Reef Calculator for Red Sea products-Pls Help!

[Katarnie]

Hi I've been searching for a reef calculator as I'm new to reef tanks and am testing for Ca,K.H & Mg plus I'm horrible at working out dosages. I'm still in the cycle stage and trying to stop 'snow' as I've obviously overdosed on something! But all the calculators I find don't use Red Sea products so I can't use them :/ Does anyone know of a link to a calculator that does? Thanks

[kurt_n]

Sorry... the one I use doesn't list it either: http://reef.diesyst.com/chemcalc/chemcalc.html

However, if you're cycling you should *not* be dosing anything. There's no need to, as you have nothing consuming your cal/alk. And you shouldn't be trying to adjust pH either, as it will be bouncing all over the place as you cycle.

Not sure how big of a tank this is, but if it's possible the best way to fix the problem is just bite the bullet and replace the water. Chasing unbalanced water parameters is not a really fun way to start the hobby. Trust me... I know!

[Katarnie]

Your right! Its not fun and my brain is about to explode with all these parameters going all over the place :s The only reason I am testing for them is because my lfs told me during its cycle is the best way to balance out these things so its up and ready for corals by the end of cycle. Do I really need to change ALL of the water? or is a half change ok?

[Mcgeezer]

The absolute best reef calculator is on bulk reef supply's website. Buy your chemicals in bulk and make it easier.

And yes. ..you shouldn't be dosing during your cycle.

[Katarnie]

Ok I'm about to replace all the water with salt/RO water, lucky its only 16g nano. Starting small till I know what i'm doing!

Should I clean out the filter media in RO water also or leave it be? Thanks all for your help really appreciate it. Will fully cycle this time before getting into other stuff..

[Xavibear]

Leave the filter media alone, just change the water.

[kurt_n]

Agree... just change the water. I wouldn't even bat an eye over 16g.

The thing is, which your LFS is kinda forgetting to tell you, is that when you're done cycling you more than likely will have a large amount of nitrates. The easiest way to get rid of those and start again with pristine water after the cycle is to do either one big 90-100% water change, or a couple 50% water changes. At that point, you have no critters in the tank and the good bacteria don't live in the water, so swapping all the old yucky water for good water is easy.

However, assuming that you've spent $$ in pumping additives in your tank to make it "perfect", you're now pouring all that money down the drain. Oops.

Best thing to do is test your new salt water for cal/alk/mag. More than likely, assuming you're using a commerical salt mix, those numbers will be suitable for coral. So instead of fighting to "better" your water change water, just call those numbers your target numbers. You'll be able to keep those numbers consistent for quite a while just by doing normal water changes, until your corals really start to take off or your coraline algae starts to take off.

When your testing shows that your cal/alk/mag numbers are dropping and your water changes can't bring them back in line, THEN start worrying about dosing to *maintain* the original water change numbers.

Also... don't be in a hurry to add corals after the cycle. Slowly add your fish and let the tank stabilize. After a few months, then start thinking about corals.

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

What Red Sea product are you looking for a calculator for?

[Katarnie]

Ok sorry i'm just making sure I have this right...taking 90% water out of tank after full cycle to rid nitrates and putting new water back in won't disrupt my whole original cycle process and good bacteria created as it isn't the water...have I got that right?

After new water is in and while I'm watching the Cal/Alk/Mag levels is it safe to put 2 clowns in? I'm in process of moving house and trying to get my clowns out of another tank (which has a case of red slime algae) and into where I am now, I figured I'd try out corals etc while doing this which leads me to now..

I'm loving all this and hating it at same time as I love the challenge and researching been wanting to try this for years but am disappointed with my lfs for neglecting a lot of useful info and now learned the hard way by spending more $$ than needed :S I've learned more from this forum than anywhere else.

Thanks again & i'm not giving up lol!

[Katarnie]

Randy- The products I'm after a calculator for are Red Sea Reef Foundation A B &C (Cal/Alk/Mg)

[Katarnie]

Also was told to use Red Sea KH Coralline Gro while cycling it says it on the box too, should I still do this?

[droog]

Originally Posted by Katarnie

Ok sorry i'm just making sure I have this right...taking 90% water out of tank after full cycle to rid nitrates and putting new water back in won't disrupt my whole original cycle process and good bacteria created as it isn't the water...have I got that right?

Yes. The beneficial bacteria will colonise the rock, sand and any filter sponges you might have in there. The more live rock you have in there the better... do you know if you started with live or uncured rock? That makes a big difference as to how long you need to cycle.

Originally Posted by Katarnie

After new water is in and while I'm watching the Cal/Alk/Mag levels is it safe to put 2 clowns in? I'm in process of moving house and trying to get my clowns out of another tank (which has a case of red slime algae) and into where I am now, I figured I'd try out corals etc while doing this which leads me to now..

I'm loving all this and hating it at same time as I love the challenge and researching been wanting to try this for years but am disappointed with my lfs for neglecting a lot of useful info and now learned the hard way by spending more $$ than needed :S I've learned more from this forum than anywhere else.

Thanks again & i'm not giving up lol!

The clowns would be fine and are quite hardy. But they are a type of damselfish and can be quite aggressive to newcomers when established. I started a nano with damsels - would do it differently next time.

If you chose a salt mix and stick to it, keep the salinity and temperature steady constant, use a skimmer you should be good. Your water parameters will be fine as it will be freshly made. Figuring out a water change procedure that you can (and do) do regularly is likely to be more helpful than worrying about parameters.

