DIY Sulfur Denitrator - Page 2

djfrankie · 01/09/2008, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by asch803
maybe i missed it, but in the pic you just posted of it working currently, where does the hose next to the effluent and off the "T" go? One other thought, would it be too difficult/expensive to use a 4" clear tube for the body rather than the pvc?

That is the feed from my return pump.

Using the clear tube would be nicer and also more expensive. I used what was simpler and cheaper for me.

HTH,
djfrankie

asch803 · 01/12/2008, 12:44 PM

a few more questions if you don't mind...instead of using my return pump to feed the denitrator, could i use a maxijet 12? would that be powerful enough? Second question, where did you get the acrylic for the top or where could i get some? what do you mean when you say you were tapping - is that making threads? last question, if i don't have a router, could i use a jigsaw to cut the plexi-glass piece and for the top? Obviously, it'll be tougher to make a perfect circle, but that shouldn't matter too much on the plexi, for the top it might...

Thanks!!!

Andy

djfrankie · 01/12/2008, 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by asch803
a few more questions if you don't mind...instead of using my return pump to feed the denitrator, could i use a maxijet 12? would that be powerful enough? Second question, where did you get the acrylic for the top or where could i get some? what do you mean when you say you were tapping - is that making threads? last question, if i don't have a router, could i use a jigsaw to cut the plexi-glass piece and for the top? Obviously, it'll be tougher to make a perfect circle, but that shouldn't matter too much on the plexi, for the top it might...

Thanks!!!

Andy

No problem with the questions.

I would use an Aqualifter to feed the reactor. If you have the maxijet laying around sure can use it.

I got the acrylic from Juliovideo (scraps) you can get scraps from anyone close to you or pm me and I'll send you a piece.

Tapping is making threads.

You can only use what you've got. So a jigsaw would have to do. You can use sandpaper to rough out the edges.

Let me know if you've got any other questions and I'll be happy to help.

djfrankie

asch803 · 01/12/2008, 04:01 PM

thanks for getting back so quickly...i'll check w/ the shop teacher at my school, i'm guessing he has a router...who makes the Aqualifter? i do have several mj1200's though...i'm gonna pm and would love if you could send me some of the acrylic scrap, thanks!

Andy

asch803 · 01/12/2008, 08:29 PM

another question, please...what keeps the media in the chamber from being pulled into the maxijet intake? the 1/2 pvc slides in 1" into the chamber. do the holes need to be above where the mdia will be inside the chamber or does that not matter? i'll do the same thing with a sppnge, then sulfor a sponge and then some arm and then another sponge.

thanks!

Andy

djfrankie · 01/13/2008, 02:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by asch803
another question, please...what keeps the media in the chamber from being pulled into the maxijet intake? the 1/2 pvc slides in 1" into the chamber. do the holes need to be above where the mdia will be inside the chamber or does that not matter? i'll do the same thing with a sppnge, then sulfor a sponge and then some arm and then another sponge.

thanks!

Andy

The sulfur media is covered with ARM media since the lower PH helps dissolve some of the aragonite and helps with the calcium and alkalinity (not by much, but it does).

The pump does not pull the media.

Check out the diagram I just made and see if it makes a little more sense now?

asch803 · 01/13/2008, 07:00 AM

YES, that makes perfect sense now! GREAT diagram! So no need for filter foam on top of the arm? you used about a 50/50 ratio of sulfur and arm in your denitrator? Did you notice or are you noticing that your chaeto is dying off now that your nitrates are zero? I remember reading that when i unsuccessfukky tried to use my mtc pro-cal as a sulfur reactor - it just never worked...that's why i'm doing this and at some point i'll going to go back to using the pro-cal for its proper use, as a calcium reactor. right now i don't have too many corals, so my calium demand isn't too high.

Black71gp · 01/13/2008, 01:43 PM

I am having issues with my large system. I have about 1200 gallons or so.. and nitrates will not drop below 50. I am dosing over 65ml of vodka and just not working. this would be my next step... so how much and what size reactor would i need to build to handle 1200 gallons?

