Is this ich?

Weboh · 12/03/2018, 08:40 PM

I noticed my Potters angel's colors are duller, and upon closer inspection, I think I see ich. I hope not. What do you think? Is it just stressed? Some other infection? https://postimg.cc/gallery/30pmnx27w/ Sorry I can't get a better picture. It just keeps swimming, just keeps swimming...

Scott07 · 12/04/2018, 06:34 AM

Really difficult to tell from the pictures. I think in the second one it looks like it has some nipped or injured fins, but I can't zoom in far enough to tell you anything about ich.

Hope he pulls through! I have a potters as well and they have great personality.

Uncle99 · 12/04/2018, 10:04 AM

Can't see anything with those pics, what do you see which make you think Ick?

Weboh · 12/16/2018, 02:52 PM

A couple other fish seem to be infected too. I'm not sure if it's ich or just an infection, but something seems to be stressing them out and my water tested normal (except for salinity that's a little high but I've been lowering it over the past week or so while still seeing the fish stressed like this). Is it possibly some other kind of infection? How would I help the fish?

https://postimg.cc/gallery/dyectx0c/

wrott · 12/16/2018, 04:33 PM

Looks like fin-rot, probably bacterial.
It can be caused by stress from over crowding, poor water quality and diet.
You could also have ich that would leave a wound for bacterial infection.
Is that a coral beauty that you had w/ the potters'?
You may have too many fish. I'd do WCs and start some antibiotics. Be careful not to pollute the water too much w/ medicine--this is very stressful, do many WCs.

slief · 12/16/2018, 04:34 PM

Really hard to tell from those pictures but its eyes look cloudy which could be an indications flukes.

Weboh · 12/16/2018, 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wrott

Looks like fin-rot, probably bacterial.
It can be caused by stress from over crowding, poor water quality and diet.
You could also have ich that would leave a wound for bacterial infection.
Is that a coral beauty that you had w/ the potter's?

I took the pictures to my LFS, and the guy there thought it may be the coral beauty and potter's fought. They were fine together for a couple months, but he thought maybe after one matured to a certain it then got territorial. The potter's thinks the whole tank is its territory which I like because it's fun seeing it dart across like a tang, but I really like coral beauty angelfish too, and they both complement each other's looks...

So maybe the fish nipping at each other made wounds that made them open to bacterial infections. My LFS gave me a reef safe medicine that's supposed to cure a lot of things (but not ich). He didn't think it was ich, but it was hard to tell from the pictures. So I'll just have to hope it's not ich.

Ich doesn't just appear in the tank anyway, right? It would have to come from an infected fish? The most recent fish I got was a ruby dragonette, which is immune to ich, as far I know (because of a slime coat or something? Or is that just the mandarin dragonettes?). Could it still be a carrier? I got it around the same time as this problem, come to think of it (I also haven't seen it in awhile, so I'm not sure it's alive)...

Quote:

Originally Posted by slief

Really hard to tell from those pictures but its eyes look cloudy which could be an indications flukes.

Yeah, I really wish I could take a better picture...

Any advice would be helpful. Thanks!

wrott · 12/16/2018, 11:30 PM

I agree with your assessment. If ich was going to kill, it would have--fish usually stop eating and die.
What size tank?
It really looks like bacterial infection. Are they still eating?

Weboh · 12/17/2018, 09:20 AM

It's a 60 gallon tank. They're still eating.

Weboh · 12/24/2018, 08:36 AM

Well, I thought I'd solved the problem. I put in the antibiotic, and the potter's angel started to get his color back. But he disappeared a few days ago and is presumed dead. I did a water change and turned back on the skimmer to get the antibiotic out, since I know that can be stressful to the fish.

Now my clownfish have what clearly looks like ich. Ugh. I guess it was ich all along.
https://postimg.cc/gallery/36fih92xo/

Or maybe marine velvet? That's a kind of important distinction. Can you guys tell from the pictures? I actually got a good one this time!

outssider · 12/24/2018, 04:27 PM

your pictures are still not clear enough for definite I.D....but it doesn't look like ick to me. ick has very distinctive white dots about the size of salt (maybe slightly larger)

Weboh · 12/27/2018, 06:23 PM

I got a new camera. Fingers crossed this is good enough quality: https://postimg.cc/gallery/14diigjfs/

Weboh · 12/29/2018, 09:29 PM

What do you guys think? Something's definitely wrong with the clownfish. If it's not ich, she's at least stressed and lethargic. Food does still motivate her. Since clownfish are usually very hardy, isn't a sick clownfish a sign that something's really wrong? I just tested again and all parameters are normal, expect for a little high salinity (1.028).

