Do not get a mandarin if...

[CuzzA]

LMAO. Ah yes, a box container of "pods" would be sure to sustain them.

I thought the mandarins did a dance just before lights out throwing eggs and sperm into the water column and so the larva would have to be snatched out with a sine net and then put in a rearing tank. I assume rotifers would be the choice of food for the fry.

[brett559]

I got up this morning while it was still dark outside. My tank lights had been off all night. I got a flashlight and shined it along the side of the tank. I could see what looked like thousands of tiny particles swirling around in the water. There appeared to be some on the glass too, but the water column was just full of little particles. Are these pods?

I've been running a fuge with chaeto for about 8 months. I keep flasher and fairy wrasses.

[CuzzA]

Originally Posted by brett559

I got up this morning while it was still dark outside. My tank lights had been off all night. I got a flashlight and shined it along the side of the tank. I could see what looked like thousands of tiny particles swirling around in the water. There appeared to be some on the glass too, but the water column was just full of little particles. Are these pods?

I've been running a fuge with chaeto for about 8 months. I keep flasher and fairy wrasses.

It's likley they are pods. Every night shortly after my moonlights come on, I have, for lack of a better term, sparkling or flashing little specs swarming throughout the water column. I cannot 100% confirm they are pods, but my bangaii cardinal, pair of clowns and bartletts anthias harem go nuts snatching the unidentified particles from the water. So I think it's safe to assume they are pods and given this is typical of natural reefs where all the zooplankton come out from hiding at night to eat, I'm confident they are some form of small crustacean.

[rt67ghy]

Originally Posted by smittysmith2

I'm probably the newest of the newbies. What are pods?

There are two types of pods we encounter in the marine tank: 1)amphipods 2) copepods.

Pods are crustaceans and look like little bugs. They're usually imported into our system via live rock/live sand/chaeto or other algae from someone else's tank. If given sufficient time and diatoms/cyanobacteria or algae to feed on they multiply and provide an additional and nutritional food source for your small fish which greatly benefits them.

[Paul B]

Are these pods?

They could be pods or the fry of something. That happens all the time in my tank and sometimes it is the babies of shrimp as they hatch live by the thousands. Any small fish that spawns has really tiny fry also. Most of the time, this happens at night for obvious reasons

[CuzzA]

Originally Posted by rt67ghy

There are two types of pods we encounter in the marine tank: 1)amphipods 2) copepods.

Pods are crustaceans and look like little bugs. They're usually imported into our system via live rock/live sand/chaeto or other algae from someone else's tank. If given sufficient time and diatoms/cyanobacteria or algae to feed on they multiply and provide an additional and nutritional food source for your small fish which greatly benefits them.

Isopods too.

Also, just to add some more info. If your system can handle the addition of dosing phytoplankton you'll see an explosion of small crustaceans as that is their number one food source in the wild.

[rt67ghy]

Originally Posted by CuzzA

Isopods too.

Thanks. I didn't know about them. I just did some research and found this interesting article on them.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencete...er-strike.html

It would probably take a shark to eat one of those! lol

[MondoBongo]

good to see this as a sticky. i feel like a broken mp3 sometimes, repeating myself in the dragonet threads. seems like most of the new people on here want a mandy for their 5 gallon pico. facepalm.

these fish are amazing, and incredibly easy to keep, if you give them what they need (proper tank size and food). my girl, Mushu, is the hidden gem in my tank, floating in and out of view in that strange, ethereal way, that only dragonets can.

it has been immensely rewarding to see how far she has come, from a slightly skinny and shy new addition, to a plump and confident star resident.

[hotelbravo]

I have a 90 with a 30 sump. And ive had my mandarin for a while. I have tons of pods it has been seeded with over 15,000 pods and my mandarin is one of the few that will eat other foods. Infact he has ate everything I have put in the tank to include pellets and flakes.
Now to my questions.
I am wanting to buy a male for her and I am worried that I will make it to much of a conpetition for food and they will end up fighting or starving. In your opinion could this work out or should I scratch this idea

[Sk8r]

She might kill the male. THese fish are amazingly placid and inoffensive---but if another mandy moves in where they feel food is getting short---it's deathmatch. 90 might be enough room. 15,000 is not a lot of pods against their consumption: they eat 2000 every couple of hours. Question is how much reproduction do they have in your fuge: if a huge ball of cheato, a lot of repro, they might make it, but you're still up against getting them to pair instead of one killing the other. An eggcrate divider might help, but since they travel the rockwork, this can be hard to set up firmly and effectively and if one can fit through the holes, another problem.

