and my tank 120/gal mixed reef. If you can start out with a sterile culture, filtered air (.03 micron) and clean you containers when you start your new cultures (1qt of sodium hypo per 5/gals and then rinse and add 2 pints of muriatic acid each for 24 hours) you'll get the jump on bacteria and your culture will have a better chance at surviving for longer. This culturing technic has proven to be the easiest way yet (started with gal rubber made containers) and lots of less work involved for me. I start with 4ml of FAF Algro per gal and the only time I will add anymore is when I split and add the sterilized culture water that replaces the phyto I remove to feed the rot’s, this averages around 1.5 to 2 ml of fertilizer per gal per 7 days in the long run.
Just thought I would throw my two cents in and this is a great thread and a lot of experience and good points.


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