first water test results Thoughts?

ddckec6972 · 02/06/2018, 12:47 PM

90g tank, 30g sump three weeks old set up
livestock = two damsels,3 Nassarius snails, 6 hermit crabs, green star polyp, xenia, trumpet coral, eagle eye zoas, neon green clove polyp, All corals are frags about 1 -2" in size. fish are about the same size

salinity = .025 need to add salt (easy)
Ph = 8.4
amo = .25 ppm
nitrites = 0 ppm
nitrates = 10-20 ppm (water source is about 5-10)
kh = 9-10 drops added test kit states that this is a range of 140-200 ppm

test kit used was API

bertoni · 02/06/2018, 06:56 PM

I would add some Prime or Amquel or the like right away. Ammonia can damage fish even if it doesn't kill then. That said, the kit might be a bit off. Ammonia kits are infamous for being a bit too sensitive or failing and reading ammonia in everything. You could try testing some distilled water.

The nitrate level is fine for fish, although it might cause problems or coloration changes for some corals. The alkalinity is fine, too.

ddckec6972 · 02/06/2018, 10:24 PM

i did hit it with prime.

RobZilla04 · 02/07/2018, 06:03 AM

I suggest slowing down with the coral additions. Tanks take quite some time to mature. If you set up with existing live rock you may be okay. If you used dry base rock, stand by for the uglies.

ddckec6972 · 02/07/2018, 08:52 AM

tank was started with live sand, and live rock. NOOOOOOOOO not the uglies, that was funny. the uglies. ha

RobZilla04 · 02/07/2018, 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ddckec6972

tank was started with live sand, and live rock. NOOOOOOOOO not the uglies, that was funny. the uglies. ha

Good to go in that case!

crawlerman · 02/07/2018, 10:31 AM

API are not the most reliable test kits. Seems like they ammonia reads .25 when there is none. API is ok to get through the cycle, but you need to upgrade to Salifert or Red Sea. That said, you are rushing. How do the corals look?

ddckec6972 · 02/07/2018, 01:24 PM

Corals look fine to me. Ill send pics later. I agree with api test products. Im presently shopping for test kit.

ddckec6972 · 02/07/2018, 03:51 PM

bertoni · 02/07/2018, 06:48 PM

Those corals seem to be doing well enough for such a new tank. I'd give them some time to acclimate before worrying much. A change in lighting level can cause more retraction than what you are seeing, for example.

ddckec6972 · 02/07/2018, 10:16 PM

Thanks... I must say i understand everyone concerns (other groups i belong to) about a young tank, i have been called [a lot of names] for adding corals and fish,,, three weeks in, You see, i am having a hard time buying in...to the young tank theory, furthermore. if a new tank is started with out live sand and live rock, then and only then, would i agree, that it would be to early to add anything....; it kinda like people telling me that big foot is not real but yet hes right in my living room.. lol.. ( harry and the hendersons) good movie.

RobZilla04 · 02/08/2018, 05:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ddckec6972

Thanks... I must say i understand everyone concerns (other groups i belong to) about a young tank, i have been called [a lot of names] for adding corals and fish,,, three weeks in, You see, i am having a hard time buying in...to the young tank theory, furthermore. if a new tank is started with out live sand and live rock, then and only then, would i agree, that it would be to early to add anything....; it kinda like people telling me that big foot is not real but yet hes right in my living room.. lol.. ( harry and the hendersons) good movie.

I don't think they are attacking you, just providing caution. I agree that it's hard to deny, at least early on, the results you see in front of you. Whether this early state of success will sustain for the long haul or curve sharply in the direction of trouble remains to be seen.