[hotelbravo]

Originally Posted by Sk8r

She might kill the male. THese fish are amazingly placid and inoffensive---but if another mandy moves in where they feel food is getting short---it's deathmatch. 90 might be enough room. 15,000 is not a lot of pods against their consumption: they eat 2000 every couple of hours. Question is how much reproduction do they have in your fuge: if a huge ball of cheato, a lot of repro, they might make it, but you're still up against getting them to pair instead of one killing the other. An eggcrate divider might help, but since they travel the rockwork, this can be hard to set up firmly and effectively and if one can fit through the holes, another problem.

The 15,000 pods that were seeded had many months to repopulate before the mandarin was added.

[JimKelly12203]

And can I take it to the bank that a well set-up fuge with thriving population of pods will continually and automatically feed the DT? That is to say, the pods not only survive the trip through the return pump but do so on the regular?

Again, this is all assuming a thriving population of pods in the DT (120 gal) and the fuge (90 gal sump w/ as much dedicated to fuge as possible) prior to introducing a mandarin.

I have read that the pods survive the trip but it still seems amazing to me.

[Sk8r]

Yes. I've seen even a started amphipod, many times their size, pop out of the return nozzle. They do make the round trip handily, and I have an Iwaki 100, with a gate valve reining it back: this is sort of like traveling through a Cuisinart. They have to travel up from the basement where my sump is located, through about 15 feet of hose and pipe.

This is a prime reason I don't use filter socks or the like. I figure goes-around will come-around again. They WILL breed in the tank rocks, wherever they go, but if you let a mandy near your 'breeding stock' they can cut down on the birth rate astonishingly fast. Some do put upside down strawberry boxes filled with rubble on their sandbed to protect them, sort of a fuge-in-the-DT operation, but a 20 gallon mature rock and moss fuge (or larger) is a great asset.

[flixxx]

I got myself a tiny mandarin 3 months ago. I was prepared for the challenge though and did all the preparation work in advance.

I have 3 condo pods I rotate weekly and Paul B's feeder idea to give him live brine shrimp (I do this once or twice a week). Otherwise he roams around and eats pods.
I also lucked out in a sense that he eats frozen food

Here's a video of him eating from the feeder back in February;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Fiq...ature=youtu.be

And here he is today

[Clowny88]

Originally Posted by flixxx

I got myself a tiny mandarin 3 months ago. I was prepared for the challenge though and did all the preparation work in advance.

I have 3 condo pods I rotate weekly and Paul B's feeder idea to give him live brine shrimp (I do this once or twice a week). Otherwise he roams around and eats pods.
I also lucked out in a sense that he eats frozen food

Here's a video of him eating from the feeder back in February;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Fiq...ature=youtu.be

And here he is today

When you say rotate, what do you mean? Rotating to/from fuge? Separate tank?

Don't mean to hijack... But this seems like one of those experiences that leads to forum gold and I'm sure a lot of us would love to hear more about your 3 month process.

Handsome guy by the way!!

[youcallmenny]

The first LFS my wife and I started the hobby at sold us a$40 ruby dragonet to an unestablished tank. Great info Sk8r!

[flixxx]

Originally Posted by Clowny88

When you say rotate, what do you mean? Rotating to/from fuge? Separate tank?

Don't mean to hijack... But this seems like one of those experiences that leads to forum gold and I'm sure a lot of us would love to hear more about your 3 month process.

Handsome guy by the way!!

That's right, the condo pods stay in the fuge and every week i switch it out. When i got him he wasn't in great shape, his was really thin. Slowly but surely he's fattening up though so i know whatever it is i'm doing is working. I think the brine shrimp help a lot in this instance.

Brine shrimp was a pain in the ***. the 2 liter bottle didn't work well for me as the eggs we're all over the place and I am not good gluing/cutting acrylic to use Paul B's hatchery idea. Then I landed on this gem and it's been the easiest thing.

