Reef Central Online Community

Go Back   Reef Central Online Community > Coral Forums > Soft Coral Keepers
Blogs FAQ Calendar Mark Forums Read

Notices

User Tag List

Reply
Thread Tools
Unread 02/26/2014, 09:09 AM   #26
mbingha
Registered Member
 
mbingha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Southeast PA
Posts: 730
Quote:
Originally Posted by Novice101 View Post
Go to liveaquaria.com they have a nano fish section but I really like the catalina goby . And oh ok I gotcha sounds interesting. You have to have fish while cycling because they create a good bioload for your tank to finish cycling.
This is the blind leading the blind. Honestly this is all terrible advise. 1) you do not need a fish to cycle your tank, it's cruel, and if your fish survives the cycle; damsels are mean sob's. 2) Catalina gobies are cold water fish, they won't survive in 78 degree water long term. :banghead:


__________________
75 Gallon Mixed Reef in the works
30 Gallon Sump
28 Gallon JBJ 28 HQI
mbingha is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02/26/2014, 09:13 AM   #27
Novice101
Registered Member
 
Novice101's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 160
The catalina goby was something I liked I never told him to purchase one.


Novice101 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02/26/2014, 09:17 AM   #28
mbingha
Registered Member
 
mbingha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Southeast PA
Posts: 730
Still poor advise. It's good your user name fits.


__________________
75 Gallon Mixed Reef in the works
30 Gallon Sump
28 Gallon JBJ 28 HQI
mbingha is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02/26/2014, 06:50 PM   #29
Devin R.
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Pearsall, Texas
Posts: 34
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nina51 View Post
NO, NO, NO, NO!!! while damsels might be hardy, it's cruel to use a live animal to cycle a tank and totally unnecessary and this is an antiquated method. you need to go back to the basics!!
Okay, but if I used a "live" Aragonite Reef Substrate, with all of the bacteria, and Real Ocean Water from the Pacific. I think the fish will be fine. Just like on that show "Tanked" they literally just plop the fish in immediately after setting up the tank, adding the sand and Nutrisea Water. If they're okay with it, then I'm pretty sure it's fine.
Sorry not to sound rude.


Devin R. is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02/26/2014, 06:52 PM   #30
Devin R.
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Pearsall, Texas
Posts: 34
Quote:
Originally Posted by mbingha View Post
This is the blind leading the blind. Honestly this is all terrible advise. 1) you do not need a fish to cycle your tank, it's cruel, and if your fish survives the cycle; damsels are mean sob's. 2) Catalina gobies are cold water fish, they won't survive in 78 degree water long term. :banghead:
Okay, but if I used a "live" Aragonite Reef Substrate, with all of the bacteria, and Real Ocean Water from the Pacific. I think the fish will be fine. Just like on that show "Tanked" they literally just plop the fish in immediately after setting up the tank, adding the sand and Nutrisea Water. If they're okay with it, then I'm pretty sure it's fine.
Sorry not to sound rude.


Devin R. is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02/26/2014, 07:07 PM   #31
criticalencore
Registered Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 381
If you are going to go with a short cycle I would get a bottle of brightwell microbacter7 or a similar product. Using fish for a cycle isn't really a good practice. You can use a very small amount of clear ammonia or a piece of table shrimp to get the ammonia for your cycle no need to put a fish in poison water.. Xenia has always seemed to grow better in "dirtier" tanks as in like tanks that were more nutrient heavy. Higher po4 and nitrates from big fish taking bug dumps and once xenia gets going it can definetly be worse then aiptasia.
BTW the fish die in a lot of the Tanked tanks I've been hearing. I know for a fact the Friday after the reveal of the Cowfish restaurant tank in Raleigh NC all the fish were gone but a lionfish and a half dead rabbitfish and that was a blot of fish that died...