Happy reefing!

ddckec6972 · 02/08/2018, 11:15 PM

Update. ok tell me what is gong on in this picture. as you know my water parms are what they are. now tonight i notice this on the front glass only. to be honest i have never looked this close to the tank at that angle before so i dont know if is an overnight growth or been there for a while. will have a pet store test water tomorrow cause i dont have a good one yet

Daddi0 · 02/08/2018, 11:50 PM

With a new tank, you are going to go through some stages of ugly til the whole system is "in sync" Gha, cyano, diatoms, and brown algae to name a few. Just part of the process. And while you started with live sand/rock, it will take a while for the bacteria levels to adjust to your reef. This is why we go slow, to give the bacteria time to adjust. Otherwise looking good!
Cheers! Mark

bertoni · 02/09/2018, 02:53 PM

That's a bit of algal or microbial growth. You could scrape it off if you'd like. At some point, you might need to add a couple of snails to keep it under control. I'd just wait for now.

ddckec6972 · 02/09/2018, 05:03 PM

ok well i do have a clean up crew in the tank at the moment, H Crabs and snails, back to the original post topic.... i went to the two different local fish stores ( hard not to buy anything) and took a water sample with me (refer to top for starting water parms and ammonia concerns). And here is the results.. they both used api for ph, nitrite, nitrate, ammonia and phos they used red sea for DKH, CAL, AND MAG..both stores pretty much got the same readings so thats why only one photo

I also discovered why my ammonia was reading high. The ph, nitrite and nitrates tests in API fresh water test kits can be used for a salt Water tanks, the color scale on both test kits for these are an exact match, the ammonia color scale however in both API fresh water test kits and salt water test kits are not a perfect match.The ammonia drops from the fresh water kit can be used to test those levels in a salt water tank but one must use the color scale for ammonia from the salt test kit for reading it,. As for the CAL, DKH and mag, i bought a red sea test kit for those. so my ammonia levels were ok. I Learned alot today about test kits, And since i tested the water and got the same ph, alk, nitrite and nitrate levels as two fish stores i am comfortable continuing to use API for those tests. I also have a seachem ammonia alert badge, (alot of good reviews) that is reading low ammonia. Now the test water i took was about 3 hours old, would this amount of time lapse affect the ammonia test results. i am going to test the ammonia levels later. As for the brown stuff, it is believe by both stores that it a diatom bloom and i should just leave it alone and prepare for a few weeks of ugliness.

bertoni · 02/09/2018, 05:08 PM

Okay, I'm glad that the ammonia actually is reading zero.

Those numbers all are acceptable.

ddckec6972 · 02/09/2018, 05:16 PM

thanks, i just hope that when i test it i get the same readings I should right? I better. lol....This feeling of confusion for water parms is very familier, i was so confused when we got our in ground pool, water turned green on me many times but now you could read the wording on a dime sitting on the bottom, so i will nail these water parms i sure of it

ddckec6972 · 02/09/2018, 05:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bertoni

At some point, you might need to add a couple of snails to keep it under control. I'd just wait for now.

i have three Nassarius Snails and 5-6 h crabs already in the tank, would it be wise to add more of these snails or a different kind of snail? how many do i need for a 100 g tank? can i not just us my magnet to clean the glass? durning this diatom bloom?

bertoni · 02/09/2018, 06:31 PM

Nassarius snails only eat leftover food and the like. They are not herbivorous. Hermit crabs are opportunistic, but they don't crawl on the tank surfaces, so they won't do anything. At some point, I might add a Trochus snail or two and see how it goes, or I might just use a magnet. Adding too many snails just leads to starvation, and magnets are easy to use. It's a personal choice. I do like watching snails, though, for some reason.

ramseynb · 02/10/2018, 03:53 AM

+1 for Trochus snails. Also, depending on what comes next (hair algae) you might add a couple of turbo snails. Your tanks big enough for them and although they like to bulldoze all over your tank, they can throw down when it comes to eating algae, especially more complex algae (I.e. hair algae and not just film algae).