I start a new batch on Sunday, Monday i get a ton of shrimp to feed. Monday night I add a bit of phytoplankton in the hatchery and I have a bit more brine shrimp to feed the mandarin until Wednesday (Some hatch late and the ones that no longer have their egg sack are gut loaded with phyto)

[Proffugazi]

Originally Posted by OllieDog

I think a mass of rock is just as important, if not more so, then the size of the tank. There is a new ultra minimalistic approach to many tanks these days, where people have very very little live rock and large open swimming areas. In these tanks, They could easily be 100 gallons, but most of it is open sand, and only 20-30 lbs of dense branch rock. These type of tanks do not provide the environment for pods to breed at rates high enough to keep a mandarin. Its not always just about tank size. its about having a ton of real estate for the pods for have a large breeding population.

+1 on That.

I'm working on a Anemone Tank and have a very simple half deep sand bed(4-5 inch deep) with 2 Rios working a UGF on other half. Hang on the back (2-3gal)Pod Farm that feeds into 60gal breeder that then feeds into 600gal a hr overflow into 37 gal sump. that holds GFO/Carbon reactor,reef octopus classic 150NI. I Have Pods on a Biblical Scale, not to mention the 300+ cerith snail babies(lol) that keep everything spotless. My Tank Crawls At Night.....I Have more fear that a Mandarin would get eaten by Pods in my tank lol Then Starve for lack of them.

[MondoBongo]

I would be more worried it would get eaten by the anemones.

[Clowny88]

Originally Posted by Proffugazi

+1 on That.

I'm working on a Anemone Tank and have a very simple half deep sand bed(4-5 inch deep) with 2 Rios working a UGF on other half. Hang on the back (2-3gal)Pod Farm that feeds into 60gal breeder that then feeds into 600gal a hr overflow into 37 gal sump. that holds GFO/Carbon reactor,reef octopus classic 150NI. I Have Pods on a Biblical Scale, not to mention the 300+ cerith snail babies(lol) that keep everything spotless. My Tank Crawls At Night.....I Have more fear that a Mandarin would get eaten by Pods in my tank lol Then Starve for lack of them.

How'd you start your pod farm? What type of pods did you buy to launch the process?

I'm trying to jump start my fuge... Just not sure what to buy.

[Sk8r]

Pod condos are a good thing, be they a small net bag full of rubble, anything you can use to pick up from the fuge and transfer to the DT. They have a double benefit: that they provide breeding places IN the fuge and they provide a means of transport (in a container of water) to the DT to inject a bunch at once. Many LFS's have live rock rubble that can be used for this purpose.

[Sk8r]

The larger the better. And the larger and more mature the fuge the better. If you are working with a 50 gallon, the fuge should be at least 20, and mature, packed with cheato and rock, and it should be a tiny mandy, not one of the larger, with NO competitors for the pods.

[kgravity]

I also think like someone posted earlier, that the amount of rock should really be considered too. I kept a mandarin for two years before I downgraded. he was in a 90g and at first he was fairly thin until I added alot more rock. Also got lucky and started eating micro pellet food though.

[SeeCrabRun]

Can you tell me, does there need to be a male for the female to lay?

Also what does their poop look like, does anyone know?

Twice now I have come upon the tank at night, maybe turning the light on for a moment to check on something, and my ocellated has darted off with what looks like roe then streaming behind and getting caught up in the current.

At first I thought it might be shrimp eggs, but the second time the shrimp was no longer in the tank (moved it to the other tank as it was very aggressive about stealing food from the corals despite how well I kept it fed).

So I've tried to determine if it is eggs or poop, could it be hers or maybe hermit crab? It's very odd. They look like very tiny decapsulated brine eggs in some mucus.

I also put decapsulated eggs in the tank in the diner and the brine hatch and are eaten pretty quickly. I cultivate my own pods as well.

I'm not sure I agree with the 12000 a day, my calculation was 8000 a day, but mine is a 1" dragonet and not a mandarin. *Not trying to argue this point, just wondering about the information.

I'm not sure how different ocellated are from mandarins but mine is thriving. She's like having a newborn, but without the screaming.

[Sk8r]

Number of 'hits' probably does vary with size.
Re poo, long as I have had mandys, I've never noticed what you're observing. I'd blame some other critter. I don't know what, however.