What is the acceptable level of Phosphate in an SPS tank?

MarineGirl411 · 05/30/2007, 11:54 PM

Hi Everyone,
I talked to my LFS lately about phosphate control in my tank. I want to get into SPS more. He said that phosphate is good for building corals skeletons and he doesn't use a phosphate remover, until he sees hair algae or some type of algae. I tested my phosphate levels and they are not detectable. I don't know if I trust my tests though because I have to swipe my glass clean every 2 days. I used a Sechem and Regeant Phosphate test kit. Both came out with the same results. I was going to purchase a Salifert test kit, but I read on here that they are not very accurate. Please let me know. Thank you all so much.

joeycadre · 05/31/2007, 12:08 AM

you want 0. phosphates can brown out your corals.

dukes707 · 05/31/2007, 04:08 AM

0

BAB43 · 05/31/2007, 04:15 AM

0 is best

jeffbrig · 05/31/2007, 04:25 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by MarineGirl411
I tested my phosphate levels and they are not detectable. I don't know if I trust my tests though

I wouldn't trust the test result either. We recently had a water testing session at my local club meeting, and the vast majority of tanks returned "0" using salifert's PO4 kit, including mine. One member brought an Elos kit that measured .07 on my water. Still not sure if that's 100% accurate, as I have good coloration and no hair algae problems. I'm debating picking up a Merck kit sometime down the line or a colorimeter.

While 0 is an admirable goal, commonly accepted practice is that .03 is a good target, as nsw tends to be .03 or lower.

brianbigoats · 05/31/2007, 05:20 AM

with my Hanna Colorimeter i run 0.03-0.00
Any Test PO4 test kit most likely wil read 0 when you are below .1 so 0 is not acually zero the best way to test is w/ Colorimeter

tperk9784 · 05/31/2007, 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by MarineGirl411
He said that phosphate is good for building corals skeletons

Thats the funniest thing I have read in awhile.

fishdoc11 · 05/31/2007, 07:24 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by jeffbrig

While 0 is an admirable goal, commonly accepted practice is that .03 is a good target,

Ditto

MarineGirl411 · 05/31/2007, 10:41 AM

Really? He's a very good and well respected reef keeper here. He said you do need some phosphates because it helps build their skeletons along with calcium and mag. That doesn't sound right huh? Where can I pick up one of those test kits you are talking about? I've never heard of them. I'd appreciate it. Thank you.

jay24k · 05/31/2007, 11:04 AM

Without any phosphates, corals would not live but you don't want too much. I swipe my glass every 2 to 3 days and have no color issues. I think it depends on many things.

MarineGirl411 · 05/31/2007, 11:11 AM

That is what he told me along with the other. I get some green algae down where my glass meets the sand. I can't really scrub down there with my mag float. I also swipe my tank about every other day or every 2 days. Should I invest in a certain phosphate test kit? I have Regeant and Sechem. Another fish guy that sold me my skimmer said the regeant was junk and he'd send me the sechem free if I just paid for shipping. So I did. Is the Sechem not accurate either? My sump/refugium has algae, I even have a little on my skimmer. Light does get on my skimmer though from my Refugium. What specific types of Algae reduce phosphates? I have Chaeto and some Caluerpa I believe. Please let me know. Thank you.

jay24k · 05/31/2007, 12:21 PM

phosphate test kits are worthless. You need the colorimeter mentioned earlier or one of the more expensive ones. I've never tested for it as long as I don't see any issues.

Philwd · 05/31/2007, 12:49 PM

Salifert's kit and most other kits only measure inorganic phosphate. The Merck/Deltec kit and colorimeters measure orthophosphate which is what gets metabolized.

By the time you see HA growing it's way too high. I judge by how long it takes for a diatom film to grow. Any less than 4 days and nutrients have built up. On the Merck kit I get .008. That is plenty for the corals to grow. Anything over .02 on that kit and I'm just feeding algae. Again that is orthophoshate levels not inorganic levels.

Big Boy69 · 05/31/2007, 01:21 PM

Where do you buy a calorimeter? It sounds like you buy it at a healthfood place.