Fish2reef · 01/14/2008, 08:56 PM

I was referred to this thread by cubano, great thread.

seattownreefer · 01/14/2008, 09:19 PM

thanks for the diy! might have to try if my phosban reactor diy doesnt work

djfrankie · 01/14/2008, 10:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Black71gp
I am having issues with my large system. I have about 1200 gallons or so.. and nitrates will not drop below 50. I am dosing over 65ml of vodka and just not working. this would be my next step... so how much and what size reactor would i need to build to handle 1200 gallons?

Wow that's a big system!

For a system that big two of this diy would be sufficient and about 10 pounds of sulfur media. I recommend 2 reactors instead of one because they would be easier to clean and once your nitrates go down you might be able to do with just one.

IMHO,
djfrankie

djfrankie · 01/14/2008, 10:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Fish2reef
I was referred to this thread by cubano, great thread.

You're welcome...just trying to help :-)

djfrankie

Black71gp · 01/15/2008, 07:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by djfrankie
Wow that's a big system!

For a system that big two of this diy would be sufficient and about 10 pounds of sulfur media. I recommend 2 reactors instead of one because they would be easier to clean and once your nitrates go down you might be able to do with just one.

IMHO,
djfrankie

ok how many lbs are in a container of sulfur??? I have a bunch of 6" PVC i can use.. what style reactor would you recommend building... the pancake type.. should it be clear?? can i make it square???? thanks for any help

djfrankie · 01/16/2008, 12:38 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Black71gp
ok how many lbs are in a container of sulfur??? I have a bunch of 6" PVC i can use.. what style reactor would you recommend building... the pancake type.. should it be clear?? can i make it square???? thanks for any help

I don't know how many pounds in a container. I bought my media from premiumaquatics and it is sold by the pound. If you're talking about the new Caribsea media that is sold in the gallon I wouldn't know.

djfrankie

klasiksb · 01/17/2008, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by djfrankie
You have experience with Sulfur or with coil denitrators?

The amount of media determines how big of a tank you can run it in, not the size of the chamber. In other words, as long as the media fits it's ok. The amount of media that I bought is good up to 250 gallon tanks. In most cases, once the nitrates have come down to near zero levels you have to remove some of the media. The sulfur media works very well.

Hope this answers your question.

djfrankie

I had purchased the small sulfer reactor from Midwest Aquatic. My system size was slightly larger than what the unit was recommended for, but they guy said it would be fine. I never got that unit to put out 0 nitrates after 3 months and couldn't figure out why. Luckily, they extended my money back quarantee so I sent it back and got a full refund. They only conclusion I came to was that the unit (media amount) was too small for my situation.

Trying again with a custom unit (different size system as well) so crossing my fingers. I will try and update this thread as results come in, along with some pics.

klasiksb · 01/17/2008, 02:23 PM

One other thing, are you using the Caribsea LSM media that comes in a 1 gal. jug, which is approx. 10lbs. of media? If you are, I assume your using 2 gal., right?

djfrankie · 01/17/2008, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by klasiksb
One other thing, are you using the Caribsea LSM media that comes in a 1 gal. jug, which is approx. 10lbs. of media? If you are, I assume your using 2 gal., right?

No, I'm using the media from PA, which is the same as the media from midwest.

Is there 10 pounds of media in that one gallon of Caribsea LSM?

Also check out this other thread here in RC by "chicken". There is a link at the very bottom of the thread at this time that is very worthwhile to read.

In summary, a couple of modifications can be made, for example:

Adding Seachem Matrix in addition to the sulfur media.
Controlling / Monitoring the unit using ORP.
Using a separate vessel for the ARM media so the unit does not have to be opened as much.

