Learning/rebuilding from my epic fail

[glaukos]

ATM I don't have something to say about your tank bud...until the next batch of pics of course

I have a question about your mh's though. Do you think that 150w would be sufficient for a 30inch deep(or even a bit deeper) tank? I'm happy with them in a 22inch deep but I'm a bit unsure if they will give me the same results in a 30+.

[reefmutt]

Originally Posted by glaukos

ATM I don't have something to say about your tank bud...until the next batch of pics of course

I have a question about your mh's though. Do you think that 150w would be sufficient for a 30inch deep(or even a bit deeper) tank? I'm happy with them in a 22inch deep but I'm a bit unsure if they will give me the same results in a 30+.

Ok Mike, some pics to follow.
That’s a good question about the mh.. I think that 150w over a 30 inch deep tank would be pushing it a bit.. if I had 30 inches, I would go 250w de.

[reefmutt]

Ok.. little update on the never ending nutrient rollercoaster that is my reef..
I have reduce the photo period in my fuge by a couple more hours so that n will not be pulled down so much but I’ve continued dosing kno3.
I’ve gotten n back to around 10ppm..
The lanthanum chloride dosing has definitely produced results.
When I started, the Hanna phosphate test was giving me .24ppm. After a week it was .22 and a week later, .17. I felt that was a bit too rapid a reduction so the past week, I reduced it a bit. Today’s tests using the phosphate test as well as a new ulr phosphorus test gave me .17 and .15 respectively.
I will continue at half the LC dose for another week and see where p is next weekend.
So far I am liking LC dosing. It is very controlled. And manipulating the photoperiod on the fuge is also very controlled......... so far.....

Ok.. some pics.. more macros from a few days ago..
Here’s a grouping..


This little piece has started to take off and the background doesn’t hurt!

Ok have a close look at this pic.. tell me what you see...

My other Robin Hood piece. Lower down in the tank..

Waiting for this guy to blow!

Ice fire!

Few more to follow.


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[reefmutt]

Ok few more shots..




Ok! Next update, I promise to take some wide shots.


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[Wrangy]

You better promise to take some blue shots as well Matt!! Haha

Stunning but nothing less can be expected from you my friend!

[reefmutt]

Originally Posted by Wrangy

You better promise to take some blue shots as well Matt!! Haha

Stunning but nothing less can be expected from you my friend!

Oh yeah!! Gotta take those super blue shots.. keep forgetting..
Thanks Dom!

[shih87]

I must lost track here a while...
Lanthanum chloride dosing!? Any link that I can learn its benefit? Very interested.

BTW, excellent coral as always.

Cheers,

[reefmutt]

Thanks, Shih. Lanthanum chloride is simply a phosphate binder. The bound p is then either removed via skimmer or filter sock.
I dose it into a reservoir in my system that is just up stream from my skimmer and then filter sock..
I watched Mark use it for a year with great results.
There is always concern about the bound p settling in the system and what may happen to it but if you can use it in a way that allows for proper filtering, there doesn’t seem to be a down side. Like gfo or any phosphate remover, you just don’t want to over dose it and drop p too quickly.

[DiscusHeckel]

The following article written by Daniel Knop is very informative. It is, however, quite weak on the potential risks associated with its use in marine aquaria. I read somewhere that this chemical irritates the gills of fish. Furthermore, alkalinity may be reduced (if I remember correctly).

https://www.reef2rainforest.com/2017...-the-aquarium/

[markalot]

Wonderful pics Matt.

I've used LC for over a year, no filter sock, first chamber of the sump. I think those that ran into issues overdosed, it's easy to do. I'm now at 1 drop every 3 days after dropping PO4 to undetectable on the Hanna ULR checker (1ppb). I read about people doing a lot heavier dosing and I think that's just asking for trouble, though a filter sock should mitigate some of the issues.

Just my opinion though, no data. I need to get another test done to see if it shows up. Does Triton test for it?

[watchguy123]

I looked into using lanthanum chloride years ago after a fellow reefer buddy in Canada was utilizing it so successfully. I think there are a few concerns with it though: 1) it can precipitously reduce PO4 which can result in severe adverse effect to corals 2) the precipitate can be detrimental to respiration of your livestock in particular clams, anemones, feather dusters and fish primarily tangs 3) it also binds with carbonate which will reduce alkalinity and 4) it can form a scale on your glass.

It seems the best way to prevent or at least reduce these potential adverse effects is use a diluted dose at a slow rate filtered through a 10 micron filter sock. I was too impressed by the potential adverse effects to utilize it. The more I read, the more concerned I became. But like many things, different approaches with a challenging material can bring about a good technique that maximizes the beneficial effects while minimizing or eliminating harmful outcomes. Although, I don’t think any test measures lanthanum chloride in aquarium water, it seemingly binds instantly to available phosphates and carbonates.