Yinger · 05/31/2007, 01:24 PM

Its the hanna colorimeter or photometer. You can get it here... you'll want the low range

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/produc...pc=1&N=0&Nty=1

delv · 05/31/2007, 04:19 PM

Orthophosphate is inorganic...it's a very stable version...organic phosphate is often reduced to the ortho to measure it. The Hanna (nor any hobbyist) test kit do not reduce organic phosphates to ortho or "free version" to measure it. Either way, you're missing out all organic phosphate that's may be available to life (or algae/corals) but not the test kit.

I would toss the tests and check algae on the glass.

d.

Sohal Tang Tim · 03/29/2011, 12:13 PM

I have a Milwaukee meter...
Phosphate showing .12.... am I in trouble??????

I have hair algae a bit only in refugium only.

Comments/opinions welcome . thanks.

Tim

Allmost · 03/29/2011, 12:17 PM

0.02

PO4 of Zero means no life, cant happen. (but our tests have Issues)

high po4 stops calcification.

bxbe888 · 05/21/2017, 08:22 PM

my PO4 is 0,09 currently, and SPS are not that colorful

Pife · 05/21/2017, 10:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bxbe888

my PO4 is 0,09 currently, and SPS are not that colorful

6 year old thread. That being said there are a lot of things that add up to colorful sps.

All Delight · 05/21/2017, 10:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bxbe888

my PO4 is 0,09 currently, and SPS are not that colorful

If youbrun gfo to.lower it use a little at a time. Lower it too fast could shock your sps.

reefmutt · 05/22/2017, 06:42 AM

Pife thank goodness you mentioned this is a 6 year old thread. I forgot to look as I was reading all of those sort of scary, uninformed posts..
My po4 is currently .2 (elos high resolution test kit) been there for a good 6 months
Here is my Jason Fox flame when I added it about 2 months ago:

And here it is today:

Nitrates: 30-40 and phosphates.18-.22 the whole time.
Now, I DO intend to lower them eventually but I am not in a hurry. I have to do it extremely slowly and would rather do it with bacteria than gfo. I have not used gfo in many months. I find it yoyos the levels and I think this is the most important aspect of nutrients- not necessarily the actual levels but their stability.
Bxbe888, .09 is really not a concern at all. Don't blame the colour of your corals in high po4 because I doubt that is the cause.. not knowing anything about your system, I couldn't say what is the cause, however..
Every time things change in a reef, the corals may brown out a bit. Stability is key. Maturity of the system is important as well.. proper lighting, parameters etc these all play a role.

Denadai · 05/22/2017, 12:36 PM

0.02 ppm is a good target

I´m keeping po4 = 0.02ppm and no3 = 1 / 3 ppm. Better color and growth

Best Regards

Stolireef · 05/22/2017, 04:34 PM

I never check phosphates. Rather, I use algae as my guide so long as my chaeto is growing and I have little to no algae in my display, I assume phosphates are where they need to be. I've been doing quite a bit of reading lately particularly on tanks that have been up more than a couple of years and that have great SPS results. Almost all of them have surprisingly high nutrients. Nitrates above 10 and phospates closing in on .1.

The other thing is that if you are growing algae anywhere in the tank, you don't have 0 phosphate or nitrates.

Denadai · 05/22/2017, 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stolireef

I never check phosphates. Rather, I use algae as my guide so long as my chaeto is growing and I have little to no algae in my display, I assume phosphates are where they need to be. I've been doing quite a bit of reading lately particularly on tanks that have been up more than a couple of years and that have great SPS results. Almost all of them have surprisingly high nutrients. Nitrates above 10 and phospates closing in on .1.

The other thing is that if you are growing algae anywhere in the tank, you don't have 0 phosphate or nitrates.

I have tons of chaeto in my refugium but sometimes po4 start to rise and I wouldn´t notice without hanna checker.