Pretty good article to read. The more info we can get the better we can make this thing work.

djfrankie.

bored4long · 01/17/2008, 06:52 PM

Great writeup! I've been trying to come up with a 3-stage system that would hold the Sulfur, ARM and Carbon in different cannisters. I think I'm going to apply your approach but break it down into 3 smaller pvc cannisters and the pump would pull from stage 3 back to stage 1. Can you think of anything wrong with that?

What pump are you using for recirculating? Do you feel it is too strong, too weak or perfect?

klasiksb · 01/17/2008, 07:18 PM

djfrankie, I found the thread you were talking about and it was very helpful. Registered on that site, but haven't recieved an email yet so I can post there, got a few more questions maybe you can answer.

My system size is roughly 200-220gal. HEAVY bio-load. My reactor is 6" OD x 20" tall with a Mag 2 recirculating pump. I have the Caribsea LSM media (1 gal. container) so that gives me about 10" of Sulfur media in the unit.

I'm wondering, since the unit isn't even cycled yet, if I should remove all the media and go with the Matrix/Sulfur combo, or just leave it alone with Sulfur only?

If I do go with the Matrix, any idea how much I should order and how much Sulfur I should use then? Would like to stick with the Sulfur (although probably not the ideal kind) I've got, since i've got it already.

Hope to get me email conformation soon so I can ask some questions there as well.

djfrankie · 01/17/2008, 11:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by klasiksb
djfrankie, I found the thread you were talking about and it was very helpful. Registered on that site, but haven't recieved an email yet so I can post there, got a few more questions maybe you can answer.

My system size is roughly 200-220gal. HEAVY bio-load. My reactor is 6" OD x 20" tall with a Mag 2 recirculating pump. I have the Caribsea LSM media (1 gal. container) so that gives me about 10" of Sulfur media in the unit.

I'm wondering, since the unit isn't even cycled yet, if I should remove all the media and go with the Matrix/Sulfur combo, or just leave it alone with Sulfur only?

If I do go with the Matrix, any idea how much I should order and how much Sulfur I should use then? Would like to stick with the Sulfur (although probably not the ideal kind) I've got, since i've got it already.

Hope to get me email conformation soon so I can ask some questions there as well.

Hi,

I would give it a try with the Seachem Matrix and the media you already have just because it makes sense

The other guy that has experience with the Seachem Matrix recommends 1/3 of the media to go with the Sulfur media. For example, 10" of Sulfur then try 3-4" of Matrix.

The idea behind setting up a separate vessel for the aragonite makes sense. It would be easier to replenish and you wouldn't disrupt the anaerobic nitrate consuming bacteria that are already established in the Sulfur reactor.

I'm glad you guys are willing to experiment with this. I hope we can all benefit from the information being shared here and elsewhere regarding Sulfur denitrators.

HTH,
djfrankie

djfrankie · 01/17/2008, 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bored4long
Great writeup! I've been trying to come up with a 3-stage system that would hold the Sulfur, ARM and Carbon in different cannisters. I think I'm going to apply your approach but break it down into 3 smaller pvc cannisters and the pump would pull from stage 3 back to stage 1. Can you think of anything wrong with that?

What pump are you using for recirculating? Do you feel it is too strong, too weak or perfect?

My pump (maxijet 1200) is working fine on my system. Remember this is the only pump I had laying around at the time.

I would assume if you want to run three canisters in your setup you would have to use a stronger pump. The pump would definitely have to overcome higher head pressure.

I love Eheim pumps and would problably buy one of them for that 3 canister setup.

HTH,
djfrankie

hankclaussen · 01/18/2008, 02:08 AM

Is the carbon in the 3 stage setup to keep the sulfur out of the tank water? How effective is that if so? Finally, I am not sure I understand how a controller could shut the system entirely off unless it was fed by another pump, rather than the main circulatory pump. I might be missing something, but the maxijet is for recirculation, while the tank's main pump supplies the nitrate rich tank water? A controller could shut off a inlet pump and the recirculation pump... A sensor for sulfur exists?