criticalencore is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02/26/2014, 07:20 PM   #32
Devin R.
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Pearsall, Texas
Posts: 34
Quote:
Originally Posted by criticalencore View Post
If you are going to go with a short cycle I would get a bottle of brightwell microbacter7 or a similar product. Using fish for a cycle isn't really a good practice. You can use a very small amount of clear ammonia or a piece of table shrimp to get the ammonia for your cycle no need to put a fish in poison water.. Xenia has always seemed to grow better in "dirtier" tanks as in like tanks that were more nutrient heavy. Higher po4 and nitrates from big fish taking bug dumps and once xenia gets going it can definetly be worse then aiptasia.
BTW the fish die in a lot of the Tanked tanks I've been hearing. I know for a fact the Friday after the reveal of the Cowfish restaurant tank in Raleigh NC all the fish were gone but a lionfish and a half dead rabbitfish and that was a blot of fish that died...
Okay, thanks for the advice! Is Nutrafin Cycle the same thing or would you recommend the Brightwell Microbacter7 over the Nutrafin Cycle, because I already have a huge bottle of Nutrafin Cycle that I used in another larger tank that I have, but that one is fish only w/ some live rock. This is going to be my first reef tank so I'm kind of open to any advice at the moment.
Really?! I didn't know that! That's so horrible! Why would they basically sell these people dead fish?


Devin R. is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02/26/2014, 07:21 PM   #33
Novice101
Registered Member
 
Novice101's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 160
The cowfish killed the tank


Novice101 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02/27/2014, 12:38 AM   #34
Pigpen17
Registered Member
 
Pigpen17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Tacoma, Wa.
Posts: 1,006
OK. Piggyback over. Learned. Don't buy one, and the tanked guys are crap.

Got it!


__________________
Never trust a man with a castle in his tank.

56g Column |Aquamaxx HOB-1 Skimmer |Reef Breeders Photon 24 LED |850gph Koralia (X2) | Maxspect Gyre XF130
Pigpen17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02/27/2014, 05:28 AM   #35
mbingha
Registered Member
 
mbingha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Southeast PA
Posts: 730
The cowfish may have contributed to the speedy death of those fish, but there have been many reports of all fish dying after the show airs. It's tv, don't assume because they do it that it's right, or even works.

The fact that noobs look to that show for advise is just one of the many reasons I despise that show. Almost everything they do is wrong.


__________________
75 Gallon Mixed Reef in the works
30 Gallon Sump
28 Gallon JBJ 28 HQI
mbingha is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 02/27/2014, 06:41 AM   #36
mbingha
Registered Member
 
mbingha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Southeast PA
Posts: 730
Quote:
Originally Posted by Devin R. View Post
Okay, but if I used a "live" Aragonite Reef Substrate, with all of the bacteria, and Real Ocean Water from the Pacific. I think the fish will be fine. Just like on that show "Tanked" they literally just plop the fish in immediately after setting up the tank, adding the sand and Nutrisea Water. If they're okay with it, then I'm pretty sure it's fine.
Sorry not to sound rude.
If you think so :screwy:

Btw have fun wasting time and money chasing problems from doing things in this hobby because "they did it on tv so it must be fine".


__________________
75 Gallon Mixed Reef in the works
30 Gallon Sump
28 Gallon JBJ 28 HQI
mbingha is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03/09/2014, 09:24 PM   #37
Pigpen17
Registered Member
 
Pigpen17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Tacoma, Wa.
Posts: 1,006
Quote:
Originally Posted by wieselsport View Post
Once upon a time Xenia was my first coral. I ended up raising it and propagating it it eventually took over my tank to a degree. I had to prune it like hair algae.

I think your tank is too new. That's the last thing I wanted to hear at your stage. You have hardly gone through your cycle, it will take over 6 weeks. Different organisms will develope and add to the maturity of your tank. I'd give It 6 months before adding a coral. Your tank will be much different then. It will have its own personality.

As far as the chemicals go. Don't add them next time. If a coral isn't doing well you won't be able to change it by adding chemicals after the fact. It all needs to be established before hand and be consistent. "Nothing good happens fast in a reef tank". That quote should pop into your head when doing anything with your tank.

It will be the coolest thing when your first coral does well.

I am down the same road. Just got my first coral yesterday. It never really looked right. It kept getting smaller and smaller. For one, my cleaner shrimp and hermits won't leave the friggin thing alone! I finally moved it to the sandbed under the best lighting and it has remained there un harassed. My PH is low, as well as alk. I thought I would try to buffer. As well I bought a bottle of Kent Marine Essential Elements. I added one dose of each today, and now the guy is just about totally wasted.


 photo DSC00082.jpg

My tank is a new upgrade (30g to 56g) with new sand. It shouldn't be considered a new set up, but it is acting new. It's been running for 2 months now.