I don´t believe is possible to have healthy and colorful SPS with PO4 > 0.1 in the long run

Best Regards

05/30/2007, 11:54 PM	#1
MarineGirl411 Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 2,583	What is the acceptable level of Phosphate in an SPS tank? Hi Everyone, I talked to my LFS lately about phosphate control in my tank. I want to get into SPS more. He said that phosphate is good for building corals skeletons and he doesn't use a phosphate remover, until he sees hair algae or some type of algae. I tested my phosphate levels and they are not detectable. I don't know if I trust my tests though because I have to swipe my glass clean every 2 days. I used a Sechem and Regeant Phosphate test kit. Both came out with the same results. I was going to purchase a Salifert test kit, but I read on here that they are not very accurate. Please let me know. Thank you all so much. __________________ I am a reefaholic and there is no cure. =) Current Tank Info: 90 gallon reef, Cardiff Nano Seahorse tank.

05/31/2007, 12:08 AM	#2
joeycadre Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: jackson Posts: 1,371	you want 0. phosphates can brown out your corals. __________________ "it's not the heat, it's the humility" Current Tank Info: 90 gal. sps mostly. bubble master 200. pci cl-300 chiller

05/31/2007, 04:08 AM	#3
dukes707 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: vallejo/707, cali Posts: 363	0 __________________ helping to save the reefs one coral at a time Current Tank Info: 90g in progress again...

05/31/2007, 10:41 AM	#9
MarineGirl411 Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 2,583	Really? He's a very good and well respected reef keeper here. He said you do need some phosphates because it helps build their skeletons along with calcium and mag. That doesn't sound right huh? Where can I pick up one of those test kits you are talking about? I've never heard of them. I'd appreciate it. Thank you. __________________ I am a reefaholic and there is no cure. =) Current Tank Info: 90 gallon reef, Cardiff Nano Seahorse tank.

05/31/2007, 11:11 AM	#11
MarineGirl411 Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 2,583	That is what he told me along with the other. I get some green algae down where my glass meets the sand. I can't really scrub down there with my mag float. I also swipe my tank about every other day or every 2 days. Should I invest in a certain phosphate test kit? I have Regeant and Sechem. Another fish guy that sold me my skimmer said the regeant was junk and he'd send me the sechem free if I just paid for shipping. So I did. Is the Sechem not accurate either? My sump/refugium has algae, I even have a little on my skimmer. Light does get on my skimmer though from my Refugium. What specific types of Algae reduce phosphates? I have Chaeto and some Caluerpa I believe. Please let me know. Thank you. __________________ I am a reefaholic and there is no cure. =) Current Tank Info: 90 gallon reef, Cardiff Nano Seahorse tank.

05/31/2007, 04:15 AM	#4
BAB43 Registered Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Sacrameto CA Posts: 47	0 is best

05/31/2007, 05:20 AM	#6
brianbigoats Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Lodi, CA Posts: 1,122	with my Hanna Colorimeter i run 0.03-0.00 Any Test PO4 test kit most likely wil read 0 when you are below .1 so 0 is not acually zero the best way to test is w/ Colorimeter

05/31/2007, 11:04 AM	#10
jay24k Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Leesburg, Florida Posts: 6,546	Without any phosphates, corals would not live but you don't want too much. I swipe my glass every 2 to 3 days and have no color issues. I think it depends on many things.

05/31/2007, 12:21 PM	#12
jay24k Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Leesburg, Florida Posts: 6,546	phosphate test kits are worthless. You need the colorimeter mentioned earlier or one of the more expensive ones. I've never tested for it as long as I don't see any issues.

05/31/2007, 12:49 PM	#13
Philwd Premium Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Gilbert, Az Posts: 4,057	Salifert's kit and most other kits only measure inorganic phosphate. The Merck/Deltec kit and colorimeters measure orthophosphate which is what gets metabolized. By the time you see HA growing it's way too high. I judge by how long it takes for a diatom film to grow. Any less than 4 days and nutrients have built up. On the Merck kit I get .008. That is plenty for the corals to grow. Anything over .02 on that kit and I'm just feeding algae. Again that is orthophoshate levels not inorganic levels.

05/31/2007, 01:21 PM	#14
Big Boy69 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Allentown, PA Posts: 1,213	Where do you buy a calorimeter? It sounds like you buy it at a healthfood place.