Uncle99 · 12/29/2018, 09:49 PM

Looks like Brooklynella to me.
If you agree, review stickies on treatment, which should include, fresh water dip, put in Hyposalinity QT until you have formalin for treatment.

At least that's what I see in the pics, don't look like Ick at all.

Weboh · 12/29/2018, 10:07 PM

Thanks! The disease does sound like what I have. The page says it's usually brought in with chromis and I did get some not long ago and had one mysteriously disappear. I guess the parasite killed it and then hid in the sand for awhile before returning with a vengeance.

I don't have a QT, so I guess the best way to treat is to RO dip the clownfish and then treat the whole tank with Acriflavin?

Uncle99 · 12/30/2018, 08:17 AM

When looking at the dates, the clown infection problem goes back two weeks.
That should rule out Brooklynella as your fish should be dead by now, it's a quick killer. In addition, you say they eat fine, a Brooklynella affected fish would not eat, progressively lathargic behavior.

The other option could be Lymphocystis, somewhat can look the same, but pics are a but fuzzy on my end. The good news here is that it does not čause health problems, but makes the fish look terrible. If you see little cauliflower type things, that would be enough for a reasonable diagnosis.

To my knowledge, there is no effect treatment for this infection, the fish must overcome the infection itself, but great stable water and good high protein foods can help lower stress and boost immune.

To be successful with diseases, we must be able to accurately diagnos, sorry, the pics are a bit fuzzy on my end.

In order to treat, you must make the decision of what the infection is, if you cannot reasonably do this any treatment could be worse esoecially if it does turn out to be Lymphocystis

Have a look at Lymphocystis infected fish and see what you think. Observe and record all behavioral changes, maybe lower your salinity to 1.020 which will make it easier for the rush to breath. Down in salinity can be done quickly, but going back up must be done slowly, as a note, no more than .001 or .002 per day.

A simple bucket can be a QT, or a 20g simple glass would be better.
It's a great investment for the future.

Good luck!

12/03/2018, 08:40 PM	#1
Weboh Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2016 Location: St. Petersburg, FL Posts: 217	Is this ich? I noticed my Potters angel's colors are duller, and upon closer inspection, I think I see ich. I hope not. What do you think? Is it just stressed? Some other infection? https://postimg.cc/gallery/30pmnx27w/ Sorry I can't get a better picture. It just keeps swimming, just keeps swimming...

12/04/2018, 06:34 AM	#2
Scott07 Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: Pittsburgh, PA Posts: 384	Really difficult to tell from the pictures. I think in the second one it looks like it has some nipped or injured fins, but I can't zoom in far enough to tell you anything about ich. Hope he pulls through! I have a potters as well and they have great personality. __________________ 65 gallon mixed reef Good maintainence and husbandry is a cumulative effect, not a single event.

12/16/2018, 04:33 PM	#5
wrott Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Alabama Posts: 2,912	Looks like fin-rot, probably bacterial. It can be caused by stress from over crowding, poor water quality and diet. You could also have ich that would leave a wound for bacterial infection. Is that a coral beauty that you had w/ the potters'? You may have too many fish. I'd do WCs and start some antibiotics. Be careful not to pollute the water too much w/ medicine--this is very stressful, do many WCs. __________________ OK, but where does the meat go! ------------------------------------------------ 120g SPS, 125g mix, 56g FOWLR, 20g qt

12/16/2018, 04:34 PM	#6
slief RC Sponsor Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 14,173	Really hard to tell from those pictures but its eyes look cloudy which could be an indications flukes. __________________ Director Customer Support Royal Exclusiv USA For All Royal Exclusiv & Bubble King questions please refer to our Sponsor forum: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/fo...play.php?f=745 Current Tank Info: 480G display mixed reef, 90G sump, 90G refugium, 60G display refugium. Check out my build thread: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1783476

12/16/2018, 11:30 PM	#8
wrott Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Alabama Posts: 2,912	I agree with your assessment. If ich was going to kill, it would have--fish usually stop eating and die. What size tank? It really looks like bacterial infection. Are they still eating? __________________ OK, but where does the meat go! ------------------------------------------------ 120g SPS, 125g mix, 56g FOWLR, 20g qt

12/04/2018, 10:04 AM	#3
Uncle99 Crab Free Zone Join Date: Sep 2017 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 2,906	Can't see anything with those pics, what do you see which make you think Ick?