Formulator · 02/10/2018, 11:59 PM

SLOW DOWN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Seriously. You need to do some better research on your own. Learn about the endeavor you are starting. The folks on this forum are extremely knowlegable and can really help get you through the hiccups you are going to encounter. Before their advice can be helpful, you need to have a better undestanding of the chemistry and biology of the exosystem you are starting in your home.

ddckec6972 · 02/11/2018, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Formulator

SLOW DOWN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Seriously. You need to do some better research on your own. Learn about the endeavor you are starting. The folks on this forum are extremely knowledgeable and can really help get you through the hiccups

huh... everyone is telling me to add. so are you saying not to add? i did not ask if i was going to fast or not and this forum is one of my research sources and its voices are saying add. soooooo .. what say you?

DesertReefT4r · 02/11/2018, 03:27 PM

Yeah slow down. The tank is new and needs time to mature. I dont add corals to a new tank for at least 3 months and I start with hardy corals. Fish are the first to get stocked up 1 at a time so the bactieria can adjust to the increased bio load. I also cycle the tank with no lights for a month constantly adding a source of ammonia, no fish added at this time. I used use a few damsels or mollies to cycle a tank but found damsels to be on the agressive side and it takes longer ime.

ddckec6972 · 02/11/2018, 03:58 PM

ok look i can not explain why my tank water tests are showing a GOOD TO GO status, only four weeks in. this is further confirmed by two local fish stores (not chains stores) i have two damsels, a few h carbs & Nassarius snails (3 I THINK), and four coral frags, all are doing fine... so please explain to me, if im going to fast; why is everything testing fine and looking fine. I would understand if my live stock was dying. MY OWN Research has uncovered that tanks can cycle way sooner, so why is this proven fact (do your own research) so hard to accept by most? we all should were safety glassed when working on certain things around the home, could lose your eye, but we dont right? if losing your eye was a guaranteed fact (aka MUUUSSSST WAIT or MUST slow down). then a large % of the world would be blind, and its not...... so please stop with the you MUUUSSSST WAIT or MUST slow down. Because my tank is more proof against the slow down supporters. Its one month old (to the day) with good water parms, and supporting corals, fish and others....... Dont get me wrong...I understand the go slow theory and i am getting sick of being reminded of that every time i post something. I'm not dumping 100 fish or corals a day in my tank. i just want to determine if i should add anything to aid in removing the diatoms or not...... simple.

02/06/2018, 12:47 PM	#1
ddckec6972 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2018 Posts: 107	first water test results Thoughts? 90g tank, 30g sump three weeks old set up livestock = two damsels,3 Nassarius snails, 6 hermit crabs, green star polyp, xenia, trumpet coral, eagle eye zoas, neon green clove polyp, All corals are frags about 1 -2" in size. fish are about the same size salinity = .025 need to add salt (easy) Ph = 8.4 amo = .25 ppm nitrites = 0 ppm nitrates = 10-20 ppm (water source is about 5-10) kh = 9-10 drops added test kit states that this is a range of 140-200 ppm test kit used was API

02/06/2018, 06:56 PM	#2
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	I would add some Prime or Amquel or the like right away. Ammonia can damage fish even if it doesn't kill then. That said, the kit might be a bit off. Ammonia kits are infamous for being a bit too sensitive or failing and reading ammonia in everything. You could try testing some distilled water. The nitrate level is fine for fish, although it might cause problems or coloration changes for some corals. The alkalinity is fine, too. __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

02/07/2018, 06:03 AM	#4
RobZilla04 Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: St. Augustine, FL Posts: 1,857	I suggest slowing down with the coral additions. Tanks take quite some time to mature. If you set up with existing live rock you may be okay. If you used dry base rock, stand by for the uglies. __________________ 90g Mixed Reef

02/07/2018, 06:48 PM	#10
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	Those corals seem to be doing well enough for such a new tank. I'd give them some time to acclimate before worrying much. A change in lighting level can cause more retraction than what you are seeing, for example. __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

02/07/2018, 10:16 PM	#11
ddckec6972 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2018 Posts: 107	Thanks... I must say i understand everyone concerns (other groups i belong to) about a young tank, i have been called [a lot of names] for adding corals and fish,,, three weeks in, You see, i am having a hard time buying in...to the young tank theory, furthermore. if a new tank is started with out live sand and live rock, then and only then, would i agree, that it would be to early to add anything....; it kinda like people telling me that big foot is not real but yet hes right in my living room.. lol.. ( harry and the hendersons) good movie. Last edited by bertoni; 02/08/2018 at 11:46 AM.

