PLEASE check out your intended fish purchases here first!

[raen]

This is GREAT!!!!! Nice thread, tons of info so far, and I'm sure we will learn TONS & TONS more! Thanks for the thread!

[Sk8r]

You're welcome. If I can get a number of people with experience to chime in on this, I hope it can be helpful to people trying to "do it right." Best advice I still have is "Google the fish name" and get details.

[raen]

The nice thing is, not only do you get great help, but , I have found that sometimes when you are researching a fish/coral/invert, it is tough to find an answer on the net. it is great to hear from someone who knows what the heck they are talking about. thanks again.

[tewkes]

Ok here's my fishlist for my very near upgrade

The tank will be a 150 gallon deep dimension cube 36"x36x27. Approx. 150+lbs of live rock, 50+sump with fuge, ASM G-3 skimmer, 4 koralia #3s, plus the return (mag 9.5). I will eventually upgrade the koralias to a vortec or similar product. Lighting will be (2) 4 bulb tek fixtures t-5ho 8X39watts total.


(current residents that will be put in the upgrade.)
2 occ. clowns (pair)
1 Royal Gramma
1 midas blenny
1 lubbocks fairy wrasse


wish list in addition to fish above.

3 lyretail anthias
2 bluethroat triggers (male/female)
1 sand sifting goby/pistol combo
1 tang (kole size) maybe?

This will be a mixed reef with sps up high, lps in the middle and zoas, etc..near the bottom.

How does this look, any potential clashes?

[Sk8r]

Ok, I'm going to appeal for tang experts here. but your anthias should be ok: dunno about the triggers (help!); I'd recommend a yellow watchman with tiger pistol up to a diamond goby (bigtime sand movement)...conch not safe with triggers. Shrimp maybe not safe with triggers *(Those blighters think crustaceans are snacks)* and may eat same. The kole should do nicely,

[tewkes]

Thanks, I had a bluethroat in the past and it was a model citizen (didn't eat inverts, coral, etc..)

[Rustylugnuts]

Here's my fish question. How will a magenta dottyback (P. porphyrea) do as a community fish? I just got one for about a third the price of an orchid dotty back and he/she is doin great in quarantine (chowin mysids the night it came home).It looks as if the reviews are mixed, some play well with others some end up as the school yard bully. Right now its the only fish I have but once the 40 is cycled I plan on adding a handful of other fish (not sure exactly what yet, open to suggestions). Anyone have experience with this critter?

[Sk8r]

Far as I know, the dottyback is a close relative of the wolf eel, and will be a PITA to small fish. I would say with the dottyback, consider fairy wrasses and the like, because they will hold their own.

[FranktheTankTx]

Ok, I'll play.

54g corner... well it's all in my signature. 40 - 60lbs LR & 1 - 1.5" sand bed.

I am considering adding the following:

Clean up Crew

2 Mexican Turbo
10 Cerith
10 Astrea
10 Nassarious
1 Sand Sifting Cucumber
5 Blue Leg Hermit (very tiny)
5 Scarlet Hermit
1 Electric Blue Hermit
1 Coral Banded Shrimp (or a Cleaner or Fire Shrimp)

Fish

2 - Twin Spot Gobies
1 - Bi Color Blenny
1 - Fridmani Psuedo (or Dwarf Angel if I dare to risk w/ reef tank)
1 - Tomato Clown or Black & White Ocellaris

Corals

Zoo's
Ric's
Acropora

Misc

Clams
Seabae Anenome

Undecided

Emerald Crab (1)
Hawaiin Zebra Hermit (2 or 3)
Brittle Star (1)

[Rustylugnuts]

Far as I know, the dottyback is a close relative of the wolf eel, and will be a PITA to small fish. I would say with the dottyback, consider fairy wrasses and the like, because they will hold their own.

Hmm I wanna keep this one but I also want a peaceful tank. My wife wants a nano anyway so this beauty may get a 20L to share with a sexy shrimp and some softies. Thanks for the info.

[SoCalSURFrider]

Alright My tank: 210g, 400lbs live rock, 100lbs live sand, 3 400w MH w/ 2 160w actinic VHOs, 60g sump w/30g Refugium, Filter sock, Protein skimmer, UV, Activated carbon, CA reactor... Pretty much ready for anything.... Have Lots of room in tank still...

Fish I have now:
- 1 percula clown
- 1 blue tang
- 7 green chromis

My overall plan is to have a HUGE mixed reef and with a decent amount of fish....

I would like suggestions for what is possible for my tank.... This is my first SW...There are pics of my tank somewhere on this site...

[Jay1982]

Originally posted by Rustylugnuts
Here's my fish question. How will a magenta dottyback (P. porphyrea) do as a community fish? I just got one for about a third the price of an orchid dotty back and he/she is doin great in quarantine (chowin mysids the night it came home).It looks as if the reviews are mixed, some play well with others some end up as the school yard bully. Right now its the only fish I have but once the 40 is cycled I plan on adding a handful of other fish (not sure exactly what yet, open to suggestions). Anyone have experience with this critter?

If you want your tank to be peaceful, the dottyback should not be the first one in your tank, he'll claim it as his own.

