Reef Central Online Community

Home Forum Here you can view your subscribed threads, work with private messages and edit your profile and preferences View New Posts View Today's Posts

Find other members Frequently Asked Questions Search Reefkeeping ...an online magazine for marine aquarists Support our sponsors and mention Reef Central

Go Back   Reef Central Online Community > Invert and Plant Forums > Marine Plants & Macroalgae
Register Blogs FAQ Calendar Mark Forums Read

Notices

User Tag List

Reply
Thread Tools
Old Yesterday, 05:27 AM   #1251
Scrubber_steve
I'm really very likeable
 
Scrubber_steve's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Down Under
Posts: 560
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Hoaster View Post
Back in the dirt…

Starting up my new ecosystem requires a foundation for life. A suitable substrate for the sand bed creatures and the seagrasses is required. To support biodiversity, I will provide a variety of sand grain sizes, dirt, mud, shells and rubble - just as I've seen in Nature. It will not be a sterile, dead sand bed. It will be messy and wriggling with life.

How will this new substrate differ from the previous one? It will have more dirt and mud in it. In my experience, the grasses and the creatures enjoy it.

I managed to save a number of spaghetti worms from the old setup. I'll be adding live sand and live rock. I'm really hoping to get the bottom of the food chain established early. I believe this will help with stability, in an unstable phase of the tank's life.

Other members of the crew include two species of reproducing snails (Cerith & Mini Strombus), a fighting conch and a sea cucumber. Right now they're in my holding tank. I'll add some serpent stars and pods as well.

This an important step. Laying the foundation for life. Yay!
The environment your reproducing reminds me of the Minnamurra River, where I live. One end of the river is greatly influenced by the sea, & the other end by grazing land & natural bush. Gets plenty of plant & tree matter, & soil washing into it. Water movement from incoming & outgoing tides only.

There's lots of mangroves growing, starting about a couple of hundred yards from the mouth. Lots of sea grasses starting at the same area.

Talking about substrate, where the sea grasses & mangroves are the sand is a darker color, & digging down its black. When walking in these areas at low tide your feet sink down about 6" to 8". Very squishy. I guess it very aerated by the organisms mixed through it.




__________________
Create a Concept & Reality Leaves the Room.

Current Tank Info: Algae scrubbed 220 litre system mixed.
Scrubber_steve is online now   Reply With Quote
Old Yesterday, 05:39 AM   #1252
Scrubber_steve
I'm really very likeable
 
Scrubber_steve's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: Down Under
Posts: 560
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Hoaster View Post
Welcome mndfreeze!

In my experience, ulva seems to need to be driven hard, with high light and high nutrients.
Ulva is what grows on my scrubber screen- naturally seeded.

Not sure but I'm guessing Enteromorpha (ulva) intestinalis. There's lots of varieties. I think I've had a few, & its changed somewhat, or evolved over time.

Super awesome for nutrient export, & easy to grow & non invasive. It's my only filtration besides some floss & occasional GAC.

I can even keep growing it with no3 & po4 levels reading zero, although thats only on hobby grade kit, & I do feed the tank a fair amount.

[IMG][/IMG]


Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_5275 - Copy - Copy.jpg (52.8 KB, 10 views)
__________________
Create a Concept & Reality Leaves the Room.

Current Tank Info: Algae scrubbed 220 litre system mixed.

Last edited by Scrubber_steve; Yesterday at 05:49 AM.
Scrubber_steve is online now   Reply With Quote
Old Yesterday, 07:48 PM   #1253
lapin
Registered Member
 
lapin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Austin
Posts: 787
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Hoaster View Post
You never know when you're going to stumble onto new, potentially game-changing information.

Here is the (basic) gist of what Scrubber steve is saying: Algae of all types have associated bacteria that 'help' the algae. If we let algae run amok in the formative stages of our aquariums, we're encouraging these algae-friendly bacteria to get established, to the detriment of nitrifying bacteria. This can lead to more virulent algae that's harder to get rid of, down the line. On the other hand, if we try to discourage algae during the cycling phase, by keeping nutrients low and the lights out, the 'good' nitrifying bacteria can get established first, making it difficult for algae-friendly bacteria to move in. If done well, an algae phase could be completely avoided. KABOOM!