[reefmutt]

Originally Posted by DiscusHeckel

The following article written by Daniel Knop is very informative. It is, however, quite weak on the potential risks associated with its use in marine aquaria. I read somewhere that this chemical irritates the gills of fish. Furthermore, alkalinity may be reduced (if I remember correctly).

https://www.reef2rainforest.com/2017...-the-aquarium/

Very informative and interesting article, Bulent. Thanks for the link.
I think the biggest take away from it is to use LC cautiously and with the proper filtration methods in place.

Originally Posted by markalot

Wonderful pics Matt.

I've used LC for over a year, no filter sock, first chamber of the sump. I think those that ran into issues overdosed, it's easy to do. I'm now at 1 drop every 3 days after dropping PO4 to undetectable on the Hanna ULR checker (1ppb). I read about people doing a lot heavier dosing and I think that's just asking for trouble, though a filter sock should mitigate some of the issues.

Just my opinion though, no data. I need to get another test done to see if it shows up. Does Triton test for it?

Hey Mark, thanks for your input. Your tank has been my trial tank

And Watchguy Mark, thank you as well..
It would seem that most of the potential advers effects come from extreme use like over dosing and when treating very high phosphates.
Markalot Mark is only using a drop per day ..
Mark could you tell me which product you are using again? Is it phosphate rx?
Clearly it is pretty concentrated..
I am using Brightwell’s phosphate e which must be a little more diluted. I was using 6ml per day and now I will use 4ml per day to try to slow the reduction..
Once I get below .1, I will play with getting a maintenance dose..
I have had no side effects concerning my yellow, purple, or Kole tangs..
I would consider the amount I am using to be quite small and with the skimmer and filter sock downstream, I am confident enough to use it going forward...
I hope that like Mark, I will have to reduce my dosage to maintain a low phosphate level, in the future.
Well.. I will continue to post a weekly update on the phosphate situation..

Now, I just have to get my shy melanurus wrasse out of the frickin tank before my flatworm issue becomes a real concern.. he is eating any shrimp that goes into the tank and I NEED to get some peppermints in there soon!

[glaukos]

Originally Posted by reefmutt

Ok Mike, some pics to follow.
That’s a good question about the mh.. I think that 150w over a 30 inch deep tank would be pushing it a bit.. if I had 30 inches, I would go 250w de.

Awesome pics bud,pic quality and acro's health is something I will never get tired of seeing in your thread

As for the mh's, that's what i was afraid of hearing.
ATM I run 3 150w on a 22inch tank and I'm really happy with that. But soon I will upgrade and tank will be 30inch and I wanted to avoid buying new balasts,bulbs etc.
Plus I thought that it would be better to have 3 sources of light(more cover area) instead of two of 250w.
Well what can you do
Thanks for your input bud

[Relativity]

What brand of kno3 are you using

[reefmutt]

Hey Relatively, I use Seachem Flourish nitrogen. For freshwater planted tanks..

[markalot]

^ PhosphateRx is what I use.

[justy]

Hi Matt

I have been trying to steer away from the catching the acro bug again and go lps for ease of maintenance and less heartache. Thanks a lot for inspiring me and infecting me with the acro bug I suppose it never leaves you.
Your tank and coral care is stunning and a real credit to you well done!
Now I will have to reassess my tank

[reefmutt]

Originally Posted by markalot

^ PhosphateRx is what I use.

Thanks Mark.

Originally Posted by justy

Hi Matt

I have been trying to steer away from the catching the acro bug again and go lps for ease of maintenance and less heartache. Thanks a lot for inspiring me and infecting me with the acro bug I suppose it never leaves you.
Your tank and coral care is stunning and a real credit to you well done!
Now I will have to reassess my tank

Thanks! Appreciate it. Very nice of you to say.
It’s my absolute pleasure to inspire you! I don’t think it does ever leave you.
Don’t reassess, just add acros!

[reefmutt]

Originally Posted by glaukos

Awesome pics bud,pic quality and acro's health is something I will never get tired of seeing in your thread

As for the mh's, that's what i was afraid of hearing.
ATM I run 3 150w on a 22inch tank and I'm really happy with that. But soon I will upgrade and tank will be 30inch and I wanted to avoid buying new balasts,bulbs etc.
Plus I thought that it would be better to have 3 sources of light(more cover area) instead of two of 250w.
Well what can you do
Thanks for your input bud

Oops. Missed this.
No problem Mike!
For what it’s worth, my tank is 26 inches high (25 inches of water) and the mh are probably a foot above the water... I have acros literally on the bottom of my tank..
Now, I also have 6 t5s and some decently powerfull but not crazy strong leds... if the mh will be your only light source, you may be pushing it a bit..
If you end up doing a super sexy/spooky scape like your current tank, maybe you’d be ok.. most of your current corals are fairly high up in the tank.. if you scape the acros up high, you might be just fine.