02/06/2018, 10:24 PM	#3
ddckec6972 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2018 Posts: 107	i did hit it with prime.

02/07/2018, 08:52 AM	#5
ddckec6972 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2018 Posts: 107	tank was started with live sand, and live rock. NOOOOOOOOO not the uglies, that was funny. the uglies. ha

02/07/2018, 10:31 AM	#7
crawlerman Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Pittsburgh, PA Posts: 503	API are not the most reliable test kits. Seems like they ammonia reads .25 when there is none. API is ok to get through the cycle, but you need to upgrade to Salifert or Red Sea. That said, you are rushing. How do the corals look?

02/07/2018, 01:24 PM	#8
ddckec6972 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2018 Posts: 107	Corals look fine to me. Ill send pics later. I agree with api test products. Im presently shopping for test kit.

02/07/2018, 03:51 PM	#9
ddckec6972 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2018 Posts: 107

02/08/2018, 11:15 PM	#13
ddckec6972 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2018 Posts: 107	Update. ok tell me what is gong on in this picture. as you know my water parms are what they are. now tonight i notice this on the front glass only. to be honest i have never looked this close to the tank at that angle before so i dont know if is an overnight growth or been there for a while. will have a pet store test water tomorrow cause i dont have a good one yet

02/08/2018, 11:50 PM	#14
Daddi0 Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2017 Location: Redwood City Posts: 1,354	With a new tank, you are going to go through some stages of ugly til the whole system is "in sync" Gha, cyano, diatoms, and brown algae to name a few. Just part of the process. And while you started with live sand/rock, it will take a while for the bacteria levels to adjust to your reef. This is why we go slow, to give the bacteria time to adjust. Otherwise looking good! Cheers! Mark __________________ 2x 65g displays with a 30g cryptic refugium and 30g sump - 55g reef 30g Bio-cube reef - I.M. 30g reef - 45g freshwater

02/09/2018, 02:53 PM	#15
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	That's a bit of algal or microbial growth. You could scrape it off if you'd like. At some point, you might need to add a couple of snails to keep it under control. I'd just wait for now. __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

02/09/2018, 05:03 PM	#16
ddckec6972 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2018 Posts: 107	ok well i do have a clean up crew in the tank at the moment, H Crabs and snails, back to the original post topic.... i went to the two different local fish stores ( hard not to buy anything) and took a water sample with me (refer to top for starting water parms and ammonia concerns). And here is the results.. they both used api for ph, nitrite, nitrate, ammonia and phos they used red sea for DKH, CAL, AND MAG..both stores pretty much got the same readings so thats why only one photo I also discovered why my ammonia was reading high. The ph, nitrite and nitrates tests in API fresh water test kits can be used for a salt Water tanks, the color scale on both test kits for these are an exact match, the ammonia color scale however in both API fresh water test kits and salt water test kits are not a perfect match.The ammonia drops from the fresh water kit can be used to test those levels in a salt water tank but one must use the color scale for ammonia from the salt test kit for reading it,. As for the CAL, DKH and mag, i bought a red sea test kit for those. so my ammonia levels were ok. I Learned alot today about test kits, And since i tested the water and got the same ph, alk, nitrite and nitrate levels as two fish stores i am comfortable continuing to use API for those tests. I also have a seachem ammonia alert badge, (alot of good reviews) that is reading low ammonia. Now the test water i took was about 3 hours old, would this amount of time lapse affect the ammonia test results. i am going to test the ammonia levels later. As for the brown stuff, it is believe by both stores that it a diatom bloom and i should just leave it alone and prepare for a few weeks of ugliness. Last edited by ddckec6972; 02/09/2018 at 05:08 PM.