I use the Red Sea "Pro" titration test kits for KH/Ca/Mg and the associated supplements. They seem good and easy to use - but its way down the priority list. Enjoy your reef....

-droog

[droog]

Originally Posted by Katarnie

Also was told to use Red Sea KH Coralline Gro while cycling it says it on the box too, should I still do this?

That stuff is not strictly necessary, but can help. I find their "NoPO-X" product to be good and would use/continue to use it on a small tank like that.

The KH Coralline geo may help speed the cycle and help promote growth of coralline algae. That will happen anyway if you keep the salinity right and keep up with water changes.

Check out the redseafish.com website. They have some cool videos on this stuff, check them out now, and then watch them again in a month or two. You'll be all good..

[Katarnie]

Its Live rock. Didn't realize clowns were related to Damsels I love damsels but awhile ago I adopted a nasty domino as it was killing its previous owners fish so I put it in with my Queen Trigger and it still thought it could win that fight!

Have done the water change keeping an eye on salinity and temp, looks a lot better I use saltwater/RO already made up from lfs although I do have a bag of Red Sea salt if I run out and can't get to shop.

I used Red Sea "Pro" titration test kit for Mag and I liked it a lot better than API test kits it was cleaner and pretty accurate. Ill check out NoPO-X and website referred to. My brain can relax now I know I don't have to worry about the parameters so much!

[droog]

The videos are at http://www.redseafish.com/videos/

Thats nothing; last time I went diving a damsel attacked me! He must have been 1.5" or so, and I'm 6'7". Talk about aggressive... he bit me several times too, smart enough to get my forearm outside the wetsuit.

The nice thing about having a nano tank like this is that water changes are small/nice/simple. You can mix the salt water yourself in a regular sized bucket. I think you will be better off making the saltwater yourself at home than going to the LFS each time. It will be more consistent and your results will be better. Cheaper too.

I think a 1.5g or 2g PWC once a week will do it. Make it your regular "Tuesday night" schedule (say) to mix water, do some cleanup in the tank and add new water. Keep that up, and you may never need to worry about measuring and dosing. Dosing a tank that small will be a headache.

Read up on the "sticky" threads here too. There's tons of good information.

Most people will recommend you get your own RO/DI system to make clean water. I do that. But if you only need a couple of gallons each time, maybe you can use store bought distilled or RO water. You will only need to use one small container each week...

-droog

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Use this calculator:

http://reef.diesyst.com/chemcalc/chemcalc.html

For the calcium part (Reef Foundation A):

select the entry for Randy's Recipe #1
multiply the amount needed by 0.185 (that is, you use about 5x less)


For the alkalinity part (Reef Foundation B):

select the entry for Randy's Recipe #1
multiply the amount needed by 0.53 (that is, you use about half as much)

For the magnesium part (Reef Foundation C):

select the entry for Randy's Recipe
multiply the amount needed by 0.48 (that is, you use about half as much)

This all assumes the info on theior web site, such as:

"Liquid supplement: 1ml will raise the Ca level of 100 liters (25 gal) by 2ppm."

is correct.

[Katarnie]

No Way!! Think I'm more scared of meeting a damsel in the water than a shark now!

I've been thinking how to add my clowns now I know they are related to damsels explains why my female can be such a nasty piece of work sometimes, I'll need to put them in last I guess..

I'd like to learn more about mixing my own saltwater I'm not very good at it, I relied too much on getting it from the store but ever since my very lfs burnt down bout 8months ago I now have to drive 50mins to the next place and other stuff I need I order online to save time and fuel. If I had a bigger tank I'd definitely install my own RO/DI System.

Thanks for the info i'll be looking into the threads and link

[Katarnie]

Randy- Very grateful for your help with the reef calculator, I have printed it up and it sure will make dosing a lot easier when I'm preparing for corals

[Mcgeezer]

The little fish are the meanest when you dive on the reef. My wife and I stay at a house in the Exumas (Bahamas) and there is a reef right off the beach behind the house so we snorkel it constantly. The meanest fish that we know personally is "Brutus"....a little bitty Royal Gramma of all things who has staked out a certain outcrop of rock. He defends it with honor lol

We can swim with giant groupers, puffers, lions, parrotfish with giant beaks, barracudas, you name it....and we are most scared of little ol Brutus

[Katarnie]

Omg a Royal Gramma?! that was on my list of 'safe' tankmates for my clowns lol little fish complex

[thegrun]

Royal Gramma tend to have a very small territory around a cave that they will defend, Clowns on the other hand stake out about a 30 gallon space as their own.

[bereleah]

Originally Posted by Randy Holmes-Farley

Use this calculator:

http://reef.diesyst.com/chemcalc/chemcalc.html

For the calcium part (Reef Foundation A):

select the entry for Randy's Recipe #1
multiply the amount needed by 0.185 (that is, you use about 5x less)


For the alkalinity part (Reef Foundation B):

select the entry for Randy's Recipe #1
multiply the amount needed by 0.53 (that is, you use about half as much)

For the magnesium part (Reef Foundation C):

select the entry for Randy's Recipe
multiply the amount needed by 0.48 (that is, you use about half as much)

This all assumes the info on theior web site, such as:

"Liquid supplement: 1ml will raise the Ca level of 100 liters (25 gal) by 2ppm."

is correct.

Randy what about if i use the powder?

[mcgyvr]

Originally Posted by bereleah

Randy what about if i use the powder?

Randy is not here anymore..
He has moved on to other forums..

What "powder" are you talking about?
Commercial products all have instructions that you simply follow..