Lignite carbon causes HLLE?

Grendel0501 · 05/01/2012, 12:18 AM

I know its just a single study, and there is probably alot of research left on this topic. But it has me worried....

I was going to get afew pound of BRS's lignite carbon, but after reading that lignite dust may be a cause for HLLE I can't decide (I love my tang).

From reading the article it seems to mainly be the dust from the carbon that can cause it. I know to rinse my carbon, but I have a tendecy to be lazy and know that occasionally I wouldn't get all the dust out before putting it into the tank.

Opinions?

Would adding a 200 (or maybe 100) micron sock to the carbon reactor's return be sufficent to catch the carbon fines left over from rinsing?

Should I avoid lignite carbon all together?

bertoni · 05/01/2012, 12:27 AM

I suspect that the lignite would be fine, but the ROX might be a good choice for piece of mind.

Grendel0501 · 05/01/2012, 12:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bertoni

I suspect that the lignite would be fine, but the ROX might be a good choice for piece of mind.

I'm using a TLF reactor, I think the ROX is so small it would make it through the filter. Maybe some modding would hold it in place.

bertoni · 05/01/2012, 01:10 AM

A sponge might help with the ROX, but I probably would just be careful when rinsing and use the lignite

Grendel0501 · 05/01/2012, 01:31 AM

Yeah I'd prefer the lignite, the ROX just seems so expensive. Add to that I'll probably be running GFO and pellets as well as the carbon. Seems like overkill.

I may go ahead and get the lignite, and run a filter sock on the output.

Dino · 05/01/2012, 04:07 AM

This thread has been moved to the current forum.

Randy Holmes-Farley · 05/01/2012, 04:47 AM

There are lots of theories on HLLE, including GAC fines and GAC low organic levels (leaving toxic metals more free to be toxic).

I had substantial effects on yellow tang dorsal fins for years when using Marineland Black Diamond, which was very dusty with lots of fines. It has been suggested that such an effect is a form of HLLE. I also had a lot of HLLE problems with Hippo tangs. With my current yellow tang I use ROX carbon (no dust) and see no such effects (I do not have a hippo).

So whether it is coincidence or an actual cause, I am sticking with the ROX and will not switch back.

Wistler · 05/01/2012, 05:52 AM

Randy,

Is this what your tang looked like?

My tang is in a 46 gallon tank and developed this condition after about the 7th week. I have had him since December and he was really healthy prior to going into QT while I left the display fallow for Ich for almost 9 weeks.

I suspect the water flow and quality may not have been optimal, although I have a seeded filter pad and was doing water changes every 4-5 days and Nitrates and Ammonia were always almost .20 and below.

This tang is very active, eats everything and doesn't seem any worse for wear. I can't decide whether to keep feeding him in here now that the ammonia has dropped to zero, or put him back in the 180.

I am feeding Spectrum pellets, Mysis, bloodworms, and nori all soaked with Selcon, Vitachem and Zoe on alternating basis.

My 180 tank and its inhabitants are all looking great so I didn't want to risk putting this tank in there, but I feel the QT may be making matters worse since its an unnatural setting.
Thanks,

Larry

alprazo · 05/01/2012, 07:58 PM

For those that have not read the study, here is the abstract.

http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/1...59.2011.608608

RegalAngel · 05/02/2012, 08:38 AM

http://www.coralmagazine-us.com/cont...king-gun-found

Randy Holmes-Farley · 05/02/2012, 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wistler

Randy,

Is this what your tang looked like?

No, the dorsal fine of mine was basically disappearing, especially the tissue between the "spines". Happened to two different tangs at different times.

Wistler · 05/04/2012, 09:13 PM

I figured I would post a pic of my yellow tang taken three days after the one above. I left him as the sole occupant of the QT tank and did a 15 gallon water change, he showed marked improvement.

All the redness disappeared from his fins and body almost overnight. I then fed him vitamin and Selcon soaked food for three days and made the guess that the water quality or stess of QT with others was causing his redness.

Since he already had 8 weeks of QT with a tour of Cu and Prazipro I hoped he was 99% parasite free. Since none of his QT buddies had any odd symptoms I ruled out something bacterial.

I decided to put him in the 180 tank and he has been doing great and is bright and active as ever. I look forward to the pitting around his eyes to completely grow back over the next few weeks.

05/01/2012, 12:18 AM	#1
Grendel0501 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Memphis Tn Posts: 434	Lignite carbon causes HLLE? I know its just a single study, and there is probably alot of research left on this topic. But it has me worried.... I was going to get afew pound of BRS's lignite carbon, but after reading that lignite dust may be a cause for HLLE I can't decide (I love my tang). From reading the article it seems to mainly be the dust from the carbon that can cause it. I know to rinse my carbon, but I have a tendecy to be lazy and know that occasionally I wouldn't get all the dust out before putting it into the tank. Opinions? Would adding a 200 (or maybe 100) micron sock to the carbon reactor's return be sufficent to catch the carbon fines left over from rinsing? Should I avoid lignite carbon all together?