[glaukos]

Thansk again for the reply bud

[FloformAustria]

nice macro shots matt!! can't wait to see the tank in real life ^^

Cheers

[Wally.B]

Originally Posted by reefmutt

Very informative and interesting article,
Now, I just have to get my shy melanurus wrasse out of the frickin tank before my flatworm issue becomes a real concern.. he is eating any shrimp that goes into the tank and I NEED to get some peppermints in there soon!

Amazing Corals Matt.
Interesting about your Wrasse eating your shrimps.
I got a couple of peppermints last week for my Kitchen Tank for a Aptasia outbreak.
I haven't seen them after I put them in.
Wondering if my Long Nose Hawkfish is eating them. However I've had a cleaner shrimp in there for ages and he's still alive (but much bigger the the peps).
Hoping they are alive since I see no skeletons.

[reefmutt]

Originally Posted by glaukos

Thansk again for the reply bud

Anytime, my friend.

Originally Posted by FloformAustria

nice macro shots matt!! can't wait to see the tank in real life ^^

Cheers

Thanks, Flo! My reef door is open!

Originally Posted by Wally.B

Amazing Corals Matt.
Interesting about your Wrasse eating your shrimps.
I got a couple of peppermints last week for my Kitchen Tank for a Aptasia outbreak.
I haven't seen them after I put them in.
Wondering if my Long Nose Hawkfish is eating them. However I've had a cleaner shrimp in there for ages and he's still alive (but much bigger the the peps).
Hoping they are alive since I see no skeletons.

Hey Wally, I certainly have seen longnose hawks eat shrimp but if yours doesn’t know they are food, maybe he won’t.
Peps are very secretive even when comfortable but when new in a tank can hide extremely well for a few days..
Look into the crevices after a feed, that’s when they are most bold.


So, here’s my LC dosing update:
First..
For the past month or so, I have had some cyano building in my frag tank and a bit on the sand in my dt.
I was leaving it alone while LC dosing, thinking that maybe as the LC pulls po4, the cyano would go away- especially since I am dosing kno3 to keep n up around 7-10 ppm.
The cyano hasn’t really changed much.. so.. thinking that cyano is so efficient at absorbing p and n, I didn’t want it to skew my test results while LC dosing.
Yesterday morning, I added a 300g dose of red slime remover to the tank. My system is 350 gallons.. Today, I woke up to a couple corals having completely browned out......
so I abandoned the treatment, added carbon, did a 10%wc and restarted the skimmer. Once I have more water, I’ll do another 10% wc. Probably tomorrow.
Grrrrr..
After testing today nothing has changed much.. n- 7-10 ppm, p- 59 ppb or .18 ppm. alk had dipped a bit from 7 to 6.2 midweek but is back up at 7 after tweaking my carx.
Clearly, the treatment stressed a few corals.. probably in conjunction with the LC dosing.
I really hope more damage is not on the horizon..

I am not sure if the LC dosing was responsible for the dip in alk.. could have been.. however calcium has remained the same since last reading which indicates to me that LC was NOT responsible for the alk drop.
If it had been, I think I would have seen a slight increase in ca after increasing my carx output to raise alk back to 7..
Well.. this week I will continue at a slightly reduced LC dose to maintain my current p reading, as I don’t want it shifting anymore for a while..

[Stickboy97]

Thanks for the reply earlier. I think after seeing your pics I am going to place my frags a little bit closer to get that filled in look (was spacing them like every 6" of so)

Ever get that full tank shot?

[reefmutt]

Originally Posted by Stickboy97

Thanks for the reply earlier. I think after seeing your pics I am going to place my frags a little bit closer to get that filled in look (was spacing them like every 6" of so)

Ever get that full tank shot?

If you are a real acro whore like me and just can’t resist adding new corals, spacing them closer will help enable your addiction.
If your long term goal is to have really nice full grown colonies, then farther is better.
Ive always felt that adding frags close together will eventually force me to space things out but will give me time to really decide which corals I want to keep. The ones that get close and that I don’t want or that I kill, by doing stupid things - like I just did- make it easier to remove corals I don’t want long term.
My great suharsonoi (or caroliniana) that I grew out from a small piece..
Pictured here is now a brown turd that looks like it will rtn within days...
So, not so happy about that..
Here is a quick and dirty Iphone fts pic..
Unfortunately, I am suddenly too ****ed off and uninspired to get out the real camera..
Hopefully, the damage won’t spread..



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