Where did I go wrong?


__________________
Never trust a man with a castle in his tank.

56g Column |Aquamaxx HOB-1 Skimmer |Reef Breeders Photon 24 LED |850gph Koralia (X2) | Maxspect Gyre XF130
Pigpen17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03/09/2014, 10:12 PM   #38
Pigpen17
Registered Member
 
Pigpen17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Tacoma, Wa.
Posts: 1,006
Now little stalks are falling off and blowing away.


__________________
Never trust a man with a castle in his tank.

56g Column |Aquamaxx HOB-1 Skimmer |Reef Breeders Photon 24 LED |850gph Koralia (X2) | Maxspect Gyre XF130
Pigpen17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03/10/2014, 05:29 AM   #39
mbingha
Registered Member
 
mbingha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Southeast PA
Posts: 730
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pigpen17 View Post
I am down the same road. Just got my first coral yesterday. It never really looked right. It kept getting smaller and smaller. For one, my cleaner shrimp and hermits won't leave the friggin thing alone! I finally moved it to the sandbed under the best lighting and it has remained there un harassed. My PH is low, as well as alk. I thought I would try to buffer. As well I bought a bottle of Kent Marine Essential Elements. I added one dose of each today, and now the guy is just about totally wasted.




My tank is a new upgrade (30g to 56g) with new sand. It shouldn't be considered a new set up, but it is acting new. It's been running for 2 months now.

Where did I go wrong?
What lights are you running and what are your parameters? Ammonia, nitrate, nitrite, ph, ca, alk, mg, phosphate, temp, and sg?


__________________
75 Gallon Mixed Reef in the works
30 Gallon Sump
28 Gallon JBJ 28 HQI
mbingha is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03/10/2014, 06:25 AM   #40
Pigpen17
Registered Member
 
Pigpen17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Tacoma, Wa.
Posts: 1,006
Well, it is still with us today. That's a start.

They were Sg: 1.024, PH: 7.8, Ammonia: 0, Nitrite: 0, Nitrate: 20, Temp: 79*.
I tested again this morning after adding buffer and they haven't changed.

My light is a 24"-36" Marineland Reef Capable LED. A toy basically. The tank is 23" high as well. Not helping. My lighting schedule has 7 hours daylights, but yesterday I pumped it up to almost all day to see if the little guy took to it.

I haven't tested for elements. My plan was to stick to easier corals and ease my way into this. One fish and one coral at a time.


__________________
Never trust a man with a castle in his tank.

56g Column |Aquamaxx HOB-1 Skimmer |Reef Breeders Photon 24 LED |850gph Koralia (X2) | Maxspect Gyre XF130
Pigpen17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03/10/2014, 07:05 AM   #41
Pigpen17
Registered Member
 
Pigpen17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Tacoma, Wa.
Posts: 1,006
I am going with all day lights again, and when I get home tonight, test the PH again and decide if I will add buffer again or not.


__________________
Never trust a man with a castle in his tank.

56g Column |Aquamaxx HOB-1 Skimmer |Reef Breeders Photon 24 LED |850gph Koralia (X2) | Maxspect Gyre XF130
Pigpen17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03/10/2014, 07:27 AM   #42
mbingha
Registered Member
 
mbingha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Southeast PA
Posts: 730
I wouldn't add buffer. 7.8 isn't terrible and I'm not a fan of adding buffer to begin with. Adding directly to the aquarium can burn the gills of fish and is not good for coral. You would be better off testing your alk as that is a natural buffer.


__________________
75 Gallon Mixed Reef in the works
30 Gallon Sump
28 Gallon JBJ 28 HQI
mbingha is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03/10/2014, 07:47 AM   #43
Pigpen17
Registered Member
 
Pigpen17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Tacoma, Wa.
Posts: 1,006
Quote:
Originally Posted by mbingha View Post
I wouldn't add buffer. 7.8 isn't terrible and I'm not a fan of adding buffer to begin with. Adding directly to the aquarium can burn the gills of fish and is not good for coral. You would be better off testing your alk as that is a natural buffer.
That is good to hear, because I am of the mind that if my system is natually 7.8, than I would rather keep that than fight it with chems.