Could this really be true? I don't know, but the science behind it sounds good to me, and I'd sure like to see it tested. This has applications to reef tanks obviously, and really any other tank where algae isn't welcome, but could it be applied to a planted tank like mine? My first inclination is to say no, since accepted methodology is to get plants in from the start, deemphasizing nitrifying bacteria, which competes with plants for nutrients. But maybe some variation of this method could work in a planted tank. After all, I'd like to avoid an algae phase too!
This is also along those lines You will need to insert reef 2 reef and...... threads/algae-release-useful-proteins-carbohydrates-and-metabolites.359116/

https://www.*********.com/threads/al...olites.359116/


__________________
Tank sizes, 2-10's a 55 and one that's about 500gal

Current Tank Info: Interior decorating happening
lapin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Today, 08:22 AM   #1254
Michael Hoaster
Registered Member
 
Michael Hoaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 4,513
I don't think I've seen that article before, Steve. I have read about bicarbonates and figured they'd pretty much help out where they can with no help from me. And I presumed the plants wouldn't have to work as hard to get CO2, if I just gave them CO2. But the article raised this point that I found interesting:

6. Keep the carbonate alkalinity up to at least 2.5 meq/l (7 dKH; 125 ppm calcium carbonate equivalents) to provide adequate bicarbonate for photosynthesis. Higher alkalinity may even be better, especially if the pH is also high, limiting carbon dioxide itself as a CO2 source for photosynthesizing organisms. This suggestion is likely already followed by most reef aquarists, but perhaps not by some with fish-only or related types of aquaria that also rely on macroalgae for nutrient export.

It sounds like my seagrasses might appreciate access to more bicarbonates.


__________________
As many naturalists and environmentalists have suggested, we should set aside our arrogance,
our desire to conquer and control everything, and walk hand in hand with Mother Nature. -Walter Adey

Current Tank Info: 180g Seagrass Sandbar Lagoon, START DATE November 28, 2018
Michael Hoaster is online now   Reply With Quote
Old Today, 08:37 AM   #1255
Michael Hoaster
Registered Member
 
Michael Hoaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 4,513
Steve, thanks for pointing out the similarities between my tank's substrate and your local river. That's really what I'm going for, providing a fertile substrate for the seagrass, as well as worms and other detrivores. I'm attempting to close the loop with detritus, allowing it to settle out, so it can be consumed and processed down the line to the grasses. It works pretty well, though I occasionally tidy up to keep things looking good enough for display. I have one fat and happy cucumber, which tend to gradually starve in cleaner tanks. I'm considering adding a detritus-eating fish as well, so I'll have to watch and see if it can support both.


__________________
As many naturalists and environmentalists have suggested, we should set aside our arrogance,
our desire to conquer and control everything, and walk hand in hand with Mother Nature. -Walter Adey

Current Tank Info: 180g Seagrass Sandbar Lagoon, START DATE November 28, 2018

Last edited by Michael Hoaster; Today at 06:44 PM.
Michael Hoaster is online now   Reply With Quote
Old Today, 08:45 AM   #1256
Michael Hoaster
Registered Member
 
Michael Hoaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 4,513
Ulva is a great utility plant. I've kept some in my tank from the beginning. I often suggest it to others over chaeto. Makes sense to use it in a scrubber. I'm considering using Enteromorpha intestinalis in my display. It looks like it would move well in the current.


__________________
As many naturalists and environmentalists have suggested, we should set aside our arrogance,
our desire to conquer and control everything, and walk hand in hand with Mother Nature. -Walter Adey

Current Tank Info: 180g Seagrass Sandbar Lagoon, START DATE November 28, 2018
Michael Hoaster is online now   Reply With Quote
Old Today, 09:05 AM   #1257
Michael Hoaster
Registered Member
 
Michael Hoaster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 4,513
Interesting thread lapin, thanks. I followed the progress of a few folks attempting the Triton method. I've also read about plants' chemical warfare, know as allelopathy. I didn't read the whole thread, but I got the impression Mr Farley wasn't fully on-board with Triton. I wasn't either, but I can't remember all the reasons. Mostly I didn't like how it made users too dependent on the company for testing and maintaining the suggested levels. Too proprietary for my taste.


__________________
As many naturalists and environmentalists have suggested, we should set aside our arrogance,
our desire to conquer and control everything, and walk hand in hand with Mother Nature. -Walter Adey

Current Tank Info: 180g Seagrass Sandbar Lagoon, START DATE November 28, 2018
Michael Hoaster is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
ecosystem, food web, macro algae, planted tank, seagrass

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:06 PM.


TapaTalk Enabled

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by Searchlight © 2020 Axivo Inc.
Use of this web site is subject to the terms and conditions described in the user agreement.
Reef CentralTM Reef Central, LLC. Copyright ©1999-2014
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging v3.3.0 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.