12/16/2018, 02:52 PM	#4
Weboh Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2016 Location: St. Petersburg, FL Posts: 217	A couple other fish seem to be infected too. I'm not sure if it's ich or just an infection, but something seems to be stressing them out and my water tested normal (except for salinity that's a little high but I've been lowering it over the past week or so while still seeing the fish stressed like this). Is it possibly some other kind of infection? How would I help the fish? https://postimg.cc/gallery/dyectx0c/

12/17/2018, 09:20 AM	#9
Weboh Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2016 Location: St. Petersburg, FL Posts: 217	It's a 60 gallon tank. They're still eating.

12/24/2018, 08:36 AM	#10
Weboh Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2016 Location: St. Petersburg, FL Posts: 217	Well, I thought I'd solved the problem. I put in the antibiotic, and the potter's angel started to get his color back. But he disappeared a few days ago and is presumed dead. I did a water change and turned back on the skimmer to get the antibiotic out, since I know that can be stressful to the fish. Now my clownfish have what clearly looks like ich. Ugh. I guess it was ich all along. https://postimg.cc/gallery/36fih92xo/ Or maybe marine velvet? That's a kind of important distinction. Can you guys tell from the pictures? I actually got a good one this time! Last edited by Weboh; 12/24/2018 at 08:56 AM.

12/24/2018, 04:27 PM	#11
outssider Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Reseda, Ca. Posts: 1,717	your pictures are still not clear enough for definite I.D....but it doesn't look like ick to me. ick has very distinctive white dots about the size of salt (maybe slightly larger) __________________ Please don't feed the bears because the bears will become dependent on free handouts and forget how to take care of themselves …... Current Tank Info: 75 Gal. Mixed reef mostly sps

12/27/2018, 06:23 PM	#12
Weboh Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2016 Location: St. Petersburg, FL Posts: 217	I got a new camera. Fingers crossed this is good enough quality: https://postimg.cc/gallery/14diigjfs/

12/29/2018, 09:29 PM	#13
Weboh Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2016 Location: St. Petersburg, FL Posts: 217	What do you guys think? Something's definitely wrong with the clownfish. If it's not ich, she's at least stressed and lethargic. Food does still motivate her. Since clownfish are usually very hardy, isn't a sick clownfish a sign that something's really wrong? I just tested again and all parameters are normal, expect for a little high salinity (1.028).

12/29/2018, 09:49 PM	#14
Uncle99 Crab Free Zone Join Date: Sep 2017 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 2,906	Looks like Brooklynella to me. If you agree, review stickies on treatment, which should include, fresh water dip, put in Hyposalinity QT until you have formalin for treatment. At least that's what I see in the pics, don't look like Ick at all.

12/29/2018, 10:07 PM	#15
Weboh Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2016 Location: St. Petersburg, FL Posts: 217	Thanks! The disease does sound like what I have. The page says it's usually brought in with chromis and I did get some not long ago and had one mysteriously disappear. I guess the parasite killed it and then hid in the sand for awhile before returning with a vengeance. I don't have a QT, so I guess the best way to treat is to RO dip the clownfish and then treat the whole tank with Acriflavin?

12/30/2018, 08:17 AM	#16
Uncle99 Crab Free Zone Join Date: Sep 2017 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 2,906	When looking at the dates, the clown infection problem goes back two weeks. That should rule out Brooklynella as your fish should be dead by now, it's a quick killer. In addition, you say they eat fine, a Brooklynella affected fish would not eat, progressively lathargic behavior. The other option could be Lymphocystis, somewhat can look the same, but pics are a but fuzzy on my end. The good news here is that it does not čause health problems, but makes the fish look terrible. If you see little cauliflower type things, that would be enough for a reasonable diagnosis. To my knowledge, there is no effect treatment for this infection, the fish must overcome the infection itself, but great stable water and good high protein foods can help lower stress and boost immune. To be successful with diseases, we must be able to accurately diagnos, sorry, the pics are a bit fuzzy on my end. In order to treat, you must make the decision of what the infection is, if you cannot reasonably do this any treatment could be worse esoecially if it does turn out to be Lymphocystis Have a look at Lymphocystis infected fish and see what you think. Observe and record all behavioral changes, maybe lower your salinity to 1.020 which will make it easier for the rush to breath. Down in salinity can be done quickly, but going back up must be done slowly, as a note, no more than .001 or .002 per day. A simple bucket can be a QT, or a 20g simple glass would be better. It's a great investment for the future. Good luck! Last edited by Uncle99; 12/30/2018 at 08:45 AM.