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07/12/2017, 10:54 AM | #176 |
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I don't know if the tank was stripped of nitrogen and phosphate; the measures provided are unclear. However, it is possible for a nitrogen deficiency to occur when dosing organic carbon as the heterotrophic bacteria consume some nitrogen along with phosphate ;while at the same time, anaerobic denification is occurring releasing more nitrogen from the tank as it bubbles out of the tank as N2 gas. Dosing a little sodium nitrate in those instances seems to help create a better balance between phosphate and nitrogen; both are needed by living things.
In my case, FWIW, dosing vodka and vinegar enables heavy feeding while maintaing PO4 at 0.02 to 0.04ppm per hanah with NO3 undetectable to barely detectable per salifert. Once a week or so a very small dose NaNO3 keeps things healthy and apparently well balanced.
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Tom Current Tank Info: Tank of the Month , November 2011 : 600gal integrated system: 3 display tanks (120 g, 90g, 89g),several frag/grow out tanks, macroalgae refugia, cryptic zones. 40+ fish, seahorses, sps,lps,leathers, zoanthidae and non photosynthetic corals. |
07/12/2017, 11:57 AM | #177 | |
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So from 5 ppm I stripped to 0 and then added some to have 1 ppm. We do not know for sure that NoPox is why my corals are dying. I don't use Nopox for at least 2 month now and thing are not getting better. All other parameters are stable. my Alk always at 9 Dkh and my Ca is always at 480-490 ppm. I do not dose anything else but my corals are still dying. I dropped my salinity lvl to 1.027 as of today and I will drop it more in a couple of days. If this will not help then it's not the water problem. My RODI water is always at 0 tdm. So I know it's not that. I replaced 100% of water when I moved my tank along with my sand and the problem is still there. The Triton test also showed no problems with water. The only thing have left is some sort of parasites that I don't see.
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07/12/2017, 12:01 PM | #178 | |
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07/12/2017, 12:36 PM | #179 |
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So let me conclude.
I started this thread 4 months ago because my SPS started slowly to dye. Polyps would not retract fully and eventually body of the coral would be covered in algae. (please see pics on the first page.) I had a big colony of Stylo and it started to dye from the bottom up. LPS wasn't affected back then. I had no algae problem, my PO4 was at 0.04 ppm and my NO3 was unknown because I didnt had a test kit. After I got a test kit and it showed 0 NO3. That's when I thought NO3 is a problem. So I bought some KNO3 and rise my nitrates up to 5 ppm over the course of a couple of days. I tested my RODI water for both FCI and TCI and it was 0. my TDS is always at 000 on TDS meter. I switched from Read Sea coral pro salt to Blue bucket Red Sea salt as was suggested to eliminate swings in ALK after WC. That was 75 gal DT with 55 gal sump. I had 1 clown fish, Purple Tang, Fox Face, Damsel, Mandarin, pair of leopard wrasses, flame angel, Two shrimps (both dead now), sea star, sea cucumber. one month ago I moved everything to my new house to 150 gal DT and 55 gal sump. I used all fresh salt water and new sand. I only moved rocks and fish. No casualties. New tank and same problem but I don't have SPS corals anymore. I lost all my SPS including 10'' plate coral. Now it was turn for my LPS corals. I had 10 head torch which is dead now, my mushrooms are all shriveled and stayed small. I also have a huge candy cane and two RBT anemones which are doing fine. My hammer head coral would stay at 50% of its usual size. I have another purple torch which is dying also. The skeleton turned dark and its loosing flesh. I don't dose anything except Alk and Ca, same amount every day. My Alk is 9 Dkh and my Ca is 450 right now. You can see all the numbers on the Triton test. I do 20 gal WC every two weeks. my NO3 right now at 5 ppm and PO4 at 0.04 ppm. I feed my fish two times a day, Algae pellets during the day and two cubes of PE misys at 7 pm. I do the same routine for 3 years now. Nothing really changed.
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07/12/2017, 01:56 PM | #180 | |
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It's the return of Dr. Goodluck Himself. fml! Current Tank Info: 156G "brick", 150 sump and 75 fuge replaces Fire, Destruction, Sad :( |
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07/12/2017, 01:58 PM | #181 |
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I will admit up front, I did not read all 7 pages. I did see you moved a month ago. That of course can be hard on corals. Probably a new cycle.
You replaced sand. Did you have a dsb in the old tank? Did you say 3 yrs? I am experiencing analogous problems of acros dying and growing back (mostly) then dying again. No water test indicates any issue and levels hold stable. I do have some cyano, that could be from the die-off though, hard to say for sure. But nothing seems to help -- including leaving well enough alone. Sometimes, it's just frustrating. I wonder about chloramines. I have not tested that but as you test 0 I suspect I will too. Good luck!
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07/12/2017, 04:22 PM | #182 |
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Here at Reef Central, we believe that dialogs between participants should be conducted in a friendly and helpful manner. If you disagree with a posting, please express yourself in a way that is conducive to further constructive dialog. Conversely, when you post on any given subject, you must be willing to accept constructive criticism without posting a hostile or inflammatory response. Personal attacks of any kind will not be tolerated. Please work to insure that Reef Central remains a friendly and flame free site where everyone, especially newcomers, can feel free to post questions without fear of being unfairly criticized. Thank you for your cooperation. All right, let's keep the personal attacks out of this thread. I have removed some posts. I don't want to have to remove more. This person is having some serious problems with his tank, and it'd be nice to try to solve it. Since he's stopped the NoPOx for a couple of months, I would guess that it had nothing to do with the coral problems. Lots of people have dosed NoPOx without issues, so that's not so surprising. I agree, though, that some people's tanks seem to have problems with carbon dosing. For me, two months without carbon is enough to demonstrate that there's some other issue here.
