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Unread 12/28/2009, 07:47 PM   #1
educom
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Sand bed in Refugium?

I have a 75g reef tank that is 13 months old. I just installed an 18g refugium located above the DT using gravity for the return to the DT. The guy at the LFS recommended no sand bottom at all and only minimal LR so I can easily vacuum the glass bottom from detritus. Is this good advice?

I had previously read in many posts that recommend a deep sand bed, so I already bought sufficient live sand to support 4"-5" sand bed, leaving another 10"-12" to the top of the tank for chaeto to grow. I also bought about 10-12 lbs of live rock to place in the fuge. I was under the impression that the DSB and additional live rock would help with nitrates, though it may have a minimal effect compared to the overall capacity of the DT.

My main goal of the fuge is to grow chaeto to reduce nitrates/phosphates and to harvest pods to ultimately get and maintain a mandarin. So ... what are the pro's and con's of implementing a deep sand bed in my fuge? Should I go with a glass bottom, a DSB, or a shallow sand bed?

Anxiously waiting for guidance!


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Unread 12/28/2009, 08:28 PM   #2
jenjen
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I would steer clear of live rock in the fuge, since you don't have enough space to put large pieces. Small pieces (rock rubble) can become a detrius trap and actually contribute to rather than reduce nitrates - it's the deep, oxygen-deprived parts of live rock that actually help reduce nitrate. You could add a couple of pieces if you wanted to, more for esthetic reasons than function.

I'm not sure on the pros/cons on a sand bed in the fuge. I personally have one but if I were to do it again I would remove it and have a bare bottom chaeto-only fuge, for the reasons given to you by your LFS. Most of my pods live in the chaeto anyway.


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Unread 12/28/2009, 08:32 PM   #3
bertoni
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For such a small refugium, I'd just light it and add Chaetomorpha. I don't think the live sand bed will do all that much. An inch for looks would be fine, and might support a few more animals.


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Unread 12/28/2009, 11:56 PM   #4
Gilbert46
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I'm surprised at the answers. I just took down my fuge from my last tank, It was 20g with a 6'' DSB, rubble and chaeto over the top. I never had a problem with detritus in the fuge or water quality. I did run 600gph gently via a spray bar. When taking it down it was spotless and full of pods and critters, I never cleaned it, occasionally I would kill aptasia only. I figure everything in the tank will equalize within reason, the chaeto and pods will grow to a population limited by available nutrients and sustain.


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Unread 12/29/2009, 09:59 AM   #5
90GalFOWLR
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I just set up my sump system a month ago, I have the same setup you described I have about 2" sand, 5-10lbs rubble, and Chaeto. Hopefully it doesnt contribute to nitrates. I am at 0, but I dont want it to go up.


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Unread 12/29/2009, 10:33 AM   #6
Jeff
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilbert46 View Post
I'm surprised at the answers. I just took down my fuge from my last tank, It was 20g with a 6'' DSB, rubble and chaeto over the top. I never had a problem with detritus in the fuge or water quality. I did run 600gph gently via a spray bar. When taking it down it was spotless and full of pods and critters, I never cleaned it, occasionally I would kill aptasia only. I figure everything in the tank will equalize within reason, the chaeto and pods will grow to a population limited by available nutrients and sustain.
I agree, sand, rocks, clean up crew and macro algae will help balance out your reason for having a fuge. I have all of these things in my fuge and have never had a problem either with detritus. I usually drain the fuge anyway for water changes though.


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Unread 05/26/2010, 04:06 PM   #7
ashtroid
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Quote:
Originally Posted by educom View Post
I have a 75g reef tank that is 13 months old. I just installed an 18g refugium located above the DT using gravity for the return to the DT. The guy at the LFS recommended no sand bottom at all and only minimal LR so I can easily vacuum the glass bottom from detritus. Is this good advice?

I had previously read in many posts that recommend a deep sand bed, so I already bought sufficient live sand to support 4"-5" sand bed, leaving another 10"-12" to the top of the tank for chaeto to grow. I also bought about 10-12 lbs of live rock to place in the fuge. I was under the impression that the DSB and additional live rock would help with nitrates, though it may have a minimal effect compared to the overall capacity of the DT.

My main goal of the fuge is to grow chaeto to reduce nitrates/phosphates and to harvest pods to ultimately get and maintain a mandarin. So ... what are the pro's and con's of implementing a deep sand bed in my fuge? Should I go with a glass bottom, a DSB, or a shallow sand bed?

Anxiously waiting for guidance!
my only quarrel with a sand in fuge is if you decide to put your return in the fuge....my buddy did it and come home one day and his fuge was sandless and all of his corals rocks were smothered and a few fish died of stress.....so be careful i do not have sand in mine just BIG pieces of live rock but mine goes from sump into seperate tank(fuge) and back into sump.


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Unread 05/27/2010, 12:02 AM   #8
karaandnick
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i use miracle mud in my refugium at about 3" and a few snails I replace some of it every year and I have never had a problem.


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Unread 05/27/2010, 03:57 PM   #9
veocool
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Set up my 1st fuge with live sand, liverock, chaeto and love it. The microfauna will help with the detritus. Mine's approx 15 gal.


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Unread 09/18/2013, 11:14 PM   #10
RileyLAFD
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Indeed a small sump works... If done right....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gilbert46 View Post
I'm surprised at the answers. I just took down my fuge from my last tank, It was 20g with a 6'' DSB, rubble and chaeto over the top. I never had a problem with detritus in the fuge or water quality. I did run 600gph gently via a spray bar. When taking it down it was spotless and full of pods and critters, I never cleaned it, occasionally I would kill aptasia only. I figure everything in the tank will equalize within reason, the chaeto and pods will grow to a population limited by available nutrients and sustain.
My sump is 16x16x16, with the fuge being 10x10 (4 inch DSB and another 7 inches of water). In my sump I have added a few different macros and a mangrove. I cant complain and I have to agree a small sump can work!


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Unread 09/18/2013, 11:19 PM   #11
RileyLAFD
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RileyLAFD View Post
My sump is 16x16x16, with the fuge being 10x10 (4 inch DSB and another 7 inches of water). In my sump I have added a few different macros and a mangrove. I cant complain and I have to agree a small sump can work!



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Am I the only one who loves the way acros smell?

34 Gal Solana;11Gal Sump.Mixed Reef. NS Apex, 2 Vortech MP10Wes, Radion PRO, JBJ1/10 Chiller & TrueTemp 150w Heater, Tunze Osmolator, BM NAC3.5.

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Unread 09/19/2013, 06:13 AM   #12
dppitone
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There is no correct answer to this. I wouldn't have any tank without a sandbed, and I wouldn't have a refugium without live rock or live rubble. It's a matter of opinion. I'm a naturalist about my system. I want as much diversity and natural processes as possible. The reef has sand and rock, so that's what I do. The sand if seeded well can host many different organisms. But on the other hand, plenty of folks don't use sand and instead use bare bottom and vacuum. I think that's disgusting, but you can have the same rates of overall system success doing it either way. Just opinion. You decide, don't let the store guy decide for you - unless you want him to

To your other point, live rock does not "help" with nitrates. Rather, the bacteria in live rock expels nitrates as biproduct. You can remove nitrates by (1) water changes, and/or (2) having algae growth. Algae feeds on the nitrates - they enter the cells of the algae and thus are removed from your water.


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