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Unread 08/29/2016, 03:54 AM   #26
Croff
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You are right, my corals having problems are mostly SPS. The only LPS receding was one acanthastrea, that finally died 3 days ago. I was hand feeding regularly as some of my other corals, but it was not extending its polyps as it used to do.
I'm using one Kessil A360W which I had for a long time (also used in my previous tank) with no changes in length of photoperiod since the beginning, and that same acanthastrea was growing noticeable before I changed to AF; the rest of my corals seemed to also like it.
Everything is pointing to high nitrates/phosphates, but I'm struggling to lower them, which never was a problem with my previous tank and NOPOX... Let's see if in a few days of using Zeo mix and Phosphate minus things change. Would you recommend to stop using Coral A,V, B, E until nutrients decrease? Right now I'm using 1 drop every other day.
And yes, I knew of the potential problems with the flame angel, but as far as I know, it's not touching anything.


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Unread 08/29/2016, 09:41 AM   #27
Myka
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I think that having to rely on significant carbon dosing (NOPOX) to keep nutrients low is probably a sign that you're lacking in the husbandry department. Maybe you aren't doing effective waterchanges or maybe your equipment isn't up to snuff or maybe you're feeding more than your system can handle. Your system has more nutrients going in than going out. Maybe it will balance out as Perry suggests or maybe you need to take a harder look at your husbandry.

I do think that cutting back or cutting out on the Coral A, V, E, and B might be a good idea for now. The point of those additives is to provide nutrients to the corals in a low nutrient environment, and if your water column is already full of nutrients I don't see why you should add more.


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Unread 08/29/2016, 02:47 PM   #28
Croff
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I'm sure you are right, but I thought 1-2 ml of NOPOX daily for a 150 liters system was not really significant, it's almost the minimum quantity you can use according to instructions. And with that quantity nitrates were 2-3 and phosphates 0,02-0,03. What is clear, as you said, is that there are more nutrients going in than out, I just have to discover why and do something about it. What still annoys me is that that nutrient spike happened when I changed to AF, not before... Maybe the system was unstable and the nutrient spike was going to happen anyway, or maybe there is a problem with my Pro Bio S bottle for whatever reason (I'll buy a new one, just to try), I don't know, but I'll keep trying...
I will also cut out Coral A, V, B, E and see if it has any effect.
Thank you again for your help


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Unread 08/29/2016, 05:59 PM   #29
plyle02
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Croff,
I know it is frustrating, but if you look over my thread, I gave insight into the fact that husbandry is more important than dosing. Patience is always rewarded in the hobby, especially with sps corals. Personally, I would evaluate the skimmer first, is it up to the challenge, meaning is it capable of at least twice system volume? Next, is there detritus building in the sump? Are you feeding fish and seeing food uneaten? A system that pushes the limits needs sound practices, regular water changes with 0.00 RODI, top off with RODI always 0.00 tds. Regular basting of rocks and disturbance of sand, but most importantly, a skimmer that pulls it out quickly.


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Current Tank Info: 50 Gallon AIO Cube, Aquamaxx WS-1 Skimmer, LED/ Hybrid 4x24 watt t5
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Unread 08/30/2016, 02:14 AM   #30
Croff
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Hello Perry,
To tell you the truth, I've been considering changing my skimmer more then once... It's the only different thing from my previous build ( I had a Bubble Magus Curve 5 ) and I'm not really happy with it. It's a Deltec 1351 with adjustable DC pump and supposed to work in aquariums from 350 to 600 liters depending on stocking (mine is 170 liters total, not counting rocks).
There is some detritus building in the sump, but it's not that much and I clean it every week with water changes. Only feed my fishes once a day and they seem to eat everything and my RODI tds is 0 according to two different tests. Just the same I did in the past with good results, except the skimmer, so that may be the problem
Thanks


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Unread 08/30/2016, 04:30 AM   #31
plyle02
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Croff View Post
Hello Perry,
To tell you the truth, I've been considering changing my skimmer more then once... It's the only different thing from my previous build ( I had a Bubble Magus Curve 5 ) and I'm not really happy with it. It's a Deltec 1351 with adjustable DC pump and supposed to work in aquariums from 350 to 600 liters depending on stocking (mine is 170 liters total, not counting rocks).
There is some detritus building in the sump, but it's not that much and I clean it every week with water changes. Only feed my fishes once a day and they seem to eat everything and my RODI tds is 0 according to two different tests. Just the same I did in the past with good results, except the skimmer, so that may be the problem
Thanks
Please post a video or picture of the skimmer in action, I am curious to see what kind of collection you are getting. Thanks


