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08/07/2017, 06:09 PM | #1 |
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Flame angel twitching
So i have a flame angel in QT. It had a serious case of the twitches with no obvious sign of anything. I formalin dipped it before it went into the QT. So I did a round of treatment with NLS Ich Shield and Prazipro. Its on the third round of PP and every now and then the fish will give a slight twitch. Its not scratching or flashing. So whats the deal with twitching, is it always a sign that the disease is still present. Do flame angels or other types of fish twitch for no real reason from time to time?
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08/16/2017, 06:43 PM | #2 |
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So right now the flame angel has been treated with NLS ich shield and prazipro. Im changing out the water to remove the PP since its time and im adding back in the ich shield. The flame angel doesnt seem to want to eat now. It will go up to food really excited, peck at it a few times, take a few bites and then just ignore it. Im confused now, I have no idea if the fish is actually still sick or even if it is sick.
I mean i see the occasional twitch but the fish isnt flashing. No obvious signs of ich and i dont see anything attached to the gills that would be flukes. The other fish that were QT with it show no signs of any disease. |
08/17/2017, 03:49 PM | #3 |
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I have had this exact thing happen to me twice recently with a flame and bicolor angel and unfortunately lost both not knowing exactly what the issue was except mine also flashed occasionally and I treated with formalin, hypo and PP as well ( not at the same time); so I hope you are not dealing with whatever I was dealing with.
If it is flukes, you might have to do a multiple formalin dips a few days apart and move the fish to a clean tank with new water after each dip. There has been some instances where the flukes have become resistant to prazipro. Also, have you checked the tank for stray voltage? that might be causing the twitching as well.
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Ryan. 300g with velocity t4 for return and a Reflo dart on a closed loop, T5 lights & SRO3000 skimmer. Current Tank Info: 300g |
08/17/2017, 04:01 PM | #4 |
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What is your ammonia at?
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Build http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2638892 Parameters: Temp 77-79degF, Specific Gravity 1.023-1.024, PH 8.1-8.4, Alk 8-12, Ammonia 0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 0, Phosphate <.2, Calc 3 Current Tank Info: Custom Oak Stand | 75G FO Display | 40G Breeder Sump | MarinePure Ceramic Media Plate | Eshopps x-120 skimmer | Mag9 Return | Aqua Ultraviolet Advantage 2000+ 15w |
08/17/2017, 07:17 PM | #5 | |
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I suspect its lack of interest in food may be due to the drugs bc before i started this round of treatment, it was eating pellets like a fiend. But I'm just concerned now with its mouth. |
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08/17/2017, 07:19 PM | #6 | |
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08/18/2017, 11:52 AM | #7 |
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Maybe its a reaction to the prazi or CP? give it a few days till the treatment ends and see how it does.
the best way to confirm if its flukes is to do a fresh water dip but it tends to be stressful on the fish. After the dip, transfer to a new, clean tank. did you get a chance to check for stray voltage? I had that happen to me a while back with a bad powerhead and had fish acting weird because of it. change the equipment, power strip, heater, ect and see if there is a change. In my experience I unfortunately was never able to keep any dwarf angels that wasnt aggressively eating and continued eating in qt long term. once they stopped eating, it ended up being down hill. not sure why.
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Ryan. 300g with velocity t4 for return and a Reflo dart on a closed loop, T5 lights & SRO3000 skimmer. Current Tank Info: 300g Last edited by lagatbezan; 08/18/2017 at 12:01 PM. |
08/19/2017, 12:23 PM | #8 | |
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The single worst thing about this hobby is the **** poor ability to diagnose sickness and medication levels, its all a guessing game. |
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08/20/2017, 09:16 AM | #9 | |
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Quote:
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Ryan. 300g with velocity t4 for return and a Reflo dart on a closed loop, T5 lights & SRO3000 skimmer. Current Tank Info: 300g |
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08/20/2017, 09:51 AM | #10 | |
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So today will be the first transfer, kind of debating to either use formalin or paraguard since I know paraguard has malachite green with it and that should also be beneficial for the fish. |
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08/20/2017, 10:04 AM | #11 |
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Formalin "should" knock out the flukes but it is harsh on the fish while paraguard is labeled as being much gentler but its effectiveness has been questioned by a lot of people since no one knows for sure whats in it.
another option would be to do the formalin dips and use the paraguard in the water between dips or do an alternate formalin, paraguard dip. also need to know for sure you dealing with flukes, which is hard to do without a microscope or a freshwater dip. keep in mind that it could allalso be a reaction to the treatments which in reality are unfortunately all poison.