[aprosody]

We have a 72 Gallon Bowfront & a 15 Gallon Sump. We are planning on having a 5 Gallon Refugium, 80 lbs of live rock, 3 inch sandbed, in sump skimmer (still undecided on which one, money will play a factor in this), 2 X 54W HO T5's w/ 4 X 65W PC and LED Moonlights.


Fish & Inverts

15 Scarlet Reef Hermit Crab
10 Dwarf Blue Leg Hermit Crab
10 Turbo Snails
3 Peppermint Shrimp
Six Line Wrasse
Yellow Watchman Goby
Pistol Shrimp
3 Spotted Cardinalfish
Maybe some Clowns w/addition of an anemone
Whitecheek Tang (Will be moved in about a year)

Also planning on some zoos and mushrooms. Will have some more softies, just haven't decided which ones.

Any conflicts here? We've tried to do as much research as possible, but you can never guarantee the information that you find. Any help is appreciated!

[Lemeshianos]

115 gallons, 26 gallon sump/refugium, Aqua Medic Turboflotor T1000 Protein Skimmer with Ocean Runner 2700 pump, SpectraPure Maxpure 60 GPD RO/DI System, 4 Hydor Koralia 2 Circulation Pump/Powerhead UL 600 gph, Eheim 1262 Pump for return.

lights will be basic lighting(not enough for any coral except maybe mushrooms) until I upgrade to metal halide.

I will be getting 50 lb of live rock initially.

I need some cleaning crew first and then some fish for beginners.
I would like to keep clown fish and a yellow tang at sometime.

[Sk8r]

ANGELS: I'd say a small angel is probably safe with zoos and rics, but the minute there's acropora, he's liable to discover they're edible. Most softies, if you handle them, make your hands smell not so good, which probably argues for how they taste. Acros don't leave that scent, they're alive, and they just may smell good to angels, who in the wild make their living by cruising down the reef taking a piece of this and that coral. in the reef, it may even be a useful habit to the coral.

unfortunately in our tanks, they reach the wall and start over again. And again.

This goes for many nippers. in the reef, no problem, in our tanks, big problem.

And big angels, parrots, filefish, etc. do big damage fast.

[Sk8r]

REEFSAFE fish: this means they won't eat coral. It does not mean they will not eat your invertebrates or your other fish.

[Sk8r]

TOXIC FISH, INVERTS, WEED:
some fish when injured or sick fire back a tank-killing toxin. The BOXFISH is one, as I recall. Some have poisonous spines: RABBITFISH can produce a sting that reacts like a recluse spiderbite---I've seen half a hand turned black from it, quite nasty. Put LEATHER gloves under the plastic ones before moving rock with this guy in the tank. LIONFISH are notoriously venomous: all that finnage conceals some spines worse than a rabbitfish, and they should never be handled.
Some WEED is toxic, which is why critters won't eat it; CAULERPA is in this class---few things eat it, it has roots, and is not safe even in your fuge, because bits of it will get into the pump and up to your tank. Once it roots, even rock cooking will not get it out. Some tangs will eat it---some urchins will---rabbit fish will. BUT nothing that fits a nano tank will except maybe some exotic shellfish like a chitin...and I'm trying to research their behavior. At least you can catch them. But I don't know what they do to acrylic. Oh, and the *other* nasty trick caulerpa has: vary its lighting or have a bulb go out or try a 3-day-dark with it, and it may 'sporulate', or spawn, turning your tank to a milky white toxic soup. Water changes, carbon, and a micron filter if you have one, but get your critters all out to quarantine tanks immediately, including the inverts: there is no oxygen in such water.
Toxic inverts: myriad. CUCUMBERS have toxin, even the 'safe' ones. Some can take your tank out. LONGSPINED URCHINS, the black ones: sexy looking, but bad news for fish or reefer who gets speared. Nasty to remove, and will fester. A fish that gets seriously nailed by this may die. Many things sting: vinegar dissolves calcium carbonate spines. Hot water relieves the pain and itch. Wearing gloves is usually enough.

[Sk8r]

COMBOS I KNOW DON"T WORK:
do not put:
a 6 line wrasse and a dragonet in the same tank: both eat pods voraciously. The wrasse eats many things. The dragonet (mandarin, scooter blenny) needs the pods. If there aren't enough, it gets weak, and then the 6 line eats the dragonet.

a butterfly fish in a reef: they think you've served them lunch.
a butterfly fish or nippy angel with a clam: if they nip the clam, it 'blinks', and the clam will trap same fatally.

a new watchman goby in with another: fatality for one or the other. And if the resident watchman doesn't kill it, his companion shrimp may.

eels in with fish that fit their mouths. Eels eat fish. They don't care if you spend 50.00 on that fish. Nuff said.

[Sk8r]

WHEN CAN YOU ADD CORALS?
As soon as you've stabilized your water quality and temperature, you can start adding coral. You do not count live coral as bioload, since it is a living filter and will actually improve your water---unless something kills it, in which case it becomes dead biomass, not a good thing. As a rule, keep softies downstream of stony. Run carbon if you run softies. And you might look at the "Why I recommend mushrooms" thread, because there will be a lot of info there on what species are 'easy' and what NOT to let onto your structural rock.