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Current Tank Info: 50 Gallon AIO Cube, Aquamaxx WS-1 Skimmer, LED/ Hybrid 4x24 watt t5
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Unread 08/30/2016, 04:38 AM   #32
Croff
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I cleaned the skimmer cup two days ago after my last water change, and the whole skimmer 10 days ago, so I think it hasn't settle down yet. It's skimming a bit wet, I believe


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Unread 08/30/2016, 12:20 PM   #33
plyle02
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Here is my skimmer which is constantly at work, it appears this way with dry foamy skim all day 24-7, this pic taken the day after cleaning

[IMG][/IMG]


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Current Tank Info: 50 Gallon AIO Cube, Aquamaxx WS-1 Skimmer, LED/ Hybrid 4x24 watt t5
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Unread 08/30/2016, 01:01 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by plyle02 View Post
Here is my skimmer which is constantly at work, it appears this way with dry foamy skim all day 24-7, this pic taken the day after cleaning

[IMG][/IMG]
Perry,
To what do you attribute the dark rich color of your skimmate? Is it due to sheer volume of fish or coral food, chemical supplement dosing as opposed to fish food, or due to using frozen as opposed to dry foods? Look forward to your input.


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Unread 08/30/2016, 01:12 PM   #35
carlosmos
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I can not ser the perro vídeo


Enviado desde mi iPhone utilizando Tapatalk


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Unread 08/30/2016, 01:29 PM   #36
plyle02
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kevlow View Post
Perry,
To what do you attribute the dark rich color of your skimmate? Is it due to sheer volume of fish or coral food, chemical supplement dosing as opposed to fish food, or due to using frozen as opposed to dry foods? Look forward to your input.
Hi Kevin,
When running system based on bacteria and carbon source, it has been well documented that the skimmer seems to perform much better. The skimmer is an ATB cone skimmer powered by a Eheim 1260 pump. I have used it on and off of algae based and probiotic based systems. This is by far the most grungy, thick, dark and constant skimmate observed. I do only feed frozen, yes my fish are snobs and get mainly LRS Reef Frenzy, 2-3 times daily, in a chunk about the size of half dollar each time I still maintain low values despite this feeding regime, and dose all the AF supps daily. If your skimmer is too wet, likely the bacteria is skimmed off before it can become effective, as with coral supps too, that said, the skimmer is supposed to run dry... Cheers


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"Anger is like drinking poison and expecting the other person to die" ~Buddha~

Current Tank Info: 50 Gallon AIO Cube, Aquamaxx WS-1 Skimmer, LED/ Hybrid 4x24 watt t5
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Unread 08/31/2016, 04:27 AM   #37
Croff
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So if skimmer is too wet, bacteria is skimmed off before it becomes effective? Maybe that is my problem... I was worried because if I skim dry, I don't collect almost anything in the collection cup, although I'm feeding less than you, only once a day and not always frozen


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Unread 08/31/2016, 02:11 PM   #38
plyle02
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Croff View Post
So if skimmer is too wet, bacteria is skimmed off before it becomes effective? Maybe that is my problem... I was worried because if I skim dry, I don't collect almost anything in the collection cup, although I'm feeding less than you, only once a day and not always frozen
The point is that the skimmer should still collect, if it only collects wet, then maybe that is your issue, but the idea is that the bacteria and carbon should have kicked your skimmer in to overdrive, it does not appear to be happening. The heart of the system is the skimmer, this is the most important function to remove what your are feeding. Cheers


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Perry

"Anger is like drinking poison and expecting the other person to die" ~Buddha~

Current Tank Info: 50 Gallon AIO Cube, Aquamaxx WS-1 Skimmer, LED/ Hybrid 4x24 watt t5
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Unread 08/31/2016, 06:17 PM   #39
2una
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I suspect the copper in E might be a factor for some of us.
600L tank - I was dosing 2/3 drops A+V+B daily & holding my No3 levels fine with 3 drops each ProBioS & NP Pro.( +/- 3 months like this) Then i started including E & i've been chasing my tail trying to get No3 back under control ever since, now dosing 16 drops/day for the last month & struggling to get it to still come back down.
Dosed E for about 2 months before i stopped dosing it.

Using Comp ABC,don't use AF salt as there's no agent in the country here & its too expensive to ship in.



Last edited by 2una; 08/31/2016 at 06:29 PM.
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Unread 09/01/2016, 03:59 PM   #40
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I have been having the same issue. Since I started using AF products my Nitrates went up to 10 and is staying there my phosphates is at 0. My system is 150gallon. Did a 70% WC last week but nitrates still at 10. I have increased feeding to add some phosphates as the bacteria needs carbon, nitrates and phosphates to work (Redfield ratio). I m following this thread closely.


