Anyone Thinking of Dumping LEDS and going back to Halides

[Johnseye]

Originally Posted by Aqualund

I can't think of anything that would count MORE since that is precisely a range of lighting that LED's can't accommodate.

Are you certain LEDs can't recreate an actinic spectrum? I think they can create a spectrum that brings out the florescence in corals better than actininc. Actinincs aren't used specifically for growth, they're used for coloration.

[Johnseye]

New whitepaper out from Radion. The study was done by Reef Wholesale. They essentially mirrored T5 AB+ and ABS lights, Phoenix 14k MH lights and created an LPS specific spectrum similar to the T5s. The schedules are available for download.

Side by side pictures of MH vs LED after 16 weeks.

Here's a link to the whitepaper.
Ecotech Radion Whitepaper

[DavidinGA]

Originally Posted by Johnseye

New whitepaper out from Radion. The study was done by Reef Wholesale. They essentially mirrored T5 AB+ and ABS lights, Phoenix 14k MH lights and created an LPS specific spectrum similar to the T5s. The schedules are available for download.

Side by side pictures of MH vs LED after 16 weeks.

Here's a link to the whitepaper.
Ecotech Radion Whitepaper

Wish it had more comparisons....

[markalot]

Originally Posted by Johnseye

New whitepaper out from Radion. The study was done by Reef Wholesale. They essentially mirrored T5 AB+ and ABS lights, Phoenix 14k MH lights and created an LPS specific spectrum similar to the T5s. The schedules are available for download.

Side by side pictures of MH vs LED after 16 weeks.

Here's a link to the whitepaper.
Ecotech Radion Whitepaper

I read that when linked from another thread. Any idea why growth and color for an acropora wasn't included? Seems to be a glaring omission. Detailed results were all for corals known to do pretty well under LED.

[mhucasey]

Originally Posted by markalot

I read that when linked from another thread. Any idea why growth and color for an acropora wasn't included? Seems to be a glaring omission. Detailed results were all for corals known to do pretty well under LED.

Yes, they grew acropora but didn't include the results. Hmmmm.

[Johnseye]

Originally Posted by mhucasey

Yes, they grew acropora but didn't include the results. Hmmmm.

No Acros. To get specific, no Millies. I'm sure there's a reason. Some corals do well under LED and some don't. Even when reproducing a T5 or MH spectrum.

[Aqualund]

Originally Posted by Johnseye

Are you certain LEDs can't recreate an actinic spectrum? I think they can create a spectrum that brings out the florescence in corals better than actininc. Actinincs aren't used specifically for growth, they're used for coloration.

Some corals do well under LED and some don't. Even when reproducing a T5 or MH spectrum.

Absolutely certain LED's cannot recreate the sub 450nm spectral plot of T5's or MH. They can get some specific frequencies, but only a few, and specific.

"Actinincs aren't used specifically for growth, they're used for coloration."

With regard to acropora, I absolutely disagree.

With regard to some corals doing well and some not...well that is exactly the point of this debate.

[Aqualund]

Originally Posted by rappyfly

I have this stylo in my chinese black box Led for more than a year. LED can keep bright pink, but no growth. It took off under 14500K Giesemann.

This has been my experience with stylos under LED only as well.

[Cyberdude]

One year of growth under hydra 52

April 20, 2015
ImageUploadedByTapatalk1456595633.073444.jpg

Today
ImageUploadedByTapatalk1456595727.487818.jpg

Leds grow coral. My water has been a mess so not much sps yet. It's possible that some do better than others. But I've seen sps from the Great Barrier Reef spawn under hydra52s. Granted it was marine biologists in the equation and water pumped in daily from the ocean.

[Cyberdude]

Spawn. Under spring full moon. Nutso.

[karimwassef]

I supplement with 395nm and 365nm 3W LEDs

[jda]

The Ecotech paper is perfect for them. They people buying their lights in general seem to miss the point that some coral do fine and that not all coral is equal. ...so of course they can pick and choose the coral that do well for their presentation. They compare birdsnets, montis, etc. and the typical Ecotech buyer is going to assume that this means all SPS since they are likely not to know better. They are targeting the inexperienced.

Many have grown porites, birdsnet and stylo under 100W incandescent light in a fuge with no issues. ...but the people who know this are not likely Ecotech customers.

[oreo57]

Originally Posted by jda

The Ecotech paper is perfect for them. They people buying their lights in general seem to miss the point that some coral do fine and that not all coral is equal. ...so of course they can pick and choose the coral that do well for their presentation. They compare birdsnets, montis, etc. and the typical Ecotech buyer is going to assume that this means all SPS since they are likely not to know better. They are targeting the inexperienced.

Many have grown porites, birdsnet and stylo under 100W incandescent light in a fuge with no issues. ...but the people who know this are not likely Ecotech customers.

you know with a "little" more effort you could get even more "elitist"...

[jda]

Did you google that, or did you form an opinion of your own?

[oreo57]

Originally Posted by jda

Did you google that,

Why? jda and elitist come up often???

[Aqualund]

Originally Posted by Cyberdude

One year of growth under hydra 52

April 20, 2015
Attachment 343420

Today
Attachment 343421

Leds grow coral. My water has been a mess so not much sps yet. It's possible that some do better than others. But I've seen sps from the Great Barrier Reef spawn under hydra52s. Granted it was marine biologists in the equation and water pumped in daily from the ocean.

Looks great...but to be fair, seriataporas grow like weeds, and the fact that yours only got that big after a year is another indication of reduced growth rates.