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Ryan. 300g with velocity t4 for return and a Reflo dart on a closed loop, T5 lights & SRO3000 skimmer. Current Tank Info: 300g |
08/20/2017, 10:15 AM | #12 | |
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Alternating the formalin/paraguard might be a good idea. I think ill just do formalin first to make sure it gets treatment and then have the fish in new clean water without any medication for the first 4 days, let it feel better. I have some API stresscoat I can put in that has the aloe. I can add that to help with soothing any of the bites when the flukes come off. In terms of eating today, I put in some omega sinking pellets and i saw it eat 2 or 3 before giving up, so at least something got in the stomach. |
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08/20/2017, 10:24 AM | #13 |
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Thats great that it started eating again! i would personally give it a few more days to start eating fully before doing more treatments and causing more stress. Flames can usually have a white coloration to their mouths or it might even be fungus maybe.
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Ryan. 300g with velocity t4 for return and a Reflo dart on a closed loop, T5 lights & SRO3000 skimmer. Current Tank Info: 300g |
08/24/2017, 12:45 PM | #14 |
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any updates?
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Ryan. 300g with velocity t4 for return and a Reflo dart on a closed loop, T5 lights & SRO3000 skimmer. Current Tank Info: 300g |
08/24/2017, 07:22 PM | #15 |
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On Sunday, I dipped the fish for 30 minutes in formalin and then transferred it back into the QT that was treated with 0.5 mL/gallon Paraguard (according to the bottle instructions). Ive repeated the 0.5 mL/gallon Paraguard dosing every day since then, and have gotten the fish to eat a bit here and there. Yesterday I picked up some live brine shrimp and the flame angel just seemed a bit confused with them. After it discovered it could eat them, it swam around the tank and found them all. Funny thing is, it seems flame angels dont have great vision if food is right in front of its face, so it would peck and miss and miss and miss until it would get it. Its much better at eating food if its on the bottom of the tank. Well anyway, since the fish started eating those, I put a few pellets in and it ate those as well. I thought we were doing well until today, i put in the brine shrimp and just ate about 3 and ignored the rest. After treating again, I put in some emerald entree and the fish immediately went to it, at a few pecks, and then has ignored it. Also gave some pellets, and same thing, ate a few and then ignored the rest. So something is still bothering the fish, maybe some parasites just hatched and are bothering it bc some days its more hungry than others.
I feel as long as it gets something in the stomach each day thats a good thing, just waiting for its appetite to fully return. Im going to treat with Paraguard for at least 21 days. |
08/25/2017, 09:40 PM | #16 |
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So the fish had its appetite return again, gave it pellets and brine shrimp.
One thing I notices was that the Paraguard is staining the silicon sealant blue because of the malachite green (why dont they call it malachite blue, i mean, its blue). Is this an issue? |
08/27/2017, 09:03 AM | #17 | |
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Has the twitching stopped? As for the paraguard staining the sealent of the tank, I don't have any experience with it. Maybe call seachem and talk to their tech support and see what they say.
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Ryan. 300g with velocity t4 for return and a Reflo dart on a closed loop, T5 lights & SRO3000 skimmer. Current Tank Info: 300g |
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09/06/2017, 09:37 AM | #18 |
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did the flashing stop?
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Ryan. 300g with velocity t4 for return and a Reflo dart on a closed loop, T5 lights & SRO3000 skimmer. Current Tank Info: 300g |
10/04/2017, 07:38 PM | #19 |
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You can check this thread for more updates: http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh....php?t=2652054
I started another one bc the flame angel is STILL flashing and its poop is stringy. |
10/05/2017, 11:36 AM | #20 |
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Send you a pm.
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Ryan. 300g with velocity t4 for return and a Reflo dart on a closed loop, T5 lights & SRO3000 skimmer. Current Tank Info: 300g |
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