Forgive me for the plethora of questions, and thanks for the help and great build instructions. I want to build one, but am worried about pumping sulfur in my tank.

djfrankie · 01/18/2008, 04:55 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by hankclaussen
Is the carbon in the 3 stage setup to keep the sulfur out of the tank water? How effective is that if so? Finally, I am not sure I understand how a controller could shut the system entirely off unless it was fed by another pump, rather than the main circulatory pump. I might be missing something, but the maxijet is for recirculation, while the tank's main pump supplies the nitrate rich tank water? A controller could shut off a inlet pump and the recirculation pump... A sensor for sulfur exists?

Forgive me for the plethora of questions, and thanks for the help and great build instructions. I want to build one, but am worried about pumping sulfur in my tank.

First of all WELCOME to RC!

Check out this thread regarding monitoring / controlling a Sullfur denitrator using an ORP controller.

http://www.njreefers.org/joomla/inde...6&topic=4537.0

Hydrogen Sulfide is the end product of using Sulfur in a reactor. Sulfur is naturally found in NSW. I believe you need to be more aware and concerned about nitrite, Alk and ph levels out of the effluent side more than anything else.

A great read if you're into the origins of a sulfur denitrator can be found here as well:

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...readid=1270536

HTH,
djfrankie

bored4long · 01/18/2008, 12:28 PM

I thought about adding the carbon stage because another DIY thread used that approach (the thread that is using the RO cannisters).

I read the NJReefers thread last night. An excellent read! I'm definitely going to get an ORP meter now.

But it didn't look like Carlo's approach uses a recirculating pump. What prompted you to use one? How necessary do you think it is?

hansmatt · 01/18/2008, 01:36 PM

so this idea takes away from the fun of a DIY project, but couldn't you mod a TLF Phosphate reactor and get something similar? Size would be a factor (too small?) and you'd have to drill a port for de-gassing. A continual loop with an intake and output on either side of the pump would be a pretty easy. Any thoughts?

01/13/2008, 01:43 PM	#33
Black71gp Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Michigan Posts: 1,186	I am having issues with my large system. I have about 1200 gallons or so.. and nitrates will not drop below 50. I am dosing over 65ml of vodka and just not working. this would be my next step... so how much and what size reactor would i need to build to handle 1200 gallons? __________________ Jarrod MASM president Current Tank Info: 315 reef... with a 900 gallon lagoon. and 100 gallon skimmer :)

01/17/2008, 02:23 PM	#41
klasiksb Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: wisconsin Posts: 1,281	One other thing, are you using the Caribsea LSM media that comes in a 1 gal. jug, which is approx. 10lbs. of media? If you are, I assume your using 2 gal., right? __________________ Just a girl looking to build a little piece of heaven on earth, without killing it!

01/17/2008, 06:52 PM	#43
bored4long Registered Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Roseville, CA Posts: 2,690	Great writeup! I've been trying to come up with a 3-stage system that would hold the Sulfur, ARM and Carbon in different cannisters. I think I'm going to apply your approach but break it down into 3 smaller pvc cannisters and the pump would pull from stage 3 back to stage 1. Can you think of anything wrong with that? What pump are you using for recirculating? Do you feel it is too strong, too weak or perfect? __________________ - Mark

01/17/2008, 07:18 PM	#44
klasiksb Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: wisconsin Posts: 1,281	djfrankie, I found the thread you were talking about and it was very helpful. Registered on that site, but haven't recieved an email yet so I can post there, got a few more questions maybe you can answer. My system size is roughly 200-220gal. HEAVY bio-load. My reactor is 6" OD x 20" tall with a Mag 2 recirculating pump. I have the Caribsea LSM media (1 gal. container) so that gives me about 10" of Sulfur media in the unit. I'm wondering, since the unit isn't even cycled yet, if I should remove all the media and go with the Matrix/Sulfur combo, or just leave it alone with Sulfur only? If I do go with the Matrix, any idea how much I should order and how much Sulfur I should use then? Would like to stick with the Sulfur (although probably not the ideal kind) I've got, since i've got it already. Hope to get me email conformation soon so I can ask some questions there as well. __________________ Just a girl looking to build a little piece of heaven on earth, without killing it!