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Unread 11/15/2016, 04:40 PM   #41
Croff
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Well, two and a half months have passed and my nitrates are still between 12-16. Phosphates decreased last week to 0,12 but only because I used Phosguard for some days (before that was still around 0,3). Still using Pro Bio S (bought a new bottle just in case), NP Pro (changed from drops to doser just in case), stopped using A,V,B,E and did weekly water changes as always. I have been using Zeo Mix, Phosphate Minus and Carbon, but in a bag, instead of a reactor. Same skimmer but skimming drier, although it seems there is not much to skim, as my collection cup never gets too full. As my salt and component 1,2,3 are finishing, I'm considering switching back to Red Sea, because I've been using Aquaforest for almost seven months and things are clearly worst than they where in May. Any new suggestion from any of you will be appreciated.
Thank you


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Unread 11/16/2016, 02:27 AM   #42
2una
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Croff maybe try some of their Life bio fil (seeded matrix),some more bacteria real estate but its already seeded.

I'm also still same like you trying to get No3 to kick down from months ago,I'm now running zeomix at KZ recommended amounts & flow to see if that will do something.



Last edited by 2una; 11/16/2016 at 02:38 AM.
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Unread 11/16/2016, 04:45 AM   #43
Croff
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I'll try it if I can find it here.
What seems strange to me is that nitrates climbed to 13-16 when I started using Aquaforest and they have been always the same, not more, not less, and I have added Siporax and then Zeo Mix since. It's like they have done nothing to the system in all these months... And yes, I have measured with different tests.
I have never used Bio S; do you think that could help? If I continue with Aquaforest, would it be better to use Reef salt instead of Probiotic? Would it be a big difference if I buy a reactor for Zeo and Phosphate Minus? (although Phosguard seemed to work in less than a week).


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Unread 11/16/2016, 05:34 AM   #44
2una
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I don't know mate i got no answers either, it seems like the nitrifying bacteria are working to get No3 present but the hold up seems to be the denitrifying bacteria to get rid of it from there. I got 2 skimmers running so skimmer ain't the issue for me.
I also tried adding not BioS but ProBioF & that's in amongst the list of things i've tried that brought no change,added more matrix,differant bottles of ProBioS + Np Pro.
The siporax or matrix i think needs to be away in a low flow area rather than high flow looking thru the siporax thread.
In my trials to date the zeomix i didn't see bringing any improvement at the 300/300/300 zeo/carbon/phos mix in a reactor so i've now stepped things up with the zeomix running by itself & pushing the "safe" zone some.

Its taken me months to build up what i been doing with the increasing levels of Zeomix so for you that Life Bio Fil might be a quicker result & a lot safer way to try out


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Unread 11/16/2016, 07:01 PM   #45
plyle02
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Hi Croff,
At this point, I think we should evaluate the skimmer, given that it is usually what helps to reduce N&P, regardless of what type system. That, or there must be a source of nitrates that is undetected, just seems odd to still be having this issue. I totally understand your frustration, and hope that it is resolved, and hopefully corals are ok? Please let me know if I can help? Cheers!


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Perry

"Anger is like drinking poison and expecting the other person to die" ~Buddha~

Current Tank Info: 50 Gallon AIO Cube, Aquamaxx WS-1 Skimmer, LED/ Hybrid 4x24 watt t5
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Unread 11/28/2016, 05:36 PM   #46
Croff
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Hello again,
I have been using NOPOX along with Pro Bio S and NP Pro for the last 7-9 days, and my nitrates are now 5 and phosphates 0,04. Since that seems to be working, do you think that I could continue using all Aquaforest products except ProBio S and NP Pro and substitute them with NOPOX? I also stopped using Zeo Mix and Phosphate Minus, so my only nutrient control would be NOPOX.

Again, thank you for your patience and advise


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Unread 11/29/2016, 06:14 AM   #47
plyle02
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Sure,
You could use AF Carbon, Energy, Vitality, Amino Mix, Power Food, and Component 123.
Cheers


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Perry

"Anger is like drinking poison and expecting the other person to die" ~Buddha~

Current Tank Info: 50 Gallon AIO Cube, Aquamaxx WS-1 Skimmer, LED/ Hybrid 4x24 watt t5
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Unread 12/14/2016, 03:10 PM   #48
orly20
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@Croff
Any updates?


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Unread 12/17/2016, 10:17 AM   #49
Croff
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Hello, and sorry foto the delay...
Nitrates now around 1, phosphates 0.03. Dosing AF products except Pro Bio S and NP Pro which were substituted by NOPOX almost 1 month ago. Everything looks really good now, coral growing nicely. I also stopped using Zeo Mix and Phosphate Minus, so nutrients are maintained low using only 1 ml. of NOPOX daily, which is what I was using before starting with AF. I really don't know why Pro Bio S and NP Pro didn't work for me, but I have tried for several months without success.


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