Question on electrical outlets

NOsushi4me · 03/25/2015, 09:18 AM

So my father is helping me put in an electrical outlet where there is not one so I can place my new Elos in the desired location. My refrigerator is on this line as well .... I am not too handy and knowledgable on this stuff. My dad knows a good amount but we have been researching a lot! Anything I need to consider ???

tkeracer619 · 03/25/2015, 12:46 PM

Not really as long as the capacity is there. I assume your pops knows what is up.

NOsushi4me · 03/25/2015, 02:17 PM

He's very handy so I'm hoping it goes smoothly

acanlover · 03/25/2015, 02:20 PM

Find out the total current draw on the fridge (should be labeled) and whatever else is on the line and then compare it to the breaker. As long as the total amount (including the new tank) does not exceed the breaker value, it will not trip.

BuzzPion · 03/25/2015, 02:22 PM

Is he installing a GFCI outlet?

NOsushi4me · 03/25/2015, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by acanlover

Find out the total current draw on the fridge (should be labeled) and whatever else is on the line and then compare it to the breaker. As long as the total amount (including the new tank) does not exceed the breaker value, it will not trip.

Ok thank you!

mcgyvr · 03/25/2015, 03:57 PM

All submerged equipment must be protected by a GFCI device (outlet/breaker/power strip or whatever).. A fridge should not be protected by the GFCI though

NOsushi4me · 03/25/2015, 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BuzzPion

Is he installing a GFCI outlet?

I read about this before so I asked him if he could install a GFCI and his response was that it was already on and/or connected to a GFCI. Does that make sense? I am not good with electrical work so I appreciate the help.

Reef Frog · 03/25/2015, 04:13 PM

My opinion only:

Unless the tank is very small and requires minimum wattage, I would use a dedicated circuit only (sharing it with a few lamps or a radio, fan & such is fine). This way sensitibe DC equipment is not put in danger by voltage changes, there is a less of chance of the circuit tripping while you're away from home. With your current plan, there is also a chance the circuit would trip from a tank malfunction, and you refrigerator loses electricity causing spoiled food and warm beer. Just something to think about.

Paul B · 03/25/2015, 04:41 PM

The refrigerator is most likely on a dedicated circuit because in a kitchen there would be dedicated outlets. It may be on the same outlet as the one you use for a toaster so check that it is not on another kitchen outlet. That is easy to do. Turn off the refrigerator breaker and see if anything else goes dead. If not, go for it. Unless you are putting in a huge tank, it will be fine.
(Electrician 40 years, retired)

joshbrookkate · 03/25/2015, 05:22 PM

Ok, Paul. Not to hijack this thread but... Is a gfci surge protector as effective as a gfci outlet?

Reef Frog · 03/25/2015, 06:35 PM

I only have a 65 g but if everything is on all at once I have a theoretical 800-1000 watt draw I think. Plus a few lights I think I recall tripping a breaker when absent mindedly plugging in a 12 amp vacuum cleaner on the aquarium's 20 amp circuit.

mmn · 03/26/2015, 02:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by acanlover

Find out the total current draw on the fridge (should be labeled) and whatever else is on the line and then compare it to the breaker. As long as the total amount (including the new tank) does not exceed the breaker value, it will not trip.

I believe the standard is total should not exceed 80% of the value of the breaker. Probably to cover startup surges and margin of error.

Regards
Michael

Paul B · 03/26/2015, 05:09 AM

You only need a standard GFCI breaker or outlet. You can also use a surge protector but IMO not needd

mcgyvr · 03/26/2015, 05:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joshbrookkate

Ok, Paul. Not to hijack this thread but... Is a gfci surge protector as effective as a gfci outlet?

Yes a GFCI surge protector is as effective as a GFCI outlet..

Dmorty217 · 03/26/2015, 05:26 AM

New electrical code requires GFCI outlet with a GFCI breaker, this is a huge PITA and cost keeps going up. Unless your having a inspection done afterward I wouldn't worry about this. Depending on when your house was built it may or may not have a dedicated circuit for the fridge.

joshbrookkate · 03/26/2015, 09:18 AM

Thanks Paul B and mcgyvr. Peace of mind!