01/18/2008, 12:28 PM	#49
bored4long Registered Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Roseville, CA Posts: 2,690	I thought about adding the carbon stage because another DIY thread used that approach (the thread that is using the RO cannisters). I read the NJReefers thread last night. An excellent read! I'm definitely going to get an ORP meter now. But it didn't look like Carlo's approach uses a recirculating pump. What prompted you to use one? How necessary do you think it is? __________________ - Mark

01/12/2008, 12:44 PM	#27
asch803 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Northern, New Jersey Posts: 335	a few more questions if you don't mind...instead of using my return pump to feed the denitrator, could i use a maxijet 12? would that be powerful enough? Second question, where did you get the acrylic for the top or where could i get some? what do you mean when you say you were tapping - is that making threads? last question, if i don't have a router, could i use a jigsaw to cut the plexi-glass piece and for the top? Obviously, it'll be tougher to make a perfect circle, but that shouldn't matter too much on the plexi, for the top it might... Thanks!!! Andy

01/12/2008, 04:01 PM	#29
asch803 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Northern, New Jersey Posts: 335	thanks for getting back so quickly...i'll check w/ the shop teacher at my school, i'm guessing he has a router...who makes the Aqualifter? i do have several mj1200's though...i'm gonna pm and would love if you could send me some of the acrylic scrap, thanks! Andy

01/12/2008, 08:29 PM	#30
asch803 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Northern, New Jersey Posts: 335	another question, please...what keeps the media in the chamber from being pulled into the maxijet intake? the 1/2 pvc slides in 1" into the chamber. do the holes need to be above where the mdia will be inside the chamber or does that not matter? i'll do the same thing with a sppnge, then sulfor a sponge and then some arm and then another sponge. thanks! Andy

01/13/2008, 07:00 AM	#32
asch803 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Northern, New Jersey Posts: 335	YES, that makes perfect sense now! GREAT diagram! So no need for filter foam on top of the arm? you used about a 50/50 ratio of sulfur and arm in your denitrator? Did you notice or are you noticing that your chaeto is dying off now that your nitrates are zero? I remember reading that when i unsuccessfukky tried to use my mtc pro-cal as a sulfur reactor - it just never worked...that's why i'm doing this and at some point i'll going to go back to using the pro-cal for its proper use, as a calcium reactor. right now i don't have too many corals, so my calium demand isn't too high.

01/14/2008, 08:56 PM	#34
Fish2reef Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 1,615	I was referred to this thread by cubano, great thread.

01/14/2008, 09:19 PM	#35
seattownreefer Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: seattle Posts: 121	thanks for the diy! might have to try if my phosban reactor diy doesnt work

01/18/2008, 02:08 AM	#47
hankclaussen Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Stafford, TX Posts: 70	Is the carbon in the 3 stage setup to keep the sulfur out of the tank water? How effective is that if so? Finally, I am not sure I understand how a controller could shut the system entirely off unless it was fed by another pump, rather than the main circulatory pump. I might be missing something, but the maxijet is for recirculation, while the tank's main pump supplies the nitrate rich tank water? A controller could shut off a inlet pump and the recirculation pump... A sensor for sulfur exists? Forgive me for the plethora of questions, and thanks for the help and great build instructions. I want to build one, but am worried about pumping sulfur in my tank.

01/18/2008, 01:36 PM	#50
hansmatt Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Western Wisconsin Posts: 681	so this idea takes away from the fun of a DIY project, but couldn't you mod a TLF Phosphate reactor and get something similar? Size would be a factor (too small?) and you'd have to drill a port for de-gassing. A continual loop with an intake and output on either side of the pump would be a pretty easy. Any thoughts?