My test kit is weird when it comes to Alk. It is not the dkh, but the ppm. My tank hovers right around the minimum 120 and a bit lower.


__________________
Never trust a man with a castle in his tank.

56g Column |Aquamaxx HOB-1 Skimmer |Reef Breeders Photon 24 LED |850gph Koralia (X2) | Maxspect Gyre XF130
Pigpen17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03/10/2014, 07:57 AM   #44
mbingha
Registered Member
 
mbingha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Southeast PA
Posts: 730
1ppm = 0.056 dkh so your alk if equal to 120 ppm is 6.72 dkh. That's low, I prefer to keep mine around 9. You should look into getting (or making) two part and dosing the alk part. I wouldn't dose the calcium part until you test your calcium levels.


__________________
75 Gallon Mixed Reef in the works
30 Gallon Sump
28 Gallon JBJ 28 HQI
mbingha is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03/10/2014, 08:03 AM   #45
RA
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: S. Jersey
Posts: 976
I haven't checked my Ph in over 15 years, and don't plan to anytime soon. I've seen numerous cases of people chasing the Ph instead of the alk, and crashing their tank. I would suggest that you get a Salifert ALK/KH test kit, and adjust the alk to be around 8 or 9 (between 7-11 is fine). I use Arm & Hammer baking soda to adjust my alk, what they sell in the pet store is the same chemically just a lot more money. The only problem I have with my xenia is that I can't sell it fast enough.


RA is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03/10/2014, 08:11 AM   #46
crissie
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: England
Posts: 385
Adding a fish to aid cycling is cruel in the extreme. Just because the fish can survive the conditions does not mean you should inflict such living standards on the poor things.

The are living creatures and when you purchase a fish you are responsible for it's welfare.


crissie is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03/10/2014, 08:13 AM   #47
Pigpen17
Registered Member
 
Pigpen17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Tacoma, Wa.
Posts: 1,006
Good to know. Thanks both.

Salifert ALK/KH test kit will be in hand on my way home today.

As far as raising ALK I think that's what I'm doing? The stuff I bought yesterday is Kent Marine Superbuffer-dkh. I have dosed once. Toss it?


__________________
Never trust a man with a castle in his tank.

56g Column |Aquamaxx HOB-1 Skimmer |Reef Breeders Photon 24 LED |850gph Koralia (X2) | Maxspect Gyre XF130

Last edited by Pigpen17; 03/10/2014 at 08:29 AM.
Pigpen17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03/10/2014, 08:31 AM   #48
RA
Registered Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: S. Jersey
Posts: 976
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pigpen17 View Post
Good to know. Thanks both.

Salifert ALK/KH test kit will be in hand on my way home today. The stuff I bought yesterday is Kent Marine Superbuffer-dkh. I have dosed once. Toss it?
The Kent Marine Superbuffer-dkh is fine, just compare the price of it to A&H baking soda, and when you run out of it just buy baking soda.


RA is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03/10/2014, 08:42 AM   #49
mbingha
Registered Member
 
mbingha's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Southeast PA
Posts: 730
Just be sure not to dose all at once, bring your alk up over the course of a couple days.


__________________
75 Gallon Mixed Reef in the works
30 Gallon Sump
28 Gallon JBJ 28 HQI
mbingha is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 03/10/2014, 10:08 AM   #50
Pigpen17
Registered Member
 
Pigpen17's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Tacoma, Wa.
Posts: 1,006
Awesome. Thank you.


__________________
Never trust a man with a castle in his tank.

56g Column |Aquamaxx HOB-1 Skimmer |Reef Breeders Photon 24 LED |850gph Koralia (X2) | Maxspect Gyre XF130
Pigpen17 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
coral advice, dying coral, emergency, please help, xenia

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:50 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2024 Axivo Inc.
Use of this web site is subject to the terms and conditions described in the user agreement.
Reef CentralTM Reef Central, LLC. Copyright ©1999-2022
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging v3.3.0 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2024 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.