NOsushi4me · 04/01/2015, 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul B

You only need a standard GFCI breaker or outlet. You can also use a surge protector but IMO not needd

I am starting tomorrow with pops - I will keep you posted

NOsushi4me · 04/03/2015, 01:53 PM

Finished product !

skeeter_ca · 04/03/2015, 10:48 PM

Wow, that's a fairly large tank(nice looking though) and it looks like it could end up pulling quite a few amps. Lights, pumps, skimmer, ato, heaters, chiller, powerheads, etc. Have you figured how much amperage it will pull with everything on. My 75gal has two dedicated 20amp circuits(which is overkill but I don't have to worry about it).

sarens · 04/05/2015, 10:26 AM

boy if you have any stack-up on initial surge/hard start you could trip the breaker, then you might have a fish tank and fridge double problem
-how hard would it be to pull a dedicated circuit, do you have room in your panel?

skeeter_ca · 04/05/2015, 10:35 AM

This definitely needs a dedicated circuit. Pulling a new line and adding it to the circuit box is pretty easy. If you don't have an open circuit in your panel you can always use slim breakers. Two fit in the same space as one.

Icefire · 04/05/2015, 11:47 AM

Seriously, dedicated line for a 110g or less? at 80% of a 15 amp break we are looking for a 1440w of available power

The biggest load are the heater (200w intermitent) and lights (160-500w).
Pumps/skimmer/reactor are less than 6-40 watts each. Start up surge are basicly inexistant.

You only have to make sure the total current draw on the line will be less than 12A and leave a bit more room since you'll be on the same line than a fridge.

NOsushi4me · 04/06/2015, 12:31 PM

Hey everyone I actually was wrong about one thing .... the tank is only on the same line as a hallway light and fluorescent kitchen light

d2mini · 04/06/2015, 12:58 PM

It's fine. Doesn't need a dedicated circuit. Not even close.

Always good to have that luxury, to have multiple circuits going to your tank so if one trips, the whole tank isn't down, just whatever equipment was plugged into that one circuit. But it's not necessary.

03/25/2015, 09:18 AM	#1
NOsushi4me Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: PA Posts: 119	Question on electrical outlets So my father is helping me put in an electrical outlet where there is not one so I can place my new Elos in the desired location. My refrigerator is on this line as well .... I am not too handy and knowledgable on this stuff. My dad knows a good amount but we have been researching a lot! Anything I need to consider ???

03/25/2015, 12:46 PM	#2
tkeracer619 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Westminster, CO Posts: 17,289	Not really as long as the capacity is there. I assume your pops knows what is up. __________________ Hobby Experience: 9200ish gallons, 26 skimmers, and a handful of Kent Scrapers. Current Tank: Vortech Powered 600G SPS Tank w/ 100gal frag tank & 100g Sump. RK2-RK10 Skimmer. ReefAngel. Radium 20k.

03/25/2015, 04:41 PM	#10
Paul B Premium Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Long Island NY Posts: 15,549	The refrigerator is most likely on a dedicated circuit because in a kitchen there would be dedicated outlets. It may be on the same outlet as the one you use for a toaster so check that it is not on another kitchen outlet. That is easy to do. Turn off the refrigerator breaker and see if anything else goes dead. If not, go for it. Unless you are putting in a huge tank, it will be fine. (Electrician 40 years, retired) __________________ I used to get shocked when I put my hand in my tank. Then the electric eel went dead. Current Tank Info: 100 gal reef set up in 1971

03/26/2015, 05:09 AM	#14
Paul B Premium Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Long Island NY Posts: 15,549	You only need a standard GFCI breaker or outlet. You can also use a surge protector but IMO not needd __________________ I used to get shocked when I put my hand in my tank. Then the electric eel went dead. Current Tank Info: 100 gal reef set up in 1971

03/26/2015, 05:26 AM	#16
Dmorty217 Saltwater Addict Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Vandalia OHIO Posts: 11,624	New electrical code requires GFCI outlet with a GFCI breaker, this is a huge PITA and cost keeps going up. Unless your having a inspection done afterward I wouldn't worry about this. Depending on when your house was built it may or may not have a dedicated circuit for the fridge. __________________ Fish are not disposable commodities, but a worthwhile investment that can be maintained and enjoyed for many years, providing one is willing to take the time to understand their requirements and needs Current Tank Info: 625g, 220g sump, RD3 230w, Vectra L1 on a closed loop, 3 MP60s, MP40. Several QTs

03/25/2015, 02:17 PM	#3
NOsushi4me Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: PA Posts: 119	He's very handy so I'm hoping it goes smoothly

03/25/2015, 02:20 PM	#4
acanlover Registered Member Join Date: May 2011 Posts: 66	Find out the total current draw on the fridge (should be labeled) and whatever else is on the line and then compare it to the breaker. As long as the total amount (including the new tank) does not exceed the breaker value, it will not trip.

03/25/2015, 02:22 PM	#5
BuzzPion Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2014 Posts: 110	Is he installing a GFCI outlet?