05/31/2007, 01:24 PM	#15
Yinger Premium Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Yorba Linda Posts: 3,657	Its the hanna colorimeter or photometer. You can get it here... you'll want the low range http://www.drsfostersmith.com/produc...pc=1&N=0&Nty=1

05/31/2007, 04:19 PM	#16
delv Moved On Join Date: Jan 2000 Location: The BK, NYC Posts: 1,048	Orthophosphate is inorganic...it's a very stable version...organic phosphate is often reduced to the ortho to measure it. The Hanna (nor any hobbyist) test kit do not reduce organic phosphates to ortho or "free version" to measure it. Either way, you're missing out all organic phosphate that's may be available to life (or algae/corals) but not the test kit. I would toss the tests and check algae on the glass. d.

03/29/2011, 12:13 PM	#17
Sohal Tang Tim Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Collingwood , ON, Canada Posts: 928	Milwaukee Phosphate meter I have a Milwaukee meter... Phosphate showing .12.... am I in trouble?????? I have hair algae a bit only in refugium only. Comments/opinions welcome . thanks. Tim __________________ "My God Reefs are Gorgeous!" Current Tank Info: 160 gallon reef

03/29/2011, 12:17 PM	#18
Allmost Moved On Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: canada, toronto Posts: 8,161	0.02 PO4 of Zero means no life, cant happen. (but our tests have Issues) high po4 stops calcification.

05/21/2017, 08:22 PM	#19
bxbe888 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: Jupiter FL Posts: 108	my PO4 is 0,09 currently, and SPS are not that colorful

05/22/2017, 06:42 AM	#22
reefmutt Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Mtl. Canada Posts: 7,824	Pife thank goodness you mentioned this is a 6 year old thread. I forgot to look as I was reading all of those sort of scary, uninformed posts.. My po4 is currently .2 (elos high resolution test kit) been there for a good 6 months Here is my Jason Fox flame when I added it about 2 months ago: And here it is today: Nitrates: 30-40 and phosphates.18-.22 the whole time. Now, I DO intend to lower them eventually but I am not in a hurry. I have to do it extremely slowly and would rather do it with bacteria than gfo. I have not used gfo in many months. I find it yoyos the levels and I think this is the most important aspect of nutrients- not necessarily the actual levels but their stability. Bxbe888, .09 is really not a concern at all. Don't blame the colour of your corals in high po4 because I doubt that is the cause.. not knowing anything about your system, I couldn't say what is the cause, however.. Every time things change in a reef, the corals may brown out a bit. Stability is key. Maturity of the system is important as well.. proper lighting, parameters etc these all play a role. __________________ Matt. Current Tank Info: 53x32.5x26 190g dt 60g of sumps 3 tank-100 gal frag system 6xAI prime 8xt5. 4x maxspect gyre. Skimz Dual internal sicce pump skimmer Deltec PF601s ca rx+Kalk stirrer

05/22/2017, 12:36 PM	#23
Denadai Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 1,816	0.02 ppm is a good target I´m keeping po4 = 0.02ppm and no3 = 1 / 3 ppm. Better color and growth Best Regards

05/22/2017, 04:34 PM	#24
Stolireef Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Scottsdale AZ Posts: 3,180 Blog Entries: 5	I never check phosphates. Rather, I use algae as my guide so long as my chaeto is growing and I have little to no algae in my display, I assume phosphates are where they need to be. I've been doing quite a bit of reading lately particularly on tanks that have been up more than a couple of years and that have great SPS results. Almost all of them have surprisingly high nutrients. Nitrates above 10 and phospates closing in on .1. The other thing is that if you are growing algae anywhere in the tank, you don't have 0 phosphate or nitrates. __________________ I want to burn twice as bright and half as long. Oh, and a full tank crash is just an excuse for a new build. Current Tank Info: 125 Rimless Leemar, Apex, Trigger 30 Elite Sump, Vertex 180i Skimmer, 2 X Gen4 Radion XR30W, BM Doser, 2xMP40WES, 2xTunze 6095, Sicce Syncra 4.0.