[lat0403]

Originally posted by FranktheTankTx
Ok, I'll play.

54g corner... well it's all in my signature. 40 - 60lbs LR & 1 - 1.5" sand bed.

I am considering adding the following:

Clean up Crew

2 Mexican Turbo
10 Cerith
10 Astrea
10 Nassarious
1 Sand Sifting Cucumber
5 Blue Leg Hermit (very tiny)
5 Scarlet Hermit
1 Electric Blue Hermit
1 Coral Banded Shrimp (or a Cleaner or Fire Shrimp)

Fish

2 - Twin Spot Gobies
1 - Bi Color Blenny
1 - Fridmani Psuedo (or Dwarf Angel if I dare to risk w/ reef tank)
1 - Tomato Clown or Black & White Ocellaris

Corals

Zoo's
Ric's
Acropora

Misc

Clams
Seabae Anenome

Undecided

Emerald Crab (1)
Hawaiin Zebra Hermit (2 or 3)
Brittle Star (1)

Is the Twin Spot Goby the same as the Two-Spot Goby (Signigobius biocellatus)? It's on the list of fish I want. I don't think you can keep more than one unless you're going to keep a mated pair. And I'm not really sure how much they rely on the sandbed for their food, but you may not have enough of a sandbed for two, anyway. Especially considering your clean up crew.

I would probably choose the Black & White over the Tomato clown. I don't believe a peaceful clown exists, but the B&W will be less aggressive than the tomato (probably; it all depends on the actual fish). And then add the Fridmani last.

Leslie

[greggnyce]

My dwarf lion would only eat live shrimp or freeze dried large shrimp--PITA. It also ate a fairy wrasse. I also had a magenta dotty back that I traded. The Dotty back was ok with my tomato clown but they both picked on my gobie.

[Sk8r]

CLOWNS
...the most peaceful is probably the pink skunk.
...percs are tolerable---will chase anything that gets near their corner, and will claim ALL of a small tank: their range appears to be the immediate 8 gallons surrounding their nest.
...clarkiis---I had them. They wanted 20 gallons all their own, and bit me (they have teeth) ever time I wanted to maintain the tank. max size about 4".
...tomato/maroon/cinnamon...temper, temper, temper. max size about 5", and bitey. They will attack their owner's hand and arm, and one person observed a female maroon grab an encroaching fish and shove it into the anemone, fatally for the fish. I used to put my hand in my piranha tank to do maintenance (rarely, but sometimes tongs won't reach it.) Say that the piranha never bit me. A maroon clown---would have.

[Sk8r]

"Is the Twin Spot Goby the same as the Two-Spot Goby (Signigobius biocellatus)? It's on the list of fish I want. I don't think you can keep more than one unless you're going to keep a mated pair. And I'm not really sure how much they rely on the sandbed for their food, but you may not have enough of a sandbed for two, anyway. Especially considering your clean up crew."-----

That's a very good point: gobies of the same species will fight. Often it's a lot of mouth-measuring and little biting among the tiniest of the species, but unless the larger guys go into quarantine together and go into the tank together, you may have one chewed-up fish left.

A sandsifter goby (yellow watchman) will cover about 50 gallons of bottom territory. They will often eat other things than detritus, but the diamond goby is notoriously unwilling to do so, and covers about 75g of bottom. I don't know the twinspot, but would suspect they're like the yellow watchman (ywg) in scope and behavior. And the ywg will fight a mirror...and kill a tankmate.

TO TEST AGGRESSION LEVEL: hold a mirror near the glass. If the fish you want to pair attacks the mirror---you're going to have that fight in your tank if you put another in. Do the mirror test.

[smspring]

Sk8r - great thread, thank you. I just noticed you live in Spokane. We moved here about 3 years ago, would love to see your setup.

Here is where I'm at today:

75 Gal
20 Gal sump
~90 lbs LR
2-4 in SB
tank about 5 months old

Currently have:
4 inch Yellow Tang
Orange spotted goby
Bi-Color Angel (until I decide to bait and hook him out)
Scott's Fairy Wrasse
Bi-Color Psueodchromis
Peppermint and Cleaner Shrimp
Variety of snails and hermits

Considering:
Pair of percula clowns
and/or
3 green/blue Chromies

Or am I max'd out now? If not, any other recommendations?

I plan on adding corals down the road... I know I'll need to get rid of the angel before I do that... dreading the thought though.

[Xiaan42]

I am looking to add some more fish to my tank.

38G with 10G sump

Current residents:
Mixed SPS & LPS reef (with Zoos and Rics)
Clam
Shrimp (Cleaner & Pistol)
Crabs (Hermit, Porcelain & Emerald)
Snails
Watchman Goby (3" is not yellow)
Neon Goby
Occelaris Clown


Here is what I would like to get:
Royal Gramma
Pigmy Anglefish (I love this fish but I would only get one if it know it doesn't nip at my coral)
6 Line or Flasher Wrasse

If I can't get the Anglefish what other fish would be good in my system?