03/25/2015, 03:57 PM	#7
mcgyvr Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: North Carolina Posts: 20,050	All submerged equipment must be protected by a GFCI device (outlet/breaker/power strip or whatever).. A fridge should not be protected by the GFCI though

03/25/2015, 04:13 PM	#9
Reef Frog Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Maryland Posts: 3,121	My opinion only: Unless the tank is very small and requires minimum wattage, I would use a dedicated circuit only (sharing it with a few lamps or a radio, fan & such is fine). This way sensitibe DC equipment is not put in danger by voltage changes, there is a less of chance of the circuit tripping while you're away from home. With your current plan, there is also a chance the circuit would trip from a tank malfunction, and you refrigerator loses electricity causing spoiled food and warm beer. Just something to think about.

03/25/2015, 05:22 PM	#11
joshbrookkate Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Windsor, ON Posts: 618	Ok, Paul. Not to hijack this thread but... Is a gfci surge protector as effective as a gfci outlet?

03/25/2015, 06:35 PM	#12
Reef Frog Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Maryland Posts: 3,121	I only have a 65 g but if everything is on all at once I have a theoretical 800-1000 watt draw I think. Plus a few lights I think I recall tripping a breaker when absent mindedly plugging in a 12 amp vacuum cleaner on the aquarium's 20 amp circuit.

03/26/2015, 09:18 AM	#17
joshbrookkate Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Windsor, ON Posts: 618	Thanks Paul B and mcgyvr. Peace of mind!

04/03/2015, 01:53 PM	#19
NOsushi4me Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: PA Posts: 119	Finished product !

04/03/2015, 10:48 PM	#20
skeeter_ca Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Yucaipa, CA Posts: 1,007	Wow, that's a fairly large tank(nice looking though) and it looks like it could end up pulling quite a few amps. Lights, pumps, skimmer, ato, heaters, chiller, powerheads, etc. Have you figured how much amperage it will pull with everything on. My 75gal has two dedicated 20amp circuits(which is overkill but I don't have to worry about it). __________________ skeeter - It is easier to ask for forgiveness than premission. My motto to my wife. Current Tank Info: 75rr,6"dsb,refugium,auto top-off & semi-auto water changer, OM squirt. 4 MJs 1200, Started on 03/03/06

04/05/2015, 10:26 AM	#21
sarens Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Commerce, Michigan Posts: 214	boy if you have any stack-up on initial surge/hard start you could trip the breaker, then you might have a fish tank and fridge double problem -how hard would it be to pull a dedicated circuit, do you have room in your panel? __________________ fish and "easy" corals for me, not in for the challenge but for for the calmness...is there such a thing? Current Tank Info: 11'6" long 330gal with 475 gallon system volume

04/05/2015, 10:35 AM	#22
skeeter_ca Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Yucaipa, CA Posts: 1,007	This definitely needs a dedicated circuit. Pulling a new line and adding it to the circuit box is pretty easy. If you don't have an open circuit in your panel you can always use slim breakers. Two fit in the same space as one. __________________ skeeter - It is easier to ask for forgiveness than premission. My motto to my wife. Current Tank Info: 75rr,6"dsb,refugium,auto top-off & semi-auto water changer, OM squirt. 4 MJs 1200, Started on 03/03/06

04/05/2015, 11:47 AM	#23
Icefire Seasoned reefer Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: In Quebec, Canada Posts: 3,653	Seriously, dedicated line for a 110g or less? at 80% of a 15 amp break we are looking for a 1440w of available power The biggest load are the heater (200w intermitent) and lights (160-500w). Pumps/skimmer/reactor are less than 6-40 watts each. Start up surge are basicly inexistant. You only have to make sure the total current draw on the line will be less than 12A and leave a bit more room since you'll be on the same line than a fridge. __________________ Temp 80F, PH 8.5-8.0, Alk 6.8-7.2, Ca 430, Mg 1700, NO3 0-0.25, PO4 0.04, 34.4 PPT Lights @ 100% all others, 35% White Current Tank Info: 60g Cube, 120lbs live rocks, Hydra52 2x120W, 2 MP40+ 1 MP10 @ 70%, Phosban 550 GFO+Carbon, 200W Heater, SWC Skimmer, Kalk ATO, 150 gpd RODI

04/06/2015, 12:31 PM	#24
NOsushi4me Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: PA Posts: 119	Hey everyone I actually was wrong about one thing .... the tank is only on the same line as a hallway light and fluorescent kitchen light

04/06/2015, 12:58 PM	#25
d2mini Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 10,344	It's fine. Doesn't need a dedicated circuit. Not even close. Always good to have that luxury, to have multiple circuits going to your tank so if one trips, the whole tank isn't down, just whatever equipment was plugged into that one circuit. But it's not necessary. __________________ -dennis Elos Diamond 120xl \| Elos Stand \| Radion G4 Pros \| GHL Profilux Controller \| LifeReef Skimmer \| LifeReef Sump Photos taken with a Nikon D750 or Leica M.