I have the same coral under a T5/combo that started the same size and it is now twice the size of yours in six months.

The mother colony I had of this coral I had under LED's only for two years and it would grow slowly, then RTN every 6 months for something and I'd keep trimming back and keeping the good parts. I moved it to my coral farm under t5's and I have a colony the size of a serving platter that just keeps growing with no losses.

To me it seems like very strong evidence. But I understand that its not for others.

Also, these spawning corals under hydras...Im pretty sure I saw that video too, and I think they used the LED's as supplementation, but not the primary light source. I could be wrong though. can you provide a link to this video?

[Wazzel]

I have yet to run into anything I can not grow. There have been some that took a real long time to get acclimated, but one they started all was good.

[lpsouth1978]

The week 1 results are in. I just weighed the frags for my little test and the results are not too surprising. Both frags have grown in the week that they have been in the tank, however, the MH frag grew more. The colors still look virtually the same, but we will see if that continues with time. The weights are:

LED frag -
2/20/16 - 11.2g
2/27/16 - 12.0g
Total Growth = 0.8g

MH frag -
2/20/16 - 13.5g
2/27/16 - 14.8g
Total Growth = 1.3g

After 1 week the MH is out front as the best grower (for my tank). Also, we have noticed color returning to our purple bonzai and red hot chili pepper, that long ago turned tan under the LED's. If we continue to see results like these, we will likely be switching everything over to MH/T5 or MH/LED in the next month or so.

[Aqualund]

Originally Posted by lpsouth1978

The week 1 results are in. I just weighed the frags for my little test and the results are not too surprising. Both frags have grown in the week that they have been in the tank, however, the MH frag grew more. The colors still look virtually the same, but we will see if that continues with time. The weights are:

LED frag -
2/20/16 - 11.2g
2/27/16 - 12.0g
Total Growth = 0.8g

MH frag -
2/20/16 - 13.5g
2/27/16 - 14.8g
Total Growth = 1.3g

After 1 week the MH is out front as the best grower (for my tank). Also, we have noticed color returning to our purple bonzai and red hot chili pepper, that long ago turned tan under the LED's. If we continue to see results like these, we will likely be switching everything over to MH/T5 or MH/LED in the next month or so.

Thank you for taking the time to do this. Great info!

[CHSUB]

Originally Posted by lpsouth1978

The week 1 results are in. I just weighed the frags for my little test and the results are not too surprising. Both frags have grown in the week that they have been in the tank, however, the MH frag grew more. The colors still look virtually the same, but we will see if that continues with time. The weights are:

LED frag -
2/20/16 - 11.2g
2/27/16 - 12.0g
Total Growth = 0.8g

MH frag -
2/20/16 - 13.5g
2/27/16 - 14.8g
Total Growth = 1.3g

After 1 week the MH is out front as the best grower (for my tank). Also, we have noticed color returning to our purple bonzai and red hot chili pepper, that long ago turned tan under the LED's. If we continue to see results like these, we will likely be switching everything over to MH/T5 or MH/LED in the next month or so.

awesome you are doing this.....beyond "hobby" stuff!!!

[dread240]

Growth is virtually identical if you go by percentage, with MH still having a slight edge

8.9% increase vs 9.2% increase, LED vs MH respectively.

You have slightly higher par on the MH side too so I'm not surprised on that. I'll have to look back though as I'm curious as to what your LED fixture consists of. Wondering if you were ever full spectrum or mainly RB and whites?

[Cyberdude]

Originally Posted by Aqualund

Looks great...but to be fair, seriataporas grow like weeds, and the fact that yours only got that big after a year is another indication of reduced growth rates.

I have the same coral under a T5/combo that started the same size and it is now twice the size of yours in six months.

The mother colony I had of this coral I had under LED's only for two years and it would grow slowly, then RTN every 6 months for something and I'd keep trimming back and keeping the good parts. I moved it to my coral farm under t5's and I have a colony the size of a serving platter that just keeps growing with no losses.

To me it seems like very strong evidence. But I understand that its not for others.

Also, these spawning corals under hydras...Im pretty sure I saw that video too, and I think they used the LED's as supplementation, but not the primary light source. I could be wrong though. can you provide a link to this video?

It was actually fragged a few times. Perspective might not do I justice but it's at the size of a large cantaloupe which started as a 2" frag 12 months ago. It's never seen any loss either.

[karimwassef]

Ooo good point. Did you get Par readings at the start? Interested in Par degradation over time!

[dread240]

Maybe this will answer your questions about the height.

We tested PAR tonight for both the LED's and the new MH. Here are the results:

LED side -

Top (3" below water surface) ~540
Middle (13" below surface) ~325
Bottom (27" below surface) ~230

MH side -

Top (3" below water surface) ~800
Middle (13" below surface) ~520
Bottom (27" below surface) ~360

I did some digging back through his olds posts. Just trying to keep things all here together as I'm interested in this too.

Visually speaking he said there is a return of color to some pieces. I haven't seen full LED spec's on what he's using, but I did see green/red/uv in his mix, but couldn't find which ones.

[Cyberdude]

Originally Posted by dread240

Growth is virtually identical if you go by percentage, with MH still having a slight edge

8.9% increase vs 9.2% increase, LED vs MH respectively.

You have slightly higher par on the MH side too so I'm not surprised on that. I'll have to look back though as I'm curious as to what your LED fixture consists of. Wondering if you were ever full spectrum or mainly RB and whites?

So mh is 0.3% better than Led at growing coral. I think this post proves that water quality trumps lighting on growth.