02/09/2018, 05:08 PM	#17
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	Okay, I'm glad that the ammonia actually is reading zero. Those numbers all are acceptable. __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

02/09/2018, 05:16 PM	#18
ddckec6972 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2018 Posts: 107	thanks, i just hope that when i test it i get the same readings I should right? I better. lol....This feeling of confusion for water parms is very familier, i was so confused when we got our in ground pool, water turned green on me many times but now you could read the wording on a dime sitting on the bottom, so i will nail these water parms i sure of it

02/09/2018, 06:31 PM	#20
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	Nassarius snails only eat leftover food and the like. They are not herbivorous. Hermit crabs are opportunistic, but they don't crawl on the tank surfaces, so they won't do anything. At some point, I might add a Trochus snail or two and see how it goes, or I might just use a magnet. Adding too many snails just leads to starvation, and magnets are easy to use. It's a personal choice. I do like watching snails, though, for some reason. __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

02/10/2018, 03:53 AM	#21
ramseynb Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: New Braunfels, TX Posts: 630	+1 for Trochus snails. Also, depending on what comes next (hair algae) you might add a couple of turbo snails. Your tanks big enough for them and although they like to bulldoze all over your tank, they can throw down when it comes to eating algae, especially more complex algae (I.e. hair algae and not just film algae). __________________ How do you make an octopus laugh? Ten tickles!

02/10/2018, 11:59 PM	#22
Formulator Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2016 Location: St. Louis, MO Posts: 72	SLOW DOWN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Seriously. You need to do some better research on your own. Learn about the endeavor you are starting. The folks on this forum are extremely knowlegable and can really help get you through the hiccups you are going to encounter. Before their advice can be helpful, you need to have a better undestanding of the chemistry and biology of the exosystem you are starting in your home.

02/11/2018, 03:27 PM	#24
DesertReefT4r Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Mesa Az Posts: 771	Yeah slow down. The tank is new and needs time to mature. I dont add corals to a new tank for at least 3 months and I start with hardy corals. Fish are the first to get stocked up 1 at a time so the bactieria can adjust to the increased bio load. I also cycle the tank with no lights for a month constantly adding a source of ammonia, no fish added at this time. I used use a few damsels or mollies to cycle a tank but found damsels to be on the agressive side and it takes longer ime. __________________ Tank history 29g tropical ,55g cichlid tank, 20H softy reef, 29g mixed reef, 20H brackish goby & puffer tank, 55g mixed reef, 6g Nanocube softy lps reef, 40B sps reef, 75g sps reef, 75g sps reef in bu Current Tank Info: 75g sps reef build in the works.

02/11/2018, 03:58 PM	#25
ddckec6972 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2018 Posts: 107	ok look i can not explain why my tank water tests are showing a GOOD TO GO status, only four weeks in. this is further confirmed by two local fish stores (not chains stores) i have two damsels, a few h carbs & Nassarius snails (3 I THINK), and four coral frags, all are doing fine... so please explain to me, if im going to fast; why is everything testing fine and looking fine. I would understand if my live stock was dying. MY OWN Research has uncovered that tanks can cycle way sooner, so why is this proven fact (do your own research) so hard to accept by most? we all should were safety glassed when working on certain things around the home, could lose your eye, but we dont right? if losing your eye was a guaranteed fact (aka MUUUSSSST WAIT or MUST slow down). then a large % of the world would be blind, and its not...... so please stop with the you MUUUSSSST WAIT or MUST slow down. Because my tank is more proof against the slow down supporters. Its one month old (to the day) with good water parms, and supporting corals, fish and others....... Dont get me wrong...I understand the go slow theory and i am getting sick of being reminded of that every time i post something. I'm not dumping 100 fish or corals a day in my tank. i just want to determine if i should add anything to aid in removing the diatoms or not...... simple.