05/01/2012, 12:27 AM	#2
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 68,513	I suspect that the lignite would be fine, but the ROX might be a good choice for piece of mind. __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

05/01/2012, 01:10 AM	#4
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 68,513	A sponge might help with the ROX, but I probably would just be careful when rinsing and use the lignite __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

05/01/2012, 04:07 AM	#6
Dino Freak of Nature Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Finding my way back to the boondocks Posts: 8,484	This thread has been moved to the current forum. __________________ Cody On facebook? Visit the Reef Central Facebook page by clicking my username and visiting my homepage!

05/01/2012, 04:47 AM	#7
Randy Holmes-Farley Reef Chemist Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Arlington, Massachusetts Posts: 81,937	There are lots of theories on HLLE, including GAC fines and GAC low organic levels (leaving toxic metals more free to be toxic). I had substantial effects on yellow tang dorsal fins for years when using Marineland Black Diamond, which was very dusty with lots of fines. It has been suggested that such an effect is a form of HLLE. I also had a lot of HLLE problems with Hippo tangs. With my current yellow tang I use ROX carbon (no dust) and see no such effects (I do not have a hippo). So whether it is coincidence or an actual cause, I am sticking with the ROX and will not switch back. __________________ Randy Holmes-Farley Club 65535 Current Tank Info: 120 mixed reef

05/01/2012, 01:31 AM	#5
Grendel0501 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Memphis Tn Posts: 434	Yeah I'd prefer the lignite, the ROX just seems so expensive. Add to that I'll probably be running GFO and pellets as well as the carbon. Seems like overkill. I may go ahead and get the lignite, and run a filter sock on the output.

05/01/2012, 05:52 AM	#8
Wistler Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Winston-Salem, NC Posts: 207	Hlle Randy, Is this what your tang looked like? My tang is in a 46 gallon tank and developed this condition after about the 7th week. I have had him since December and he was really healthy prior to going into QT while I left the display fallow for Ich for almost 9 weeks. I suspect the water flow and quality may not have been optimal, although I have a seeded filter pad and was doing water changes every 4-5 days and Nitrates and Ammonia were always almost .20 and below. This tang is very active, eats everything and doesn't seem any worse for wear. I can't decide whether to keep feeding him in here now that the ammonia has dropped to zero, or put him back in the 180. I am feeding Spectrum pellets, Mysis, bloodworms, and nori all soaked with Selcon, Vitachem and Zoe on alternating basis. My 180 tank and its inhabitants are all looking great so I didn't want to risk putting this tank in there, but I feel the QT may be making matters worse since its an unnatural setting. Thanks, Larry __________________ 90 Gallon Reef with 29 Gal sump/ 40 Gal fuge. GFO reactor, ATO, Cadlights 1050 Skimmer 180 FOWLR, 55 gal Sump, BRS GFO/Carbon Reactor, AQUA UV 57watt 46 Bowfront QT tank with sump

05/01/2012, 07:58 PM	#9
alprazo salt '82, reef '88 Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Delaware Posts: 993 Blog Entries: 4	For those that have not read the study, here is the abstract. http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/1...59.2011.608608 __________________ Saltwater since '82, reef '88, sharks '92 "Common sense solutions" is purposefully ignoring science. Current Tank Info: SRO XP8000, RK2 25PE, RF Orca 250

05/02/2012, 08:38 AM	#10
RegalAngel Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: The Redwood Reef Posts: 802	http://www.coralmagazine-us.com/cont...king-gun-found

05/04/2012, 09:13 PM	#12
Wistler Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Winston-Salem, NC Posts: 207	I figured I would post a pic of my yellow tang taken three days after the one above. I left him as the sole occupant of the QT tank and did a 15 gallon water change, he showed marked improvement. All the redness disappeared from his fins and body almost overnight. I then fed him vitamin and Selcon soaked food for three days and made the guess that the water quality or stess of QT with others was causing his redness. Since he already had 8 weeks of QT with a tour of Cu and Prazipro I hoped he was 99% parasite free. Since none of his QT buddies had any odd symptoms I ruled out something bacterial. I decided to put him in the 180 tank and he has been doing great and is bright and active as ever. I look forward to the pitting around his eyes to completely grow back over the next few weeks. __________________ 90 Gallon Reef with 29 Gal sump/ 40 Gal fuge. GFO reactor, ATO, Cadlights 1050 Skimmer 180 FOWLR, 55 gal Sump, BRS GFO/Carbon Reactor, AQUA UV 57watt 46 Bowfront QT tank with sump