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07/12/2017, 04:26 PM | #183 | |
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07/12/2017, 04:39 PM | #184 | |
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Please read my summary of what I have done already. I am still trying to bring my salinity down to 1.026, if this won't help then I have to look elsewhere. 1. I stopped dosing Nopox. 2. I switched salts from RedSea Pro to Blue Bucket RedSea. 3. I only dose Alk and Ca right now on the doser. (two parts from BRS. CALCIUM CHLORIDE and SODIUM BICARBONATE ) 4. I replaced 100% of the water in the move and replaced sand. So there is nothing laying and dying in my tank. 5. I replaced my refractometer to digital. So now no more calibration solution needed. 6. I took everything extra from a water and inspected my equipment for stray voltage and found some bad pump in my skimmer. 7. Replaced Skimmer. 8. I replaced DT and Sump. 9. I fixed NO3 issue, now it stays at 5 ppm(redsea test). and PO4 at 0.04-0.06 ppm (hanna). This issue is going on for half a year already. At this pint I don't think the problem with water quality.
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07/12/2017, 04:40 PM | #185 | |
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07/12/2017, 06:06 PM | #186 |
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As noted folks bring in fresh air or even use CO2 scrubbers to reduce the amount of CO2 in the air that enters the tank.
CO2 hydrolizes in water and adds H+(CO2 +H2O---->CO3 + 2H) which lowers pH. pH is not affected by the O2 content of the incoming air or the oxygen level in the water.
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07/12/2017, 06:42 PM | #187 | |
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Yes they care . They can't osmoregulate like fish can;their internal sg is dependent to a large extent on the water around them. Fish can either concentrate salts in their urine and urinate less than they drink or vice versa to maintain a constant internal sg,around 1.008; corals and invertebrates can't . When the internal sg is off ,the internal chemistry is off and the organs don't function. At external sg higher than the necessary internal sg, fluids flow out interrupting internal osmosis. With external sg lower than internal sq .fluids flow in with a similar disruption. The range of adaptation may vary from one specific non osmoregulating animal to the next but overall an sg of 1.026 will do for all slatwater animals. Further, the salt mix adds many major ,minor and trace elements not just calcium alkalinity and magensium; posaium, chloide, sodium , iron and a myriad of others.
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Tom Current Tank Info: Tank of the Month , November 2011 : 600gal integrated system: 3 display tanks (120 g, 90g, 89g),several frag/grow out tanks, macroalgae refugia, cryptic zones. 40+ fish, seahorses, sps,lps,leathers, zoanthidae and non photosynthetic corals. Last edited by tmz; 07/12/2017 at 07:21 PM. |
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07/12/2017, 07:24 PM | #188 |
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Those steps look good.
It's not hard to drop the sg by drawing out some salt water and replacing it with ro/di. Where is it now?
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07/12/2017, 11:38 PM | #189 |
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Have you thought about air contamination?. I had mysterious inverts dying and coral issues due to air pollutant before.
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07/13/2017, 01:41 PM | #190 |
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I haven't been able to come up with any ideas on how to proceed. This kind of problem can be extremely difficult to solve. I remember one person who trace a problem back to a bad batch of artificial live rock. I don't know how he managed.
I might try keeping a PolyFilter in the system long-term. I'm not sure what turning white means, but that might be a hint. On the other hand, it might be a coincidence.
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07/13/2017, 03:32 PM | #191 | |
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07/13/2017, 03:32 PM | #192 | |
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I hope that Salinity caused all my problems. It makes sense what Tom said, I was using that single bottle of calibration solution for past 2 years, and it was probably going off little by little without my notice until levels got very high and corals start dying. I had no clue that simple of the salt water could go bad. So i never had doubts about my salinity levels since I calibrate my refractometer every time before use.
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07/13/2017, 03:33 PM | #193 | |
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07/13/2017, 03:47 PM | #194 |
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Oh, well, there goes that idea down in flames. Maybe the SG excursions were the source of the problem. If so, I'd expect the corals to recover in a couple of months or so, provided that they are not too damaged currently.
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07/13/2017, 09:13 PM | #195 | |
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Household cleaning agent & air freshener usage might find their way into your tank via skimmer. It might not be the culprit here but I think adding a filter is good as a precautionary measure. Skimmer manufacturer should supply activated carbon filter as standard package. The amount of air being pushed into the skimmer is enormous.
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07/14/2017, 07:07 AM | #196 | |
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07/14/2017, 09:28 AM | #197 |
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First casualties were snails. It didn't kill them straight away, their mobility gradually affected, then they stop moving and eating and eventually died. I introduced new snails, drip acclimate and all out of sudden they stop moving. I made a small batch SW, they immediately recovers. Strange as it may sound, but that was exactly triggered my curiosity. My LFS recommends WC (i don't normally do), installed DIY charcoal filter and everything returns to normal.
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10/04/2017, 03:22 PM | #198 |
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UPDATE: After I stabilized my salinity my corals stopped dying but overall condition is still bad. It looks like they are not recovering Half the size or barely open. Maybe the damage was too severe and now it's too late?
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10/04/2017, 03:34 PM | #199 |
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How long has the salinity been stable? A couple of months should be enough to see some recovery, I'd hope.
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10/04/2017, 03:37 PM | #200 | |
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